Gorgog

Since i3 Rad has always been one of my favourite sets. Really no longer like my ill/rad any more especially with reference to damage but I guess that may just be my own opinion. For me PA used to contribute quite a bit to damage and as rad debuffs instead of buffs I guess it goes well together. But rad goes well with anything.

Much has probably changed but isnt fire/kin still the way to go for damage?

This thread is funny. Fayth made one post a month ago and since then nothing. If they wanted to make a GLB SG then they could have just done so as I know for a fact that having Gay as a prefix on a SG name doesnt bat an eyelid in game at least not on my server.

So if anyone wants to just do it. Dispite the pages and pages here I honestly dont think anyone else minds or cares.

P.S. In BB one time someone thought I was an alt of TG's and didnt like him so yup being TG probably did create more of a fuss then being Gay. :P

P.P.S. My mum comes from the same country as Bruno. Wonder why I laughed so much at his other stereotypes and less at his new one. ;D

Took me a long while to decide on primary for my pvp MM but have learnt a bit from it I think.

1. If your secondary doesnt have a self heal then necro may be a good choice for life drain.

2. Melee minions seem to need more micro managing to get them to do the best damage as some always tend to stay at range. If you are going to add damage by using melee attacks from patron powers melee minions are good as you will keep body guard up more easily.

3. Im happy with my choice of bots as they can annoy with stuns, have range so less micro managing and the regen debuff prevent interruptable powers being used for 30s. So many people have complained how annoying this to fight against (ninja poison dart may have the same effect).

4. Thermal secondary is coming out and will probably be the best 1v1 secondary (purely subjective though, just my opinion).

5. Anyone who says any MM is easy to kill must be fighting MMs who use aggressive 24/7.

Just what Ive found so far, hope it helps. MMs imo are probably the best 1v1 AT but they do suffer from mobility, especially in zones.

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also take a look at this I guarantee if you were female and walked about London with no top on you would find your self being arrested and possibly charged.

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So lesbians arent female now?

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Is that not an assumption on your behalf that the women in the picture are lesbians?

*wondering when the link will be removed*

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and speaking personally i find the entire thing disturbing in the same way i find the idea of positive discrimination disturbing it mite be "positive" but its still bigotry and discrimination and as long as people see these divides there's going to be problems.

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This is actually why I am still following this thread. To see if folk are open minded on both sides (every side) of the fence. In an ideal world there would be no more reason for g.a.y pride then straight pride as nobody would feel anyone is in need of championing.

Sadly though this isnt an ideal world and reading some of the accounts given in the thread I can understand why folk would feel the need to have visable support for what essentially only makes them a minority and not a good or bad person.

Whilst being homosexual doesnt necessarily prevent Hidden from being homophobic he didnt come accross to me as such. Given the strong views on this, as shown in the thread, I think he was right to warn people to be prepared and saying he personally wouldnt do it seems more as a personal view, which after all is what a forum is for, and not telling anyone not to do it.

Ill continue to have a friendly laugh at anyone g.a.y as much as anyone straight and myself for that matter but from what some folk have written here I will keep in mind that what is funny to one person can easily be very offencive to another.

Problem is it isnt always the person being offended who is in the right, they may just be overly defencive, so it does take everyone to be as understanding as possible.

Oh man Im sorry and I know I should be taking this more seriously but you really made me laugh. Are you saying that nobody in the army is "lewd and lascivious"?

If it was as bad as all that it was probably because they were there.

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No - I still find it highly amusing to make the uptight ones with no sense of humour cry...

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And I was going to say you were coming over as having an ever ready stuck somewhere tight as you keep on going. WoW dried up my tier glands years ago.

As for the noob bit... 83% res in pvp, cors Im an noob wouldnt have to be asking questions if I wasnt.

You keep going on about teh old pvp. Well if we cant have it in game we may aswell make do with the forums.

NOOB!

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You guess wrong then noob!

I know what you mean but I don't worry about daft stuff like that.

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What? Never! You are just bored and trolling on a thread that was already answered.

Also if you dont bother with things like this why on earth are you posting?

Idk would have thought you may have mellowed and grown up in the three years I was away, clearly not.

Cheers. I was in the arena yesterday counting all the numbers untill my mate asked why I didnt just use the combat attibutes page...

Tested further to make sure the info given there is correct and it seems to be. Also with hours of testing found out some very interesting things on effects and secondary effects some of which one would not of thought would act the way they do but all good and should be handy.

For instance I am very happy with my choice of bots as primary on my MM as they seem to have a somewhat unique ablitlity.

Thanks once more for the help.

Ah interesting, thanks, still so much to catch up on.

I was just taking the base 40% and adding temp invulnerability. Could you tell me please what the resistance would be with these on taking into account DR? Or better still point me to a site that can help me work these out for myself?

Thanks.

Lol, well Im guessing then you no longer play the game or follow the mechanics.

As Carfanix can tell you it was a pretty straight forward question.

Yeah there were some very wierd changes. Looking at my old rad/psi defender Ive come to the conclusion it would be best getting the 1st attack from secondary and flurry.

End up with flurry that does 231 base damage with a +130% damage "buildup" for 12secs and 75% resists to all damage, moving faster then all but SR type sets.

Or in other words a melee defender doing more melee damage then scrappers and with better defence then most tanks.

Go figure.

Lol finally some response. Yeah it was really just for me to compair results as Ive always thought MA was competative.

What I didnt realise when I started the thread was that tough etc. gives res to all in pvp now so that makes MA even better.

P.S. Didnt you have a fire/dev blaster? Think I remember compairing TGs defiance based AR/Dev to Fire/Dev. Pitty folk dont seem to be into pvp ideas as much as before but I guess if things change all the time there is little point.

Thanks Carnifax. Ill aim for 83% then. With BG mode I should be on a practical resistance of about 93% to all damage which could be fun. If it is lowered to 63% then still works out at about 90% which is still pretty decent for a support toon.

"I've read that 10 times and i'm still confused ha"

Hay dont blame me Im just qouting wiki:

"Resistance to resistance debuffs follow the formula

NewResistance = OriginalResistance + DebuffAmount - [(DebuffAmount × OriginalResistance) / 100%]
In other words, resistance resists resistible resistance debuffs"

Confusing as it is I think I get the "resistance resists resistible resistance debuffs" concept but I am wondering what the end resistance would be if you are over the cap.

For instance if my MM has 83% resistance to all damage capped to 75% resistance and gets a 20% resistance debuff (resistable resistance already taken into account) would I end up on 55% (coming down from cap) to all or 63% resistance (coming down from non capped figure)?

In other words could it be worth while slotting for 83% vs debuffs or just aiming for 75%?

Are there any half Continental, half British, single white, male, promiscuously hetrosexual SGs out there?

If not could I join the [censored] one please if you start it? Just for the chat.

If you havnt leveled your thugs/storm yet Id think about nec/storm as you get a self heal with life drain and with snow storm your melee minions can still engage fliers.

Otherwise thug pets (lower level ones 3acc,3dam as they are low level), gang war is ok for some burst and easy to use as it isnt placed. Best storm powers are snow storm (vs fliers), mist for resistances and hurricane for herding pet ATs and debuffing acc.

I think storm is best used offensively, getting in close to your target, so works well with melee minions rather then ranged ones to keep BG mode (keeping zombies in passive perhaps till you need burst).

You can upgrade as soon as you can target one minion even if the others arnt fully summoned so it only takes as long as activating five powers if you target the fastest summoned minion.

I think the biggest problem with MM in zones is folk can just run away and not fight you and if you chase them you leave your damage and survivability behind.

That and good mind/storm controller, I think they could be nasty for MMs.

P.S. If you are looking for a future PvP MM though I think you could do far worse then the upcomming Bots/Thermal. Bots+Power Boost+Debuffs gotta be ok.

Hope this may be be of interest and help to some stalkers out there. Please feel free to post if you notice any mistakes or can give more accurate figures as I didnt level eight stalkers for this thread.

Attacks used

Claws

Eviscerate after placate
Activation: 2.33s
Recharge: 8.87s (5.22s)
PvP Damage: 134.58 + 134.58 = 269.16 Lethal

Focus
Activation: 1.17s
Recharge: 6.4s (3.76s)
PvP Damage: 66.56 Lethal

Dark Melee

Shadow Maul after placate
Activation: 3.07s
Recharge: 8s (4.71s)
PvP Damage: 80.92 Smashing + 77.68 Negative + 161.84 negative = 320.44 mixed


Siphon Life
Activation: 1.93s
Recharge: 10s (5.88s)
PvP Damage: 121.34 negative

Dual Blades

One Thousand Cuts after placate
Activation: 3.3s
Recharge: 15s (8.82s)
PvP Damage: 160.48 + 50% chance of 186.72 = 160.48 or 347.2 lethal

Sweeping Strike
Activation: 1.23s
Recharge: 11s (6.47s)
PvP Damage: 95.95 Lethal

Electrical Melee

Thunder Strike after placate
Activation: 3.3s
Recharge: 18s (10.6s)
PvP Damage: 96.74 smashing + 96.74 energy + 96.74 smashing + 50% chance of 96.74 energy = 290.22 or 386.96 mixed

Lightning Rod
Activation: 2.57s
Recharge: 90s (52.9s)
PvP Damage: 133.5 energy

Energy Melee

Total Focus after placate
Activation: 3.3s
Recharge: 20s (11.8s)
PvP Damage: 55.44 smashing + 142.36 energy + 55.61 energy = 253.41 mixed

Energy Transfer
Activation: 2.67s
Recharge: 20s (11.8s)
PvP Damage: 74.44 smashing + 154.29 energy = 228.73 mixed

Martial Arts

Eagle's Claw after placate
Activation: 2.53s
Recharge: 12s (7.06s)
PvP Damage: 149.54 +149.54 = 299.08 smashing

Crane Kick
Activation: 1.67.s
Recharge: 10s (5.88s)
PvP Damage: 111.07 smashing

Ninja Blade

Golden Dragonfly after placate
Activation: 1.83s
Recharge: 12s (7.06s)
PvP Damage: 121.9 + 121.9 = 243.8 lethal

Soaring Dragon
Activation: 1.33s
Recharge: 9s (5.29s)
PvP Damage: 95.39 lethal

Spines

Impale after placate
Activation: 2.43s
Recharge: 8s (4.71s)
PvP Damage: 109.26 + 109.26 lethal (+80% of 27.8 toxic) = 218.52 to 246.32 mixed

Ripper
Activation: 2.17s
Recharge: 6.47s (11s)
PvP Damage: 106.46 lethal (+805 of 55.6 toxic) = 106.46 to 162.06 mixed

Toxin in Spines is in brackets as RedTomax says it is only for PvE though I am pretty sure it also in PvP.

This is some information I put together for my own use but thought maybe other people may find handy.

When going through it please note:

1. Damage figures (except for lightning rod) were taken from RedTomax as I found them to be more accurate then Mids' hero designer.

2. Dispite this I know the damages are not all 100% correct but hopefully very close.

3. The damage shown is damage done by the first two attacks after placate assuming AS was the oppener. As such the highest crit damage attack was taken and then added to the second highest attack in the set, e.g. Golden Dragonfly crit + Soaring Dragon non crit for ninja blade set. This was in order to try to have an idea of what damage can be done quickly after AS.

4. More indepth figures on attacks used given in second post.

5. Due to the forum layout it looks quite messy dispite me spending quite a bit of time and effort, sorry.



Two hit combo after placate


Activation time followed by damage

Claws 3.50s, 335.72 lethal
Dark Melee 5.00s, 441.78 smashing/negative
Dual Blades 4.53s, 256.43 (50% chance of 443.15) lethal
Electical Melee 5.87s, 423.72 (50% chance of 520.46) smashing/energy
Energy Melee 5.97s, 482.14 smashing/energy
Martial Arts 4.20s, 410.15 smashing
Ninja Blade 3.16s, 339.19 lethal
Spines 4.60s, 324.98 (408.38 if poison counted, 80% for each attack)

My thoughts on sets:

Claws Pros:
Small range on focus and high chance chance to crit on evicerate when not hidden.
Fast recharge rates on these two attacks mean little reliance on other attacks

Cons:
Fast animation but proportionately worse then ninja blade for animation/damage ratio.
Only lethal damage so less damage vs tough etc.

Dark Melee Pros:
Second highest reliable burst damage and faster animation then electric and energy.
-Acc on attacks good for stalkers as they are most likely to get the hits in first.
Mixed damage with energy defence sets tending to have lower negative resistance.
Second highest damager has ok recharge and self heal.

Cons:
Quite long animation on highest damager though less then similar high damage attacks and lower recharge.

Dual Blades Pros:
Empower is given through the obvious BU/AS/Placate starter giving +30% damage for 10s.
Potentially the highest burst damage when one considers empower.
-Defence on highest damager which should help in making further combos.
Gives an alternative of weaken combo for less burst damage but further debuf to hit and defence.

Cons:
Potentially the lowest burst damage if One Thousand Cuts doesnt crit after placate or in Sweeping Strike is used instead.
To really make the most of combos possibly too many attacks need to be taken for a tight pvp build.
All lethal damage.

Electrical Melee Pros:
Potentially the highest burst damage (if dual blade's empower isnt taken into account) and high damage even if Thunder Strike doesnt crit.
Mixed damage with dark sets tending to have lower energy resists.
Ranged attack with Lightning Rod which could make up for long animation on Thunder Strike.
Has a high damage attack even without crit.

Cons:
Long animation times.
Long recharge times meaning other attacks needed to be able to keep damage going.

Energy Melee Pros:
Highest reliable burst.
Mixed damage with dark sets tending to have lower energy resists.
Two high damage attacks even without crits.

Cons:
Longest animation times.
Long recharge times meaning other attacks needed to be able to keep damage going.
If not used while hidden energy transfer will cause damage to caster so may steer secondary towards secondary with self heal.

Martial Arts Pros:
Quite fast animation speed and quite high damage, probably the best ratio between the two.
For slightly less damage Crippleing Axe Kick can be used instead of Crane Kick to keep -fly,-jump and slow on target.
More accurate then most sets without drawing animation.
Eagle's Claw is one of the best attacks out of hide as it is high damage, low recharge, higher accuracy and higher crit chance then nukes in other sets.

Cons:
All smashing damage so as with lethal suffers from players running tough etc.

Ninja Blade Pros:
Fastest animation speed for highest damage attacks.
More accurate then most sets.
Golden Dragonfly is similar to Eagle's Claw with faster animation but lower PvP damage.

Cons:
Due to fast animation speed it has the second lowest burst PvP damage.
All lithal damage.

Spines Pros:
Best ranged attack from sets in Impale.
-Recharge secondary effect can be very useful in PvP.

Cons:
Very low burst damage and most of it lethal in fact kick from fighting pool may be better then ripper.
Impale is pretty much the its only decent damageing attack (though it is good in effect).
Quite long animation given the damage it does.

It is nice to get some indepth feedback as most guides seem a little sparce on detailed info.

We havnt mentioned necro/storm combo which is being used in the US but again I dont really want a targeted self heal.

On necro though Ive been thinking of a tactic that may work, in thoery at least. The zombies seem to have very good burst damage with double puke and brawl. If you only use the first upgrade and set them on passive for BG mode then it may be possible to time them all to puke up on an opponent once you get his health low.

Even if he gets away he will have a DoT on that will prevent aid self and give you some time to finnish him off.

Only an idea but may work.

Thanks SinergyX. I already swapped to necro as I thought that would be the answer. MM guides seem a little lacking other then stuff saying "this teir 3 pet is so awesome".

Sadly air superiority doesnt have -jump though so do you know if any of the patron powers do?

Traps is an idea and probably way more fun to play. Reason I personally am shying away from bots/traps is the lack of self heal.

Also I dont know how bots shield and traps defence is with power boost but couldnt a blaster with slotted aim and build up hit you through it? I remember I used to have little difficulty killing FF defenders through personal forcefield with my stalker so thought relying on defence alone wouldnt be enough. Any idea what % defence you are reaching and if there is a cap on it? -acc on dark would also work maybe with traps. But isnt traps a little more stationary? I would like to have reasonable mobility though I know as an MM it will be limited.

Ah so many questions, thanks again for your help though, Ill get there eventually.

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Mercenaries: Ranged, -perception on flash bang, stuns and web granades on 2nd pets must be useful and good synergy with serum/pain/commando. Lethal damage damage though and maybe too much DoT, no -regen.

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The recharge on all these powers is soo freaking long, it aint worth it to rely on their control abilities.

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Yup the webs are 30secs which is longer then ppp ones. Thing is with yet further thought Ive decided mace mastery is rubbish for pvp as defence is useless, blasters can hit easily through 100%.

Way I see it mercs can get that 1st web out then I can follow up with air superiority.

Problem is that only real damage would come from the commando and me. So can the commando with serum and painbringer do enough damage to take down a tank or scrapper?

Other choice would be Nec/Pain and air superiority to control my opponent. As pain one should be able to be out of BG mode for a while without too much hassle.

Whatever I do Ill be getting speed,leaping,fitness and flighting pools.