Corruptors get some Love


Adeon Hawkwood

 

Posted

I see a good powerset lingering around in the mastermind sets, Poison of course, its not used often so I think it should be placed for corruptors too, to componsate for the lack of force fields.

Also, a poison blast set would be a nice replacement for the other lacking power, psychic blast which corruptors dont have either and add a powerset which is just poison damage. The poison blast could have a DoT effect on certain powers and others that effect defense, speed or resistance.


A total of 14 of my nerves have been harmed in the making of this post...

 

Posted

Have long wanted to see /Poison ported over to Corrs and possibly Fenders.
/Signed


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Posted

Here you go, some Corruptor Love.


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Posted

I like poison, but I can't think of many compelling PvE reasons to play it with /Radiation Emission available... Rad does most of the things Poison does and almost as strongly, but as AoE instead of single-target. A lot of it would come down to how Noxious Gas was ported over or what replaced it, though.


Having Vengeance and Fallout slotted for recharge means never having to say you're sorry.

 

Posted

I'd want to see poison ported over to corruptors with faster recharges and lower end cost.... have Noxious Gas be an ally targeted AoE. Then up all the debuff numbers on the single-target effects. Turn poison into a single-target slaying set. Radiation Emission has good numbers and AoE effects. Make Poison GREAT numbers and single-target.

As for a poison blast set: I wouldn't mind it. I imagine it'd have damage values similar to Psi Blast or Rad Blast, which wouldn't be that bad.

Though, to be honest, I'd probably make a Dual Pistols/Poison as my first and probably only poison corruptor >.>

-Rachel-


 

Posted

Poison blast won't happen. Toxic is considered an "unbalanced" damage type, with no matching defense. It's the elephant in the living room of damage types, and why no single player attack in the game deals primarily poison damage.

And Poison... there is not really any reason to take it over Radiation Emission. The two anchors are not much weaker than the single target debuffs and are AoE (hell, they pack more -tohit), especially when you realize that Poison debuffs are still subject to Ranged defense. AM is a powerful and highly desirable ally buff. Antidote is... decent, but not that good. Alkaloid is horribly overpriced for its effect and (especially) recharge time. Neurotoxic recharges faster than LR but in return doesn't have the much-desired -regen. The whole set has absolutely no alpha strike reduction capability. Poison Trap is a joke. The only AoE debuff that would help is on a 5m timer and often dies with its carrier.

So, yeah. I think Poison needs some work before it's good enough. For the lack of alpha help I have no solution, but I do believe Alkaloid needs to be retooled. I'd start by cutting the duration in two or four but adding a +regen component to the heal. The heal that keeps on healing, like the new (and awesome) Energize.


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Posted

Looking at /poison's numbers, and having played it, I'd have to say it has two powers going against it: poison trap and noxious gas. It has one big hole as well: little regular mob mitigation, so aside from the enemies weakened so badly, you'll have a crowd bearing down on you/your team full throttle. Making noxious an ally toggle, the consistent -res helps as quicker death=mitigation.

Poison trap's sleep is not applied to newcoming mobs, but it's actually not the sleep I'd tweak. I'd have it do a pulsing, continuous -end that could completely drain endurance from a mob after some time. As there'd be no -recovery with this, they could do a few counter-attacks between drain ticks, but it would still help reduce damage.

If you can tweak those up, you'd have a more viable solo AND team performance, something very important when you don't have minions to take hits for you à la corruptors.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkarmoryThePG View Post
Poison blast won't happen. Toxic is considered an "unbalanced" damage type, with no matching defense. It's the elephant in the living room of damage types, and why no single player attack in the game deals primarily poison damage.

And Poison... there is not really any reason to take it over Radiation Emission. The two anchors are not much weaker than the single target debuffs and are AoE (hell, they pack more -tohit). AM is a powerful and highly desirable ally buff. Antidote is... decent, but not that good. Alkaloid is horribly overpriced for its effect and (especially) recharge time. Neurotoxic recharges faster than LR but in return doesn't have the much-desired -regen. The whole set has absolutely no alpha strike reduction capability. Poison Trap is a joke. The only AoE debuff that would help is on a 5m timer and often dies with its carrier.

So, yeah. I think Poison needs some work before it's good enough. For the lack of alpha help I have no solution, but I do believe Alkaloid needs to be retooled. I'd start by cutting the duration in two or four but adding a +regen component to the heal. The heal that keeps on healing, like the new (and awesome) Energize.
To be fair: Mastermind End costs for their secondary powers are much more expensive than their Corruptor Secondary counterparts.

For example: Tar Patch
Corruptor End cost: 7.8
Mastermind End Cost: 9.75

25% Difference on that power.

Meanwhile Mastermind "Soothe" from Pain Dom costs 16.12 while a Corruptor's only costs 13. Since the poison heal costs 16.25 we can assume it's cost would be near to 13 since 16.25 is 125% of 13. It's got a slightly lower heal component, but a 15% damres buff versus toxic.

So the end costs for Corruptors would be as follows ((MM Costs in Parenthesis)

Alkaloid: 13 (16.25)
Envenom: 9.75 (13)
Weaken: 9.75 (13)
Neurotoxic Breath: 9.75 (13)
Elixir of Life: 24.38 (32.5)
Antidote: 4.88 (6.5)
Paralytic Poison: 7.3 (9.75)
Poison Trap: 12.19 (16.25)
Noxious Gas: 17.06 (22.75)

Now Envenom and Weaken are both Click-Activated Singe Target Debuffs while Radiation Infection and Enervating Field are both AoE Toggle Debuffs based on a Target's location. The Debuff from Envenom and Weaken lasts 30 seconds and recharges in 12 seconds. So let's see a per-second end cost.

9.75 divided by 30 is .32 end per second

Meanwhile Radiation Infection comes out at .52 end per second. Turning it into an AoE click with a 30 second duration it would cost...

.52 multiplied by 30 is 15.6 end per click.

So the endurance cost for using a click equivalent of Rad infection (AoE Debuff) would cost 15.6 end. The same click as a single target costs only 9.75. I think that's a fair tradeoff. Though, again, I'd still like to see the numbers of the single target debuffs increased...

-Rachel-


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkarmoryThePG View Post
Frankly, I disagree. The debuffs are strong enough as is. I'd rather affect more targets than one more. Most mobs die fast enough as is already to bother debuffing them one by one.
What would you think of increasing the end cost, then, to 15.6 end per click and making the current poison debuffs (Envenom and Weaken) targeted AoEs, instead of single target effects?

Cottage rule -could- apply to this, but it's keeping the power more or less the same, isn't it?

-Rachel-


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelenar View Post
I like poison, but I can't think of many compelling PvE reasons to play it with /Radiation Emission available... Rad does most of the things Poison does and almost as strongly, but as AoE instead of single-target. A lot of it would come down to how Noxious Gas was ported over or what replaced it, though.
This. Thematically it would be awesome for Corruptors to get Poison but from an actual game play point of view it seems weak compared to other sets (especially Rad). Personally I always figured Poison was deliberately designed as a single target version of Rad for Masterminds.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steampunkette View Post
What would you think of increasing the end cost, then, to 15.6 end per click and making the current poison debuffs (Envenom and Weaken) targeted AoEs, instead of single target effects?

Cottage rule -could- apply to this, but it's keeping the power more or less the same, isn't it?

-Rachel-
Hm.

Actually, I think it would run contrary to what the set is.

I mean, it'd be a clear buff, but I feel that'd... stretch what Poison currently is past the comfort zone. Cheapen it.

No, I'd rather either see Neurotoxic or Noxious get a buff that actually helps with dealing with alpha strikes. Perma/Toggle Noxious would be interesting definitely, and raise my interest in the set (though it comes oh-so-late). Neurotoxic... I don't know. It's good at what it does, but it doesn't do what the set could use (see Fearsome Stare, which is both a great -tohit debuff AND a fear that greatly reduces a spawn's alpha).

[edit] the thing is... I cannot in good faith advocate a buff to Neurotoxic. It's great at what it does, just... unslottable (like all -rechs) and it doesn't do what the set could use.

Hmm. I wonder what if Poison Trap was heavily remade into a lobbed glob of poison that exploded and did SOMETHING to a spawn that'd neuter an alpha. It'd also need to be moved earlier in the set to matter.

[edit2] Or a patch! I love me a good, pulsing patch! ....pulsing sleep? hmmmmm.....


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkarmoryThePG View Post
Hm.

Actually, I think it would run contrary to what the set is.

I mean, it'd be a clear buff, but I feel that'd... stretch what Poison currently is past the comfort zone. Cheapen it.

No, I'd rather either see Neurotoxic or Noxious get a buff that actually helps with dealing with alpha strikes. Perma/Toggle Noxious would be interesting definitely, and raise my interest in the set (though it comes oh-so-late). Neurotoxic... I don't know. It's good at what it does, but it doesn't do what the set could use (see Fearsome Stare, which is both a great -tohit debuff AND a fear that greatly reduces a spawn's alpha).

[edit] the thing is... I cannot in good faith advocate a buff to Neurotoxic. It's great at what it does, just... unslottable (like all -rechs) and it doesn't do what the set could use.

Hmm. I wonder what if Poison Trap was heavily remade into a lobbed glob of poison that exploded and did SOMETHING to a spawn that'd neuter an alpha. It'd also need to be moved earlier in the set to matter.

[edit2] Or a patch! I love me a good, pulsing patch! ....pulsing sleep? hmmmmm.....
How about bumping the hold percentage on Neuro breath a bit? Have it at a mag 2 a certain percentage of the time and another mag 2 at another certain percentage. It would hold Minions and LTs for a short while almost every time and have the potential to hold a boss on occasion... Or it could miss all it's hold chances.

I honestly think Noxious Gas should be ported over as is, just turn the target into an ally.

-Rachel-


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steampunkette View Post
How about bumping the hold percentage on Neuro breath a bit? Have it at a mag 2 a certain percentage of the time and another mag 2 at another certain percentage. It would hold Minions and LTs for a short while almost every time and have the potential to hold a boss on occasion... Or it could miss all it's hold chances.

I honestly think Noxious Gas should be ported over as is, just turn the target into an ally.

-Rachel-
That's certainly an idea, though it's stepping on Dominator/Troller toes.

And that port... could work, yes. It'd make the power slightly better in Corruptor hands which, well, which is all right.

Hmm. I'm toying with the idea of turning Poison Trap into a pulsing sleep patch.


What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?

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Posted

/signed
It's a great set, but too exclusive.


 

Posted

I love this suggestion. I'd love to see poison proliferated to Corruptors, to blasters and defenders too. I know it's not a "heroic" set, but since heroes can go vigilante and villain now. (Well soon thy will.) And since from what they've said at the cons it seems like praetorians will be able to pick any AT and be either side, Defenders and Blasters don't have to be strictly heroic anymore.


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