They're doing just fine. Some updated builds appear at the end of the guide (see my sig for a link). If you like playing with an aggressive, jump in the middle of the pile play style, they're worth looking into.
To qualify as a WarTroller, a build must have some sort of control, blasts, and tanking ability, including some sort of mez protection. Again, see my sig for a link. Go to the end of the guide for some fairly up to date builds. The big difference between those builds and the rules now is you get Stamina for free, which allows you to add 3 extra unslotted powers to your build.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
The "official" WarTroller combos are:
● Mind/FF/Stone - Excellent hard control. Good single target damage from very early levels.
● Fire/FF/Stone - Strong AoE damage, better than expected control. Pets supplement somewhat weak single target damage.
● Plant/FF/Stone - Probably the best all-around WarTroller. Excellent control. Good AoE damage. Weak single target damage. Don't underestimate the usefulness of +Regen coming from Spirit Tree.
● Illusion/FF/Stone - Can get nearly perma PA if you're willing to invest in IOs. PA is perma with incarnate added. This is the "Granite Tanker" of controllers. It's an incredibly tough toon. Fair damage when PA is at or near perma.
To see how good of a tank a WarTroller can be, watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlQOpUeLWoI
Both Mind and Plant use AoE Confuses to reduce the time needed to kill baddies. To see how fast you can kill things using AoE confuses, watch this video at the 2:05 mark: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUBYFlcNs3A
With Accolades and Earth's Embrace made perma, you'll be running around with more HP than the base HP of a Brute. With Dispersion Bubble and the Stone Shield, you'll have better S/L defense than an Ice Tanker. With Provoke you'll hold aggro, with PFF and Aid Self you'll hibernate. With your controls you'll shut down baddies.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I'd list as "unofficial" WarTrollers the following combos:
Fire/Mental/Force Blaster
Take Provoke, PFF, Repulsion Field, Temp Invul, and Force of Nature. Take everything in Fire. Ignore the controls except for World Of Confusion in Mental and the single target knockback, take everything else in mental. Get the Wedding Band.
With Wedding Band, Temp Invul and Force of Nature going, you're at the resistance cap (90%) for S/L Damage and at 75% resistance vs everything else, including Psi and Toxic. Mez protection is counted as a Blaster's built-in mez protection. So there's your tank. Use it only when you need it, as it has a timer on it with Force of Nature and Wedding Band.
Slot your single target attacks with a chance to hold proc. Put 2 chance to hold procs in the tier 1 immobilize from Mental. That, plus World of Confusion, gives you control. Repulsion Field gives you the ability to do chaos control. To see how chaos control is done, watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gebY_SwaCWA The same type of effect can be achieved by a Blaster with the Force Epic pool.
Take Aid Self. That plus PFF gives you a down and dirty Hibernate.
For I/Os go with +Recharge and +Recovery in addition to the hold procs. For incarnate, go damage.
Playstyle: Nuke nuke nuke nuke nuke.
Robotics/FF/Mace Master Mind
Take your robot minion powers and upgrades. Take the AoE chance to stun power too. Take the bubbles and repulsion bomb, repulsion field and PFF. Take power boost, the shield, the single target hold, and the AoE immobilize from Mace. Take Provoke. Take Aid Self, Aid Other, and Repair (it helps a lot when soloing AVs and other long fights because it not only heals the bots, it replenishes their endurance as well.)
This is a toon that can do AoE control, chaos control, put the bots at the soft cap for DEF(ALL), put yourself at the soft cap for DEF(S/L), blast, and solo AVs without temp powers or IOs. You can tank pretty much anything with this toon. Just watch out for AoEs and us the "Go To" command for your bots to move them away from you when you're tanking baddies with AoEs.
For I/Os go with +Recovery and +Recharge or Ranged Defense. For incarnate, go damage.
Playstyle: Tank tank tank tank tank.
That combo is just seriously sick, and is a perversion of gameplay mechanics. - Excelsio
The Infernal Challenge
Building a WarTroller
Troller Damage
That is a pile of information. I have some reading to do. Thanks!
(If you're gonna have the vanity quote in your sig, pretty please link it to the quote source so we can bask in the sick-ness?)
Having tried Plant, not tried Mind yet, little interest in Fire, and being unlikely to invest in IOs for some time, I think the Mind one is likely next on my list of controllers to try. (Currently doing a very powerful-feeling grav/storm, and a "feed my thirsty roots"-themed plant/kin. Don't know if it's optimal but I really like the theme of trapping, entangling, and draining as opposed to the more lifebloomy feel of Plant/Storm.) Soft-capped Bots/Traps is somewhere on my to-do list, albeit quite some time away. Probably tanky enough but with weaker control than Bots/FF.
Quote:
The quote is from the old boards, so I think it's gone. It was in reference to the Fire/FF/Stone build I mentioned above.|
Originally Posted by The Demacian
That is a pile of information. I have some reading to do. Thanks!
(If you're gonna have the vanity quote in your sig, pretty please link it to the quote source so we can bask in the sick-ness?) |
P.S. Sorry for the "Wall of Text". But as soon as my subscription runs out (any day now), I'll be gone. So it's a quick and dirty brain dump of sorts.
That combo is just seriously sick, and is a perversion of gameplay mechanics. - Excelsio
The Infernal Challenge
Building a WarTroller
Troller Damage
No worries, cap, I'm somewhat of an information addict. I tend to read about my games more than I play them, unless I make a concerted effort to stop reading. I was still reading about WoW for 6 months to a year after I'd quit playing.
...on which note, I'm off to play my painfully ineffective MM through a cool-sounding MA arc I've just read about. Must remember to buy wakies this time. Thanks for the info dump; I'm glad my query happened to be timely!
Good luck to you. And if the MA arc is the "Girls of Boomtown" one from my videos, be forewarned it's _much_ harder now than when that video was made. And it was no cakewalk when the video was made.
Also, one last thing if you decide to go the WarTroller route. I'd give the Fire/Mental blaster build strong consideration. It's an uncompromising AoE damage machine that out-damages an EM/Shields scrapper. It's the only toon I've ever played that, based solely on damage output, can single-handledly change the performance of a team. And a late levels when teamed with an Empath or Kin, it's absolutely insane.
That combo is just seriously sick, and is a perversion of gameplay mechanics. - Excelsio
The Infernal Challenge
Building a WarTroller
Troller Damage
Quote:
Note that the hard cap on resistance for Blasters is 75%, so you're unlikely to be at 90% unless you know something I don't know.
|
Originally Posted by magicj
Fire/Mental/Force Blaster
Take Provoke, PFF, Repulsion Field, Temp Invul, and Force of Nature. Take everything in Fire. Ignore the controls except for World Of Confusion in Mental and the single target knockback, take everything else in mental. Get the Wedding Band. With Wedding Band, Temp Invul and Force of Nature going, you're at the resistance cap (90%) for S/L Damage and at 75% resistance vs everything else, including Psi and Toxic. |
If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
----------------------------------------------------------
The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog
Quote:
Thanks, I didn't know that. So you're capped across the board then.
|
Originally Posted by Sailboat
Note that the hard cap on resistance for Blasters is 75%, so you're unlikely to be at 90% unless you know something I don't know.
|
That combo is just seriously sick, and is a perversion of gameplay mechanics. - Excelsio
The Infernal Challenge
Building a WarTroller
Troller Damage
Yeah, 75% resistance on a character with defense and Aid Self is solid enough. 
If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
----------------------------------------------------------
The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog
Just looking at it now. Is there an updated build you'd suggest for an ill/ff wartroller?
J-Man- Lieran, if you were Paris Hilton, I'd be the chihuahua in your purse.
Here is my Ill/FF/Stone build if that helps. It has capped HP, S/L defense and perma Phantom Army and Hasten without incarnate buffs. It doesn't have provoke though and is very expensive. With chaining repulsion bomb and fissure, everything is knocked down so much that it's not particularly needed. I find that Phantasm's knockback is extremely annoying for this build and dramatically drops DPS against groups, so I only bring him out for tough single targets. I really think this build is a lot of fun at high levels [although extremely passive and boring before the epic pool attacks]. It is underpowered in the damage department compared to many other vastly cheaper builds for other ATs or power sets -- the main reasons being no buffs other than defense and absolutely no debuffs, also repulsion bomb doesn't seem to be affected by containment the last time I checked. The sleep hole can be kind of annoying.
Code:
| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1480;722;1444;HEX;| |78DA65945B4F134114C7677BB152282DB4C8A5140A2DB4F4B274057C52515B6EDA2| |A91C427B5AEED4037D96C9BB624C2939FC1171FBD45FD006AF483A831315E3E805C| |D4177DAA67CF19E8C64E02BF99FF9CDB9C996DE15EAE87B1FB8B4CF26575B5D1286| |6AB46B35ED5755E7716D42DADE4B9AEEEEEEA3C9C43B8186391B6C991B5BCA6EBDB| |0DAD6A1C09418BCDA5EDCD4D79B95A2FF1E2B2C6F572DF9A51E1756E34E5A3897BB| |D0A31366A9C973D385DD6B62A4DCDD8A2558197B59266702FAEF25C2DF37AA3A2D5| |FA976A5A49DE68560D5E2CA88D26AFEF0C417DB3F0F7486262B41C4CB131A6305B8| |6308B70C88414E26CDB9CB13F80107B0C12A92DA7B486562756092B88934B841CC2| |1762269E808B5DE4B5ABB8E3BE4328227A6E136E229E82B993CCEDCE4F36336FEF4| |7C20784EF3DE219D8B9447DAE01C9942661DD8505B6A4AE2426EF279C03B55B1877| |93F122FCF708C9634A0A93C0DF2B242F15FF1C36FAC491FBB25860FF22E2D40162E| |837E11762E4107111BCFC5488D34FB147BD845EC49887D08D987623EC907E40943F| |3088458E9D8795C3CE1CB035485BB6410A180E1016C8E205AC86459787BFE3D6C86| |7C4C437C25744E40B22040183E2A8C1281E75DC6566A4A243D7C02AC6C25710D13C| |FA440B54ED55442C885E2F61312EF28E5FC0D34F5067A6A925B19F04EA4C16CC274| |592C977182172067722A711D105C4CC3C618E5A0EA54DD1F1D9D4047AFD80271517| |81E21468E61522F196F086F01A91DA81407EB6075E49713149EC1C6329BA92145D4| |29A6E264D3793A65BFB0BBF07B238A49CC49266138419421CA14C23F6214B46DC56| |C66C6E8C292BD849651531EAB07C5BF4D0F256298DD2BAE3F8736312BDE350DBAAD| |5E53BFEAE5A7B6E30150D92C87BDF2AC5513A684B9274192B09DCC0031EB6776CD2| |433C44E0013DF330BA663ACB4B744A4AA734DF29CD754A2D73E4FD30A52268ACBBC| |D4A49B86599AB96F95DCBFCBFF10F0FBAEE0F| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
What the hell is a Wartroller?
I vaguely remembered it had something to do with MagicJ when I saw the title, and I guess I was right, but do more than like, ten people maybe, even recognize that pet term? Also, I swore a Wartroller was Mind/FF but I saw some Illusion stuff. I suppose I should read the thread.
But I'm kinda a Slacktroller myself.
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
I was only familiar with the term "Wartroller" as a Warshade that focused on powers that controlled the enemy... Any other usage is totally new to me...
The Sly Bold Renardine - " I am Scraptastic!"
Quote:
It is MagicJ's personal term for his playstyle on */FF controllers, mostly. It is an aggressive playstyle that uses PFF and the Provoke power pool to tank, draw aggro and control. Even if you don't play that style, it was interesting to see what MagicJ could do with the set.|
Originally Posted by UnicyclePeon
What the hell is a Wartroller?
I vaguely remembered it had something to do with MagicJ when I saw the title, and I guess I was right, but do more than like, ten people maybe, even recognize that pet term? Also, I swore a Wartroller was Mind/FF but I saw some Illusion stuff. I suppose I should read the thread. But I'm kinda a Slacktroller myself. Lewis |
I have a Mind/FF that I have very, very slowly leveled up on one of my secondary servers. It's a pretty fun build, but not fast. I have never had any character get Nukes in Warburg easier, though. Between confuse and PFF, it was amazingly easy.
LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control
Quote:
Yes, as I recall, the main requirements were that you could herd and that you could confuse foes. It was a novel-though-perhaps-overrated way for MagicJ to squeeze extra offense/leveling speed out of what was otherwise a very low-offense character build (Mind/FF).|
Originally Posted by Local_Man
It is MagicJ's personal term for his playstyle on */FF controllers, mostly. It is an aggressive playstyle that uses PFF and the Provoke power pool to tank, draw aggro and control. Even if you don't play that style, it was interesting to see what MagicJ could do with the set.
I have a Mind/FF that I have very, very slowly leveled up on one of my secondary servers. It's a pretty fun build, but not fast. I have never had any character get Nukes in Warburg easier, though. Between confuse and PFF, it was amazingly easy. |
By that standard, to address the subject line of the OP, the so-called WarTroller is obsolete. Nowadays, you can use IO bonuses to vastly increase survivability; you don't have to rely on Force Field to carry you. Also, many Controller builds are capable of delivering a lot of damage without a confuse power. If you happen to have a Mind/FF or (even better) a Plant/FF, then sure, go for it, but Magic's old-school definition of Wartroller is by no means worth pursuing on its own merits.
If, on the other hand, we're going with the expanded definition of the term described earlier in the thread ("control, blasts, and tanking ability"), then almost any high-end build can qualify, and in spades. That newer version of the term (as I understood it) is so vague, though, that there's scarcely any point in using it. Might as well sub in the equally instructive phrase, "decent build."
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
Nice build
|
How would a Elec/FF/Stone do in this situation? Would it be able to drain the minions endurance and keep it drained? Thinking if so then that would be less times your getting attacked. Also I've got a prebuild done where I focused on S/L/E defense and recharge, would that be the way to go? Thanks
Having had some time to check out CoH, and having dabbled in a little bit of everything, I feel that no AT makes me feel Like Unto a God as much as a Controller does.
Even without Hasten, I have pretty much every creature Immobilized, 2 or 3 creatures Held, and 1 or 2 creatures suffering from a Knockup/back/down effect that neuters them every bit as well as a Hold. It gets me to kinda feeling invincible... right up until a bad string of Misses or something like that. Sure, my regen scrapper will reach 50 first because he's "ezmode", but at that point I suspect he'll largely become a Wentworth's bot.
Anyway, I didn't mean to rant about how awesome my character is. Really, I suspect that every Controller is equally awesome or better than mine, and I'm nothing more than a recent, exuberant convert to the playstyle. What I really want to know, in the likely event that I create more Controllers or maybe even the occasional Dominator, is whether the "Wartroller" concept still floats around. I read a years-old post by Whisperwind that sounded rather cool and exciting, but it mentioned "six-slotting" frequently, which I hear is a thing of the past, along with selecting Fitness as a pool power. Do mind or illusion controllers still have the capability to rival Warshades for all-in-one awesomeness, these days?