The real problem why EU populations are low?

shazan · 12-10-2008 09:14 AM

Forums arent really a good thing to go by anyway.

I know lots of people who just dont visit them, either because they dont like forums or due to posting and getting jumped on.

Zhaan, Chakyra, Fiorina 161, Aeryn, Polly Nation, Dee Pression, Shazanne, Night Jester and too many more to mention.

Network Hell 47640
Valley of the Harpies 74519
Green and Pleasant Land 75966

FloatingFatMan · 12-10-2008 09:20 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sorry Phantoms you were not explaining why. You were giving your opinion as too why and as it was your opinion others are entitled to agree or disagree with you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not sure how that qualifies him to be labelled a fool, mind you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nah, his guides are what qualified him for that.

@FloatingFatMan

Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

GrinningSpade · 12-10-2008 10:08 AM

Whenever I think about buying/joining a game/mmorpg I check out the forums. Doooommmm messages and the I quit messages are a factor then for my decisions.

So I am not to fond of either of those. The first thing you don't want new players seeing are Dooom and Bye bye threads. The reason why many of those are not allowed in a lot of mmorpg's.

Larac · 12-10-2008 10:38 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I know lots of people who just dont visit them, either because they dont like forums or due to posting and getting jumped on.

[/ QUOTE ]

So true, both of the coalitions I game with never user these boards due to the presence of certain types of people they just don't want to deal with.
We have our own boards for this and the other games we play which are normally much happier places. So when ever we meet new people in the game we tell them to join up on our boards rather than here.

not much can be done about that, other than eve style brutalisation by the mods.

Spyte · 12-10-2008 02:22 PM

There's a beautiful cyclic futility in everyones arguments here,

Apparently raising a concern about the population is being a doom merchant, apparently doom threads have been here for years and its apparent that those that disagree most vehemently with doom threads are the very same people who say things are ok so just keep quiet.

Therefore the people who dont like Doom Threads have proved to themselves, as they are nothing new, that clearly they dont negatively impact on the game's popualtion. Conversely those that think there is a problem can look squarely at themselves and their postings and must concede their threads might actually be an integral cause as to the problems they are seeing.

We need 4 more impossible things to believe in and who knows what wonders we might unlock.

SteelRat · 12-10-2008 05:09 PM

I never read an official forum of a game as a means of gauging whether or not it's going to be a worthwhile purchase for precisely the reason that it could be the most successful most well thought out game out there, but the official forums are always going to be full of self proclaimed "experts" who think that just because they don't like something, it's automatically and universally bad. Additionally, that one (or perhaps even group) of features that they don't like or disagree with their implementation automatically gives them the "right" to spout all sorts of personal opinion as misinformed "fact", and the resulting rant is massively disproportional to not only the thing(s) they're complaining about, but also the state of the game as well. Most of these kinds of posts aren't infact anything other than incredibly desperate and sad individuals shouting off in order that they might get people going "Yeah I agree with him!" to gain some sort of self worth as a result of it.

The AoC forums are a classic example of this. I actually found myself quite enjoying the game despite some of its not so well applied ideas, but a walk around the forums would really make even the keenest player lose the will to live. The example I will always remember is someone saved up the 2 gold for his mount, and accidentally sold it because he'd played whilst under the influence. The devs were lambasted by him and a number of other players for nothing more than his own carelessness and stupidity. When I commented that if you have something in your inventory you were that concerned about, surely you would take extra care not to sell it, I was equally labelled as heinous evil that should be struck from humanity!

Frankly, those who have raised concerns about the falls in population haven't been "jumped on" or ridiculed - it's only those who shout about it as if they are the "voice of the people" and their views are completely factual, and representative of the whole game population rather than just their own personal opinion about it.

@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat

SweetChilli · 12-11-2008 04:20 AM

Personally, I stopped "reading" when I saw how much you "misused" quotation "marks".

@Sweet Chilli

SteelRat · 12-11-2008 05:27 AM

Not misused at all. Nor used to excess. Maybe you should read the whole post? Maybe not. *shrug*.

@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat

GrinningSpade · 12-11-2008 08:47 AM

For the record I disagree.

The OP has been jumped on and ridiculed. You yourself as a self proclaimed "expert" are doing so by saying: "Most of these kinds of posts aren't infact anything other than incredibly desperate and sad individuals shouting off" implying that he might be one.

Sir_Helm · 12-11-2008 10:42 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Or maybe it's because potential players looking for more information on CoX come to the forums and see DOOM! posts like the OPs and think, "This game is failing I'll go to WoW instead."
Bravo The_Phantoms! You're making things worse!

[/ QUOTE ]
No no, silly forum goers! Because I am feeling generous I'm going to tell you a truth that will possibly anger, upset, or (if I am really lucky) make you cry - the majority of players don't read the forum, don't know who you are, and most importantly don't care about ongoing the ongoing petty feuds between various 'forum personalities'.

And I use the word 'personalities' in the loosest possible sense here.

Population is seemingly low because the game is in Autumn, or pre-decline form. Is anyone in an SG that has had a significant and provable intake of new players lately?

Autumn's not necessarily a bad thing for a game - there's still no doubt great content and features yet to come, but the period of greatest subscription growth has passed. This can be quite freeing for developers - they have secured a loyal, long term player base and can embark on development they may not have been able to prioritise in the past. I see the Architect as a prime example of this.

The OP isn't wrong about his interpretation of some of the new and upcoming features - they could easily be viewed as developments focused on keeping the existing loyal playerbase entertained. And that's a smart move that I salute.

SteelRat · 12-11-2008 04:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
For the record I disagree.

The OP has been jumped on and ridiculed. You yourself as a self proclaimed "expert" are doing so by saying: "Most of these kinds of posts aren't infact anything other than incredibly desperate and sad individuals shouting off" implying that he might be one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps I should have made myself more clear. I am trying to point out that there is a difference between "I am worried that the game might be in a decline; here's why" and "The game is dooooomed, I demand action! The devs are rubbish. Post here if you agree. If you don't shut up 'cos I don't want a flame war"

People are far less likely to jump on, if that's the term you want to use, people who adopt the former attitude than the latter one. The OP has been jumped on because his post, at least came across, as the latter.

@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat

The_Phantoms_EU · 12-11-2008 04:47 PM

Almost all of the latter is NOT what I said.

I would've pointed out the pooints, but thanks to the friendly "form no longer valid message", it's not worth it anymore. Damn forum.

SteelRat · 12-11-2008 05:02 PM

Re read the OP. Phantoms I apologise, not sure where I got the idea that was the tone at all.

Feel a bit of a [censored] now, it has to be said

@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat

Scarlet Shocker · 12-11-2008 05:04 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Almost all of the latter is NOT what I said.

I would've pointed out the pooints, but thanks to the friendly "form no longer valid message", it's not worth it anymore. Damn forum.

[/ QUOTE ]

How very convenient

"You got to dig it to dig it, you dig?"
Thelonious Monk

The_Phantoms_EU · 12-11-2008 05:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Re read the OP. Phantoms I apologise, not sure where I got the idea that was the tone at all.

Feel a bit of a [censored] now, it has to be said

[/ QUOTE ]

You're not censored. You just misunderstood my post. You can learn from mistakes.

[ QUOTE ]
How very convenient

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, Scarlet, you're really nice, aren't you?

GrinningSpade · 12-11-2008 05:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
For the record I disagree.

The OP has been jumped on and ridiculed. You yourself as a self proclaimed "expert" are doing so by saying: "Most of these kinds of posts aren't infact anything other than incredibly desperate and sad individuals shouting off" implying that he might be one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps I should have made myself more clear. I am trying to point out that there is a difference between "I am worried that the game might be in a decline; here's why" and "The game is dooooomed, I demand action! The devs are rubbish. Post here if you agree. If you don't shut up 'cos I don't want a flame war"

People are far less likely to jump on, if that's the term you want to use, people who adopt the former attitude than the latter one. The OP has been jumped on because his post, at least came across, as the latter.

[/ QUOTE ]

But he got jumped upon right? I can understand and sympathize with the reasons why people feel the need to jump upon somebody. I also can understand and sympathize with the urge to punch somebody on his nose when provokes people enough. However there is a difference between the urge to punch and the act itself. This is supposed to be a civil forum and with that comes the need not to give in to urges to make a personal attack. However much you think somebody deserves to.

(Not that i think that the OP has written anything here to warrant such a personal attack).

Your post contributes to the inflamatory reactions because you seem to approve of the flamers reactions and make a claim possible that it is the OP's very own fault he got flamed in the first place.

Shame is that in the meanwhile the Op's post is no longer discussed for what he has said with proper counter arguments for those who disagree or wish to make a point.

SteelRat · 12-11-2008 05:30 PM

The irony is, spade, is that none of my post was directed at the OP. The first paragraph explains why I don't read forums to decide whether or not I will play a game before I buy it. The second one gives an example from the AoC forums as to why this is so, and the third one explains why people who are jumped on, are jumped on for the most part (at least in my experience / opinion)

My mistake came from my second post when I accused Phantoms of coming across as a irrational doom monger, when in actual fact he explained why he thought i13 did nothing to improve CoH's apparent falling numbers. And for that I have apologised.

@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat

Scarlet Shocker · 12-11-2008 07:58 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Wow, Scarlet, you're really nice, aren't you?

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice? I prefer to think pragmatic.

You came out with some assertions that you can't back up. I asked you some specific questions you've totally chosen to ignore and then you blame the technology when called on an argument.

'Nuff said

"You got to dig it to dig it, you dig?"
Thelonious Monk

SweetChilli · 12-12-2008 09:04 AM

Maybe actually "read" what is "written" SteelRat instaed of "lecturing" on what you "THINK" is written.

@Sweet Chilli

GrinningSpade · 12-12-2008 09:47 AM

[ QUOTE ]
The irony is, spade, is that none of my post was directed at the OP.

[/ QUOTE ]

The irony is not lost to me. I read in your post something else then you intended. Such are the fickles of communication. It is easy to misunderstand each other and jump to the wrong conclusions as I apparently have done in this case.

A wise thing not to pay to much attention to Doom 0r bye bye threads in game forums though. Still, I am a bit worried that not everybody is able to do that. And it would be a shame if threads like those scare potential gamers away.

shazan · 12-12-2008 09:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe actually "read" what is "written" SteelRat instaed of "lecturing" on what you "THINK" is written.

[/ QUOTE ]

Steelrat has actually apologised and you are still having a go.

Perhaps people like you are the reason some people dont use forums that much.

Zhaan, Chakyra, Fiorina 161, Aeryn, Polly Nation, Dee Pression, Shazanne, Night Jester and too many more to mention.

Network Hell 47640
Valley of the Harpies 74519
Green and Pleasant Land 75966

SweetChilli · 12-12-2008 10:30 AM

If someone has done something wrong I'll be the first to point the finger. Thats whats wrong with society these days. People don't like to point the finger.

SteelRat - the finger is pointing at you!

@Sweet Chilli

Diggis · 12-12-2008 10:35 AM

Cool, finger pointing. You are wrong in pointing the finger at SteelRat as he has already apologised.

GhostRaptor_EU · 12-12-2008 10:45 AM

Since this is turning into a meta-discussion about the original discussion, and I don't like the way it's becoming personal, I'm going to go ahead and close this thread.