Set to Average damage * chance I do more damage over time than that (minus the chance to res) when my choice of slots are placed within the rest of my build. Especially once I start multiplying over the numbers that can be hit. I settled on a def debuff of 44% whilst doing the damage. Thats only 5% less than Oktons.
All my ticks added up do 50,7 cold damage, every 27 secs, I do do a debuff of 44% so I didnt go all out on damage. On 16 foes that's 811,2 damage to group for an end cost of 11,11 end with only 2 secs of my time taken every 27 secs.
I mention the end cost because I like to see how much damage per endurance point I do and then compare it to a single target power of mine like spectral wounds which does 83.5 for 4.06 damage.
Spectral Wounds of mine is 83.5/4.06 = 20 damage per endurance point.
Freezing Rain on 16 targets (So yes the bigger the teams the better in my case):
811,2/11,11 = 73 damage per end point.
Now then. Assuming its alright to do 20 damage per end point on a single target attack...
The minimum number of foes to use Freezing Rain on is:
73/20 = 3.65
16/3.65 = minimum number of foes worth using it on = 4.38.
Working back now:
(4.38 * 50,7 FR Total Dam)/11.1 end = 19.5 dam per end...near enough.
For damage purposes my Freezing Rain is near enough economical on 4 targets as my spectral wounds is on 1.
In PvE large teams, your gonna hit more than 4 normally.
FR -30% resistance, the -rechg and -spd stacked to snowstorm in my case.
Freezing Rain is a power I like to use all the time for what it does out of the box.
Getting down to 30 secs, - sweet.
Slotting it for def debuff - can be needed although its -30% which is pretty strong. I took mine to 44% anyway with IOs.
Slotting it for damage - if you can afford the slots and much like other auras a minimal use on a number of targets, in my case 4. Likely at times I would use it on 1 as its good.
Like everything you can be in excess at times which has been pointed out. At times def debuffs may not be necessary, slows may not be necessary, damage is always good in my book if the damage done per end point per second is as economical as it is on a good single target attack.
All this with still doing as much as I would do with Blind and do as much as I would do with Spectral Wounds on top of it all. You can 3 recharge 3 Dam Blind and spam it if you want but you may just run out of an endurance bar before you get to the 13th use especially whilst running Stormies Toggles.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
Sorry but there is something i dont follow
You compare Spectral wounds single target damage and divide that to get damage per endurance point with Freezing rain total damage to make a point.
Case in point is:
Your spectral wounds does
83 damage on a single target.
Your Freezing rain does 50.7
You spectral wounds takes 4.06 endurance endurance to do that.
Your Freezing Rain takes 11.
Point is that yeah you might pull 800 damage on a total of 16mobs but in reality those mobs lose 50hp each and they aint debuffed as well due to rubbish slotting.
And then comes the blaster in large team and kills everything.
Case in point is also that the larger the team is,the less damage is needed from control sets and they can focus on what they do best.Control.
How are they not debuffed well due to rubbish slotting?
As well as doing that amount of damage per target I am debuffing them 44% in defence which is only 5% less than Oktons at 49%.
The Dam per end is gained from how I slot. My single targets need to hit and I lowered the end cost in all powers to widen the gap between attack chain end drain and toggle end drain and end recovery.
To take on groups and lets say they are fast moving, as some Tanks just don't stop herding and teams just don't stop mowing, I got the dam per end down to worth use on 4 as my spectral wounds is on one.
The case in points is 83 dam on single target is 83 dam to group.
Freezing Rain is as much as 811 dam to group but roughly 50 dam to each single target.
Your greatest Dam per end to group comes in the AoEs.
Now I know in PvP you'd be lucky to see 16 together but mine is alright on 4 people, and alright for every other component freezing rain offers anyway.
I much rather do 800 dam to group and not have to have my first 5 spectral wounds doing what Freezing Rain could of done if I hadnt slotted it with damage enhancements especially as of they ain't dead soon with that the damage disappears.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
I have a couple of questions.
How do i handle stalkers? Pop hurricane and hope for the best?
What times are people at the arena?
How should i slot phantasm(pve)?
Do i need the leadership pool?
Reason for the last q is that i am already devouring end fast, should i slot some cheap recovery sets?
Ok so you are making you case based on Set IO's here.Set IOed stormies dont have endurance issues if properly build of course.At least our SG ones and all set IOed stormies i teamed recently they had no problem spamming powers and keeping toggles up.
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Dam per end to group comes in the AoEs
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Maybe,but only when the damage is significant to make a difference.You are talking 50 damage here.
And since we are talking PvP here slotting damage in Freezing Rain for PvP is definitely a no no.
That reply has my name on it but I assume it isn't for me as I don't PvP so this is a reply to not wish to look rude.
@Tainted I heard your post had numbers, its a shame most peoples don't as I am happier to see them.
Edit: Before I have to go out today; being that my planned final build was a rushed one, all this looking at it has helped me improve it further to do more dam per group per end over time just now, as I improved the slotting some more.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
I'd give my opinions, but I've gotta go DPS Lusca on my Emp/Dark with unslotted Dark Blast. It's more DPS than Blind so it's obviously awesome.
Sorry Shannon but the more I look at the numbers the less I'm convinced. How exactly do you slot it then? I'm quite sure that the (potentially) 400 less dmg I do from not slotting dmg into it (assuming 16 foes will stay within it for 15 secs - unlikely) is more than made up by my dmg proc and the -res one which benefits my whole team (and hopefully in a group of 8, I'm not the main dmg dealer 
).
CoX 50s: <ill/rad> <ice/ice> <fire/kin> <grav/sonic> <ice/storm> <earth/kin> <kin/elec> <cold/psy> <thugs/dark> <fire/dark> <dark/elec> <night widow> <EM/ninj> <mind/icy>
So are you gonna mock and argue how one choose to slot freezing rain? Just let me know and i'll get a mod to close it for me. And if you are done derailing could someone please answer my questions?
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I have a couple of questions.
How do i handle stalkers? Pop hurricane and hope for the best?
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Hurricane must be always on.99% of stalkers will try to mez you first so must always have breakfrees at the ready.You must never stand still as well and have hurricane well slotted for acc debuff.
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What times are people at the arena?
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Afternoons usually but most time we spend it in Zonal PvP.RV ranks top in traffic (lvl 50) and sirens gets some mid level action and more experienced pvpers prefer arena or high end zonal
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How should i slot phantasm(pve)?
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I cant answer this i let someone with more experience answer it
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Do i need the leadership pool?
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Its a choice of tactics really.If you want increased perception could use it defo.
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Reason for the last q is that i am already devouring end fast, should i slot some cheap recovery sets?
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Enhancing recovery is priority on stormies.You could use some cheap recovery sets for starters.
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How should i slot phantasm(pve)?
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I cant answer this i let someone with more experience answer it
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With SOs, 2 acc 3 dmg.
CoX 50s: <ill/rad> <ice/ice> <fire/kin> <grav/sonic> <ice/storm> <earth/kin> <kin/elec> <cold/psy> <thugs/dark> <fire/dark> <dark/elec> <night widow> <EM/ninj> <mind/icy>
Mids herobuilder the way its set doesn't reveal all the numbers and it so I use in game figures and that.
Spectral Wounds; Devastation 5 slots, all but the chance of hold.
You can read what level of damage it does. Without Recipes being on it does 86.7 damage for 4.37 end and if hastened it'll recharge in 2,27 secs. Mids will tell you its dps which is 25,9 dps and its end per sec is 1.41 eps.
If you look at the bars for damage per end it shows it does 18.32 damage per endurance point.
If we divided the 25,9 dps by its 1.41 eps then we get 18.37 rounded figure which is close enough to the 18.32 damage per endurance point.
This slotting means its had its damage increased and its endurance cost reduced already for decent dam per end
Accuracy 66.25%
Damage 97.89%
Endurance 45.05%
Recharge 66.25%
Whether or not its the best slotting it is a set offering a dam buff but we have the recipes off.
The way Mids comes in, Freezing Rain doesn't show up in the Power Stats Dam/End nor can you scale it to 16 targets.
I slotted it as this:
Level 16: Freezing Rain -- Posi-Dmg/EndRdx:50(A), Posi-Dmg/Rchg:50(17), Det'tn-Dmg/Rchg:50(17), Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx:50(25), UndDef-DefDeb/Rchg:50(37), UndDef-DefDeb/Rchg/EndRdx
Damage 95.9%
DefDebuff 47.7% = - 44.1% def debuff.
Endurance 73.78%
Recharge 95.11%
Mids will tell you it does 53.2 damage, if its also hastened, it will be 53,2 damage every 20,5 seconds and it will tell you it costs 10,5 endurance. It will tell you its eps is 0,46 end per sec but it won't tell you its dam per sec and it doesn't have a slider there for you to scale it from 1 - 16 targets to give you a total damage per endurance. Which is what I do.
I take the 53.2 damage and can clearly see that its worse on a single target than spectral wounds as its 53.2 dam/10.5 endurance = 5 dam per endurance point, but if it hits 4 it's become 20 damage per endurance point rivaling spectral wounds, by the time it hits 16 foes its 4 times better.
In terms of damage per cast time Spectral wounds is 86.7/1.07 = 81 dpa or dpc
Freezing Rain is 2.03 secs long so to match it we will need to know the minimum amount to hit 81 * 2.03 = 164
Being 53.2 per target then 164 is slightly over a minimum amount of 3 targets.
So in terms of dpa almost 3 targets, in terms of dpe you need 4 targets in terms of potential we go:
53.2 * 16 = 851.2 every 22.03 secs which works out as 38.63 dam per sec or as I like to think it 2318.3 dam per min for 6 secs of my time.
Spammed Spectral Wounds is 1554 dam per min for 60/(1.07/2.27) = 18 secs of my time
Also the eps of spectral wounds is 1.41 compared to freezing rains 0,46.
I'd much rather slap on Freezing Rain then do the STs on top.
Edit:Pets.FreezingRain_Controller
Edit: I have been doing some testing and starting to believe there is something awkward with it.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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Ok so you are making you case based on Set IO's here.Set IOed stormies dont have endurance issues if properly build of course.At least our SG ones and all set IOed stormies i teamed recently they had no problem spamming powers and keeping toggles up.
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Dam per end to group comes in the AoEs
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Maybe,but only when the damage is significant to make a difference.You are talking 50 damage here.
And since we are talking PvP here slotting damage in Freezing Rain for PvP is definitely a no no.
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I knew that its a no no with PvP before people started telling me I am wrong. My suggestion was to concentrate on leveling first and then going back to PvP seeing as leveling was at a snails pace and was based on that.
Agreed 50 damage differs, I know that once I have tried casting Rain of Arrows at the start of the fight the arrows land on dead bodies. However not all teams are the same and I can spare the slots. The slotting of damage was a "suggestion" to speed up leveling speed.
We turned to IOs later, I believe as Okton turned to IOs. It can get based on SOs np.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
So 35 is close, is tornado good in pvp? Or should i start on leadership?
Also how much rech bonuses do i need for perma pa with hasten?
Yes Yes and Yes to the first part, it rocks.
Afraid I don't know about the recharge numbers....cue stats wizz entrance stage right please...
I miss him in the weeping of the rain;
I want him at the shrinking of the tide;
The old snows melt from every mountain-side,
And last year's leaves are smoke in every lane;
But last year's bitter loving must remain
~Edna St. Vincent Millay
Not sure of the actual %bonus recharge you need but its around 60% but then i have AM as im RAD, tbh there's no point gimping your build to gain the extra 5 or 10 seconds to get them perma you will have enough useful powers (perma tornado, lightning storm x2, freezing rain and spectral terror) and remember in PvP everyone will ignore them anyway and go straight for you.
*this is from a PvE point of view have never PvPd with stormy or illusion trollers
So maybe i should aim for 30 secs to 1min downtime then?
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I see no ones done the numbers to prove otherwise because I don't think the numbers can be denied.
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Seriously lolex with the numbers.0.66 dmg over 76 ticks?With 3 slotted damage.Thats 50 cold damage per mob.
On the flipside Blind is 60dmg over a single cast 1.67seconds.
Lets look at Damage now.
Freezing Rain 3x Recharge gives a 30sec duration with a 30second recharge. Thus 2casts per minute and so 2x50=100 damage per mob
3xRecharge on bline bring recharge to 4.5 seconds.That gives 13 casts over a minute. 13x60 = 780 damage per mob.
If in one minute i can do 100 damage to a mob i am a hot steaming train of powerlevel.
EDIT: Numbers without hasten but i can throw it in just for lols.
EDIT 2:Here is hasten numbers
Blind: 3.34 recharge
17 casts x 60 = 1058 dmg per mob
Freezing Rain
22 seconds recharge.
I will be nice and give you 3 casts over a minute
3x50= 150 damage per mob
Whats next?Slotting Frezing Rain with Ragnaroks to break DPS and make herostats go down from the imbaness?