Windows 7 Compatibility
By
Father Xmas,
Posted on: 2010-09-02 19:25 in ALL ACCESS Gameplay Technical Issues Bugs
about the only option you have is keep complaining to the devs to update the game to play nice with the current generation OS. CoH is the only game that does this that I play.
Pinnacle server
just another random dude
That actually has nothing to do with it. It can be re-enabled easily by going to "Compatability" and not checking "Disable Visual Themes" and (if it's checked) "Disable Desktop Composition". However, doing so takes more graphics memory and resources because it continues to render the aeroglass and the taskbar and desktop system BEHIND the game, even in full screen. Ideally, any majorly intensive game you run SHOULD disable these features, they've been there since Vista. Unless you're running a massively powerful card (GTX460 and up) with CoH, I wouldn't even consider it, and if you're using most of ultra mode, I still wouldn't. It's actually to your benifit for those to be disabled while gaming. Even moreso if you run Windowed, as that's even harder on the system.
Yes, you're correct, CoH wasn't written to deal with that new stuff, it pretty much would take a full graphics re-write for that to happen, and likely never will (you're far more likely to see that in CoH2, if it was made).
"Superman died fighting Doomsday because he allowed his toggles to drop, and didn't beat Doomsday before Unstoppable wore off, sad really..."
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Okay so... the first thing I checked was the theme's and desktop composition... none of them are checked.
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Originally Posted by PeerlessGirl
That actually has nothing to do with it. It can be re-enabled easily by going to "Compatability" and not checking "Disable Visual Themes" and (if it's checked) "Disable Desktop Composition". However, doing so takes more graphics memory and resources because it continues to render the aeroglass and the taskbar and desktop system BEHIND the game, even in full screen. Ideally, any majorly intensive game you run SHOULD disable these features, they've been there since Vista. Unless you're running a massively powerful card (GTX460 and up) with CoH, I wouldn't even consider it, and if you're using most of ultra mode, I still wouldn't. It's actually to your benifit for those to be disabled while gaming. Even moreso if you run Windowed, as that's even harder on the system.
Yes, you're correct, CoH wasn't written to deal with that new stuff, it pretty much would take a full graphics re-write for that to happen, and likely never will (you're far more likely to see that in CoH2, if it was made). |
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*Nod* I dunno what to tell you, my aeroglass stays enabled if I run CoH, UNLESS I turn those options on (it's primarily the "disable visual themes" one, but the other controls the taskbar "hide peek" mouseover popup thing, I think, so I always disable or enable both). If yours is doing it anyway, that's a little wierd.
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Originally Posted by sceritz05
Okay so... the first thing I checked was the theme's and desktop composition... none of them are checked.
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"Superman died fighting Doomsday because he allowed his toggles to drop, and didn't beat Doomsday before Unstoppable wore off, sad really..."
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It does this for me on a completely new built computer too.|
Originally Posted by sceritz05
Okay so I've upgraded from XP to Windows 7 recently (complete wipe and install) and now everytime I play CoH it changes to a compatibility mode that basically changes my graphics on the computer from Aero to basic mode.
Its not really a big deal, it doesn't stop gameplay or anything, but it's kind of annoying considering that when I play on my laptop with vista, and a significantly lower end graphics card, it doesn't need to change for compatibility. I would really just like for my graphics to NOT change to basic, so I could get any help, thanks. |
"This application si not compatible with (whatever it calls Aero)"
I solved the issue by accident when I switched to playing in windowed mode so I could switch to other applications while playing sometimes.
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I don't really need Aero Glass, and it's not really that fancy that I even really want to keep it, so how do I disable it at all times, not just while playing CoH?|
Originally Posted by PeerlessGirl
That actually has nothing to do with it. It can be re-enabled easily by going to "Compatability" and not checking "Disable Visual Themes" and (if it's checked) "Disable Desktop Composition". However, doing so takes more graphics memory and resources because it continues to render the aeroglass and the taskbar and desktop system BEHIND the game, even in full screen. Ideally, any majorly intensive game you run SHOULD disable these features, they've been there since Vista. Unless you're running a massively powerful card (GTX460 and up) with CoH, I wouldn't even consider it, and if you're using most of ultra mode, I still wouldn't. It's actually to your benifit for those to be disabled while gaming. Even moreso if you run Windowed, as that's even harder on the system.
Yes, you're correct, CoH wasn't written to deal with that new stuff, it pretty much would take a full graphics re-write for that to happen, and likely never will (you're far more likely to see that in CoH2, if it was made). |
Edit:
I think I found it. If it doesn't improve performance in windowed mode in Praetoria(the only real place other than special events that even pushes this beast) then I'll re-enable them because they're nice to have on.
Edit 2:
Disabling the Aero features had no effect on my performance with my GTX 465, 8GB of system ram and i3-530.
I still get about 30 fps in the heart of Nova Praetoria at any time with shadows, reflections and water on high(4/5), occlusion off, FSAA and AF 2xs, particle physics to high and everything else maxed out at the windowed version of 1920x1080 resolution.
Is that good for windowed mode?
It sounds fairly good to me. The 465 is a bit weaker than the 470 and the 460 (I know, it's counter intuitive). I run at 1920x1200 with everything maxed except AF at 8x (there's no real noticible benifit IMO on CoH's older textures beyond this point, and it slows the game down). Vertical Synch off (there's an issue in CoH where with the new UM features, it likes to lock at 30ish FPS if this is turned on). and Ambient Occlusion at High Quality (I think that's it...either way it's 2 notches down from maximum). I get around 35-45fps depending, in Praetoria it's closer to 35-38. That's full screen and not windowed, so you're not far off from me. I also have 8GB of ram, am running an AMD Phenom II x4 965.
"Superman died fighting Doomsday because he allowed his toggles to drop, and didn't beat Doomsday before Unstoppable wore off, sad really..."
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Originally Posted by PeerlessGirl
It sounds fairly good to me. The 465 is a bit weaker than the 470 and the 460 (I know, it's counter intuitive). I run at 1920x1200 with everything maxed except AF at 8x (there's no real noticible benifit IMO on CoH's older textures beyond this point, and it slows the game down). Vertical Synch off (there's an issue in CoH where with the new UM features, it likes to lock at 30ish FPS if this is turned on). and Ambient Occlusion at High Quality (I think that's it...either way it's 2 notches down from maximum). I get around 35-45fps depending, in Praetoria it's closer to 35-38. That's full screen and not windowed, so you're not far off from me. I also have 8GB of ram, am running an AMD Phenom II x4 965.
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/facepalm
No wonder I'm only at 30 fps in Praetoria. I have vertical sync on. :P
I'll let you know how the change affects it in windowed mode for me with an edit shortly.
Edit:
Ok, I now get 40-50fps even in the heart of nova praetoria, but my frame rate shoots up way past 60 most anywhere else. Is there a way to limit the frame rate to 60 max so my graphics don't kill themselves trying to push to infinity?
Edit 2:
I foudn out in another thread that the /maxfps 60 command will do limit it while keeping the benefits. I'm happy now.
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That's good. Although your graphics aren't going to "kill themselves trying to push to infinity". I used to routinely get 150+FPS in CoH before UM went in. Granted the further past your monitor's refresh you go, the more tearing you get, but there's no harm in it. Though knowing about the max fps command is handy.|
Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
/facepalm
No wonder I'm only at 30 fps in Praetoria. I have vertical sync on. :P I'll let you know how the change affects it in windowed mode for me with an edit shortly. Edit: Ok, I now get 40-50fps even in the heart of nova praetoria, but my frame rate shoots up way past 60 most anywhere else. Is there a way to limit the frame rate to 60 max so my graphics don't kill themselves trying to push to infinity? Edit 2: I foudn out in another thread that the /maxfps 60 command will do limit it while keeping the benefits. I'm happy now. |
I'm honestly not sure if that 30fps "lock" with V-synch is intended or a bug or unintended consequence with Ultra Mode, I've never gotten a confirmation on it either way. It's probably also safe to add back some settings if you wished to, such as Ambient Occlusion, or a higher AF rating, or AA or somesuch. If you don't prefer them though, you're good to go as is. Glad I could help.
"Superman died fighting Doomsday because he allowed his toggles to drop, and didn't beat Doomsday before Unstoppable wore off, sad really..."
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I always had those settings that way. It looks great and occlusion doesn't play well with AA from what I read in MaximumPC.|
Originally Posted by PeerlessGirl
That's good. Although your graphics aren't going to "kill themselves trying to push to infinity". I used to routinely get 150+FPS in CoH before UM went in. Granted the further past your monitor's refresh you go, the more tearing you get, but there's no harm in it. Though knowing about the max fps command is handy.
I'm honestly not sure if that 30fps "lock" with V-synch is intended or a bug or unintended consequence with Ultra Mode, I've never gotten a confirmation on it either way. It's probably also safe to add back some settings if you wished to, such as Ambient Occlusion, or a higher AF rating, or AA or somesuch. If you don't prefer them though, you're good to go as is. Glad I could help. |
Also, trying to push graphics to infinity can kill a computer. My laptop won't play squat anymore after I started WoW. It played great, easily over 60 fps, but then the "pushing to infinity", because there was no fps limit on WoW even with Vsync, hammered my computer making it overheat so bad that it won't even run that game well at 20 fps anymore.
I discovered the maxfps command thing there far too late to save my poor laptop.
Anyway, maybe I'll be able to add back the last notch of ultra mode though. I have shadows, reflections and water at the second to last notch.
All the other settings I'll probably keep as is since they're maxed already or stuff I don't want at all(only occlusion in this category).
Edit:
That Vsync thing sounds to me like it may be related to how Nvidia's 3D Vision works. That has to send 2 feeds of alternating frame 30 fps signals to a 120hz monitor to work right, which is odd considering 2 30fps feeds would logically only need 60hz.
They could be related.
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It may not play well with AA for ATI cards, but I have no problems with it, and I'm using a slightly better version of your card, so it's not an issue with CoH and/or Nvidia.|
Originally Posted by T_Immortalus
I always had those settings that way. It looks great and occlusion doesn't play well with AA from what I read in MaximumPC.
Also, trying to push graphics to infinity can kill a computer. My laptop won't play squat anymore after I started WoW. It played great, easily over 60 fps, but then the "pushing to infinity", because there was no fps limit on WoW even with Vsync, hammered my computer making it overheat so bad that it won't even run that game well at 20 fps anymore. I discovered the maxfps command thing there far too late to save my poor laptop. Anyway, maybe I'll be able to add back the last notch of ultra mode though. I have shadows, reflections and water at the second to last notch. All the other settings I'll probably keep as is since they're maxed already or stuff I don't want at all(only occlusion in this category). Edit: That Vsync thing sounds to me like it may be related to how Nvidia's 3D Vision works. That has to send 2 feeds of alternating frame 30 fps signals to a 120hz monitor to work right, which is odd considering 2 30fps feeds would logically only need 60hz. They could be related. |
The only reason it killed your computer was heat, and primarily that was a major issue because it was a laptop. I suspect it was already on the heat borderline, or that wouldn't have happened. A properly cooled PC maintained well can run 100% load almost indefinately, until a fan fails or a hard drive does. I routinely full-load stress test my PCs for at least 1-3 days after they're built to make sure they can handle that.
They aren't related. Nvidia 3D only works when 1) it's turned on 2) the hardware supports it (that requires a 120Hz monitor) and 3) With games that support it. I had heard CoH was looking into it, but I don't believe it does currently. Even if it DID each "eye's" feed runs between 30-60fps (that's why it requires a 120Hz monitor, 60x2 is 120), I doubt it's related to that.
Don't worry so much, as long as you test your equipment properly, you likely won't overheat it.
FWIW, once I started using Ambient Occlusion, I couldn't go back, however, my SO is exactly the same as you, she keeps it turned off. But then, some people run without AA too, and I can't do that.
It's also worth noting AA settings take a MUCH lower hit on the 400 level GTX cards than they have on any cards previous, including current ATI models, so it "costs you less" in FPS to use the higher AA modes. In some cases nothing, and in others, no more than 5-10 fps, where it used to make 20-30fps differences.
"Superman died fighting Doomsday because he allowed his toggles to drop, and didn't beat Doomsday before Unstoppable wore off, sad really..."
Well MaximumPC said occlusion settings do weird things to object when AA is trying to do things to those same objects. It was something about transparent textures like leaves on a tree.
They also did a story about if people really need 3D or if it is just a fad and explained how it works.
They said it is physically limited to two feeds of 30 fps each to make up the 60 fps you see by alternating the frames in time with the shutters on the glasses.
It needs a 120hz monitor, but only puts out 60 hz worth of frames which is counter intuitive, but that's how it works.
I wouldn't be surprised if they built functions like that into the new graphics engine in preparation for 3D support.
It would definitely explain the Vsync limitation given that we are only using one feed to a 60hz monitor, and Vsync HAS to be enabled for 3D vision to keep the frames in sync witht he shutter glasses.
I would bet money it has something to do with it.
Either that or something very very weird is going on.
Edit:
This beast isn't going to overheat. :P
I may turn it on, but it's really good the way it is and my fps is fine, except it got down to 10 fps or a little lower and even crashed CoH during zombie invasions. Maybe my change to disable Vsync will make it better during those times though I don't know.
Again, I've never heard any indication CoH is going to support 3D. Also, they didn't write a new graphics engine, the engine is the same as it's always been, it's only the skinning that changed. I would more than likely figure it's a bug. Changing your settings is of course, up to you, you could also try asking in the bug forums, and see if someone like Television will bring up the Vsync issue, I would bet it has nothing to do with 3D though.
"Superman died fighting Doomsday because he allowed his toggles to drop, and didn't beat Doomsday before Unstoppable wore off, sad really..."
If you are connecting to an LCD monitor it would depend if you are connecting with a DVI cable or VGA. DVI output tends to be limited to 60Hz, regardless how "fast" the monitor is. A VGA connection may be around 72 Hz but you should be able to check the signal's refresh rate from one of the monitor's on screen displays.
The animations in the games and client are designed around 30FPS so in theory you shouldn't "need" to be any faster than that.
You can use the /maxfps command to cap your framerate.
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I wasn't aware of the command, but I was aware of most of the rest of it, was just trying to explain some stuff to the poster. As far as "need" to be faster, if it gets too close to 30 or below 30 it looks and feels like crap, so it "needs" to be at least 40-50 for me personally, thankfully that's what I tend to run at with everything maxed out, so I'm good. |
Originally Posted by Father Xmas
If you are connecting to an LCD monitor it would depend if you are connecting with a DVI cable or VGA. DVI output tends to be limited to 60Hz, regardless how "fast" the monitor is. A VGA connection may be around 72 Hz but you should be able to check the signal's refresh rate from one of the monitor's on screen displays.
The animations in the games and client are designed around 30FPS so in theory you shouldn't "need" to be any faster than that. You can use the /maxfps command to cap your framerate. |
"Superman died fighting Doomsday because he allowed his toggles to drop, and didn't beat Doomsday before Unstoppable wore off, sad really..."
Okay so I've upgraded from XP to Windows 7 recently (complete wipe and install) and now everytime I play CoH it changes to a compatibility mode that basically changes my graphics on the computer from Aero to basic mode.
Its not really a big deal, it doesn't stop gameplay or anything, but it's kind of annoying considering that when I play on my laptop with vista, and a significantly lower end graphics card, it doesn't need to change for compatibility.
I would really just like for my graphics to NOT change to basic, so I could get any help, thanks.