The passives (Resist elements and Resist energies) are very low priority and in most cases skippable.
If you're goin for the fighting pool with tough and weave you can skipp REl and REn alltogether IMO(especially with the upcoming change for non- scalable defence)because Weave alone gives you a better survivability than both of em, otherwise I'd pick them in the mid-late 20s, when you already have SOs and can get some resistances worth the name off them.
On my Invuln/SS i left them out, both. Tough+Resist Physycal and Temp Invuln make me really invulnerable against foes like malta, nemesis and most pretorian minions, while weave helps big time being stackable with Tough Hide and Invincibility gives you Ice tanker-like defence, when surrounded.
According to Character Builder the two passives plus Unyielding get you 27.5% resistance to all non-L/S damage except Psi. Weave will give you 4.33% defence base.
Leave the two passive out , if you want one take the energy/negative one ,
and fifth if i am correct from my head , the unyielding gives more then 50% of the 27.5 so what does that say for the passive that needs 3 SO slotted.
Silver early on the Resist are useless , later on you will be tanking in teams with minimal 1 healer .
So defense is the way to go simply everything close gives you DEF bonus from invincibility everything close always does some part S/L .
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Leave the two passive out , if you want one take the energy/negative one ,
and fifth if i am correct from my head , the unyielding gives more then 50% of the 27.5 so what does that say for the passive that needs 3 SO slotted. [...]
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As far as I know, the base F/C/E/N resistance of Unyielding is 10% where the passives are 7.5%.
I wouldn't leave out either REl or REn of my build.
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I wouldn't leave out either REl or REn of my build.
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Ditto. You're a Tank for gawd sake!
i took elements around 30 as i wanted unstoppable, hurl and footstomp at 32, 35 and 38, if you skip hurl then put it there, defo want it by mid 30s as thats when you start really running into the cot demons and i found they ripped my inv/ss health apart fairly fast until i got elements and slotted it.
going for energies at 41 in time for the av's and other higher level mobs that dish that type out. may skip though.
@ExtraGonk
I'll go with Jiaozy on this one, except that I'll add that with Tough, Resist Physical Damage is unnecessary too.
I got Resist Energies at level 47 for a little bit of extra protection.
Weave provides better protection than either of the Resist Es, because it stacks with Tough Hide and Invincibility ( and in my case Combat Jumping ) to get over 20% defence against 1 foe, things just get better as you add more.
26% ( Un + RE ) resistance means that you take 88% of the damage than you would with only 16% ( Un ).
18.5% defence ( Weave + Un + TH + Inv 1 enemy ) means that you 82% of the damage that you would with just 11.5% defence ( Un + TH + Inv 1 enemy ). Also the benefit increases as the amount from Invincibility increases. This is using I7 figures, but with a few foes around around you it is the same effect.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
Its because of i7 and the scaleable defence changes i may revert somewhere to this "respec build" not quite pve to me partly pvp too without making too many compromises to my personal liking.
This is very similar to what i used to have, except without my personal touches or pre-ed slotting when i was low damage but had rage and it took ten minutes so a quick one.
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Exported from Ver: 1.7.2.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder - (http://home.comcast.net/~SherkSilver/index.html)
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Name:
Level: 49
Archetype: Tanker
Primary: Invulnerability
Secondary: Super Strength
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01) --> Temp Invulnerability==> DmgRes(1) DmgRes(7) DmgRes(7) EndRdx(46)
01) --> Jab==> Acc(1) EndRdx(11)
02) --> Dull Pain==> Rechg(2) Rechg(3) Rechg(3) Heal(5) Heal(5) Heal(15)
04) --> Taunt==> Taunt(4) Rechg(11) Rechg(13) Taunt(13)
06) --> Kick==> Acc(6)
08) --> Unyielding==> DmgRes(8) DmgRes(9) DmgRes(9) EndRdx(48) Rechg(46)
10) --> Hasten==> Rechg(10) Rechg(15) Rechg(43)
12) --> Hurdle==> Jump(12)
14) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(14)
16) --> Health==> Heal(16) Heal(17) Heal(17)
18) --> Invincibility==> DefBuf(18) DefBuf(19) DefBuf(19) Taunt(50)
20) --> Stamina==> EndMod(20) EndMod(21) EndMod(21)
22) --> Haymaker==> Acc(22) EndRdx(23) Rechg(23) Dmg(33) Dmg(34) Dmg(34)
24) --> Tough==> EndRdx(24) EndRdx(25) EndRdx(25) DmgRes(36) DmgRes(36) DmgRes(37)
26) --> Weave==> EndRdx(26) EndRdx(27) EndRdx(27) DefBuf(33) DefBuf(33) DefBuf(34)
28) --> Knockout Blow==> Acc(28) Acc(29) EndRdx(29) Dmg(31) Dmg(37) Dmg(37)
30) --> Tough Hide==> DefBuf(30) DefBuf(31) DefBuf(31)
32) --> Unstoppable==> Rechg(32) Rechg(45) Rechg(46)
35) --> Hurl==> Acc(35) EndRdx(36) Range(40) Dmg(42) Dmg(43) Dmg(43)
38) --> Foot Stomp==> Acc(38) EndRdx(39) Rechg(39) Dmg(39) Dmg(40) Dmg(40)
41) --> Conserve Power==> Rechg(41) Rechg(42) Rechg(42)
44) --> Resist Elements==> DmgRes(44) DmgRes(45) DmgRes(45)
47) --> Resist Energies==> DmgRes(47) DmgRes(48) DmgRes(48)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> EndRdx(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Acc(1)
01) --> Gauntlet==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Rechg(2)
---------------------------------------------
note on this build as to why it aint finished:
at 49 i either would get resist physical damage but i would be tempted to get rage, rage can either add to your survivability or get you killed, it has approx 30 point end drop as it comes off, if thats all you have left then your toggles will drop. Using it correctly can add to your survivability (kill or be killed) and incorrectly will get you killed (ok be killed) as timing is crucial.
taunt is at lvl 4 on this so ill just swap things around.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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at 49 i either would get resist physical damage but i would be tempted to get rage, rage can either add to your survivability or get you killed, it has approx 30 point end drop as it comes off, if thats all you have left then your toggles will drop. Using it correctly can add to your survivability (kill or be killed) and incorrectly will get you killed (ok be killed) as timing is crucial.
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I think ( not sure about this ) that the 3rd end red in Tough and Weave might be slightly less effective than a 2nd in TI and Unyielding.
As for Rage I have it on my Ice tank and it normally doesn't cause problems other than annoyance and sometimes loss of aggro. But Ice has defence debuff resistance, something which I think Inv should also have as it relies on defence almost as much as Ice and certainly more than stone does when in Granite. Ice also doesn't have the same end issue as a fighting pool Inv tank, mainly because they have a full end recharge available every 30 seconds.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
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I wouldn't leave out either REl or REn of my build.
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Ditto. You're a Tank for gawd sake!
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Me neither. They can be taken late though.
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I think ( not sure about this ) that the 3rd end red in Tough and Weave might be slightly less effective than a 2nd in TI and Unyielding.
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Without even checking i believe you to be right because for every end redux you add the less the end cost comes slightly down iirc, but i like all my toggles running below a certain amount as a rule so I just looked for that, I went to check this build but i deleted it ages ago as it was a 10 minute model. In no way do i recommend it as a guide or even an uber build for that matter but its just showing people something close to what i will be considering again. It is not an "allow other people to pull build" it is more a "tanker must be allowed to consolidate aggro how and when on their terms build" and not all toggles will be running at the sametime against everything. For me when facing AV's its the defenders etc that have the hardest job as the tanker only has to keep the likelihood of people getting aggro or pbaoed down to an absolute minimum hopefully 0.
Currently i have nothing other than my primaries and it works ok.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
I have no interest in OR room for either Boxing or Kick, nor am I interested in having two more toggles to drain my endurance, so it's a 'no brainer' for me.
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I have no interest in OR room for either Boxing or Kick, nor am I interested in having two more toggles to drain my endurance, so it's a 'no brainer' for me.
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well, it shows in your tanking 
(you think about it if thats postive or negative :P)
@Shift
Shift 50 DM/DA Scrapper ][ TTL 50 Kat/Reg Scrapper ][ Shabriel 50 Peacebringer ][ Ion Shift 46 Rad/Rad Corruptor ][ Thermal Shift 35 Fire/Fire Blaster
"A Scrapper is a lot like a chainsaw. Somewhat hard to handle, incredibly dangerous, and by far the most fun when wielded by the slightly insane."
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I have no interest in OR room for either Boxing or Kick, nor am I interested in having two more toggles to drain my endurance, so it's a 'no brainer' for me.
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The option I suggest is an even power choice one, RPD is IMO overkill on a fighting pool tank, 80% S/L resistance is certainly good enough and has been for me on my Inv.
1. Resist Physical Damage, Resist Elements and Resist Energies or
2. Boxing, Tough and Weave
It however is not even on slots as I'd expect with option 1 you spend 6 extra slots.
With option 2 you need to put 2 slots each in tough and weave for def and res and then I'd put 2 end reds in each of them too, which is 8 extra slots. You are still over your original endurance usage though so expect to slot attacks and some other toggles with more end reds.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
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I have no interest in OR room for either Boxing or Kick, nor am I interested in having two more toggles to drain my endurance, so it's a 'no brainer' for me.
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well, it shows in your tanking
(you think about it if thats postive or negative :P)
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I'm not tanking - I'm scranking... with the occasional Taunt 
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26% ( Un + RE ) resistance means that you take 88% of the damage than you would with only 16% ( Un ).
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unthing does that look right to you? cos it dont to me..
26% ( Un + RE ) resistance means that you take 74% of the damage than you would with only 16% ( Un ) which means taking 84%
better?
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
an attack for 1000 damage.
UNY + REl (taking elemental damage for easy here)
UNY = 15.7% RES
REl = 11.8% RES.
no defenses.
100%/1000 damage
UNY only
84.3%/843 damage
UNY + REl
72.5%/725 damage.
72.5/84.3x100%= 86.00%
with UNY+REl you take 86% of the damage you would when only having UNY active (im not taking the defense debuff into account here, too tired for that :P)
@Shift
Shift 50 DM/DA Scrapper ][ TTL 50 Kat/Reg Scrapper ][ Shabriel 50 Peacebringer ][ Ion Shift 46 Rad/Rad Corruptor ][ Thermal Shift 35 Fire/Fire Blaster
"A Scrapper is a lot like a chainsaw. Somewhat hard to handle, incredibly dangerous, and by far the most fun when wielded by the slightly insane."
yeah better i have to ask these things cos i dont follow the maths and figured it was just an error but saying that i had read it wrong! 
Edit: With no defenses taken into account why would you need to include a defense debuff?
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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I wouldn't leave out either REl or REn of my build.
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Ditto. You're a Tank for gawd sake!
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If you're planning _not_ to take the fighting pool, pick those 2, otherwise Weave offers a far better damage mitigation than both of those..
RPD can make you hit the S/L cap res with Tough and the change from 78% to 90% it's pretty important.
Well, I'm level 31 atm, so the next powers the doozy. I've already got tough and kick. I was pondering ReE after getting Radded to death by Anti-Matter on SK,and Stomp is a necessity,but Unstoppable seems a death knoll on my character.
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Well, I'm level 31 atm, so the next powers the doozy. I've already got tough and kick. I was pondering ReE after getting Radded to death by Anti-Matter on SK,and Stomp is a necessity,but Unstoppable seems a death knoll on my character.
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These robots are nasty because they destroy your defence(as much as the one of an ice tank, the res to DEF debuff is really useless)for everything else bar psi, I've managed fine without any passive bar RPD and TH, feel free to ask around if you're sceptic
yer, thos robots mince MoG too, was hilarious watching me and another MoGger charge in and get whipped in a fraction of a second 
'ah, MoGs not so good against these then'
'no'
@ExtraGonk
Inv/SS Tanker. Are Resist Elements/Energy really worth taking after ED? If so, at what level-ish?