Electric the new top control set?

I believe the Jolt has ACC+stam enhance (for now not priority)
Chain fences 2 acc 2 immobile 2 stamina ( i will redo this later)

I believe my accuracy is from my leadership mostly fully slotted maneuvers and the acc one...no end reduction...dont need it.

Its less that the sleep patch becomes negated on large teams, but instead its function changes. It goes from being a safety button, to being a buff button. I've performed a few qualitative tests on TFs, and have noticed positive effects both on my own endurance, and my teams endurance, in laying this down at the start of every fight.

Originally Posted by VoodooGirl [*]Watching out for the Spinning Disco Portal of D00M!*

Amen...

What do you do on any control set when you've already used your every-spawn control power, your other every-spawn control power is not absolutely perfect for the situation, and your long-recharge AoE hold is still recharging? I mean, other than "play mind control so you still have an AoE control for that ambush plus the next one".

There are valid criticisms of Elec Control, but "if every power you have is still charging there's not much you can do" is a pretty weak one. Especially since Elec Control's every-spawn control is a persistent patch you can draw new ambushes onto.

For my part, I don't think Elec Control is the new top set for control: Earth Control is as solid as ever, and Mind Control is drastically underrated for some reason. It's up there, though, and it especially excels at low levels. I don't think any other set can area-control nearly as well on DO enhancements, with the possible exception of Plant (and even then, the recharge on Seeds of Confusion is just a little too long to be entirely comfortable on DOs.)

IMO it's a great set for sapping the pants off anything you target. Can't wait to take my Elec/Rad up against AVs.

Wouldn't you bump into AV resistance issues? I would assume that Elec/ would fare as horribly as any other control set against AVs, i.e. they'd totally ignore you.

Debuff and sapping don't fare as terribly as actual control does against AVs, since purple triangles don't nullify them. There's severe resistance, but I'm actually not sure how well elec sapping will or won't go against AVs (it works fine against EBs in my limited experience.)

Pitting two to three Elec/Rads against an AV would be an interesting fight. Have to see how it'd all turn out. I'll post about it in the future. As for the post made by Mr. Arizona, he's pretty right. With Power Boost, my Ill/Kin troller can knock out 50% of an AV's endurance with Transference. Granted, it comes back in a matter of seconds, but that's cause it's a one-hit, not a pulse.

Against Dr Vaz in Posi, Myself and another electric control Dominator had the AV sapped before 1/4 health was gone.

During Synapse, as the only Electric Control I had Clockwork King sapped to 1/2 by the time we killed him. But its important to note that I take AV fights on my dominator as I'm intended to, by unleashing my full attack chain and throwing out my controls as and when I am able, not priority. If I were to concentrate on sapping I could easily have had him down very quickly.

Originally Posted by VoodooGirl [*]Watching out for the Spinning Disco Portal of D00M!*

Seconded. I've found that laying down Static Field and telling my teammates to stand on it negates their need for Stamina. My friend that I duo with was always complaining about END problems until I realised what Static Field could do. Now no issues at all.

Does anybody have any numbers for Static Field? How much does it do for END drain, and more importantly how much it gives back? If I put an EndMod enhancement in to it, will it increase the endurance that I get back? I ask because I'm not sure if the enhancement would carry over to the pseudopet in that manner.

Jolting Chain, IME, does a very nice job as an alpha disruptor when you are on a team that kills quickly and it recharges quickly.

Mids only reports Static as summong a pseduopet

RedTomax's data doesnt seem to have been changed.

So all I have to go off is in the ingame numbers.


ok, in game "50.00%% (double % actually in game" chance for -3.00% Endurance on Target" so thats the drain effect

"1.88 AttrEndurance on Target" I'm assuming this is the endurance gift, I dunno when it ticks, I'm led ot believe its per target from the description and i dont, as of yet, know if its enhanceable.

unenhanced for endmod (without logging in to double check) theres a chance for it to drain 1.25 end, and gift 1.25 end. This is per enemy, but I'm not sure on the tick rate, or if this is accurate. People better with data are gonna have to look at it, and i think i checked combat logs and coulnd tsee any quanitification, as pseduopets dont report into the combat log? i'll check when i log on next.

Edit again: Doesnt report any endurance gifting in any log channel i can find, or the amount drained (checked all logs I can find) specifically found a log that the performance shifter proc was reporting in and this just reports a gift from the static field, not the amount given)

Originally Posted by VoodooGirl [*]Watching out for the Spinning Disco Portal of D00M!*

From when i last looked at it with no end mods it was 1.88 end returns per target hit by the 3.7ish end drain that has a 50% chance to hit per pulse. End mods are not worth it as it wouldn't be a big increase compared to gettign the sleep longer duration(to allow sleep to stack on bosses and higher targets for longer duration) and the recharge to use this before it fades(allowing you to stack fields).

I don't disagree with this. I also think the alternative is also adding some endurance enhancements to all skills will add up also. I am not solely dependent on one skill to drain.

So if you consider the application of SF,Aura,Chain fences, and Zappityzap.... those endurance enhances will add up nicely to your team.

Is it necessary ..probably not. I think the flexibility of how we can slot really is great here. More sleep, more hold, more immobile, or Vampire more End. What ever one goes it all is great to have for a team.

Let me clarify.

By "starting the fight" I mean that enemies become aware of you and begin to fight you. Only 3 sets Control sets can mezz an enemy without starting a fight: Illusion (Decieve), Mind (Confusion, Mass Confusion, Mass Hypnosis), and Electric (Synaptic Overload). Mass Hypnosis is also available to Defenders and Corruptors as part of their APPs.

Other sets can indeed mezz enemies as an "opener" but doing so immediately alerts the group to your presence and that point you either have to kill them or run. The entire group becomes aggroed on you, and anything that was either missed or has sufficient mezz protection will immediately attack. The enemy also becomes "locked" on you, and will continue to chase you for long distances if you do try to escape, unless someone else pulls the aggro off you.

Now, with the 3 previously mentioned sets, the "opener" is often not the first mezz you cast, but the second. In other words, Electric isn't opening with Static Field, it's opening discretely with Synaptic Overload, and only making enemies aware once it casts Static Field. If it tries to cast Synaptic Overload and the power fails or it hits fewer targets than anticipated, the enemy does nothing. The power will also not attract the attention of enemies if it is cast "too early" during a bull rush.

Enemies hit with the aforementioned powers are also less relentless. If you take off running after casting any of those powers, the enemy is less persistent about chasing you. They basically react the way enemies on the overworld street do, taking pot shots from a standing position and only chasing you a short distance before returning to their posts. Mass Hypnosis is actually probably the king of the "secret mezz and run for it" club (I use it when I round a corner and unexpectedly encounter a huge angry group) but the utility is still there for Electric.

In short, having a non-aggro mezz is game changing. It still doesn't make Electric amazingly overpowered or anything, but it is a significant advantage most sets don't have. Only Mind Control gets a secretive AoE Confuse, and it recharges 4 times slower than Electric's. That's significant, if you can find a way to leverage it.

Was Ice removed from the game?

End drain is hit, or miss. There are a number of times I can get the end bar to go down at the same rate as health does, but I think in terms of higher end AVs, you most likely need two sappers to consistently pull it off. Note this is based on playing a level 50 Kin/elec defender. Without Transference, and one that uses some sort of buff(Power Build Up), I think doing draining on AVs(certainly higher end ones) will be rather difficult solo.

On my Kin/Elec Defender, who is built as a sapper, I was able to drain an AV or two with Power Build Up-Thunderous Blast-run in and pop a blue-Transferance-Short Circuit-Ball Lightning. All of those (except Power Build Up) are slotted to some degree with EndMod.

There was a comment earlier in the thread claiming that Elec control is the most effective low level controller. I think some of the fans of Plant Control might challenge that statement.

One aspect of Electric control that gives it some similarity to Illusion -- more Electric Controllers on a team make the controller more effective rather than less. Multiples of other controllers can often step on each other's toes. (On my Earth Controllers, I can't tell you how many times my Earthquake has been neutered by the Fire Controller casting Fire Cages . . . to the point where I just give up on Earthquake.)

I've played kin defenders and I've played elec controllers and it really is a very different sapping experience, though. Elec controllers apply a steady drain and are much more able to keep an enemy down at a "can't do anything or can only fire off Brawl occasionally" level, while a kin can drop enemies to nothing very quickly but can't do much to keep an enemy there for long. While I'm not certain how well an elec controller could sap an AV, I'm not ready to discount the idea on the basis of kin-based theorycraft.

I have a plant controller too. The thing is that on dual-origin enhancements Seeds' recharge is just long enough that if you miss some enemies or fire it at the wrong time or an ambush shows up you can't do a whole lot about it, while Static Field produces a persistent patch that will grab enemies you've missed once they run into it.

Don't get me wrong, Seeds is a great power and stays a dominant control power in situations where Static Field is less useful, but in the DO levels Static Field is much more consistent control. (Assuming you don't have somebody dropping Rain of Fire on the static patch and then failing to kill his targets, anyway.)

This is one of the reasons I hate people advocating the "Pseudo-hold" maneuverer Fire and Earth can do. There's no particular need for the Cage part and anything which is capable of avoiding the Stun (like a Boss) is now either aggroed at you or if there's someone laying down a Slip Patch you've just made them immune to it.

Mind you Earthquake also has a tasty ToHit and Defense Debuff and hopefully the knockdown will get a chance to kick in in around 10 seconds, so I lay it anyway.

This is exactly right. Elec controllers are solid, steady drainers where Kins are one-shot-wait-for-the-second drainers. I believe I posted earlier in this thread that my 50 Ill/Kin can shave off most of an AV's endurance with a Power Boosted Transference, but it comes back in a matter of seconds. On my Elec/Rad controller I can herd entire rooms (entire missions if I bring my Elec/Rad controller's friend, another Elec/Rad ) and just sit there doing whatever. Granted it's not a fast way to level; Fences Containment damage only goes so far, so fast in that situation. But I don't die, I don't.

This is exactly why I still lay it down. Even solo on my Earth/Earth Dominator I lay down Earthquake and Quicksand just so I have the gigantic defense debuff in place before punching in my AoE stun/AoE attacks. It makes the entire congregation a hell of a lot easier to beat on. Drop that quake anyway!

Back to Electric Control, I've found my aforementioned level 19 Elec/Rad controller... doesn't really need Paralyzing Blast. I mean, I'm gonna take it, but not immediately. The rest of EC is enough 'pseudo-hold' as it is (fences/drain-lock).

I was thinking of putting a pile of EndMod into Chain Fences, and obviously into Conductive Aura. I was asking about Static Field mostly for the team recovery buff, which I'm still not sure it will affect or not (though I am inclined to agree with Raptis that increasing the Sleep would probably be more beneficial)

Mmm... so much fun!

I think the Flashfire/Fire Cages combo is perfectly fine if you're not rolling with someone who uses KD patches. I mean, the problem is less with the power combo itself and more with not paying attention to who you're teaming with: if you're teamed with someone who drops the KD patches like candy then yeah, your stunnees aren't going anywhere anyway.

That said, I don't like stun + immob on Earth Control because it's counterproductive to one of the character's own powers and Quicksand works fine to keep wandering to a minimum (and you should always have Quicksand down for the debuffs anyway). I don't even take Stone Cages, but that's a matter of personal taste.

I'm putting EndMod in everything I can, to be honest. Especially Conductive and Static. Putting those two together is like having nuclear Stamina.