Best solo pve / pvp primary?


Bloodspeaker

 

Posted

I know this must be asked a lot, but I didn't see any immediate threads, and I spent a decent while searching around and comparing the various guides and stats that were available, but it is pretty difficult to determine when all the information is in terms of severity (minor/moderate/heavy, etc) and not in terms of DPS.

It seems like, looking at the stats, that Mercs would be the best, at least at dishing out damage while still having some CC abilities ... even with a potentially gimpy medic (is it?).

Ranged seems like a good thing, as it should keep them near me and so under my supremacy buff and in range for Twilight Grasp heals moreso than the more melee-focused primaries (necro, ninja)...

Bots seem potentially gimped with their tier 2 pet being a healer? How do they compete with damage?

Anyway ... what are your thoughts on the best? I'll likely mostly solo PvE to level as I can only play at odd times, but love PvP as well.

Suggestions on a secondary would be useful as well, though I think I'm pretty sold on Dark.

Thoughts?

Thanks


 

Posted

Every Mastermind that has their pets and upgrade powers can solo missions while you are at the grocery store or running other errands. In PvE, it doesn't matter what you pick. You are going to kick major booty.

http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=139481
That thread has some discussion of PvP and Masterminds that you will find interesting.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mobius View Post
It seems like, looking at the stats, that Mercs would be the best, at least at dishing out damage while still having some CC abilities ... even with a potentially gimpy medic (is it?).

Ranged seems like a good thing, as it should keep them near me and so under my supremacy buff and in range for Twilight Grasp heals moreso than the more melee-focused primaries (necro, ninja)...

Bots seem potentially gimped with their tier 2 pet being a healer? How do they compete with damage?

Anyway ... what are your thoughts on the best? I'll likely mostly solo PvE to level as I can only play at odd times, but love PvP as well.

Suggestions on a secondary would be useful as well, though I think I'm pretty sold on Dark.

Thoughts?

Thanks
Mercs
  • -medic closes to engage due to a different max range from the others (at least that's what it seems like to me)
  • -cones are extremely narrow (think 5 degrees)
  • -Tier 3 pet has long recharges on AoEs and Tier 2 pets have ridiculously long recharges on controls, and they use them at stupid times (tear gas grenade on last minion of spawn at 10% health )
  • +All ranged all the time assuming you keep them there
  • +Good resistances

Bots
  • -More fragile than you expect at first
  • -Feels a little weak on damage before you upgrade things to the max
  • -CLANK CLANK CLANK CLANK *blocks door*
  • +Tons of AoE once upgraded and not on retardedly long timers
  • +Prot bots bubble you and your other bots, heal, and do good damage assuming you slot for damage like you should

Necro
  • -Melee only mainly, ranged attacks are lacking
  • -retarded AI really enjoys keeping your grave knights at range, spamming Dark Blast while Headsplitter gathers dust, so some positioning is necessary
  • -Lich occasionally mouths off about you being next on his list
  • +All kinds of toxic/smashing/lethal/dark damage once upgraded
  • +Lich is a control machine and assuming you position him right he pretty much neuters every spawn

I can't address ninjas or thugs, never played them.

Secondaries all offer something but I find FF the most boring and surprisingly not the highest in safety. Dark is hard to go wrong with, same with traps. I'm levelling a necro/pain ATM and things die twice. My wife is levelling a bots/traps (bats/tarps?) and she is loving it. Like Smurphy said, any primary is pretty much a murder machine in PvE.

As far as PvP, I don't know. I've never PvP'd on my mastermind, and the only times I've come across MMs in PvP I've killed them really fast. I'm told this is because they didn't know what they are doing; this is entirely possible because I sure don't know what I am doing in PvP so if I kill you, you must have been asleep or something.


 

Posted

I have found that as pets go the thugs are the best for DPS as every pet is geared to dishing out the hurt, this is even more true since you can slot the tier 2 pet to proc drop resists on target, perfect for PVP. Slotting them with the new pet recharge sets is great too, since you can whip them out for PVP damage very very quickly and cheaply.

I also find that the big debuff sets as secondary are great for pvp, dark, poison and storm come to mind. Add amazing damage at range to full to hit and defence/rsists debuff makes for a great PVP.

Interestingly enough, in this game at least, using the good PVP builds makes for excellent PVE as well.

I would go with thugs/dark or thugs/storm as the most versatile both ways. Having played both I can say with confidence that thugs/storm is my favourite.


@Boerewors

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emberly View Post
Bots
  • -More fragile than you expect at first
    not my experience
  • -Feels a little weak on damage before you upgrade things to the max
    same thing here, I felt pretty tough with two tier ones and a single tier two
  • -CLANK CLANK CLANK CLANK *blocks door*
    all MM pets block doors, not just bots; the clanking is the sound of massive win being applied (you get used to it)
  • +Tons of AoE once upgraded and not on retardedly long timers
    range fighters too, not melee; I find this preferable
  • +Prot bots bubble you and your other bots, heal, and do good damage assuming you slot for damage like you should
    yup
That's my take anyway.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mobius View Post
I know this must be asked a lot, but I didn't see any immediate threads, and I spent a decent while searching around and comparing the various guides and stats that were available, but it is pretty difficult to determine when all the information is in terms of severity (minor/moderate/heavy, etc) and not in terms of DPS.
Welcome to the boards. Something to keep in mind is that many of the MM guides were written before Real Numbers and the Invention System was introduced, so some of them are lacking in statistics. I suggest downloading a copy of Mid' Hero designer:

http://www.honourableunited.org.uk/

It has not been updated since Issue 13, but it should still be useful.

Quote:
It seems like, looking at the stats, that Mercs would be the best, at least at dishing out damage while still having some CC abilities ... even with a potentially gimpy medic (is it?).
The problem with the controls in Mercs is the long recharge time, they just are not used often enough to be useful. As for the Medic, he has too many powers that draw too much aggro, resulting in his death( the same can be said about the Arsonist in the Thugs set).

Quote:
Ranged seems like a good thing, as it should keep them near me and so under my supremacy buff and in range for Twilight Grasp heals more so than the more melee-focused primaries (necro, ninja)...
That's a good point, but pets do have a tendency to run into melee range. I'd suggest setting up some macros to help control your pets. Twilight Grasp is great, but only if the pets are in the small radius of healing it provides.

Quote:
Bots seem potentially gimped with their tier 2 pet being a healer? How do they compete with damage?
The Protector bots have several very useful abilities. In addition to healing they also put defensive bubbles on all your pets, and you as well. Combined with their innate resistances, it makes Bots one of the tougher pets sets. Damage wise, the're not spectacular. However, that same damage is spread out in some very good AoE attacks.

Quote:
Anyway ... what are your thoughts on the best? I'll likely mostly solo PvE to level as I can only play at odd times, but love PvP as well.

Suggestions on a secondary would be useful as well, though I think I'm pretty sold on Dark.

Thoughts?

Thanks
Basically, any Mastermind combination will be able to solo with no difficulty. As for PvP, I'd say it depends on your playstyle. In Zone PvP, any of the secondaries are useful if used properly. If you're going to do any arena matches, take a good look at Necro/Poison, but again any combination will do well if used properly.

And do not forget that you have access to two builds for your character. So you can make a PvE build and and PvP build. It will cost more because you have to buy for two builds, but if it means greater success, then use it.

Grizz


"When Chuck Norris can't go on, Petra Majdič perseveres!"

 

Posted

Thanks for all the input. So, it definitely seems, as PvE shouldn't be an issue, I'm focusing on PvP effectiveness.

For primary, the consensus seems to be Thugs or Necro are the better ones, but Bots and Ninja are decent too.

For secondary, while Poison or Storm seem definitely interesting, I'm hesitant to give up the PBAoE heal, especially since it heals me as well (Poison and Storm heals are single-target and ally-only).

I guess I'm leaning towards Thugs/Dark then, at the moment...until I read another post that changes my mind


 

Posted

Took me a long while to decide on primary for my pvp MM but have learnt a bit from it I think.

1. If your secondary doesnt have a self heal then necro may be a good choice for life drain.

2. Melee minions seem to need more micro managing to get them to do the best damage as some always tend to stay at range. If you are going to add damage by using melee attacks from patron powers melee minions are good as you will keep body guard up more easily.

3. Im happy with my choice of bots as they can annoy with stuns, have range so less micro managing and the regen debuff prevent interruptable powers being used for 30s. So many people have complained how annoying this to fight against (ninja poison dart may have the same effect).

4. Thermal secondary is coming out and will probably be the best 1v1 secondary (purely subjective though, just my opinion).

5. Anyone who says any MM is easy to kill must be fighting MMs who use aggressive 24/7.

Just what Ive found so far, hope it helps. MMs imo are probably the best 1v1 AT but they do suffer from mobility, especially in zones.


 

Posted

My Bots/FF MM is incredibly tough. Once you get Assault Bot (l26 I think) and then again with the final upgrade (l32?) they become very potent. FF is all about controlling the battlefield. I can take on swarms of enemies without problems. Well, minus the terrible AI forcing my robots outside the protective bubbles. Seriously, fix the AI! I want a stay here and fire command that works!

EDIT: Oh, my major weakness is AoE DoTs like fire slicks and such. The robots run out of it in every direction and usually outside my dispersion field/force bubble.


 

Posted

Another nice thing about the level 32 upgrade for necro: ALL of your pets get Life Steal (or whatever it's called), so they're all a bit more self-sufficient at that stage. With Dark Servant at 38, you can plunk that next to the Lich (who generally stays at range), walk into melee range yourself with everyone else, and watch as the two of you spam the snot out of Twilight Grasp.

I've PvP'd mine (necro/dark/soul), generally about 50/50 against tanks, eat most /regen stalkers and scrappers (with -regen on TG and HT). Psi is necro's big weakness.

Necro/dark is also the only pairing with 8 pets (not counting Gang War ), 6 permanent and 2 temps.


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