You've never been on a Raid, have you?
It was called Cathedral of Pain and was a grand failure of epic proportions. We don't talk about it. We don't mention it. We try not to think about it.
short answer: They lack the skills of doing it right! At least we do get the mothership raid with the arena chat as poor substitute of a proper raid interface.
Then again, the "other" game only has 5 people in each team and as far as I know nothing that even compares to raids - yet! 
How an MMO can survive without real raids today is beyond me, I'm guessing we're just so stuck in this game we don't really know the competition anymore. Personally I'm rather amazed everytime I play another game. It really shows how old and dated this one feels, yet we're so scared they'd change it that most suggestions are beaten down hard, very hard.
Then again, in the EU, any villain would be hard pressed to find more than 8 players to join up with, even when using forums etc to arrange something. We've had several miserably failed Hamiraids due to the simple lack of people. I sometimes log on to my founders LOTRo account just to see the vast amount of people on. Can't stand playing that crap though...
Oh, well, see you in GR (most likely still without any proper raid system)
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Um, the CoP was not a failure from requiring multiple teams. It was pulled because of an exploit - which, from commentary, needed a rewrite of the entire thing to root out. |
Originally Posted by SingStar
It was called Cathedral of Pain and was a grand failure of epic proportions. We don't talk about it. We don't mention it. We try not to think about it.
|
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| short answer: They lack the skills of doing it right! At least we do get the mothership raid with the arena chat as poor substitute of a proper raid interface. |
I'd say it's more along the lines of (a) not being able to find a way they're happy with and (b) wanting to keep things accessible. The Positron TF used to be multi-team (if not SG) content. As was the initial faultline raid - the description (from the old, written-in-beta Prima book) had you needing up to ninety (!!!) people (if they were at minimum level - 17) to do it successfully.
Think about that.
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| How an MMO can survive without real raids today is beyond me, I'm guessing we're just so stuck in this game we don't really know the competition anymore. |
I do see where they fit in with a more PVP-centric game (working my way there in Aion, for instance.)
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| Personally I'm rather amazed everytime I play another game. It really shows how old and dated this one feels, yet we're so scared they'd change it that most suggestions are beaten down hard, very hard. |
As far as "feeling dated?" Your opinion, and you're welcome to it. I like that it's different in not having stats tied to costume pieces, that it has its own setting, that it doesn't require the "holy trinity" to do anything, that you can be expected to handle large mobs solo (instead of kiting if there's more than 1-2 even-level enemies around, or requiring a "healer" or whatnot.) That mindset is what feels "dated" to me.
What Bill said.
~ Infinity Heroes ~
Dark Voltage - 50 NRG/NRG/EM Blaster
Shure Shot - 50 Arch/NRG/MM Blaster
Silent Shadow Blade - 50 Katana/SR/BM Scrapper
Uphir - 50 Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster
Ohwell...
I've never concidered CoX to be an MMO anyway... It's a 1-8 man game where you select server ("missions") in a rather big chat lounge similar to a game world with some optional events occationally (e.g. miner strikes in Sharkshead ever 5 minutes).
The fact that there was real raids planned that never ever really made it to the game fully functional without exploits doesn't exactly support the idea that they can indeed make'em, but interpretations are like opinions - everybody has them.
On the upside, I'll have to admit that teaming and even mothership raiding with the arena chat works far better than most "real" raids in other games.
Unfortunately I see this game becoming more and more of a solo project for people instead of the other way around, and as far as I'm concerned, if I'm gonna solo a game I'd rather play something modern and fancy that requires skill and/or tactics (no, not the pool power).
Personally I'd rather see an aggressive posture, more team and/or SG oriented stuff and /signed, more teams working together, preferably not co-op although it might be necessary concidering the low amount of players we can muster nowadays. I miss the old hamiraids, not because they where easy, laggy or rewarding, but because we all showed up and had a good time. The MS raid isn't bad, but it's just not... fun...
Now, I know people usually go into a frenzy whenever someone says something like that, but let's face it. There's plenty of soloable stuff in the game, and I'm not suggesting "it" would reward something special (like HO's), I'm just saying that this is supposedly an MMO and I'd love to see more MMO stuff in the (supposed) MMO. Making people come together, getting to know each other is the best marketting they can possibly do. I'm still around solely because there's still plenty of good people I enjoy spending time with on Defiant. Most of the times nowadays the game's really just a chat room for me (done-it-all-itism).
If you enjoy soloing, that's fine. You pay your subs so I'm not gonna tell you you're wrong. ...but I don't get it! I honestly don't get it! There's so many good, funny games out there... Oh.. well! As long as you're happy! 
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Since we're on the topic, I've never considered the bus a form of public transportation. It's more like a meeting room, typically filled with strangers, that just happens to move between different designated meeting brake stops.| I've never concidered CoX to be an MMO anyway... It's a 1-8 man game where you select server ("missions") in a rather big chat lounge similar to a game world with some optional events occationally (e.g. miner strikes in Sharkshead ever 5 minutes). |
... yes, that was complete sarcasm.
For some reason I've got a modified version of that obvious saying running through my head... obvious AE power-leveler with no grasp of the history of the game is obvious.
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So let me get this straight. On one hand you insult the devs because they don't have more multi-team content, then promptly complement them because the multi-time content they do have is better than the competition? |
The fact that there was real raids planned that never ever really made it to the game fully functional without exploits doesn't exactly support the idea that they can indeed make'em, but interpretations are like opinions - everybody has them. On the upside, I'll have to admit that teaming and even mothership raiding with the arena chat works far better than most "real" raids in other games. |
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| Unfortunately I see this game becoming more and more of a solo project for people instead of the other way around, and as far as I'm concerned, if I'm gonna solo a game I'd rather play something modern and fancy that requires skill and/or tactics (no, not the pool power). |
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| Personally I'd rather see an aggressive posture, more team and/or SG oriented stuff and /signed, more teams working together, preferably not co-op although it might be necessary concidering the low amount of players we can muster nowadays. I miss the old hamiraids, not because they where easy, laggy or rewarding, but because we all showed up and had a good time. The MS raid isn't bad, but it's just not... fun... |
Also, most players miss the I8 Hamidon raid because the I9 Hamidon raid was a complete crock of ... well. I can't say that in a public place. Yes, some servers still do Hamidon raids... but let's be realistic. You get the same enhancement reward, a Hamidon Enhancement from doing Lord Recluse's Strike Force or Statesmans Task Force, a lot more inf and prestige, with only 8 players instead of zone pop-cap... and it generally takes less time to do the TF/SF's.
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| If you enjoy soloing, that's fine. You pay your subs so I'm not gonna tell you you're wrong. ...but I don't get it! I honestly don't get it! There's so many good, funny games out there... Oh.. well! As long as you're happy! |
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| Most of the times nowadays the game's really just a chat room for me (done-it-all-itism). |
To get the thread back on topic, as Bill mentioned, the CoP was a grand event that held up to three teams at a time. Lamentably, it had to be deactivated due to problems with SG members not participating in the raid being able to get unlimited experience with certain missions. I'm not going to hold my breath about seeing it in the future, but it would be nice.
Base raids also fall into the redevelopment category, and were the catalyst for the I13 PvP changes. The problem with player-created bases is the exploitation of geometry in order to teleport players into "prisons" and other inescapable places, so base raids were deactivated for the time being.
I know that the survey sent out in 2008 mentioned more PvP-centric battles in the future; and Castle has mentioned the desire to include more objective-based PvP in the future, such as "capture the flag" scenarios, etc.
Currently, the Mothership raids and Hamidon raids are the best we have. With global channels, it's pretty easy to set up a "raid channel" without having to resort to Arena or Broadcast. The Hamdion raid takes a fair degree of coordination, while the MS is mostly a mash-up with priority targets being those damn Rikti Magi.
In any case, I understand where you're coming from, and would enjoy more types of scenarios that involve more than just one 8-man team. I think CoH could easily build upon the Hami raid and MS raid schemes in the future, although I would love to see a mechanism for instanced raids. If base raids and IoPs can ever be sorted out, that would also be a bonus (although some of the original premises were flawed IMO). Anything else would be icing.
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Items of Power are gone. They aren't coming back. They've been replaced in function by Invention Origin enhancements. | If base raids and IoPs can ever be sorted out, that would also be a bonus (although some of the original premises were flawed IMO). Anything else would be icing |
Also, even at it's heyday, most SG's weren't doing base-raids. Very few supergroups could afford the prestige cost of having to completely rebuild a trashed out base, and most super-groups viewed it as a pointless exercise. One of the big problems with redeveloping base-raids is making it into a meaningful experience that all sg's can... well.. I don't want to say enjoy... tolerate? Since Items of Power supposedly won't be making a comeback outside of decorative objects, that means having to come up with a new mcguffin for players to chase after or for.
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| I'm not going to hold my breath about seeing it in the future, but it would be nice. |
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| I know that the survey sent out in 2008 mentioned more PvP-centric battles in the future; and Castle has mentioned the desire to include more objective-based PvP in the future, such as "capture the flag" scenarios, etc. |
The problem is also complicated because many CoH players come to CoH because it does not have open battlegrounds like WarHammer or WoW and does put an emphasis on skill and teamwork. From a development point, copying something players are leaving other games to get away from... doesn't sound like a smart design move.
Of course, there's also the viewpoint that having exactly equivalent features might pull in more players from other games. There's probably a large number of WoW and WarHammer players that won't give CoH a shot because it doesn't have epic scale objective based PvP goals.
Hello,
I know it may sound too complicated or possibly far fetched but, i think i'm ready for something different and which requires more teamwork. anyways any thoughts or ideas would be great.
I'm sure this might have been suggested before but in CoH you only have the option on task forces for 8 players and I was thinking today how different it would be to have multi teamed task forces. The idea would go like this. 2-3 teams of 8 working together either on same mission or different missions and meeting together for the final mission. Just some ideas off the top of my head would be stuff like one team would need to defend a base or an area the other team would go in and complete the objective. This idea would create multiple objectives for each team that would need to coordinate for the final objective. One scenerio would possibly land in bloody bay where recluse has launched an all out assault on the hero base and one team would need to defend it and take out key targets while another hero team would lead an assault on the villain base and have a list of objectives to complete together. Maybe key players would have temporary powers to assist in certain circumstances that is required in the game or just all out fun i think it would be cool to operate a turret or fly one of those longbow jets or some sort of land vehicle halo style