Masterminds: Praet zone events and a mini rant
I think you might have linked to something you shouldn't have, DarkGob. Might want to check that.
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EDIT: Oh. That's weird. I found the post by searching Positron's posts, but I guess that was in the I16 Closed Beta subforum, which was "removed", but for some reason I can still see it...? I don't even remember if I was in I16 Closed Beta.
Anyway, for those who can't see it:
Originally Posted by Positron
ALL dismissable pets will now zone with you. They will lose their buffs, however, BUT Mastermind pets will keep their Mastermind buffs.
I would like to personally thank Pohsyb for making this dream of mine come to life. |
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
Don't take it so seriously Dark, I don't think anyone really believes Posi actually hates masterminds except possibly for the headaches they cause him in regards to designing and balancing content. That being said the newer content (specifically the Preatorian zone events and the new TFs) do come accross as somewhat anti-MM.
In the case of the new TFs MMs have two major issues. First fighting +4s hurts them worse than other ATs. Most have their damage reduced to 48% of it's norm against +4s and while that is true for the MM and their T3 pet the damage from their T1 and T2 pets is cut proportionally more (to about 33% and 19% of the damage they'd do against enemies that are +0 to the MM). Additionally the need to move around precisely during combat is significantly more difficult for the MM, especially given the issues with pet AI. Ideally MMs need more precse control tools to keep their pets positioned correctly.
There's also the issue with the summoner Nictus in the final encounter in the ITF. Teams with MMs actually using their pets are punished for that, as the summoner's power counts each pet as an extra player, and ups its blooms accordingly.
Don't take it so seriously Dark, I don't think anyone really believes Posi actually hates masterminds except possibly for the headaches they cause him in regards to designing and balancing content. That being said the newer content (specifically the Preatorian zone events and the new TFs) do come accross as somewhat anti-MM.
In the case of the new TFs MMs have two major issues. First fighting +4s hurts them worse than other ATs. Most have their damage reduced to 48% of it's norm against +4s and while that is true for the MM and their T3 pet the damage from their T1 and T2 pets is cut proportionally more (to about 33% and 19% of the damage they'd do against enemies that are +0 to the MM). Additionally the need to move around precisely during combat is significantly more difficult for the MM, especially given the issues with pet AI. Ideally MMs need more precse control tools to keep their pets positioned correctly. |
2. I honestly haven't even managed to run a full Apex or Tin Mage on any character (got maybe halfway through mission 1 of Apex on a Blaster before it fell apart), so I can't really comment on how MMs fare on those, but any problems they may have are likely due to a flawed or unforgiving design rather than a specific bias against Masterminds. How well do Stalkers fare on these TFs? (Not rhetorical, I'm genuinely curious.)
3. I am still not sure what to make of the Praet zone event badge situation. On the one hand, it's supposed to be Working As Intended, but on the other hand it definitely is not working as it should be without some imagined dev conspiracy against Masterminds. Castle's post on the matter raised more questions than it answered.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
I honestly believe that very few - possibly none - of the development team prefer playing Masterminds themselves, and making sure they get Mastermind players into closed betas doesn't seem to be a very large priority either.
I think most of it just boils down to the fact that they don't test with Masterminds before releasing to the public, because they just assume Masterminds will perform at or above par, like they always have before, without considering how changed mechanics will actually effect them.
1. This guy sure seems to actually think that Posi hates MMs (and now that I look at his entire post, it does seem to consist of nothing more than hearsay that was probably taken out of context). Mostly what annoyed me was the post immediately before mine jumping on this statement as gospel truth without even remotely questioning it.
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Secondly, I admit I wasn't very diplomatic in my original post but there has long been a suspicion that MMs do not get quite as much attention from the developers when compared to some other ATs. Further more, this new patch of bugs (and the borked henchmen AI) which makes MM a royal pain to play has only served to reinforce that suspicion. After all, how did the developers miss some of these fairly obvious issues if they did in fact test MMs thoroughly prior to i19 release? I certainly hope that someone just unintentionally dropped the ball along the way and it will get fixed sooner rather than later.
So you're allowed to state that Posi's comments were *hearsay that was probably taken out of context* while I'm not allowed to take it at face value? No offense but don't you think that's somewhat hypocritical?
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And it's not like the claim was made by some total newbie that just signed up with the forum and has 0 posts under his belt. |
But even assume he's right. Positron hates Masterminds. So? He's not running the show anymore. Even if he were, do you really think he deliberately introduced these little bugs in order to screw with people who play Masterminds?
Sorry but I view conspiracy theories with a critical eye.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
I just have to say, that any conspiracy theory where devs are out to get Masterminds is lunacy and that's not what I red from Zep's post. I could be wrong, but I read his post as saying that positron said he hated some of the technical issues surrounding Masterminds, and that's it. No hidden agenda or mustache twirling.
And all I was saying is that it seems that the dev team has fallen into the trap of thinking that issues surrounding henchmen are of less priority than issues facing other AT's powers, because other AT's control their powers directly making issues seem more impactfull to the player. That's why I compared the AI to a blaster being forced to run into melee on activation of a ranged attack. It seems like the henchmen's issue would be lesser, but really it's the same. That henchmen uses powers on behalf of the Mastermind. If that henchmen's doesn't activate it's power correctly the Mastermind is as sunk as that blaster would be. Though maybe slightly better off as the mastermind might have a better chance of disengaging while the henchman dies.
But like the title said, It was a mini rant. I have no clue what the Devs are working on. They could've, for all I know, been trying to fix those problems from day 0. The issue I had is that it isn't fixed yet and we know just as much today about the issue as we did in the begining, and that's just that the problem exists. Well I guess I learned /releasepets. Thanks for that, I'll be sure to try that!
Sarcasm, jokes, and witty banter aside. I was only attempting to vent and bring this issue out front and center. No assumptions as to developer intentions, if they knew hopefully they'd mention something. The zone event thing was just the straw that broke the camel's back.
Murphys Military Law
#23. Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy other people to shoot at.
#46. If you can't remember, the Claymore is pointed towards you.
#54. Killing for peace is like screwing for virginity.
Castle sez:
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
Success on Takedown Artist, but only because I was using my secondary powers 1. way more than I usually do, and 2. way more than was necessary. (And just to clarify, I did have all my pets out and attacking, although I did make a point to use my debuffs first before directing them to attack. Bots/Dark, for the record)
I'm not really pleased with how this is working, but the fact that it's at least possible to get the badges solo is good to know.
EDIT: Protester achieved, although this time it was without pets. This is mostly because my pets stopped following me after I zoned in Nova from Imperial, and wouldn't resummon after dismissal (I tried twice, then gave up).
EDIT x2: Further weirdness: Upon taking the train from Nova to Neutropolis for that zone's event, my Bots summoned right next to me when I arrived. Previously in Nova my pet list had been empty after I supposedly "dismissed" them. Followed me up the train station steps and outside, then refused to follow again. /releasepets allowed me to resummon.
Got Laureate. I teamed with a Kinetic Melee/Willpower Scrapper (much lower than my level 50). Bots out, hitting the debuffs frequently. I got the badge, Scrapper did not.
Conclusion: Use your secondary more than you usually do, even if you could easily solo the event without using it that much, and you should get the badge.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
2. I honestly haven't even managed to run a full Apex or Tin Mage on any character (got maybe halfway through mission 1 of Apex on a Blaster before it fell apart), so I can't really comment on how MMs fare on those, but any problems they may have are likely due to a flawed or unforgiving design rather than a specific bias against Masterminds. How well do Stalkers fare on these TFs? (Not rhetorical, I'm genuinely curious.)
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I see folks are gonna go full steam ahead on the whole "Posi hates Masterminds" thing without asking for proof that he ever actually made this statement, never mind the equally ridiculous conclusion that Mastermind pet damage isn't counting for Praetorian events because of this supposed fact.
EDIT: Look at how much he hates Masterminds! He hates them so much he doesn't want their pets to dismiss when zoning. Oh wait, but there's that bug with zoning, that's probably Posi's fault too. |
You know, a person who was in the room with and heard him say it? At a Q&A session full of people who play the game.
Perhaps what you meant to say was that you were hoping to find a second source rather then publicly doubting the word of the poster who stated hearing the "I hate masterminds?"
You could like, PM Posi you know and check. Or for the matter any of the other dev's that went to the meet and greet. Well 1/2 of them anyways. We split into two groups so we could fit in the conference rooms.
Why are you being so defensive anyways?
I just have to say, that any conspiracy theory where devs are out to get Masterminds is lunacy and that's not what I red from Zep's post. I could be wrong, but I read his post as saying that positron said he hated some of the technical issues surrounding Masterminds, and that's it. No hidden agenda or mustache twirling.
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Give the man a cigar.
To further clarify and reiterate;
As it was stated in the original post I made the 'hate' was all about server resources. Masterminds use as much server time as *SEVEN* regular characters once they take their last pet. How do I know this......? Because the next question asked by the crowd was "Why do you hate masterminds?"
I met Posi and spoke to him One on One at the first Hero Con as well. Unless Cryptic is using impersonators to represent the Dev's AND Cryptic is keeping the same, errr, actors on payroll then I am pretty sure I correctly identified who I was speaking too as well, Oh and well, Everyone was wearing name badges too. Dev's even had special glowy lanyards (at the meet and greet, dont remember them from Hero con)
Should I post pictures of the Hero-Con T-shirt? And the glowy statesman badge I picked up more recently? Or should I just take some screen shots of my characters in the Dark Carnival costume (hero con) or the Meat Doctor costume (meet and greet). Ever since I got the Meat Doctor thing I have been fighting an impulse to make an Empath defender for some reason.
Oh yeah, well MY uncle works for Nintendo.
Look, I clearly misunderstood your meaning based on how others interpreted it, but no, one dude's "eyewitness account" doesn't really hold a lot of meaning for me. Sorry. Sounds like you got some cool SWAG though.
EDIT: Want to clarify that I'm not calling you a liar.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
Would a petless Thug MM have less trouble getting these badges?
![](http://www.awarddriven.com/c/spacer.png)
![](http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/8333/colepimpbanner.png)
Would a Dual Pistols Corruptor? (Honest answer - don't know, but probably.)
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
When I got these badges I used one of the following ultra-super helpful methods of participation.
Summon thugs, upgrade, and after the event side was set put them on follow/aggressive while I spammed every power I had.
Or
Didn't bother to summon thugs, and I spammed every power I had.
Both of those methods have suceeded, in fact, those methods have yet to fail.
Murphys Military Law
#23. Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy other people to shoot at.
#46. If you can't remember, the Claymore is pointed towards you.
#54. Killing for peace is like screwing for virginity.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
I think you might have linked to something you shouldn't have, DarkGob. Might want to check that.
Anyway, I was mostly kidding with my accusations, though they are accusations rooted in the facts that Masterminds are punished in ways other ATs are not in certain encounters in this game (mostly "end game" content.)