Yeah with the new level shift, I may eventually level my Ninja/FF.
Being higher level means you get hit less (you don't have higher HP) and you deal more damage and your debuffs work better.
I still doubt that Genins won't die in one hit but at least with 48+2, their damage output could be a lot higher (when it counts). The pets still do zero damage when they just die.
Mmmm, resistance seems to be better with higher level. I may start alpha with my 50 Necro/Pain.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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I'm not saying this to disagree with any of the sentiments in this thread; I'm just in here checking up on MMs since a buddy of mine is resubbing and really digs them. Thought I'd see what's what. |
Originally Posted by JD_Gumby
The trial doesn't make any mobility demands on Masterminds, except for the turrets. It's the impatient and inconsiderate players (mostly Tankers, Scrappers and Brutes, with a smattering of the others) who don't want to bother steamrollering the collection phase (generally taking longer than if each team had stayed together) that make the demands and which make Lambda an extremely crappy experience.
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Full disclosure: I actually see how you guys have some legit complaints about aspects of the iTrials.As one of those brute/scrappers that bounces from one cansiter/crate to the next, I'm sorry that makes you upset - but I don't expect you to try to keep up. Frankly, I'm not trying to be inconsiderate, but I just don't need to wait. I've never been on a team that wanted to clear those maps, universally my experience has been to speed that section. YMMV as I can't speak for all teams, obviously. I can take the alphas, I can take the sustained damage long enough to kill the canister, and I move on.
Do what an MM on one of my recent runs did; slowly progress through the map wiping mobs along the way while we speed from objective to objective across the map.
A: You'll generate drops and iXp (if you need it) and B: people end up looping through the maps, or getting lost, or returning from the hopsital anyway, so it's probably not a bad idea to have a couple folks clearing the spawns.
Anyway, we're not trying to be inconsiderate, we're just trying to finish the phase and get to the part where we push Marauder's face in.
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Absolutely! |
Originally Posted by MayorOfAngrytown
I'm not saying this to disagree with any of the sentiments in this thread; I'm just in here checking up on MMs since a buddy of mine is resubbing and really digs them. Thought I'd see what's what.
Full disclosure: I actually see how you guys have some legit complaints about aspects of the iTrials.As one of those brute/scrappers that bounces from one cansiter/crate to the next, I'm sorry that makes you upset - but I don't expect you to try to keep up. Frankly, I'm not trying to be inconsiderate, but I just don't need to wait. I've never been on a team that wanted to clear those maps, universally my experience has been to speed that section. YMMV as I can't speak for all teams, obviously. I can take the alphas, I can take the sustained damage long enough to kill the canister, and I move on. Do what an MM on one of my recent runs did; slowly progress through the map wiping mobs along the way while we speed from objective to objective across the map. A: You'll generate drops and iXp (if you need it) and B: people end up looping through the maps, or getting lost, or returning from the hopsital anyway, so it's probably not a bad idea to have a couple folks clearing the spawns. Anyway, we're not trying to be inconsiderate, we're just trying to finish the phase and get to the part where we push Marauder's face in. |
I doubt many, if any of us MM's actually expect anyone to slow down for us, and thats really our main complaint. I manage to contribute during this phase anyway, to varying degrees based on the abilities of the MM I'm playing. But I think we mostly just feel bad for not pulling our weight in this stuff. Sure we can make up for it later -- I've never got the booby prize -- but still.
My main concern is not so much to do with MM being slow. I am more frustrated about the erratic movement of the pets instead; and the distance they often falling behind when the MM moves.
The defining trait of MMs is their ability to use pets to do their fighting - as much as other ATs using their fists, weapon, etc. I find it ironic that pets do seem to have their own mind when it comes to doing their job; and some of them (ninja, of course) are nigh uncontrollable in some circumstances. It is like a DPs or a DBs left one of its pistols or swords behind and have to go back to pick it up. Or lost it and have to reorder it from the manufacturer again - then wait for the delivery. Or one of the pistols thinks it is better to go in melee range to smack the boss in the face while the other is rather contented to stay back a bit.
Of course, other ATs have their own shortcomings too: for instance, stone armour is inherently slow and some ATs are squishies. And there are ways to get around the problem: stoner are up to the hilt with recharge and speed, and the squishies are soft-capped one way or the other. But that does not mean that improvements are not necessary. Improvement of QoL helps the players to enjoy the contents more instead of dealing with those little bits of nuisances here and there.
The level-shift is going to improve the QoL of MM by quite a bit (and thanks to the explanation above, I now know how it works). But still a matter of movement needs to be dealt with. Tough pets do the MM and the team no good if they are 100ft away out of line of sight and buff/supremacy range attracting the attention of a group of angry mob.
Hmmmm, I just might take my MM through the trials after that change.
For Lambda I was thinking as a Poisoner I would stealth and fly along with whoever is busting crates and hit the crates with Envenom and Weakness and then throw in some single target attacks on the crate as well. Would that be an OK contribution on that part?
Same thing I suppose with the turrets.
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Indeed, I don't expect the melee players to slow down. I do, however expect them to try to keep up with me.
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Originally Posted by Lewisite
I doubt many, if any of us MM's actually expect anyone to slow down for us, and thats really our main complaint.
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MFing THIS.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Indeed, I don't expect the melee players to slow down. I do, however expect them to try to keep up with me.
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Where to now?
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Now that's what I like to hear! |
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Indeed, I don't expect the melee players to slow down. I do, however expect them to try to keep up with me.
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fwiw: The iTrials are only a fraction of the content (even at lvl 50) and MMs can steamroll things by themselves that would leave my brutes/scrapys eating pavement repeatedly. I know you guys rock, just wanted to clear up the "inconsiderate" thing.
Dechs - bring a DKTF to Virtue sometime? I got toons that burn for every spawn to be their "first time." (noting your rules from another thread).
The strategy that works for me with my Ninjas/Thermal for the Lambda goes like this.
Defeat 60
Nothing different. It is nice being a Mastermind here because once my pets are up and ready I can send them in while spending my time buffing the rest of the league.
Turrets
Here is where I understand some of the grief. The pets are too slow to hit all of the turrets. I find that sending them after the next turret while the league takes out the current one works best. Then I just follow along and heal/buff when necessary.
Security Team
Pretty standard "Hahaha I killed all your pets with my sneeze!" Strong target.
Sabotage
The first time I ran through with my Mastermind I indeed felt out of place. After playing through it a few times thought I found a nice little groove that works for me.
Me: I find a strong looking teammate and latch myself onto them. (If the majority of the team stays together even better!) That teammate, and anyone who is close enough, gets my buffs and heals. It's my job to make sure they stay alive long enough to defeat the target and move on.
Pets:
Genins and Oni are summoned and buffed when we reach the target, and desummoned when the target is defeated and we move on. Depending on how fast the team is moving, I may alternate between the two rather than summon both.
Jounin are always summoned and buffed. The second upgrade gives them Hide, so they are able to Passively follow me without dragging along extra agro while we move to the next target.
Personally I like the 'buff bot' mentality, but I can see why others would not like my way of doing things.
Maurader
Fundamentally another typical AV fight, however there are two things that really irk me.
Artillery Bombs (That 'You're too far from Maurader' attack) are just completely and utterly stupid and need to be removed. Plain as that.
Heavy Commanders suck. The normal agro magnets are locked on to Maurader, so they can't stop the commanders from killing my pets and me with their attack chain of [Massive Damage AoE]+[Massive Damage AoE]+[Massive Damage AoE]+...
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There's two problems with that. It is auto hit, so no amount of defense will stop it. It automatically does 99% (or was it 95%?) damage to you regardless of your Resistance or Hitpoints. If you are damaged at all before, or immediately after the attack you're out of luck. It is best just to avoid it.|
Originally Posted by CptAdder
For the rest of us just blitz it, it is the hardest content (Aside from the damn shadow shard) in the game and with a Tier 3 Barrier it's quite possible to stay in Melee with Maurader, just wait for his warning to go off, count to 4 then fire off your barrier, the attack should arrive 2-3 seconds later and you and your pets will be at 90% to everything and the attack should miss them all, and if it does hit you hey one-shot rule back off and eat your inspirations and get back in there.
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Against pets, however, the attack only takes about half of their health. Depending on your secondary, they might be able to survive in melee range.
Favorite Hero: Computer (Empathy/Energy Blast Defender)
Favorite Villain: Gimp Computer (Fire Control/Psionic Assault Dominator)
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+6
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Originally Posted by Computer
Artillery Bombs (That 'You're too far from Maurader' attack) are just completely and utterly stupid and need to be removed. Plain as that.
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It's the end. But the moment has been prepared for ...
So currently the lower tier minions generally have a lower base damage than the higher tier ones but this damage is further reduced by the purple patch. Assuming you're fighting enemies that are +4 to you your top minions will do 48% of his base damage but your basic minions will do only 15% of their base damage. With this change all of your minions will do 48% of their base damage. You with no other level shifts your basic minions are having their damage TRIPLED.
Similarly against +4s your top tier minion has a base hit chance of 39% versus 20% for the basic minions, with this change they will all have 39% against +4s.
The damage they take is similarly reduced. Currently +4s will deal 44% more damage to your top minion and 66% more damage to your basic minions (who will also be hit quite a bit more). With this change all minions will take only 44% more damage.
Now once you get your level shifts the bonus is smaller but your basic pets will still be doing about 38% more damage than they currently do as well as being more accurate and taking about 17% less damage.
So to summarize the biggest bonuses will be before you get the level shifts, but it's still a pretty large buff after you get them.