I have gathered some comments about the Praesidium from elsewhere, hopefully they will further illuminate the topic at hand.
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Originally Posted by Stalemate
It was/is the Praesidium coalition's semi-private channel.
http://www.guildportal.com/Guild.asp...4&TabID=374262 Member SGs were allowed to have 3 OPs to manage their own invites and then keep an eye out for any needs or interventions that might have been needed. It died pretty much the same way this server's once largest coalition did: through lack of interest. I was one of the 3 original founders, along with Bionexus and Fire_Spin, way back in 2005. It hosted the Herolympics on this server for 2 years in a row, then the cross-server Superolympics project was launched so I joined that thinking it could replace it. It couldn't, and fell into an endless spiral of red tape and mismanagement (the Superolympics, that is). I quit being involved in its leadership earlier this year. ... "The more you know..."  |
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Originally Posted by Sooner
Which then brings up the big question...
Is there interest in attempting to revive Praesidium? I'm not even going to try on my own, but if I can get a couple people to help... I'd be willing to try. It was a noble idea. |
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Originally Posted by Stalemate
Straight out of Wikipedia:
"The presidium or præsidium (from Latin præsidium meaning protection or defense, so plural presidia or præsidia) is the name for the heading organ of various legislative and organizational bodies. The members of the presidium usually sit on the tribune in front of the main members body." Also, the latin flavor appealed to us and it was only later that we learned it could possibly be a political reference (socialism). We took it for it's meaning of "committee, or commission" as the concept called for those in leadership to serve the constituent members (SGs and individuals) If I recall correctly, it took weeks of discussions to agree on a name (my suggestion here) originally. Quite honestly, when our 3 original SGs decided to form a coalition there was no clear objective that it become Protector's largest open coalition. But when it did start expanding we came up with the precepts you find on the website I linked earlier, to try to keep the original concept working with a larger number of SGs. Bionexus left the game, and then Fire_Spin became less involved as well, so new leadership was voted in by the member SGs, the precepts were adapted again to better suit everyone (allowing for solo SGs, for example), and we continued adding to our numbers. I think I was one of the only ones who tried to actively recruit some more visible SGs that I thought would be a good fit. Some worked out, very few did not, others left of their own free will. Despite the server-wide activities, the unofficial coalition nights organized to run TFs and such, SGs and players became less and less interested in organizing things for others and more demanding of activities they could partake in. A vicious circle. People said they wanted it to work, wanted to get involved, but the reality of it was much different. Expectancies ran high, while involvement was almost nil. That, and the indifference from some SG members (my own included, truth be told) created an environment where investing more time, more effort seemed futile - especially since the Jello Shooters channel was doing it already. |
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Originally Posted by Ice9_
It may be cliche, but the Praesidium was a bright, shimmering idea resting up on a hill. One that should not fade into the past... we've reshaped it many times already, it can be done again. Those who are interested, member and non-members alike, should head here to discuss the revival of the Praesidium.
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I'd be interested in assisting on behalf of the Teamsters, but I'd also like to talk it over with the other leaders first.
City of Heroes taught me that when the world is burning, you don't just stand by and watch, you grab a fire extinguisher and do whatever you can to stop it-even if it's not much at all. Sign the petition to keep City of Heroes alive HERE.
@MissKyo, Leader of the Teamsters coalition on Protector
Well, then... let me throw this out there as a question for all.
I was the last presiding officer of the Praesidium. This also means that I was in charge when Praesidium finally crashed liked the Hindenburg.
I've been interested for some time in trying to revive this, and I will gladly take charge of that project IF I have help. If you'd prefer, I'll hand the reins off to someone else, and just help out as best I can.
Well then I have two questions:
1) What is involved in being a part of the Praesidium
2) In this new era is there any consideration for Villain groups?
The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.
Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?
A: You crash into another one.
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In answer to your first question, each member SG had representatives that acted as liason between the SG and the Praesidium. All members were welcome to and encouraged to use the Praesidium global channel and website to discuss anything under the sun with regard to the game, SGs, events, etc. There were no dues, no fees, no obligation of membership. You probably already know many people who are, or were, members. Some of the member SGs include: Phantoms of War, Ultimate Avengers, Defenders of Time, Ghosts Reborn, UHF, and Paragon Punishers.|
Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
Well then I have two questions:
1) What is involved in being a part of the Praesidium 2) In this new era is there any consideration for Villain groups? |
Some might say Jello Shooters (and other global channels) provides a means to find a team, chat, or whatnot. I agree, this is true, but Praesidium can do far more for example... From hosting events, games, and contests to providing info, coaching, and assistance with SG bases, character builds, and even finding that elusive IO your character needs. Yes, you can find these resources in the forums if you have the time and inclination to dig for them. However, the Praesidium, as a super coalition, can provide these things in one centralized entity.
Time and again fellow Protectorites have thanked me for bringing info to the Protector threads that I found elsewhere on the forums. This tells me there are a good number of people who could, and likely would, appreciate the value of a 'one-stop shop' so to speak. Looking for a team? Need help with a badge? Can't find an IO in your level range? Need a new SG? Don't know how to access Teleport Beacons for your base?
As a member of the Praesidium, just click on the Praesidium global channel and toss out your question or go to our site and post it in the forums. You won't hear "figure it out n00b!". You will get honest, good info from the collected knowledge of dozens if not 100s of players. Because it is by membership only, we can decided who joins and who does not, and those requirements are simple. Be honest, be fair, and don't be a jerk*.
About villain SGs, previously we did not extend membership to red side, but since we are reshaping the coalition and we use a global channel for most ingame communication, I do not see why we cannot explore that option too.
*Being a jerk is open to interpretation, but it is like art. You may not be able to define it, but you know when you see it.
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I know where that belongs...
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Originally Posted by Ice9_
*Being a jerk is open to interpretation, but it is like art. You may not be able to define it, but you know when you see it.
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Nice. I'll talk to OD and see what he thinks. He would probably be our best liason.
Blazing Blue 50 fire/fire Blast, BlueStarr 50 PB, BlueSt 50 stone/ss Tank, Purple Pummaler 50 bs/regen Scrap, Green Puritan 50 emp/nrg Def, Raging Red 50 ice/cold Cor,WhiteLightning 50 ill/storm Cont, GrayMatter 44 WS,Green Marauder 24 nrg/stone Brute,Dark Blue Blaze 26 fire/fire Cor,etc
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Just to clarify on Ice's answer: There were no plans originally to make the Praesiidium open to villains. I think that was largely due to my influence actually. I don't play villains and saw this coalition as ... hard to justify villain side given its ideals.|
Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
...2) In this new era is there any consideration for Villain groups?
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F.U.S.I.O.N. and Praesidium were once closely collaborating on the "blacklist" we kept in our forums. We had been talking about the possibility of making it official that we would confront each other - basically create an archenemy system of our own where those of one group would gleefully hunt down those of the other. In theory, FUSION would have been our dire enemies and that is where we referred anyone looking for somthing similar to the Praesidium, but red-side.
But it didn't happen.
I'm torn as to whether or not to throw my hat in for this round... we'll see. It will probably hang on whether villains are allowed to join or not.
█ Players Guide to the Cities
Nicely said Ice. *perks up in interest*
Huron: "...with Coffee primary / Attitude secondary"
Charnage: "Please. Think of the poor defenseless desks."
"The Babylon Project was our last, best hope for peace. It failed... In the year of the Praetorian War, it became something greater... our last, best hope for victory."
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there was a full listing on the main page of the website of current and inactive SGs.|
Originally Posted by Ice9_
...Some of the member SGs include: Phantoms of War, Ultimate Avengers, Defenders of Time, Ghosts Reborn, UHF, and Paragon Punishers...
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Oh, btw - Phantoms of War and Paragon Punishers are now "fused". Both names are kept, but the leadership is common to both.
█ Players Guide to the Cities
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Let me make a suggestion here...|
Originally Posted by Stalemate
I'm torn as to whether or not to throw my hat in for this round... we'll see. It will probably hang on whether villains are allowed to join or not.
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There is the out of game coalition of players, then there is the IN game coalition of characters.
Believe me when I say that NO member of the Ghosts Reborn (for instance, Sooner Spirit) would ever willing work in any way, shape, or form with a member of the Shades of Vengeance (for instance, Shattered Ice9). However, the PLAYER @Sooner and the player @Ice9 might have plenty of reason to interact on a global channel and on forums and the like.
So... IN game, there would be two separate coalitions. OUT of game, the players would all interact in one global channel.
Or... to put it another way... I am not a villain. I play a villain occassionally.. but I am not myself a villain.
Make any sense?
Sadly, it may amount to a moot point, at least as far as my original question was concerned. While Aeon University would certainly find the Praesidium's goals admirable (especially the sharing information one) it's quite honestly way too small to become a part of this. However, if this line of inquiry DOES get one of the bigger Villain Groups in, and as a result get more folks actually interested in red-side, then it's still a plus in my book.
The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.
Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?
A: You crash into another one.
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We had a few 1 person SGs when last it was active |
Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
Sadly, it may amount to a moot point, at least as far as my original question was concerned. While Aeon University would certainly find the Praesidium's goals admirable (especially the sharing information one) it's quite honestly way too small to become a part of this. However, if this line of inquiry DOES get one of the bigger Villain Groups in, and as a result get more folks actually interested in red-side, then it's still a plus in my book.
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█ Players Guide to the Cities
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Originally Posted by M_I_Abrahms
Sadly, it may amount to a moot point, at least as far as my original question was concerned. While Aeon University would certainly find the Praesidium's goals admirable (especially the sharing information one) it's quite honestly way too small to become a part of this. However, if this line of inquiry DOES get one of the bigger Villain Groups in, and as a result get more folks actually interested in red-side, then it's still a plus in my book.
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Originally Posted by Stalemate
We had a few 1 person SGs when last it was active
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Stirring up conversation and interest is the first step, I'm glad to see people checking this thread and asking questions. While I do not want to abandon the founding preceps of the Praesidium, we are also not without the ability to alter them to reflect changes in the game and our community. SGs, from solo efforts to titanic rosters of 100+, are welcome to join the conversation.
I've put some more thought into the issue of villain SGs and I think a good alternative, one we did not explore previously, is establishing a similiar super coalition on red side. Member of both the Praesidium and (villain coalition name to be decided) could share one global channel for easy of communication, but utilize seperate (but linked) guildportal sites. That way if you're inclined to focus on blue or red side, you can enjoy content tailored to one side or the other.
Again, I want to stress that there is a great deal of latitude for discussion here, we are working from a great original design but we also have the power to shape our future together.
Since Ice is gung ho on this, I have granted him admin rights to Praesidium's guildportal sight. Ice... run with this. I
It goes without saying I will offer whatever help you need.
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I won't say it either.
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Originally Posted by Sooner
It goes without saying I will offer whatever help you need.
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"Goodbye, Jean-Luc. I'm gonna miss you... you had such potential. But then again, all good things must come to an end..." -- Q
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Mine joined as a 1-man SG.|
Originally Posted by Stalemate
We had a few 1 person SGs when last it was active
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Now I have about... Six different people in it... Two of us are regulars, I believe.
I would like to help out in any way I can as well, though I have some concerns that would be better addressed in private.
And, Sooner, don't beat yourself up about the Praesidium fading while you were in charge. It was during a time when the P.E.R.C. and P.V.P.E.C. were getting into full swing and there was a massive cross-server influx of events. Many times, Praesidium events would be the same as P.E.R.C. events, and scheduled to be roughly at the same time. We, of course, graciously stepped aside from the path of what looked to be the greater impetus.
Now we've reverted to the state before I joined the Praesidium, with regularly scheduled Rikti Raids and irregularly scheduled Hami Raids, but not much collusion outside "Hey, J.S.! I want to run this TF! Who wants to come with me? Hello?"
Frankly, we're probably looking at a good time to revive this idea. I'm growing weary of Protector's "I stand alone!" mentality. It's still the Little Server that Could, but there's starting to be a creeping "Don't you mess with me!" attitude that's been bothering me. I think establishing this community support concept would prove extremely beneficial to Protector.
A little-remembered fact is that Praesidium basically started the New Player Welcome Night. It was a radical idea to help new players get familiar with the game and various qualities within it. I'm surprised this didn't catch on with the other servers. God knows some of them need it.
My Stories
Look at that. A full-grown woman pulling off pigtails. Her crazy is off the charts.
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This answers a concern of mine. While I do have toons in larger SG/VG's, the majority of my toons are in a SG/VG of less than 3 active people.|
Originally Posted by Stalemate
We had a few 1 person SGs when last it was active
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I'm glad that small SG's would be welcome, and as I said earlier - I think either Ice or Sooner would be good for this. Or both.
And now that I've inflated both of their egos... *tiptoes out of thread*
Huron: "...with Coffee primary / Attitude secondary"
Charnage: "Please. Think of the poor defenseless desks."
"The Babylon Project was our last, best hope for peace. It failed... In the year of the Praetorian War, it became something greater... our last, best hope for victory."
Personally, I really appreciate Grey's comments up there. Always nice to see that those hours upon hours of coordinating, planning, motivating didn't go completely unnoticed.
When I decided to step aside as coalition chair after 4 years and tapped Sooner to replace me in that role, I knew there was leadership potential there. I'm a big fan of the "promote those who have what it takes, but don't want it over those who ask for it" approach. It ensures someone who's not in it for popularity nor fame is in charge and that their attention is on the job, not keeping their position.
True, Ice9 was also a candidate and at the time the precepts didn't allow for the Consulate to have more than 1 person from any single SG, so with Real Life keeping him busy he declined anyhow (hope my memory serves me well here). Thankfully that was changed soon after (by popular vote, as always).
Grey's explanation of why the coalition faltered is spot on. PvPEC, PERC, the Superolympics, Jello Shooters activity were all on the upswing at the time and the people in charge at the time did what they could, with what they have.
I want to be clear that I don't for a second think that this was due to a lack in leadership on Sooner's part. I really think Ice9 and Sooner are great candidates for a re-launch of the Praesidium.
█ Players Guide to the Cities
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Thanks, Stale. That means a lot to me.|
Originally Posted by Stalemate
I want to be clear that I don't for a second think that this was due to a lack in leadership on Sooner's part. I really think Ice9 and Sooner are great candidates for a re-launch of the Praesidium.
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Wel.. I'll say this... I've been talking about trying to revive it for some time, but Ice popped here and really got interest going. So, I'll just say that I'll be here to help in any way I can, but since Ice has the ball rolling...
...passes the ceremonial baton to Ice.
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The PVPEC had nothing to do with the success or failure of the Praesidium. I would contact people from the organization, or go on the Praesidium boards to drum up interest in an event I was hosting--and nothing ever came of it. I had friction with Stalemate over holding events on Thursday night, which is when he wanted to badgehunt. That's it.| Grey's explanation of why the coalition faltered is spot on. PvPEC, PERC, the Superolympics, Jello Shooters activity were all on the upswing at the time and the people in charge at the time did what they could, with what they have. |
Btw, to whom is the new Praesidium meant to cater? What kind of player?
Blacklisted
"I'AM SATANS FAVORITE CHILD!!"
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We did?! |
Originally Posted by FrozenDeath
The PVPEC had nothing to do with the success or failure of the Praesidium. I would contact people from the organization, or go on the Praesidium boards to drum up interest in an event I was hosting--and nothing ever came of it. I had friction with Stalemate over holding events on Thursday night, which is when he wanted to badgehunt. That's it.
Btw, to whom is the new Praesidium meant to cater? What kind of player? |
Sorry, I don't recall... I don't even recall having badgehunting events organized through the Praesidium, except for the 400 rep runs and the New Player Welcoming Night's exploration badge tour (that only happened twice) - but those were mostly mine.
My apologies if you felt that way. I know we had friction on other issues, but I was unaware of this one.
We were talking about the PVPEC, along with those others, as one of the reasons players did not flock in droves to Praesidium forums, channel, events. In other words - they had other things to do, PVP being only one of them.
The reasons you probably didn't get much feedback (even after I asked for a GuildPortal alliance with the PVPEC site) was for exactly the same reasons no one else did. People were busy elsewhere and paid little attention to the coalition's activities.
I think I had allowed the PVPEC site access to our "public" section through the GP alliance for shared sections of forums / calendars, but don't remember if it was used or not before it was removed (not by us btw).
If you contacted anyone from the Praesidium re: PVP events, I'm afraid the chain of commmunication died somewhere before it reached the member SGs. I never heard or saw anything besides the PVPEC events proposed through GP, and almost all those came through the shared calendar. I'm pretty sure it wasn't me.
This brings up a good issue to discuss: venues of communications. Pick only a handful. Stick with them. Ensure their use.
█ Players Guide to the Cities
We have forums, but not everyone reads them or at least not every day.
We have global channels, but not everyone belongs to or watches the same ones.
We have global friends and server friends, but those lists have limits too.
We all know SGs we like and respect as well as those we avoid, but what if we had a place...
where friendly SGs and their members could chat, team up, and share stories and info...
where we could find interesting events, opportune TFs and SFs, or bump into long lost friends...
What if we stood up the pillars of Praesidium once more?
Curious about what the Praesidium is all about? Please join the discussion and, if you like, help shape it's future.