Quote:
I had trouble doing this mission on my PB too. If you're using SO's, that is probably the problem. Your Dark Defender was probably able to do it because Dark has massively awesome debuffs... Peacebringers don't.|
Originally Posted by Papaschtroumpf
I recently came back to the game, and I'm a bit rusty, but I see "bragging threads" about how people take down AVs with their Kheldian.
since I just came back to the game, I needed to unlock my alpha slot on all my 50s by running Ramiel's arc. I soloed it with my blaster, didn't even try to solo with my WS (no corpses to help with trapdoor). I was able to get through Trapdoor on my Dark/Sonic Defender but logged before the Lady Grey missions. When I logged back on later, it was on my PB instead and I tried to do the arc but could get get through the Lady Grey mission with him. Try as I might I couldn't get The Honoree down, his regen always gets the better of me, even with LF+Hasten(+Conserve Energy). so how do you gets get AVs on your PB? do you get temp powers, shivans, etc...? |
To be completely honest with you, you really need an IO build if you don't have one already. If you want to post up the build you're using here, I'm sure someone can help you out.
Another strategy is to fill up your inspiration tray with half purples and half reds, devour all of them as soon as you get the Elite bosses, and hope you take at least one of them down before your inspirations wear off.
As for fighting Trapdoor (or doing any of Ramiel's arc) on a Warshade, it's a piece of cake. Set your difficulty to +0x8, and there's a good enough group for a decent eclipse/double mire right outside the room where trapdoor is. Buff up, grab a fluffy, and proceed to beat the crap out of Trapdoor. My Warshade killed him in under 30 seconds, and he killed the Honoree/Holtz in just barely longer... The room where the AV's are is so littered with enemies that you can keep your damage at 300% pretty much the whole time. You also have an endless supply of fluffies. I completely ignore the Rikti in the room and focus on the EB's.
being more familiar with the mission and having played my WS a bit (I definitely was rusty on that one), I can see that it would actually have been pretty easy.
I got some help and it's not done.
My PB doesn't run any IOs to speak of, I never took the time to IOs him out properly (was working on other characters).
He does run a bunch of Hammis though, which is the other reason I didn't give him IO priority.
Here's the build as exported by Titan Sentinel. as you can see it's still a build with legacy stamina. He's on the list for a respec but I may wait till i21 and hte Kheldian changes.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.942
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Pilou: Level 50 Natural Peacebringer
Primary Power Set: Luminous Blast
Secondary Power Set: Luminous Aura
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Concealment
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Glinting Eye -- HO:Centri(A)
Level 1: Incandescence -- ResDam(A)
Level 2: Shining Shield -- ResDam(A), ResDam(3), ResDam(3)
Level 4: Essence Boost -- RechRdx(A), RechRdx(5), RechRdx(5)
Level 6: Bright Nova -- HO:Cyto(A), EndMod(7), EndMod(7)
Level 8: Radiant Strike -- Acc(A), Dmg(9), Dmg(9), Dmg(11), EndRdx(11)
Level 10: Hasten -- RechRdx(A)
Level 12: Build Up -- HO:Membr(A), RechRdx(13)
Level 14: Super Speed -- Run(A)
Level 16: Stealth -- EndRdx(A)
Level 18: Incandescent Strike -- HO:Endo(A), HO:Perox(19), HO:Perox(21), HO:Nucle(21), EndRdx(23)
Level 20: White Dwarf -- ResDam(A), ResDam(23), ResDam(25), EndMod(25), EndMod(27), EndMod(27)
Level 22: Reform Essence -- HO:Golgi(A)
Level 24: Conserve Energy -- RechRdx(A)
Level 26: Pulsar -- HO:Endo(A), HO:Endo(29), Dsrnt(29)
Level 28: Quantum Flight -- EndRdx(A)
Level 30: Solar Flare -- HO:Lyso(A), Dmg(31), Dmg(31), Dmg(31), HO:Enzym(33)
Level 32: Photon Seekers -- Dmg(A), Dmg(33), Dmg(33), RechRdx(34), RechRdx(34), RechRdx(34)
Level 35: Dawn Strike -- Dmg(A), Dmg(36), Dmg(36), RechRdx(36), RechRdx(37), RechRdx(37)
Level 38: Light Form -- ResDam(A), RechRdx(39), RechRdx(40), RechRdx(40), EndMod(40), HO:Ribo(42)
Level 41: Gleaming Blast -- Acc(A), HO:Centri(42), HO:Centri(42), Dmg(43), EndRdx(43)
Level 44: Restore Essence -- RechRdx(A)
Level 47: Glowing Touch -- Heal(A)
Level 49: Proton Scatter -- Acc(A), Dmg(50), Dmg(50), Dmg(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run(A)
Level 1: Energy Flight -- Flight(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx(A)
Level 10: Combat Flight -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Cosmic Balance
Level 4: Ninja Run
------------
Level 1: Bright Nova Bolt -- Dmg(A)
Level 1: Bright Nova Blast -- HO:Nucle(A), HO:Centri(13), HO:Centri(15), EndRdx(15)
Level 1: Bright Nova Scatter -- HO:Nucle(A), HO:Centri(17), HO:Centri(17), HO:Enzym(19)
Level 1: Bright Nova Detonation -- HO:Nucle(A), HO:Centri(37), HO:Centri(39), HO:Enzym(39)
Level 1: White Dwarf Strike -- Acc(A)
Level 1: White Dwarf Smite -- Acc(A), Dmg(43), Dmg(45), Dmg(45)
Level 1: White Dwarf Flare -- HO:Nucle(A), Dmg(45), Dmg(46)
Level 1: White Dwarf Sublimation -- HO:Golgi(A), RechRdx(46), Heal(46), RechRdx(48)
Level 1: White Dwarf Step -- EndRdx(A)
Level 1: White Dwarf Antagonize -- Acc(A), Taunt(48), RechRdx(48)
Ya on SOs that's probably not going to happen. I did that mission this weekend on my pb as well (getting him ready for the changes), and, while I took the other one out, I had to call in some help for honeree. I would almost have him and he would heal or pop a tier 9.
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Makes me feel a little better.
At least it was nice to see he couldn't kill me either, we were just in stalemate, although in the end he would probably get me since I needed to pop blues after LF crash
Quote:
Snag the temp power "envenomed Dagger" and see how much difference that makes for you. Massive -regen plus decent damage. If you were stalemated, then I suspect they would be enough to take you over the edge against him.
|
Originally Posted by Papaschtroumpf
Makes me feel a little better.
At least it was nice to see he couldn't kill me either, we were just in stalemate, although in the end he would probably get me since I needed to pop blues after LF crash |
"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
I had trouble doing this mission on my PB too. If you're using SO's, that is probably the problem. Your Dark Defender was probably able to do it because Dark has massively awesome debuffs... Peacebringers don't.
To be completely honest with you, you really need an IO build if you don't have one already. |
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Microcosm
Ya on SOs that's probably not going to happen.
|
This statement is complete and utter BS. You do not "need" an IO build in the least for this, on a PB or any other AT. Inspirations, sure. And the envenomed dagger is useful, sure. But you do not need an IO build any more than you need to have green in your costume's colors.
What I soloed him on:
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.942
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Voidbane: Level 50 Natural Peacebringer
Primary Power Set: Luminous Blast
Secondary Power Set: Luminous Aura
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Concealment
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leadership
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Gleaming Bolt -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(3), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Dmg-I(5), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), RechRdx-I(7)
Level 1: Incandescence -- S'fstPrt-ResKB(A), ResDam-I(7), ResDam-I(9)
Level 2: Glinting Eye -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Acc-I(9), Dmg-I(11), Dmg-I(11), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(13), RechRdx-I(13)
Level 4: Essence Boost -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(15), Heal-I(15), Heal-I(17), Heal-I(17)
Level 6: Gleaming Blast -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Acc-I(19), Dmg-I(19), Dmg-I(21), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21), RechRdx-I(23)
Level 8: Radiant Strike -- Acc-I(A), Acc-I(23), Dmg-I(25), Dmg-I(25), Dmg(27), RechRdx-I(27)
Level 10: Proton Scatter -- Acc-I(A), Acc-I(29), Dmg-I(29), Dmg-I(31), Dmg(31), RechRdx-I(31)
Level 12: Build Up -- RechRdx(A)
Level 14: Hasten -- RechRdx(A), RechRdx(33)
Level 16: Shining Shield -- EndRdx-I(A), ResDam-I(33), ResDam-I(33)
Level 18: Incandescent Strike -- Acc-I(A), Acc(34), Dmg(34), Dmg(34), Dmg(36), RechRdx-I(36)
Level 20: Quantum Shield -- EndRdx-I(A), ResDam-I(36)
Level 22: Reform Essence -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(37), Heal(37), Heal-I(37), Heal-I(39)
Level 24: Conserve Energy -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 26: Solar Flare -- Acc-I(A), Acc(39), Dmg(39), Dmg(40), Dmg(40), RechRdx(40)
Level 28: Quantum Flight -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 30: Stealth -- EndRdx(A)
Level 32: Dawn Strike -- Acc-I(A), Acc(42), Dmg(42), Dmg(42), Dmg(43), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 35: Restore Essence -- Heal(A)
Level 38: Light Form -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(43), EndMod(45), ResDam(45)
Level 41: Photon Seekers -- Acc(A), Acc(45), Dmg(46), Dmg(46), Dmg(46), RechRdx(48)
Level 44: Kick -- Empty(A)
Level 47: Tough -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(48), ResDam-I(48), ResDam-I(50)
Level 49: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Energy Flight -- Winter-ResSlow(A)
Level 10: Combat Flight -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Flight-I(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Heal(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(50), EndMod-I(50)
Level 1: Cosmic Balance
Level 4: Ninja Run
------------
And...
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.942
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Therra Paladina: Level 50 Natural Peacebringer
Primary Power Set: Luminous Blast
Secondary Power Set: Luminous Aura
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Concealment
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Gleaming Bolt -- Acc(A), Dmg(3), Dmg(3), Dmg(5)
Level 1: Incandescence -- S'fstPrt-ResKB(A), ResDam-I(5)
Level 2: Gleaming Blast -- Acc(A), Dmg(7), Dmg(7), Dmg(9)
Level 4: Essence Boost -- RechRdx(A), Heal(9), Heal(11), Heal(11)
Level 6: Bright Nova -- GSFC-Build%(A)
Level 8: Radiant Strike -- Acc(A), Acc(13), Dmg(13), Dmg(15), Dmg(15), RechRdx(17)
Level 10: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Build Up -- RechRdx(A)
Level 14: Shining Shield -- EndRdx(A), ResDam(17)
Level 16: Proton Scatter -- Acc(A), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(19), Posi-Dmg/Rng(19)
Level 18: Incandescent Strike -- HO:Endo(A), Acc(21), HO:Perox(21), Dmg(23), Dmg(23), RechRdx(25)
Level 20: White Dwarf -- Winter-ResSlow(A), ResDam(25), ResDam(27), ResDam(27)
Level 22: Reform Essence -- RechRdx(A), Heal(29), Heal(29), Heal(31)
Level 24: Conserve Energy -- RechRdx(A)
Level 26: Solar Flare -- Acc(A)
Level 28: Quantum Flight -- EndRdx(A)
Level 30: Combat Jumping -- Krma-ResKB(A)
Level 32: Dawn Strike -- Acc(A), Dmg(33), Dmg(34), Dmg(34)
Level 35: Restore Essence -- Empty(A)
Level 38: Light Form -- RechRdx(A), RechRdx(39)
Level 41: Photon Seekers -- Acc(A), Dmg(42), Dmg(42), RechRdx(43)
Level 44: Quantum Shield -- ResDam(A)
Level 47: Stealth -- Empty(A)
Level 49: Invisibility -- Empty(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Energy Flight -- Empty(A)
Level 10: Combat Flight -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Heal(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(50), EndMod(50)
Level 1: Cosmic Balance
Level 4: Ninja Run
------------
Level 1: Bright Nova Bolt -- Acc(A), RechRdx(31), Dmg(31), Dmg(33), Dmg(33)
Level 1: Bright Nova Blast -- Acc(A), RechRdx(34), Dmg(36), Dmg(36), Dmg(36)
Level 1: Bright Nova Scatter -- Acc(A), Posi-Dmg/Rng(37), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(37), Dmg(37), Dmg(39), Posi-Acc/Dmg(39)
Level 1: Bright Nova Detonation -- Acc(A), RechRdx(40), Dmg(40), Dmg(40), Dmg(42)
Level 1: White Dwarf Strike -- Acc(A), Dmg(43), Dmg(43), Dmg(45)
Level 1: White Dwarf Smite -- Acc(A), Dmg(45), Dmg(45), Dmg(46)
Level 1: White Dwarf Flare -- Acc(A), Dmg(46), Dmg(46), Dmg(48)
Level 1: White Dwarf Sublimation -- RechRdx(A), Heal(48), Heal(48), Heal(50)
Level 1: White Dwarf Step -- Jnt-EndRdx(A)
Level 1: White Dwarf Antagonize -- Mocking-Rchg(A)
(The HOs are actually *more recent* than the Alpha unlock arc.)
So anyone saying he's "unsoloable without an IO build" is, as I said, full of it. The only character I've teamed to beat him on was my Shield/Stone tank - and that's solely because my friends that were part of the group that character was running to 50 with were running it then.
Edit: Hell, I soloed the arc on my *Earth/FF* and *Ice/Emp* controllers. You can't get much lower damage than that. So if you want to insist that you can't do this on an SO'd PB... yeah, right.
Um, neither of those are pure SO builds. The second one doesn't have end redux in the attacks, so I'm not even sure how you run it unless you sit around and wait for either lightform or conserve power, unless that's your form build? My build has two to three damage SO's per power with acc/rech/endredux as needed, and while I could get him downhe would pop his tier 9 or heal and I couldn't finish him in time of lightform.
The Inspiration Maker's Guide [i12] UPDATED with POPMENUS and Movement Binds!
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Kheldian Inspiration Macros UPDATED with POPMENUS and Movement Binds!
Guide to the Katana~Ninja Blade/Electric [i23]
Waah, waah, waah. The little bit that isn't SO doesn't have that big of an effect. What, one KB protection? A few HOs? You think that makes such a HUGE difference to invalidate the point that your "You can't do that on pure SOs" is complete BS when I *did* do so? If we were looking at, say, a build with five LotGs you'd almost have a point. But we're not, are we? Oh, no, the first one has *A* set of thunderstrikes, look at my capped ranged defen... wait, barely have any. I can outdo what the *few* pieces I have in there give me with single small inspirations. So, yeah, quit whinging that Voidbane's "not a pure SO build." It's close enough to make no difference.
And just because YOU don't know how to run the second build doesn't mean *I* don't. (Hmm. Rather like Knockback use....) No sitting and waiting needed. That second one? I've run her since issue *4.* ON... guess what. Go ahead, guess. Hint 1, those HOs are newer for the most part than the alpha slot. Hint 2, IOs didn't exist when I rolled her OR got her to 50. It is a true Triform build, not a "forms with human buff" build. The build's morphed - it's pretty much respecced to try something different with a triform about once a year, quite honestly, different emphasis on different areas - but that's where it was when Alpha came out (haven't redone it since.)
Quote:
Wow, the amount of venom dripping from that post is a bit shocking. By the way, I didn't say "You can't do that on pure SOs," I said "Ya on SOs that's probably not going to happen," because I didn't quite pull it off on SOs either.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Waah, waah, waah. The little bit that isn't SO doesn't have that big of an effect. What, one KB protection? A few HOs? You think that makes such a HUGE difference to invalidate the point that your "You can't do that on pure SOs" is complete BS when I *did* do so? If we were looking at, say, a build with five LotGs you'd almost have a point. But we're not, are we? Oh, no, the first one has *A* set of thunderstrikes, look at my capped ranged defen... wait, barely have any. I can outdo what the *few* pieces I have in there give me with single small inspirations. So, yeah, quit whinging that Voidbane's "not a pure SO build." It's close enough to make no difference.
And just because YOU don't know how to run the second build doesn't mean *I* don't. (Hmm. Rather like Knockback use....) No sitting and waiting needed. That second one? I've run her since issue *4.* ON... guess what. Go ahead, guess. Hint 1, those HOs are newer for the most part than the alpha slot. Hint 2, IOs didn't exist when I rolled her OR got her to 50. It is a true Triform build, not a "forms with human buff" build. The build's morphed - it's pretty much respecced to try something different with a triform about once a year, quite honestly, different emphasis on different areas - but that's where it was when Alpha came out (haven't redone it since.) |
Also, notice the part of my post about the second build ended with a question mark. That meant I was asking a question.
On knockback, while I dislike it in certain powers, I have always respected your opinion of it when you brought it up, which you can go back and check various threads for if you want.
I would normally ask you to enlighten me as to what I did wrong when I fought Honoree, because clearly it was something, but at this point I don't care what you have to say. I used to like you, but you have become such a complete *** in your "must defend peacebringers at all costs" crusade that I don't give a flying tentacle what you think. Nice job.
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Quote:
You mean much like several peoples "Must slam peacebringers and give the impression they can't do jack" posts in pretty much every bloody thread? Because that's sure what it starts feeling like when it's almost all you hear, over and over. Or is putting down PBs over and over perfectly fine? That'd be a bit of a double standard, wouldn't you think? But that's what I see done and *encouraged* - or at least certainly not DIScouraged - over and over.|
Originally Posted by Microcosm
I would normally ask you to enlighten me as to what I did wrong when I fought Honoree, because clearly it was something, but at this point I don't care what you have to say. I used to like you, but you have become such a complete *** in your "must defend peacebringers at all costs" crusade that I don't give a flying tentacle what you think. Nice job.
|
Much like (and I know this comment wasn't you) "MF PB guide" - "Select PB, go back and select Warshade." Yeah. Helpful. And irritating in the extreme. "It's a joke" a few posts later - but think of the impact of seeing that on someone looking for help and information. And the impression it gives of the AT. Hell, as Khelds, we still have people insisting we do nothing but hide because we get one-shot from every Void or Quantum and every Cyst is an instant team-wipe (and/or declaring they won't invite Khelds to a team because of it, no matter how out of date it is.)
Sorry, but yes, the whole "Let's slam PBs" bit has gotten VERY tiring. As said elsewhere, I don't think I've ever seen a forum so devoted to making people NOT play one of its ATs. Then you go out to the REST of the forum....
And then you turn around with the "Neither of those are pure SO builds" which, quite frankly, felt like trying to nitpick to me to invalidate it and *keep* with that same forum "vibe" of "Make sure people think PBs are worthless, go worship at the shrine of Warshade." So, yes, given the way the forum in general seems to be about PBs, I read that as essentially trying to invalidate the fact that yes, I *did* do this on a non-IOd, essentially SO build. Twice. So no, your question, given all that did NOT come across as an actual question. If that wasn't your intent - re-read the rest of this and see just why.
(Edit Re: the knockback comment. That was more general, but I see how you can read it as me directing that to you specifically. Not intended, it was meant to be general.)
If I've completely misread you and owe you an apology, I'm sorry - but make sure you see WHY I read it that way. Because that *is* how the whole thing came off to me.
Quote:
A lot of what you're referring to are jokes made by people who also play Peacebringers, myself for instance. It sort of seems like you take it to heart a bit too much, but that's just my opinion.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
You mean much like several peoples "Must slam peacebringers and give the impression they can't do jack" posts in pretty much every bloody thread? Because that's sure what it starts feeling like when it's almost all you hear, over and over. Or is putting down PBs over and over perfectly fine? That'd be a bit of a double standard, wouldn't you think? But that's what I see done and *encouraged* - or at least certainly not DIScouraged - over and over.
|
Quote:
| Much like (and I know this comment wasn't you) "MF PB guide" - "Select PB, go back and select Warshade." Yeah. Helpful. And irritating in the extreme. "It's a joke" a few posts later - but think of the impact of seeing that on someone looking for help and information. |
And it might have been pretty obvious that I didn't mean anything malicious with it by anyone who glanced an inch down their monitor and noticed the only other character of mine who is in my signature besides my Warshade. What's that? A Peacebringer?
Quote:
|
And the impression it gives of the AT. Hell, as Khelds, we still have people insisting we do nothing but hide because we get one-shot from every Void or Quantum and every Cyst is an instant team-wipe (and/or declaring they won't invite Khelds to a team because of it, no matter how out of date it is.) Sorry, but yes, the whole "Let's slam PBs" bit has gotten VERY tiring. As said elsewhere, I don't think I've ever seen a forum so devoted to making people NOT play one of its ATs. Then you go out to the REST of the forum.... |
Quote:
| And then you turn around with the "Neither of those are pure SO builds" which, quite frankly, felt like trying to nitpick to me to invalidate it and *keep* with that same forum "vibe" of "Make sure people think PBs are worthless, go worship at the shrine of Warshade." So, yes, given the way the forum in general seems to be about PBs, I read that as essentially trying to invalidate the fact that yes, I *did* do this on a non-IOd, essentially SO build. Twice. So no, your question, given all that did NOT come across as an actual question. If that wasn't your intent - re-read the rest of this and see just why. |
If you managed to do it, that's really awesome and I'm glad that you relayed that experience here, but that doesn't mean that people who didn't have that same experience aren't allowed to relay that, too.
Quote:
Now stop and think how that actually looks. |
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Yeah, that was me. Notice that I didn't make the joke until after the OP was already linked to a helpful guide. One that, I think, you wrote.
And it might have been pretty obvious that I didn't mean anything malicious with it by anyone who glanced an inch down their monitor and noticed the only other character of mine who is in my signature besides my Warshade. What's that? A Peacebringer? |
"This person tells me to stop rolling a peacebringer and roll a warshade instead. *And they have both.* If they play one and think it's that bad, maybe I shouldn't even bother," as opposed to, "oh, ha ha ha."
The "jokes" don't come across as "jokes" at all, especially with the AT getting unfairly slammed here and everywhere else.
Quote:
|
Er, I would probably have trouble with the Incarnate Arc on my Warshade if he used an SO build too (But I'm not sure, he's been IO'd since before he did that arc.) SO's are just not the best way to get anything to perform optimally. Based on my experience having tried to do that mission on an SO'd Peacebringer, it didn't seem like something that was viable to accomplish. If you managed to do it, that's really awesome and I'm glad that you relayed that experience here, but that doesn't mean that people who didn't have that same experience aren't allowed to relay that, too. |
Compare to, say, GavinRuneblade - "Grab an envenomed dagger, the -regen will probably be enough to put you over the edge."
Now, which sounds more useful? And which sounds like PS up there should just not bother because it's too underpowered? (And as mentioned, I soloed this on my Earth/FF and Ice/Emp, which makes pretty much *anything* else look like a damage powerhouse.)
I have no problem with people saying they have trouble. Because they do, regardless of AT or powerset. Maybe it's settings, maybe it's approach, maybe it's slotting - that's what the forums, among other things, are here for. I *do* have a problem with basically saying "Nope, you can't do it without sinking INF into an IO build" when it's simply not true. If it were, with as much as I like PBs, I'd be insisting they were in need of fixing - because, quite frankly,SOs are where things are supposedly balanced.
If I were fairly sure this could not be done on SOs and it wasn't *me* (which, yes, *is* the first thing I check - I'll run something multiple times to see if it's a tactic that needs changing, a temp power I could use (see curse breaker,) or if I'm missing a "tell" from the NPC that will otherwise keep me from getting killed,) my next step would be coming here - and if it were universal, I'd start being a royal PITA to the devs about it (see 1 1/2 years of fighting for Sonic Dispersion graphics, and picking up right where I left off on Barrier.)
Edit:
Quite frankly, I think people are too hung up on "OMG I need to IO out everything for perma-recharged-insta-super-this-that-the-other" to pay attention to what the powers do *without* them. Perform "optimally?" Perform decently on SOs - frankly I've never had anyone complain about my SO'd builds. Nobody really can tell the difference. I'm not sitting back, sucking wind and plinking for 1-2 damage while IO'd builds of the same sets are nuking spawns. And yet paging through you'll see and hear people complaining that "I just can't play this character without my IOs/permahasten/etc/etc/etc." If they took away IOs tomorrow, I'd have a few respecs to do things like toss Acrobatics back on my Fire and Dark tanks/scrappers, maybe rearrange a few slots, and I'd be back in business. Even on my heavily-IOd builds, frankly, I wouldn't break a sweat. Because I built them to work properly *without* them.
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That's fair enough, I will make a point to be more mindful of that in the future. |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Now stop and think how that actually looks.
"This person tells me to stop rolling a peacebringer and roll a warshade instead. *And they have both.* If they play one and think it's that bad, maybe I shouldn't even bother," as opposed to, "oh, ha ha ha." The "jokes" don't come across as "jokes" at all, especially with the AT getting unfairly slammed here and everywhere else. |
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There's a difference between "I had trouble with it" and "Yeah, you can't do that." Look at what you said - "To be completely honest with you, you really need an IO build if you don't have one already." Compare to, say, GavinRuneblade - "Grab an envenomed dagger, the -regen will probably be enough to put you over the edge." |
My experience was that the task the OP was having trouble with was going to be pretty rough. If you read the rest of my post, I also suggested devouring inspirations, going in, and taking one of the EB's out before they wear off.
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Now, which sounds more useful? And which sounds like PS up there should just not bother because it's too underpowered? (And as mentioned, I soloed this on my Earth/FF and Ice/Emp, which makes pretty much *anything* else look like a damage powerhouse.) I have no problem with people saying they have trouble. Because they do, regardless of AT or powerset. Maybe it's settings, maybe it's approach, maybe it's slotting - that's what the forums, among other things, are here for. I *do* have a problem with basically saying "Nope, you can't do it without sinking INF into an IO build" when it's simply not true. If it were, with as much as I like PBs, I'd be insisting they were in need of fixing - because, quite frankly,SOs are where things are supposedly balanced. |
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If I were fairly sure this could not be done on SOs and it wasn't *me* (which, yes, *is* the first thing I check - I'll run something multiple times to see if it's a tactic that needs changing, a temp power I could use (see curse breaker,) or if I'm missing a "tell" from the NPC that will otherwise keep me from getting killed,) my next step would be coming here - and if it were universal, I'd start being a royal PITA to the devs about it (see 1 1/2 years of fighting for Sonic Dispersion graphics, and picking up right where I left off on Barrier.) Edit: Quite frankly, I think people are too hung up on "OMG I need to IO out everything for perma-recharged-insta-super-this-that-the-other" to pay attention to what the powers do *without* them. Perform "optimally?" Perform decently on SOs - frankly I've never had anyone complain about my SO'd builds. Nobody really can tell the difference. I'm not sitting back, sucking wind and plinking for 1-2 damage while IO'd builds of the same sets are nuking spawns. And yet paging through you'll see and hear people complaining that "I just can't play this character without my IOs/permahasten/etc/etc/etc." If they took away IOs tomorrow, I'd have a few respecs to do things like toss Acrobatics back on my Fire and Dark tanks/scrappers, maybe rearrange a few slots, and I'd be back in business. Even on my heavily-IOd builds, frankly, I wouldn't break a sweat. Because I built them to work properly *without* them. |
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I'm not telling everyone else to feel the same way. But to me, having a good grasp of an SO'd out character provides a far *better* foundation for IOing out, if you choose to do that. And that - again - it seems that people are getting (IMHO) far too reliant on IOs. It's one thing to say "And when you IO out the build, it takes you from *here* to *here!*" and another to say "It's unplayable/I can't see playing it without IOs." What if you had to? (See some of the Freedom announcements.) |
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Well that's all well and good, if you prefer not to use IO's on your builds I don't think anyone here is going to tell you that you're doing it wrong or your builds suck.. But a lot of people also like using IO's. They make things smoother, they help realize a character's full potential. If that's not how you feel, then more power to you, but that doesn't mean you should expect everyone else to feel the same way.
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Now, here's the part where you say "I'm glad you're not a dev." See, there were rumors way back when that Hami-os "might have a cost" (or drawback) sometime "in the future." And you know what - I like the idea. And I'd be tickled to find content where something is actively working against IO buffs (looking specifically at set bonuses.) Not to "stick it to" anyone, but to remove that crutch, much like we've seen a rise in heavy -def and the like in late game content. (I remember people howling hate at the rogue Vanguard they ran into with their melee... while my squishy controllers sat back and asked "What's the problem?")
Now, obviously this would be temporary - I'd love to see part of it where you have to fight to various devices and disable them to start getting your powers back, which would also buff the SO'd/lightly IO'd characters, so at the end the IO'd characters are at full strength and the SO'd are buffed - but I'd find it interesting *just* to see how the folks on IOs would do.
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I've told you this before, but I haven't started to IO out my Peacebringer yet (waiting for i21.) He's currently on a tri-form SO build, and he's still my second favorite character to play. I never said you can't do anything, I just didn't think it would be possible to solo the Honoree mission without one, really, except maybe with excessive inspiration usage. Temp powers could work too.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
I'm not telling everyone else to feel the same way. But to me, having a good grasp of an SO'd out character provides a far *better* foundation for IOing out, if you choose to do that. And that - again - it seems that people are getting (IMHO) far too reliant on IOs. It's one thing to say "And when you IO out the build, it takes you from *here* to *here!*" and another to say "It's unplayable/I can't see playing it without IOs." What if you had to? (See some of the Freedom announcements.)
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| Now, here's the part where you say "I'm glad you're not a dev." See, there were rumors way back when that Hami-os "might have a cost" (or drawback) sometime "in the future." And you know what - I like the idea. And I'd be tickled to find content where something is actively working against IO buffs (looking specifically at set bonuses.) Not to "stick it to" anyone, but to remove that crutch, much like we've seen a rise in heavy -def and the like in late game content. (I remember people howling hate at the rogue Vanguard they ran into with their melee... while my squishy controllers sat back and asked "What's the problem?") |
And for the record Bill, I still like you (but I do think you should stop spitting venom at Microcosm
)
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Don't get me started on Incarnate content and power creep... honestly, I should open up a coffee shop with as much grinding out of those trials as the devs want you to do.|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Heh, Incarnate content already bypasses the entire concept of building for survivability... But I already started a thread about that.
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And for the record Bill, I still like you (but I do think you should stop spitting venom at Microcosm )
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Alright, this is good. I think it's time for all the Warshades and Peacebringers to bring it in and hug it out.
Since peacebringers have plenty of knockback in their attacks, I'd suggest tossing that silly Trapdoor into the lava and letting him burn. It worked quite well with my En/En stalker with the soon-to-be-retired Repulse power 
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Originally Posted by Zemblanity
Since peacebringers have plenty of knockback in their attacks, I'd suggest tossing that silly Trapdoor into the lava and letting him burn. It worked quite well with my En/En stalker with the soon-to-be-retired Repulse power
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The trouble the OP was having was with the Honoree mission, I think.
I think he needs IOs or roll a warshade
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couldn't resist
1. Why Soft Cap is Important : http://dechskaison.blogspot.com/2011...important.html
2. Limits: http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Limits
3. Attack Mechanics: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Attack_Mechanics
4. Rule of Five: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Rule_o...e_Law_of_Fives
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or even better...both!
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Originally Posted by plainguy
I think he needs IOs or roll a warshade
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I guess these last two posts just prove Bill's point. :/
I recently came back to the game, and I'm a bit rusty, but I see "bragging threads" about how people take down AVs with their Kheldian.
since I just came back to the game, I needed to unlock my alpha slot on all my 50s by running Ramiel's arc.
I soloed it with my blaster, didn't even try to solo with my WS (no corpses to help with trapdoor).
I was able to get through Trapdoor on my Dark/Sonic Defender but logged before the Lady Grey missions.
When I logged back on later, it was on my PB instead and I tried to do the arc but could get get through the Lady Grey mission with him.
Try as I might I couldn't get The Honoree down, his regen always gets the better of me, even with LF+Hasten(+Conserve Energy).
so how do you gets get AVs on your PB? do you get temp powers, shivans, etc...?