I would imagine for everything but MAYBE fightclub (not even sure about that) it will be pretty bad. The animations are ridiculously long, and the only way to increase them is with momentum which would probably require a still target, or a really dumb one. It's possible if they scaled the damage super high to deal with that, it could be OK, but I would imagine those long-*** animations will make it pretty terrible.
I suppose you can get a full momentum attack off once every 30-40 seconds with the BU power, but I don't think that really makes up for it.
@TheKatalyst
My **** is bleeding.
ive seen it in action in fiteklub specifically and it did really poorly
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well, animation time shouldn't matter if yer playing the role of a KM or a Stalker.|
Originally Posted by The Katalyst
I would imagine for everything but MAYBE fightclub (not even sure about that) it will be pretty bad. The animations are ridiculously long, and the only way to increase them is with momentum which would probably require a still target, or a really dumb one. It's possible if they scaled the damage super high to deal with that, it could be OK, but I would imagine those long-*** animations will make it pretty terrible.
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in fact, the longer the better! (assuming the damage scales with the animation).
can't wait to find out what the damage is. Hurry up Mids!.
perma jump is ---> /up 1
Off topic real quick...Ive seen Street Justice on Stalkers in action after catching some uppercuts.
Hows it looking for for Scrappers/Tanks/Butes?
"Forum PvP doesn't give drops. Just so all of you who participated in this thread are aware." -Mod08-
"when a stalker goes blue side, assassination strike should be renamed "bunny hugs", and a rainbow should fly out" -Harbinger-
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KM only has a ridiculously high damage:animation ratio because CS can't crit, so they thought the best way to balance that was to make it the equivalent of a 100% chance to crit. There are other melee attacks that have longer or similar animation times that don't do anywhere near the damage of CS, unless they crit.|
Originally Posted by Hindenburg
well, animation time shouldn't matter if yer playing the role of a KM or a Stalker.
in fact, the longer the better! (assuming the damage scales with the animation). can't wait to find out what the damage is. Hurry up Mids!. |
Titan Weapons attacks without momentum are upwards of 4 seconds long, that's longer then basically any other attack in the game, melee or ranged.
I think it's pretty obvious TW was basically made for people who wanted to make concept toons based around big dumb brutes with oversized weapons. I don't think making it super powerful was their focus, just making it fit that type of concept. Personally, that look doesn't appeal to me, but to each their own I guess.
@TheKatalyst
My **** is bleeding.
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My Tw/Fire farms faster than a SS/Fire but for PvP it's poo |
Originally Posted by The Katalyst
KM only has a ridiculously high damage:animation ratio because CS can't crit, so they thought the best way to balance that was to make it the equivalent of a 100% chance to crit. There are other melee attacks that have longer or similar animation times that don't do anywhere near the damage of CS, unless they crit.
Titan Weapons attacks without momentum are upwards of 4 seconds long, that's longer then basically any other attack in the game, melee or ranged. I think it's pretty obvious TW was basically made for people who wanted to make concept toons based around big dumb brutes with oversized weapons. I don't think making it super powerful was their focus, just making it fit that type of concept. Personally, that look doesn't appeal to me, but to each their own I guess. |
Oh and long animation times = better in pvp is wrong.. you can't heal during an animation time..
Consciousness: that annoying time between naps.
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Originally Posted by The Katalyst
Titan Weapons attacks without momentum are upwards of 4 seconds long, that's longer then basically any other attack in the game, melee or ranged.
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Lol no, the longest ST attack is 2.3 seconds (Rend Armor) and the longest AoE is Arc of Destruction (2.7). So... longest ST is basically KO Blow in cast time and the longest AoE is still faster than CS, Total Focus, 1kCuts and whatev.
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Have you actually used the set? With no momentum, there is an added delay outside of their regular animation times. It would be fairly hard to keep momentum up in a PvP zone.
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Originally Posted by Kioshi
Lol no, the longest ST attack is 2.3 seconds (Rend Armor) and the longest AoE is Arc of Destruction (2.7). So... longest ST is basically KO Blow in cast time and the longest AoE is still faster than CS, Total Focus, 1kCuts and whatev.
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@TheKatalyst
My **** is bleeding.
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Yup, I did, but honestly it isn't slower than starting with KO Blow (my usual opener Defensive Sweep is 2.2 secs, there's also a 2sec attack, crushing blow).|
Originally Posted by The Katalyst
Have you actually used the set? With no momentum, there is an added delay outside of their regular animation times. It would be fairly hard to keep momentum up in a PvP zone.
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And if there was a delay to make it 'slower than any other melee attack' the math gurus in the scrapper boards would be all over it (as in the beta feedback which I participated - arc of destruction originally was 2.50 secs and was changed to 2.70). The one that had a slight delay on beta was Crushing Blow and because of the complaints Synapse reduced it to the intended number (2 secs).
Anyway according to City of Data the fast versions of the attacks (Momentum) shows less damage in PvP than the non-Momentum ones.
Like Rend Armor:
2.3 sec cast time: 178.62 Smashing damage [PvE] - 169.12 Smashing damage [PvP]
1.3 sec (Momentum): 178.62 Smashing damage [PvE] - 124.44 Smashing damage [PvP]
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Ah, well, I guess I stand corrected then. Regardless, I've heard nothing good about TW in PvP as of yet, although I don't know many people who built any PvP toons using TW.
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Originally Posted by Kioshi
Yup, I did, but honestly it isn't slower than starting with KO Blow (my usual opener Defensive Sweep is 2.2 secs, there's also a 2sec attack, crushing blow).
And if there was a delay to make it 'slower than any other melee attack' the math gurus in the scrapper boards would be all over it (as in the beta feedback which I participated - arc of destruction originally was 2.50 secs and was changed to 2.70). The one that had a slight delay on beta was Crushing Blow and because of the complaints Synapse reduced it to the intended number (2 secs). Anyway according to City of Data the fast versions of the attacks (Momentum) shows less damage in PvP than the non-Momentum ones. Like Rend Armor: 2.3 sec cast time: 178.62 Smashing damage [PvE] - 169.12 Smashing damage [PvP] 1.3 sec (Momentum): 178.62 Smashing damage [PvE] - 124.44 Smashing damage [PvP] |
@TheKatalyst
My **** is bleeding.
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I'm guessing it's because it's a stupid heavy AoE set, that's why it's getting a lot of love on PvE. It has 3 ST attacks and 4 AoEs, people are saying they're soloing at x6 at DO level (the first AoE does +def and the 3 others do KD so you have plenty of mitigation quite early since at level 18 you have all but Arc of Destruction). And if you look at CoD, the longest casting attack at 2.7 secs, AoE, is a huge cone so it doesn't do as much damage as the 2.3 second one (Rend Armor which is very close to GFS in damage and cast time in PvE) - on CoD you have to look at the 'pet' values since the momentum version is considered a different power but the fast cast versions are always lower damage in PvP. So anyway the hard hitter from the set is no CS.|
Originally Posted by The Katalyst
Ah, well, I guess I stand corrected then. Regardless, I've heard nothing good about TW in PvP as of yet, although I don't know many people who built any PvP toons using TW.
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The fact that two of the attacks (one of the STs and the Footstomp clone) are usable only in momentum might hurt it too, and also that in beta the BU power was replaced by Build Momentum which grants less +damage than plain old BU.
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Well, unfortunately we are kind of forced to use KM as a benchmark in terms of non fiteklub style PvP (zone, team arena). It's not that KM is OP so much as it is that the rest of the melee sets just don't compare. Closest you would get is MA if you get lucky crit streaks, which does happen pretty frequently, and can outdamage KM if you're lucky.|
Originally Posted by Kioshi
I'm guessing it's because it's a stupid heavy AoE set, that's why it's getting a lot of love on PvE. It has 3 ST attacks and 4 AoEs, people are saying they're soloing at x6 at DO level (the first AoE does +def and the 3 others do KD so you have plenty of mitigation quite early since at level 18 you have all but Arc of Destruction). And if you look at CoD, the longest casting attack at 2.7 secs, AoE, is a huge cone so it doesn't do as much damage as the 2.3 second one (Rend Armor which is very close to GFS in damage and cast time in PvE) - on CoD you have to look at the 'pet' values since the momentum version is considered a different power but the fast cast versions are always lower damage in PvP. So anyway the hard hitter from the set is no CS.
The fact that two of the attacks (one of the STs and the Footstomp clone) are usable only in momentum might hurt it too, and also that in beta the BU power was replaced by Build Momentum which grants less +damage than plain old BU. |
Basically, I'm saying KM is good, and the rest of the melee sets are bad, so if a melee set can't outperform KM, then it's basically just bad, in PvP terms. I think KM only seems OP because the rest of the Melee primaries are so underpowered, outside of fiteklub and SS. Kind of a different issue, but I saw you compared it to CS and just wanted to point out that it's very fair to do so for melee sets.
That's assuming we are talking about Scrappers, for Tanks/Brutes just replace KM with SS and it's the same idea.
@TheKatalyst
My **** is bleeding.
Titan Weapons can be gewd if you buy da my little pony weapon pack and use da rainbow dash brutal gasher, it does over 9000 loldamage.
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Is it viable or will the damage be meh!