Valerika

There's no distinction. That's like saying, "I didn't hit the guy, I just pushed my fist toward his face until it made contact." You assumed everyone who didn't agree with your position was a hater or a coward. Face up to it and don't hide it behind clinical language. You aren't fooling anyone.

Considering the widespread lack of support for your "idea", I'd say you're doing more than insulting the playerbase at large. You're advocating that they be forced to deal with a PvP system that many of them would rather quit the game than accept. That's not just insulting, that shows complete disregard for them altogether. You'd rather assume they're deficient in some way than simply accept majority opinion. In your mind, the only reason the majority of people dislike this PvP suggestion is because there is something wrong with the majority. And you expect us to take you seriously.

Your blatent disregard for the wishes of other players in favor of your own narrow viewpoint, and your "generalizations" have earned you those labels. If the shoe fits, wear it. You have no interest in what other players think. You only care about your "impromptu PvE duels". I have little patience for people who would continue to ask for a feature after others expressed discontent so vast that they would leave the game over it. Could you really enjoy a feature (especially a small one) if it came at the cost of a large chunk of the playerbase? Would you really just laugh it off and say "Well, people leave games all the time." ? I can't think of any way to describe someone who holds viewpoints like that other than "a bully, PvP smacktard, or a jerk". Maybe I'm being to hard on you, but if you had your way, you'd be happy, but there would be a lot of upset people.

You aren't trying to "flesh anything out". You want your PvP, and you want everyone else to jump through hoops so you can get it. PvP in CoH has already been "fleshed out". It's made to accomodate the majority of the playerbase in an acceptable way already. Taking PvP out of the PvP zones in any way will only lower the overall quality of life for a large segment of the game population (the non PvP'ers). It's even debatable that it would lower the overall quality of life for PvP'ers as well, since they'll be spread out even further than they are now.

Again, you choose to belittle your detractors rather than address the issues raised. If you had a shred of empathy in you, you'd recognize that many people came to this game to get away from the very system you're advocating. Smoking in a hospital is rude and potentially hazardous to the patient's health, but it wouldn't kill everyone right away. Adding worldwide PvP on the other hand, would cause the game to wither and die in short order.

You poke fun at my metaphors without addressing them. I on the other hand, addressed yours. Worldwide PvP is a worn out idea. Designated PvP zones is the new and improved PvP system. Accept it, or go elsewhere. To use your "floating skateboard" metaphor, We're enjoying our skateboards, but if you would rather walk, you're welcome to do so. Just don't pretend walking is the way of the future.

It's nothing like an anti-grav skateboard. That idea would actually have a following--lots of people would want to use it, and it would be revolutionary. Worldwide PvP, on the other hand, has been tried on other games and found to be a disappointment. It's less like a floating skateboard and more like an 8-track tape player--old, worn out, and totally useless given improvements in design.

The real "Anti-Gravity Skateboard" is designated PvP zones. It's new and rare for MMOs, and the idea has a strong following here.

No, describing anyone in opposition to said idea as fearful or hateful is what makes you bullying and belittling. You refuse to believe that there could be something wrong with the idea--instead, there must be something wrong with the people who disagree with it. Which is odd, since they comprise the majority of the playerbase. So in essence, you're describing most people who play this game as scared or hateful. I stand by my statement. If you think that you can change people's minds by grouping them together and calling them names, you're a bully, and you're attempting to belittle people into seeing your point of view.

Obviously you don't get it. PvP'ers are by and large, decent people. They stick to themselves and don't enjoy abusing other players. There is a smaller subset of PvP'ers who enjoy griefing and making life difficult for other players. Making a worldwide PvP system would affect them the most and empower them the most.

You're overgeneralizing to make your point by assuming I hate all kinds of PvP--not the case. I enjoy occasionally going to PvP zones for PvP when I'm in the mood, and I'm glad it's there when I want it. It's like visiting someone in the hospital, and going to the smoking section to light up--there's nothing wrong with that. What you're advocating, on the other hand, is installing ashtrays next to the hospital beds so you can smoke anywhere you want. That makes you a jerk. It doesn't make all smokers jerks, just people like you. You are so inconsiderate that you can't realize that the slight increase in enjoyability this "feature" would create for you is outweighed by the massive annoyance it would cause for most of the other players of this game. But that doesn't matter to you, because they are obviously all haters and cowards...

There is a BIG difference between spam and smacktalk--intent. As annoying as either activity is, I'd much rather have people trying to sell me things/asking me for favors than people trying to PISS ME OFF ENOUGH TO FIGHT THEM. Are you really telling me you think it's the same thing?

Having no interest in PvP doesn't mean you have no credibility or relevence. It means you're representative of the majority of the playerbase in this game. I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but PvP just isn't that popular in this game, and the problem isn't exposure. An ugly dog is an ugly dog, no matter how many times you try to force people to pet it.

Good luck, because no idea yet proposed even comes close to achieving this. PvP flags don't work (other games that have them still have griefing). A dedicated PvP server would be labor-intensive, etc.

Not at all. It's more accurate to describe it as a lack of willingness to watch this game devolve into a pseudo-WoW clone, copying the worst aspects of other games. I wouldn't leave this game because I was afraid and I hated it--I would leave because I couldn't bear to watch all of the cooperative spirit leave. I couldn't bear to watch the small griefer population of this game (small relative to that of other games) become empowered and enabled with a massive grieifing tool. In short--I don't want bullying and belittling PvP smacktards like you holding sway over other players. It's ruined other games, and I won't watch it ruin this one.

If you've played those other games with PvP flags and enjoyed them, then seriously, go back to them. I found them to be good games plagued by bad PvP systems, many of them to the point where dealing with the PvP griefing made the game more annoying than fun. Many of us came to this game to get away from systems like that, and if this game adopted such a system, we would leave. It's as simple as that. It's not fear, it's not hatred, it's just that having a PvP system like that isn't enjoyable for us. And your attempts to push it down our throats doesn't enhance our opinions of you and people like you. No means no. Your rights end where other begin, and your desire to have "impromtu PvP duels" doesn't trump everyone else's right to enjoy a game free of a PvP system they don't support.

I'm really sorry that you see it that way, but it's just not the case. It's not a situation where the forum veterans are just shooting holes in this idea because it's new and the veterans hate changes. Trust me, if this idea was a GOOD idea that just had a few problems, you wouldn't be getting this kind of resistance. People would be offering solutions. This suggestion, on the other hand, starts from a bad premise--"Let's take this new feature, which simple datamining has already determined is unpopular even in areas set aside exclusively for itself, and apply it to the entire game." If you applied it to your business model, it would be like if a young junior executive stood up at a meeting and said, "Ladies and Gentlemen, I have an idea to increase revenue. First, we shoot one of our customers in broad daylight. Wait, where is everyone going? Hear me out!"

The idea isn't a good one with hurdles to overcome, it's a bad one with hurdles that aren't worth overcoming--it's built on a bad premise. No one will help you fix it, because the idea is bad at the very core. It doesn't matter how you sugar coat it with conditions like PvP toggles, the opportunity to go to 50+ levels, cutscenes, badges, etc. You're just pouring sugar on turds, and almost no one wants to eat them. Period. I'm sorry you consider yourself an unsung genius, tirelessly fighting for truth and justice, but to almost everyone else, you look like someone who refuses to give up a bad idea, no matter how strong the logic is to the contrary.

Entirely your opinion, but it would annoy everyone else who was going about their business in the zone. I don't want to have to deal with the lag, and I don't want to have to deal with the associated griefing of others trying to goad me into combat. PvP isn't appropriate in a PvE zone. You might consider it fun to do it elsewhere, but that doesn't mean you have a mandate to do it. I'm sure there are people who want to smoke in a hospital, but that doesn't mean they should install ashtrays next to the hospital beds. Go outside and smoke in the gazebo like you're supposed to.

And the larger majority of us are sure that trying to implement this would decrease the popularity of PvP by spreading it even thinner than it is already, and introducing griefing that wasn't a factor before.

No, our responses aren't speculation. We've played other games that have systems like the one your proposing already in place. It's ugly there, and it would be ugly here. Even uglier, perhaps, given the broken/unbalanced nature of the CoH PvP system.

Here's something you need to grasp in a hurry--you can't insult or shame people into agreeing with your idea. This attempt to ridicule and belittle your detractors is exactly the sort of attitude we expect to see from people trying to goad us into PvP. "You don't want to fight? You're a carebear chicken baby!" It's not effective, and you're digging yourself a hole.

Only the devs know for sure, but you can get a pretty good idea without holding a developers meeting. And even if the effort were minimal (which is highly, highly unlikely no matter how you implement this), implementing it would likely upset more people than it would benefit.

Of COURSE not.




...Because they kicked all the puppies to death already.

How did you get on the other end of the country like that? No wonder you're rare there. I lived in Georgia for over 10 years, and I never saw one of you the whole time.

The best evidence you can find for this is in other games that already have worldwide PvP, which many of us have played. Even with conditions like PvP flagging, you still get smacktards following you around trying to goad you into turning on your PvP flag.
"Duel me"
"No."
"Duel meh nao nub!"
"No."
"You suck-go *perform obscenity*"
"Leave me alone. I just want to PvE right now"
"Hey (in broadcast)! This guy is a chickens*** loser who won't fight me!"
etc, etc, etc.

You'd be surprised. We have some very educated guess floating around, and none of them point to "easy" on the coding and resource scale.

It wouldn't stop griefing, but it would concentrate the bulk of it in one area. You'd need to hire people specifically to police the new server. You'd also (as mentioned earlier) have to maintain two different sets of code. Not easy or cheap, especially for something with as little interest (and as much to lose in the bargain) as worldwide PvP.

AFAIK, advancing PvP beyond the boundaries of the PvP zones is the ONLY idea that generates such frustration that multiple people threaten to leave the game over it. It's certainly the only thing I know I'd leave the game over. PvP should stay where it belongs--it's ugly enough where it is.

It must be nice to assume that the only reason people disagree with you is because they don't understand you. There's no need to improve yourself or your ideas if all problems associated with you are actually caused by other people...