Average Amount of recharge hasten actually gives.
By
Arbegla,
Posted on: 2010-10-09 01:06 in Player Questions
With 87.5% global recharge, you'd be much better off taking Hasten, providing you can slot it fully with three slots. At 87.5% global, Hasten with three level 50 recharge IO's will only have a downtime of 7-8 seconds. The rest of the time you'd be running at 157.5% recharge.
If you could find another 15%-20% global recharge, you'll be close to perma-Hasten, with little to no downtime at all.
If you take Hasten and 3 slot it with level 50 recharge IOs, Hasten will have 256.58% recharge, meaning that it will be down for about 10 seconds before recharging. Going to 2 recharge results in about 20 seconds down. Only one recharge results in just under a minute of downtime.
If you can free up 2 slots, get Hasten.
@Roderick
Remember, you don't have enough global recharge until your attack chain is (and this is coming from my MA Scrappers...for other ATs and their attacks, replace appropriately) Eagle's Claw, Eagle's Claw, Eagle's Claw, Eagle's Claw.
Quote:
So, you're suggesting an attack chain consisting entirely of the 2nd lowest DPA attack in the set? |
Originally Posted by Willowpaw
Remember, you don't have enough global recharge until your attack chain is (and this is coming from my MA Scrappers...for other ATs and their attacks, replace appropriately) Eagle's Claw, Eagle's Claw, Eagle's Claw, Eagle's Claw.
|
Eagle's Claw is the MA tier 9, you know, the heavy hitter. That is one you would want recharging fast.
Quote:
Not if you want good DPS. Eagle's Claw is the 2nd lowest DPA attack in the entire set, which if used as you suggested, would result in some extremely low DPS, especially considering attacks don't begin recharging until their animation is complete.|
Originally Posted by Willowpaw
Eagle's Claw is the MA tier 9, you know, the heavy hitter. That is one you would want recharging fast.
|
MA attacks, sorted by DPA at level 50, unenhanced.
Storm Kick: 99.5
Crippling Axe Kick: 82.9
Cobra Strike: 73.4
Crane Kick: 73.4
Eagle's Claw: 64.8
Thunder Kick: 63.3
Or, to put another way, in less time than it takes for Eagle's Claw to animate (2.53s) for 164 damage, a MA scrapper could fire off Storm Kick & CAK (2.43s) for 215 points of damage.
And incidentally, attacks don't start to recharge until they're done animating. I remember the old joke being that you don't have enough until your pattern is Foot Stomp- Knockout Blow- Foot Stomp.
Arbegla, you might want to have a look at this guide to calculating effective recharge.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
That guide will probably help me more once i wake up 
I'll won't be able to spare any slots, so thats where i'm having the problems, trying to figure out if hasten, with only 1 rech IO, is better then 2 LoTG +rech..
Quote:
Its perhaps the weakest Tier 9 that I can think of, or have experience of. It seriously needs looking-at.
|
Originally Posted by Willowpaw
Eagle's Claw is the MA tier 9, you know, the heavy hitter. That is one you would want recharging fast.
|
Quote:
Hasten with a single L50 IO and 87.5% Global +Rech will recharge at 2.999 ticks per second for 120s, leaving 90.12 ticks to go at a 2.299 tick per sec rate for another 39.2s. It has a 0.73s cast time before it starts recharging, so that's a cycle time of 159.9s with an up time of 120s. That's an average global +Rech of +70% * 120s / 159.9s = 52.5%.
|
Originally Posted by Arbegla
I know during hastens duration, its giving 70% recharge, but when its not up, its giving 0%.
My question is, how can one figure out the average % of recharge hasten is giving, when factoring in other recharge benefits. Example. I'm lookin to swap into some new powers come i19 on my mastermind, whose currently at 87.5% global recharge. My options are Stealth/grant slotted with a LoTG +rech (giving me 15% more global recharge) Or hasten, which gives 70% while up, and 0% while down. Given my already high global recharge, would having hasten be a higher benefit for increasing my recharge then the LoTGs, as the defense really isn't worth it to me either way? |
Kosmos
Global: @Calorie
MA Arcs in 4-star purgatory: Four in a Row (#2198) - Hostile Takeover (#69714) - Red Harvest (#268305)
Quote:
It's been looked at recently - resulting in a higher critical chance after it lands for a couple of seconds on Scrappers (so it doesn't hit harder, but the following attack probably will) and a higher base damage for Stalkers.|
Originally Posted by Bad_Influence
Its perhaps the weakest Tier 9 that I can think of, or have experience of. It seriously needs looking-at.
|
The DPA for the Stalker version isn't bad - while it's still "the worst" of the regular attacks that people are likely to take (which is to say, it's only better than Assassin's Blow and Thunder Kick) it's a lot better than either of those, and has the same DPA as Focus, from Claws.
As for Hasten... well, you need to figure out what it's overall recharge is in order to determine the uptime of the effect, which you can use to get the average recharge bonus. Its base recharge is 450 seconds, but there's 120 seconds of that which is being affected by its own buff.
With only Hasten affecting its own recharge, you have a recharge while it is active of 450 / 1.7 = 264.71 seconds; 120 seconds into that, you're 45% of the way through that recharge - that means that you're also 45% of the way through the higher recharge when it drops, meaning you have 55% of the base recharge of 450 seconds left to go (247.5 seconds), for a total recharge of 367.5. That gives you around a 32% uptime, with no recharge slotted, and the average amount of recharge would be around 23%.
With 87.5% global recharge and a single level 50 recharge IO in Hasten (42.4), the numbers change to (450 / ( 1 + .7 + .424 + .875 ) =) 150.05; the 120 second duration is ~80% of that, meaning that you only have 20% of the remaining duration to go. The recharge without Hasten is 450 / (1 + .424 + .875), or 195.74, 20% of that is 39.15 seconds for a final recharge of 159.15 seconds, uptime of 75%, and average recharge of 52.78.
If the 87.5% global recharge you were talking about before was including the effect of Hasten, then you end up with:
Recharge while Hasten is active: 195.74 (61.3% of the time)
Recharge while Hasten not active: 281.43 (38.7% of the time)
Final recharge: 229.02 seconds, 52.4% uptime, average recharge buff of 36.7%.
Edit: I didn't bother with the cast time, which is why my final numbers differ from what Kosmos posted; there were already a lot of rounding issues so I just didn't care about the difference - it's not like you were aiming for permaHasten.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
|
Thank you Kosmos, and Siolfir for explaining it all out using math, really lets me see exactly how it'll benefit me. Looks like hasten + assault + repair is the better choice then
(i was looking at stealth + grant invis + repair before, but i recently found out the added defense of stealth and grant invis would be overkill in my current build, so i went out looking for better options)
I know during hastens duration, its giving 70% recharge, but when its not up, its giving 0%.
My question is, how can one figure out the average % of recharge hasten is giving, when factoring in other recharge benefits.
Example. I'm lookin to swap into some new powers come i19 on my mastermind, whose currently at 87.5% global recharge. My options are
Stealth/grant slotted with a LoTG +rech (giving me 15% more global recharge)
Or hasten, which gives 70% while up, and 0% while down.
Given my already high global recharge, would having hasten be a higher benefit for increasing my recharge then the LoTGs, as the defense really isn't worth it to me either way?