Fire/Thorns, Any thoughts?

Hello folks,

I have been playing for a while and I have found that I like making less popular AT/powerset choices when creating new toons (powerset choices in this case). Just for the novelty and such. Usually I can make these toons pretty fun and for the most part productive parts of the Paragon community.

I seem to have met my match with my Fire/Thorns Dominator though. Low damage and high end use combined with holds that don’t seem to hold (except in domination) very much suck the fun out of this toon for me. I have end reducers in the attacks but still run out of end long before even small/medium mobs are down, or held.

I have him up to level 22(through teaming mostly) and was hoping stamina would help, but no luck. I think perhaps I am going into the Dom thing with the wrong play style in mind. To me, Dominators are like a light controller with more damage. Am I wrong here?

I have seen no guides on the Thorns set other than Plant/Thorns so I’m guessing that it is not popular for one reason or another. Anyone out there had success with a Fire/Thorns? I’m really just looking for play style suggestions rather than specific builds, but if certain powers are useless/great to have please let me know. Also if there is a level that Doms really start to shine (example: tanks after the low 20’s) that would also be great.

I hate deleting toons after level 20 but I am real close to wiping this one.

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

Low damage?

I built Cayenne up as an out and out AoE toon lots of fun to play especially at high levels but you do need someone with taunt on the team as otherwise you will draw more aggro than a fire blaster - most of the control is immobs and with so many AoEs/Cones I'm amazed I don't have more debt badges.
Yes the AoEs and cones are heavy on end but the single target attacks have low end use - I can keep using those even with next to no end left.

I made no attempt to get her permadom but instead slotted IOs for acc/damage - to the extent I still hit Valkyrie after she MoGs a significant amount of the time on RSF. Nowhere near a fully optimised build though.

As to playstyle she plays much closer to a blapper with some control than a controller.

The low damage comment has just been my experience with this dom so far(my mind/psi dom is MUCH better).

It could be I only have attacks slotted with Acc and end reduction or that I am only 22,....not sure. That is part of my problem.

If the damage gets better and is viable as mostly AOE I will try a respec(mostly single target right now other than immobs) and see how that goes.

It's too bad some of the old threads have been lost. I recall some threads touting Fire/Thorns as one of the more damaging dom combos. /Psi is probably the best..but after the buffs /Thorns should be a very close second (for aoe). Maybe you can post your build or power picks so far..so we can see what may be the issue. I know I wouldn't skip AIM on a Thorny as it boasts accuracy and damage. And Flashfire is must for Fire/ Dommies.


If you're truly disappointed you could always go for a Fire/Energy dom. Very strong single target attacks, with stuns, plus power boost upping your Primary..could be helpful. And maybe provide the fast pace you're looking for.

I own a lvl 50 Fire/Thorn Dom.

He's rather deadly


JJ

It's hard to characterise whats wrong without seeing a build or at least power choices.

I'll throw some general points though; they may be of some use:

• Stamina will help with endurance (obviously), but the big improvement will come with better enhancements and more slots to put them in. That starts at 22, but your slot issues won't resolve until later.
• Hot Feet is hellishly expensive. Running it all the time with less than 3 EndReduc SOs (or equivalent) in it will cause endurance issues. Many people skip this power until L22 (and personally, I don't even turn it on until L23 when I can stick some slots in it).
• Also spamming Fire Cages will cause you issues. This is very tempting to do as it is flashy and has a nice quick recharge. However there are several reasons why you shouldn't, including the fact that it is quite end-expensive and you really don't get much bang for your buck. Use it by all means - it works well after Flashfires. But stop yourself from constantly reapplying it.
• Flashfires isn't a great soft control, but realistically, it's what you have to live with. You'll need to 6-slot it ASAP and get some mix of enhancements that maximises Accuracy, Recharge and Stun duration. Cinders is panic button only stuff - you shouldn't be using it for real control purposes.

I dont even use Hot Feet on my Dom, skipped it totally


I move around far to much, for that power to even be remotely useful to me. When I solo, Im very mobile & all over place, thus Hot Feet no good. When I team, I Firecage+Bonfire Combo constantly, chucking in some Thorn Barrages for Bosses.


Here is my Build, Most probably discount it, but run roughshod over many things & seriously do not fear any mob in the game(even Carnival & Malta).


Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Dominator
Primary Power Set: Fire Control
Secondary Power Set: Thorny Assault
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Teleportation
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Char -- Lock-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(A), Lock-Acc/Hold(3), Lock-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(5), Lock-Rchg/Hold(7), Lock-Acc/Rchg(7), Lock-%Hold(9)
Level 1: Thorny Darts -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(31), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(33), Thundr-Acc/Dmg(40), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(50), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 2: Skewer -- T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A), T'Death-Acc/Dmg(3), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx(5), T'Death-Dmg/Rchg(9), T'Death-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(23), T'Death-Dam%(31)
Level 4: Fire Cages -- Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(A), Posi-Acc/Dmg(34), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(48), Posi-Dmg/Rng(48), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(48)
Level 6: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 8: Combat Jumping -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(50)
Level 10: Impale -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(11), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(11), Thundr-Acc/Dmg(13), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(17)
Level 12: Flashfire -- Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(A), Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(13), Stpfy-EndRdx/Stun(15), Stpfy-Acc/EndRdx(17), Stpfy-Stun/Rng(19), Stpfy-KB%(19)
Level 14: Super Jump -- Jump-I(A)
Level 16: Smoke -- DarkWD-ToHitDeb(A), DarkWD-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx(29), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/Rchg(31)
Level 18: Health -- Heal-I(A)
Level 20: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(21), EndMod-I(21)
Level 22: Cinders -- Lock-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(A), Lock-Acc/Hold(23), Lock-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(25), Lock-Rchg/Hold(27), Lock-Acc/Rchg(27), Lock-%Hold(29)
Level 24: Acrobatics -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(25)
Level 26: Bonfire -- KinCrsh-Dmg/KB(A), KinCrsh-Dmg/EndRdx/KB(43), KinCrsh-Acc/KB(45), KinCrsh-Rechg/EndRdx(45), KinCrsh-Rchg/KB(45), KinCrsh-Acc/Dmg/KB(46)
Level 28: Aim -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 30: Thorntrops -- TmpRdns-EndRdx/Rchg/Slow(A)
Level 32: Fire Imps -- SvgnRt-Acc(A), SvgnRt-Acc/Dmg(33), SvgnRt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(33), SvgnRt-Acc/EndRdx(34), SvgnRt-Dmg/EndRdx(34), SvgnRt-PetResDam(37)
Level 35: Ripper -- Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(36), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(36), Oblit-Dmg(36), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), Oblit-%Dam(37)
Level 38: Thorn Barrage -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(39), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 41: Scorpion Shield -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(A), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(42), RedFtn-Def/Rchg(42), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(42), RedFtn-Def(43), RedFtn-EndRdx(43)
Level 44: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(46), RechRdx-I(46)
Level 47: Recall Friend -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Domination
------------
Set Bonus Totals:

• 13.5% DamageBuff(Smashing)
• 13.5% DamageBuff(Lethal)
• 13.5% DamageBuff(Fire)
• 13.5% DamageBuff(Cold)
• 13.5% DamageBuff(Energy)
• 13.5% DamageBuff(Negative)
• 13.5% DamageBuff(Toxic)
• 13.5% DamageBuff(Psionic)
• 5.31% Defense(Smashing)
• 5.31% Defense(Lethal)
• 2.5% Defense(Fire)
• 2.5% Defense(Cold)
• 17.8% Defense(Energy)
• 17.8% Defense(Negative)
• 10.6% Defense(Melee)
• 24.4% Defense(Ranged)
• 5% Defense(AoE)
• 5% Enhancement(Held)
• 3% Enhancement(Stun)
• 30% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
• 39% Enhancement(Accuracy)
• 12% FlySpeed
• 49.6 HP (4.88%) HitPoints
• 12% JumpHeight
• 12% JumpSpeed
• Knockback (Mag -3)
• Knockup (Mag -3)
• MezResist(Confused) 2.75%
• MezResist(Held) 9.9%
• MezResist(Immobilize) 4.95%
• MezResist(Sleep) 2.75%
• MezResist(Stun) 4.95%
• 13.5% (0.23 End/sec) Recovery
• 6% (0.25 HP/sec) Regeneration
• 12.5% Resistance(Smashing)
• 10% Resistance(Lethal)
• 12.8% Resistance(Fire)
• 12.8% Resistance(Cold)
• 10% Resistance(Energy)
• 10% Resistance(Negative)
• 10% Resistance(Toxic)
• 10% Resistance(Psionic)
• 15% RunSpeed

• 3% DamageBuff(All)
• 2.5% Enhancement(Held)
• MezResist(Held) 2.2%
• 2.5% Defense(AoE), 1.25% Defense(Fire), 1.25% Defense(Cold)
• 3.75% Defense(Ranged), 1.88% Defense(Energy), 1.88% Defense(Negative)

• 2% (0.03 End/sec) Recovery
• 2.5% Defense(Energy,Negative), 1.25% Defense(Ranged)
• 7% Enhancement(Accuracy)
• 4% RunSpeed, 4% FlySpeed, 4% JumpSpeed, 4% JumpHeight
• 2.5% Defense(Ranged), 1.25% Defense(Energy), 1.25% Defense(Negative)

• MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
• 15.3 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
• 2.5% DamageBuff(All)
• MezResist(Held) 2.75%
• 3.75% Defense(Melee), 1.88% Defense(Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Smashing)

• 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
• 1.58% Resistance(Fire,Cold)
• 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
• 6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)

• 2% (0.03 End/sec) Recovery
• 2.5% Defense(Energy,Negative), 1.25% Defense(Ranged)
• 7% Enhancement(Accuracy)
• 4% RunSpeed, 4% FlySpeed, 4% JumpSpeed, 4% JumpHeight
• 2.5% Defense(Ranged), 1.25% Defense(Energy), 1.25% Defense(Negative)

• 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
• 19.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints
• 3% Enhancement(Stun)
• 6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
• 3.13% Defense(Ranged), 1.56% Defense(Energy), 1.56% Defense(Negative)

• 15.3 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
• 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery

• 3% DamageBuff(All)
• 2.5% Enhancement(Held)
• MezResist(Held) 2.2%
• 2.5% Defense(AoE), 1.25% Defense(Fire), 1.25% Defense(Cold)
• 3.75% Defense(Ranged), 1.88% Defense(Energy), 1.88% Defense(Negative)

• 3% RunSpeed
• 2.5% Resistance(Smashing)
• Knockback Protection (Mag -3)
• 6% (0.25 HP/sec) Regeneration
• 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)

• MezResist(Sleep) 2.75%
• MezResist(Confused) 2.75%
• MezResist(Stun) 2.75%
• MezResist(Held) 2.75%
• 3.13% Defense(Melee), 1.56% Defense(Lethal), 1.56% Defense(Smashing)
• 10% Resistance(All)

• MezResist(Stun) 2.2%
• 3% DamageBuff(All)
• 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
• 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
• 3.75% Defense(Melee), 1.88% Defense(Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Smashing)

• 2% (0.03 End/sec) Recovery
• 2.5% Defense(Energy,Negative), 1.25% Defense(Ranged)
• 7% Enhancement(Accuracy)
• 4% RunSpeed, 4% FlySpeed, 4% JumpSpeed, 4% JumpHeight
• 2.5% Defense(Ranged), 1.25% Defense(Energy), 1.25% Defense(Negative)

• MezResist(Immobilize) 2.2%
• 1.26% Resistance(Fire,Cold)
• 2% DamageBuff(All)
• 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
• 2.5% Defense(Ranged), 1.25% Defense(Energy), 1.25% Defense(Negative)

I would Imagine to be an awesome combo. I know My Earth/Thorn is loads of fun I imagine Fire would be even more awesome in the dmg factor and less on the control factor an Earth Dom does....I have to agree with the others pair up with a Good Brute b/c /Thorn anything can aggro like no other...seriously I have out Tanked a Tank on blue side before lol.

My Fire/Thorns was one of the first farmers on Freedom, after IO system was released. By that time he was awesome, he burned and destroyed through TV farms like no one of my toons. The combo it's really strong and a solid PVE AT.
I would definitely go permadom , Hotfeet and grab a end recovery PPP. Also to fit aid-self would be a good idea if you can.
Sadly my dom is empty and i keep it hoping to build him up again. I got just a good recall from this toon.