Ok, first off there is a entire thread devoted to arguing over what the best farmer is...at least when it comes down to brutes. Why do I make this exception? Because a spines/fa scrapper can do some pretty mean things as well.
Back to your point, between SS/FA and Elec/FA it is a tough one. It basically comes down to the fact that as you hit 50 and really begin to farm you are going to want a fairly strong AoE up at all times and you want that AoE not to have a long cast time. For SS/FA your Attack chain includes Burn, Footstomp, Mu Ball Lightning, and Mu Electric Fences. For SS/FA you do not need anything beyond that once you are slotted at the very least with SO's.
Rage gets you +dmg and a little +tohit. Rage crashing ends up taking a chunk of your end, you know when you've crashed when end goes down/you were looking at your bar/you now see orange "1"s all around you. That is when you stop dmg. Rage is great, and if you time your hasten to be used right after your crash you will see a shorter down time as well.
With Elec/FA you don't necessarily want more AoE's you just want a solid chain that will allow unbroken AoE dmg, you don't ever want be hitting non AoE's unless in FA's case it is Fiery Embrace. EM's really has 2 AoE's anyway. I wouldn't count Jacob's Ladder and Chain Induction is...well a chain.
I've blathered on enough and I don't know enough to answer your more technical questions. For a SS/Fire build that doesn't hit your pocket too hard check out the link below. (Deevian's Build)
SS/Fire: http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showt...250051&page=16
If you want to know all the arguments about the very best farmer and why SS/Fire is leading the pack right now you can start at page one.
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=250051
I hope you find this helpful.
well i guess what i am asking is. i know/have seen that a SS/Fire brute can do a complete clear cyborgs +4x8 in 5-7 minutes. i dont really see elec/fire brutes though. in my eyes, there shouldnt be any reason as to why elec couldnt be up there as well. SS has FS which is comparable to elec's Thunderstrike. it has knockout blow as well which is great for getting rid of boss's, but elec's LR does just as much dmg, and even though it has a recharge time of about 3-4x as long, it also hits ALL targets in the area, and not just one.
im not so much here to debate which is better, but to make a elec build that can do cyborgs on max settings in the same or close to the same amount of time.
does this build do it? what can be improved? and as stated before. what epic power pool and aplha slot should be taken?
*and just a side note, where as FS is cool and all. moves like LR and SC and those MASSIVE AOE no limit on # of targets moves are kick *** *
Come to freedom and email @iMidget, ill show u a elec/fire brute 5-6 minutes run on 54x8 fire cybor. I was argueing who the best farmer was, but it became pointless, becuase the difference was only seconds. Elec is far more fun in PvE too so :P Aint nothing like a 20 second LR with 20 ft range hitting 16 people at +600 dmg against lvl 50s.
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Not even LR because it does not hit all 16 mobs at full damage. Unlike footstomp.
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Originally Posted by iMidget Perfection
Come to freedom and email @iMidget, ill show u a elec/fire brute 5-6 minutes run on 54x8 fire cybor. I was argueing who the best farmer was, but it became pointless, becuase the difference was only seconds. Elec is far more fun in PvE too so :P Aint nothing like a 20 second LR with 20 ft range hitting 16 people at +600 dmg against lvl 50s.
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u sure about that? Never seen different numbers since I've been farming/PvE with it. over 300 hours on it.
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Yep, i believe it was stated by a dev thats how it works too. Just like Shield charge.|
Originally Posted by iMidget Perfection
u sure about that? Never seen different numbers since I've been farming/PvE with it. over 300 hours on it.
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Edit: i would also like to mention that the AoE dmg of thunderstrike is only half the dmg mids gives it. It's base is roughly 58 smashing dmg and 58 nrg dmg. However, only your target get smashing and nrg everything else only takes nrg dmg
AND i would like to mention SC and LR dont attack ALL targets in range. They cap at 16 targets.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
I will tell you what i know. LR does the same dmg to all the targets i hit within 20 ft (16 people) and TS does a alot of dmg also, for elec i only have Havoc Punch, build up, TS and LR. that's all you should be useing. I believe TS does 208 dmg at dmg cap to lvl 54s to all the people it can hit. and double dmg to the one target you hit. I think what they did to Elec was change from 2 numbers to just 1 staight number. I can't go online, but ill check in 12 hours. I only go on forums at work.
Interesting, Foot stomp does about about 350 dmg to for 54s when at the cap.
Im still trying to find some solid info on LRs dmg.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
It doesn't do 350. LR does about 410ish. and FS isn't even half the damage of LR. Ill post pics in a few days and if you want i can also post pics of my SS/fire at dmg cap too.
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575% of 60(FS) is 345. I think the data your writing down doesn't include fighting lvl 54s. Only level 50s.|
Originally Posted by ultrawatt
Interesting, Foot stomp does about about 350 dmg to for 54s when at the cap.
Im still trying to find some solid info on LRs dmg. |
575% of 133(LR) is 764.
Only thing I don't know is the numbers of how much res each level you go up has.
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Um, pretty sure its 7.75. Not sure where you got 5.75|
Originally Posted by iMidget Perfection
575% of 60(FS) is 345. I think the data your writing down doesn't include fighting lvl 54s. Only level 50s.
575% of 133(LR) is 764. Only thing I don't know is the numbers of how much res each level you go up has. |
And with a lvl shift you do 65% dmg to +4s
But yes, its actually 297 dmg v 54s
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Quote:
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Originally Posted by ultrawatt
Um, pretty sure its 7.75. Not sure where you got 5.75
And with a lvl shift you do 65% dmg to +4s But yes, its actually 297 dmg v 54s |
Ultrawatt, first off I wasn't being a dick to you, but you should try taking advice instead of trying to put people down. Brute's dmg cap is 675%, there base dmg is 100% of that. so you can only do 575% more.
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No, there dmg cap is 775% That 675% you see ingame doesnt count your 100% base. And Im prett sure you count the 100% base when you multiply dmg.|
Originally Posted by iMidget Perfection
Ultrawatt, first off I wasn't being a dick to you, but you should try taking advice instead of trying to put people down. Brute's dmg cap is 675%, there base dmg is 100% of that. so you can only do 575% more.
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Sorry if i sounded like an *** though didnt mean to.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
can you point me in a direction that says it's really 775%? I don't understand why they would only drop DMG cap on brutes by 25% some 800DMG cap before.
"Decreased Brute Damage Cap from 850% to 775%."
source
The old dmg cap ment that a brute at the cap would out dmg a scrapper at the cap. That is no longer the case.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
LR doesn't do full damage throughout its entire radius. I don't have the numbers, but it does work like SC does. Also, when calculating damage for it you have to remember it caps out at something like 400% I think since it's a pseudo-pet.
[U][URL="http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=251594"][/URL][/U]
Oh yes, i forgot that LR is a pseudo-pet so it has a lower dmg cap.
Burn is the same as well.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Quote:
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Originally Posted by iMidget Perfection
575% of 60(FS) is 345. I think the data your writing down doesn't include fighting lvl 54s. Only level 50s.
575% of 133(LR) is 764. Only thing I don't know is the numbers of how much res each level you go up has. |
Now I forget if pets cap out at 400% damage or +400% damage. Here is the breakdown either way at damage cap for even level mobs.
400% of 133.46 (LR)is 533.8
500% of 133.46 (LR)is 667.3
775% of 59.22 (FS) is 459
Ultrawat is correct. The damage numbers you see when you monitor your damage bonus are +damage and does not include the base. Your previous calculations were making Footstomp seem to have less potential and Lightning rod to have more potential. Guessing this was out of ignorance and not an attempt to deceve others.
Consider that with ultra levels of recharge you can hit footstomp about 3 times in the same time you can use LR once. Also consider that LR does not do the full damage to all mobs. Make an ambush farm with mobs that do no attacks and check your combat log and you will see.
really now. Can't wait to test all this 
still LR is beast as hell no matter what. but isn't this page about elec/fire builds not why SS or Elec is better? we alrdy did this once before.
i had just finish making my tanker and slotted him for farming and was not very pleased with him. he gets the job done. but i see elite people who can get like a +4x8 cyborgs run done in 5-6 mins. and i notice they are brutes, so i decided to make one for myself. now the goal for this character is to run cyborgs on max settings and get runs done very fast. i went with the musculature alpha and the energy mastery epic power pool.
if there are any tips please tell me. i am not so sure how to slot this toon resistance wise, because its much easier as a tanker. and im also not sure as to which aplha and epic pool would be the best. cardio for end reduction and added resistance? with pyre mastery for fireball(don't know how that'd fit into build.) or should i go musculature for all around more damage, and energy mastery to make up for the endurance.( i did this in the build now, but i feel like i have TOO much end recovery. like ill have near unlimited endurance and consume will be useless to me.)
and if your going to tell me to be SS/Fire. please explain to me Why its better? i mean to be a farmer u wanna survive and do great aoe dmg. elec has more of that than SS..... how does rage work? i dont understand the whole concept of it INCLUDING the crashing. when do i stop attacking?...... and if your going to tell me to do that. please include a SS/Fire farmer build. so i can work off of it.
any help is greatly appreciated. or posted builds. tyvm