How tall should I make her?
By
Amerikatt,
Posted on: 2010-07-04 14:29 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Belts and tails were mutually exclusive until i17. The tech to create the animated tails pretty much served as a perfect chance to also move the tails to their own slot.
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Originally Posted by BBQ_Pork
Edit: about the belt: Nevermind. I've never had a character with both a belt and a tail at the same time. Coulda absolutely sworn that they were mutually exclusive at one time. You need the spiked belt for that costume.
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That's what I thought. If I still played my namesake, I might look at doing something with his curly (closest thing was demon) tail. Couldn't hurt to go back to Icon and tinker.
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Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
Belts and tails were mutually exclusive until i17. The tech to create the animated tails pretty much served as a perfect chance to also move the tails to their own slot.
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I don't know...
Having toyed around with the +tail -ears concept, I... Just don't know. Here's where I am at the moment.
What I don't like: I hate how the tail sticks out FAR from the butt almost horizontally. It just doesn't feel natural. It gives her an "I like big butts and I cannot lie" silhouette, and the way the tail flares out towards the base is a bit, um... Icky? Besides, it hides her butt, which is cute and I do not appreciate it being hidden. What? I can admit it when my motives are impure.
What I like: I LOVE the way the tail sways with Ninja Run, and I LOVE the way ninja run looks with a shield and a right-hand weapon. That's one of the key reasons I picked bigger gloves, in fact - I really need them for Ninja Run to look good. I also have to say that I don't necessarily mind the "big butt" silhouette and, having removed the tail to compare, I that type of pants don't really give me that nice a picture to look at anyway, so there isn't much for the tail to hide. Crucially, I have VERY few characters with tails, and I'm grasping at straws to differentiate this one from my other giant woman, and this is basically "that one obvious thing that's clearly different."
Conclusion: I'm still not sold on the idea, largely because it's a pretty distinct look that I haven't worked with, but I guess now's as good a time as any to expand my horizons. On the other hand, I'm just not sure it looks good enough and, to be frank, I wouldn't know what screenshots to take to show you. Looking at her in real time in the actual game is one thing, but I'd have to spam you with pics just to get the point across, and at this point, I doubt anyone wants that. If anyone's interested in having a live audit, just let me know. I can remake on almost any server for a show and tell 
Either way, even though this still isn't set, I want to thank you guys for expanding my horizons once again. I appreciate it
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Just buy the Super Science Booster pack ... then you can adjust it anytime you dont like it, instead of being locked in at time of creation.
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I actually do have the Super Science Booster Pack. If I could actually make the character right now, I'd have been doing this as I'm playing her |
Originally Posted by Morbid Star
Just buy the Super Science Booster pack ... then you can adjust it anytime you dont like it, instead of being locked in at time of creation.
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but I need to wait for Going Rogue. I just love the concept, though, so I'm trying to work on it in the meantime, so I'm not stuck second-guessing myself while I play. That REALLY sucks the fun out of the game.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Well, at 6'3 i am taller than some men, with some high heels on i'm taller than most men.
I'd say 6'6-7'0 would be a good number to make you taller than most men.
Hehe, don't worry about bringing this stuff up, Sam 
I understand and enjoy seeing (And sometimes possibly taking a part in) the process.
Hmm... It's funny, when she is just standing there, I don't care for the large gloves so much. However, when holding the axe it looks terrific. All things considered, I think you found your answer on that question. I just wish you could have large handed gloves without the bulky flare (If you could call it a flare).
As for the ears and tail...
1) You seem to have worked for a while to have her look the way it is... and I mentioned this because...
2) If I were to go with the ears and tail, I would work more on her entire look to better fit them. It may just be small tweaks, but, as is, they look more to be added on after the fact than incorporated into her look.
The one thing that may be good (Although, based on your problems with the tail that you've since mentioned... and the fact that the only pros you mentioned for having the tail were that you liked the animation) is to have that tail in its inanimate form (Is there one? I haven't gotten the Mutant Pack yet).
Attach a tail more as a decoration hanging from her costume.
The unfortunate thing is, I doubt that would work well enough to my (never mind your) liking. 
The way it sticks out and such, I don't know that it would work as a hanging decoration.
However, it might.
But yeah... If you were to go with a less-human looking character... I would suggest going a bit farther than what you've shown thus far.
I am likely about to go into the costume creator to mess around with this right now. I'm not sure though, that I'll have anything to offer you afterward.
Probably just a completely different interpretation of the idea, but nothing that you would want to use. Of course, you never know what may come of it.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
Alright, I didn't do most of what I sort of expected to do... I figured I would start with your design and see what little changes I might make (Then, I figured I would start from scratch, just for the fun of it... but I never got that far [And had to run out for a bit]).
I mostly just did some color variations... And, since I don't have the mutant pack, I ended up not going very far into the feral/animal realm.
Let me make it clear that I like your costume and am not suggesting you change anything
Make the suggestion for me to go into the costume creator and mess with something... and I'm usually there before you can say "boo".
Anyway, I'll just get to the pictures.
First, I tried to mostly match your costume... And I ended up using some different colors:
Sample 1 Closeup
Sample 1
The only real intentional differences were the shoulder armor and the tiara (Actually, I chose the wrong tiara and then, after looking back at yours, decided to leave it just in case)
Next, I wanted to go for two things...
First, I added a bit of a skirt (Think more along the lines of a loin cloth type thing) on top of the pants. I liked this, but I know it might obscure some of the view that you enjoy
Regardless, I figured I would try and combine options for you to see to cut down on how many different pictures I'd be posting 
Also, I wanted to try and aim for more of the other world.
I stayed somewhat subtle though:
Sample 2 Closeup
Sample 2
Sample 2 Action Shot
While I like the earth-tone scheme you have for her, I figured we could try to use colors to make her more other worldly.
I ended up liking the skin tone you used and decided to use alternate colors elsewhere (Especially since the skin color palette is rather limited and your other big girl probably uses one of them).
The hair is an easy target and I thought these shades looked nice on her.
One of the only things I was unsure about on your design were the chains (Not sure if there is a conceptual reason for them... or if you were locked into them... but since I was supposed to throw some changes at you, this was one of them). -Oh, I also changed her top for this one... thought it worked for this approach-
I thought maybe some piece of her home world could go there... this being a piece of odd-colored vegetation.
Regardless of the color, it adds a bit more of the tribal element, which steel chains don't really... and possibly provides a touch of femininity without losing any strength or toughness (In my opinion, of course).
I changed the facial markings to bright blue-purple spots, going with that color theme to represent her home world.
The tiara's colors also were changed to match these...
And then the skirt has animal stripes in the similar shade.
The skirt could easily have the dark brown stripes instead (That's what I started with).
-Also... I had used the default mini skirt blend option with a very subtle darker shade and it looked nice... the stripes may not be best *shrugs* For some reason, I did not grab a pic of that-
The whole costume was darkened a bit, as I just thought the mixing of (the new) colors worked better this way.
When I see her, I think more of an other worldly amazon with those purples and such.
You could go further with it and ditch our normal earth tones all together... but, I sort of thought that base helped to relate her to the rough and tumble, tribal/barbarian sort more than if I went with all alien world colors.
The canine tail could be worked in with any of these... either as an animated one or a decorative piece hanging off the belt.
Regardless... I have no anticipation of you going with anything I offered up and am completely happy if you stick with exactly what you have.
Whatever works for your fun
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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I actually don't want to go TOO tribal on this one. What I have in mind is more of a "savage" look than specifically a tribal one, which I came to realise when I dismissed the Tribal shield out of hand as looking far too off. As David Nakayama's Noble Savage demonstrates, you can have various degrees of technology and still be savage, and I originally drew Brutticus' initial concept to something of an iron age to bronze age look. I wanted to have metalworking added in there, though not be very prevalent, hence mostly axe handle, shield trim and other odds and ends.|
Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
If I were to go with the ears and tail, I would work more on her entire look to better fit them. It may just be small tweaks, but, as is, they look more to be added on after the fact than incorporated into her look.
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As well, going too tribal and/or bestial risks losing the actual "girl" part of the whole monster girl design, which is actually why I eventually resolved to get rid of the ears. They're not a bad detail, but they detract too much from the point in a costume which is basically engineered to detract from the point as a central feature. Still think I'll leave the tail in, though, just because
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| The one thing that may be good (Although, based on your problems with the tail that you've since mentioned... and the fact that the only pros you mentioned for having the tail were that you liked the animation) is to have that tail in its inanimate form (Is there one? I haven't gotten the Mutant Pack yet). |
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Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
[B]Let me make it clear that I like your costume and am not suggesting you change anything
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First, I tried to mostly match your costume... And I ended up using some different colors: Sample 1 Closeup Sample 1 The only real intentional differences were the shoulder armor and the tiara (Actually, I chose the wrong tiara and then, after looking back at yours, decided to leave it just in case) |
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First, I added a bit of a skirt (Think more along the lines of a loin cloth type thing) on top of the pants. I liked this, but I know it might obscure some of the view that you enjoy Regardless, I figured I would try and combine options for you to see to cut down on how many different pictures I'd be posting
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| While I like the earth-tone scheme you have for her, I figured we could try to use colors to make her more other worldly. |
Again, I don't actually know what leather, fur or animal hide would look like in real life. Those are just the impressions I got from rooting through my memory. That said, blue is... Not really something I can see and go "Oh! She's wearing furs! I get it!" The concept is already weird and then some. If we go too much weirder I risk losing my audience
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| I ended up liking the skin tone you used and decided to use alternate colors elsewhere (Especially since the skin color palette is rather limited and your other big girl probably uses one of them). The hair is an easy target and I thought these shades looked nice on her. |
However, my attempts to carry this over into City of Heroes tanked. Bad. I suspect I just suck at this, but there was no way I could make a blond, dark-skinned girl AND make her feel like she should be big and intimidating. I honestly don't know why that is, but it seems to work much better for tomboys than it does for... Well, this. However, Basquash!'s Miyuki is a concept I don't think I've seen much of in anime, as she basically looks like a native African girl, with the thick, curly black hair and very dark skin. That sort of look is what got me hooked, originally, as it really did seem to be right at home with the whole "giant strong woman from another world." I could alter her hair or skin colours, I admit, but I think she would lose a lot of her charm in so doing. Again, I'm trying to balance the fantastic with the instinctive, and I tend to give most of my more assertive characters black hair if I don't have a better idea.
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| One of the only things I was unsure about on your design were the chains (Not sure if there is a conceptual reason for them... or if you were locked into them... but since I was supposed to throw some changes at you, this was one of them). |
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| I changed the facial markings to bright blue-purple spots, going with that color theme to represent her home world. |
That's why I had it just a shade darker than her skin, though I wonder if I shouldn't have actually made it LIGHTER than her skin. Honestly, if I could, I'd have given her more scars over her back and her upper arms, but the game doesn't support it. It'd make sense, though, considering the story I wrote for her.I should note that even if it feels like I went point by point and rejected everything, I still rather enjoyed this
Thank you for your help and for your participation.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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just set up marcos if ya do it right you could have her switiching costumes while in mid fight :P
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
You know, when I read this the first time I thought "Doh! Why didn't I think of this before!" It's a really good idea, I have to say, but... Well, it has a particular problem that's inherent in how costumes are handled, in that I can easily "reverse" the evolution by swapping to an earlier costume. Because of this, I try to design my costumes like outfits, that is to say as things that can be swapped into and out of either in real time or with minor limitations (such as having to go back home to change). Any costume which obsoletes another costume is best done as a REPLACEMENT for the earlier costume, rather than as an alternate one.
Now, I guess I could just go the werewolf route and have her sprout ears and a tail at night or during a full moon or when she powers up or such, but... Well, it's just ears and a tail, so that's a pretty underwhelming transformation of that's what I'll be selling it as. And I honestly don't want to go full werewolf. I don't have a wolf head I can use with hair (or that doesn't look like my butt), I don't want to go with backwards legs and werewolves are... Kind of a bland concept, to be honest. Granted, girls that turn into werewolves are inherently more interesting, but I just don't think the concept is interesting enough to carry a werewolf through. |
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I should note that even if it feels like I went point by point and rejected everything, I still rather enjoyed this
Thank you for your help and for your participation. |
Zero worries. And I'm not saying this as though you are too predictable, haha... I just fully expected you to be happier with what you already had. And I appreciate and enjoy the point by point explanations.
I truly just felt like messing with it and offering it up and don't mind at all. You never know if one tiny thing might inspire the other person, even if they take it down some other path that is far far from what was suggested.
Regardless, I didn't expect any changes to come from this, but you never know for sure.
So, it's always worth tossing things out there, when it is invited.
I'd respond more about a few of the things you asked about, but I'm pressed for time, so I thought I'd just chime in quickly.
Oh, and yeah, I understood the clothes were supposed to be that tawny animal hide/leather look. I think some deer, antelope type animals tend to turn out that way. And yeah, that's all I meant by the 'earth tones'. I should have just said animal hides, hehe. So, I think you did well on that... I got it, at least
And I hear you, about the chains and shoulder pads. I have actually done that a few times myself. I, too, like that aspect of realism in a lot of my costumes.
About the skirt for loin-cloth-like attire, I actually like to use the slit sided mini. It would be much better if the slits went higher, of course.
But, sometimes, it can work nicely.
And one last response:
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
That... Actually confuses me a bit. If the majority of my pros for the tail have to do with liking its animation, why would I want to pick a tail that didn't have animation? Not criticising, just trying to follow your thought here. To be honest, I probably wouldn't have even considered keeping the tail after I saw it in action if it didn't look so cool with Ninja Run.
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I offered that for two reasons.
1) I had already thought of the idea before I read any of your opinions on the animated tail in action. So, the idea was there in my brain and I planned to tell you regardless, hehe. (And yes, I do laugh this often)
2) It seemed that you were unsure that you really wanted to make your girl have a tail. So, I just thought it was worth a shot in allowing the option to have the tail as a hunter's decorative item/trophy (As opposed to making her have an animal tail sticking out of her).
Honestly, I really doubt that a motionless tail would sell well as that (Too rigid and not hanging, like such a thing would do), but I wouldn't be sure until I tried it.
So, that's why I suggested it, despite you liking the animations, hehe
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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Hey, if you ever have more time, do tell. I am interested to hear about it |
Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
I'd respond more about a few of the things you asked about, but I'm pressed for time, so I thought I'd just chime in quickly.
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About the skirt for loin-cloth-like attire, I actually like to use the slit sided mini. It would be much better if the slits went higher, of course. But, sometimes, it can work nicely. |
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Hehe, I suppose I can understand your confusion on that one. I offered that for two reasons. 1) I had already thought of the idea before I read any of your opinions on the animated tail in action. So, the idea was there in my brain and I planned to tell you regardless, hehe. (And yes, I do laugh this often) 2) It seemed that you were unsure that you really wanted to make your girl have a tail. So, I just thought it was worth a shot in allowing the option to have the tail as a hunter's decorative item/trophy (As opposed to making her have an animal tail sticking out of her). Honestly, I really doubt that a motionless tail would sell well as that (Too rigid and not hanging, like such a thing would do), but I wouldn't be sure until I tried it. So, that's why I suggested it, despite you liking the animations, hehe
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Aw... Aw, great... Right as I'm typing this, an annoying colleague of mine has been speaking in a loud voice for the past hour or so, so I put on my headphones and play some Nightwish. And right away, my imagination starts giving me pictures of people like that running and jumping through terrains like what you'd see in Conan the Barbarian. I can't help it, it's just how my head works. But that's kind of the mental bridge I needed between just seeing a character alone transected from any background or world, and being able to imagine that character in her own world. Actually without the context of the game itself, which can sometimes be limiting.
I guess that's what passes for inspiration with me, but that sort of thing is what makes the game and the characters so much fun. I'll have to stew on this for a while
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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2. I had not thought of that. The only reason I put in ears was because I put in a tail. I figured it made sense. As you suggest, it doesn't, not necessarily. To be honest, I've tried playing around with "ears on" and it just looks bad. I have not tried playing around with just a tail, however. I'll do that. Thanks!
Will go test. Thanks for the tip