Sin_Stalker

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I don't see any missing bodies - they're all eclipsed by each other. I can make out where they are based on what I see, and their balance/proportions seem fine. I admit the girl in the black is a bit thin in the waist, but at least her spine isn't broken like in a Liefield.

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Not so much missing bodies as poor composition. It gives the effect that the lizard chick is missing half her body. Also, as a woman, aka the proud owner of a pair of breasts, the gal in the black isn't just thin, she'd break. She has no pelvis or musculature to support the weight of her chest, fake or real.


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Even Power Girl (with the biggest superhero boobs ever) isnt a twig. She is generally is wide to support the giants, at least wider than alot of other superheroines with smaller(but still giant) boobs and twig thin.

Man... I really love how this thread went. How often can you talk about giant knockers and smaller (but still giant) knockers? LMAO

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ok, ready or not, heres a little peak into my personal life:

i work in retail... in a 1 hour photo to be exact. i develop film, print pictures, sell cameras and accessories, and spend all day being nice to people i'd rather strangle with my bare hands.

for a while now i had this idea of doing a comic strip based on my real life experiences of serving the general public.

but i also wanted to do a comic based on fantasy, or superheroes and such.

so i came up with the idea of combining the two ideas and do a comic about my favorite hero, Clawkitty. at night she will battle the evil of the streets, and by day she will fight the urge to slice and dice the many dimwits who can't tell the difference between a digital camera and an electric shaver. (yes it really happened!)

here is a quick work up of what may be the first page. this is just an intro, so dont expect any gut busting funny jokes or anything. :P
Clawkitty, page 1

let me know what you think, not only about the page, but the idea in general.

thanks

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This really looks great. Awesome art. I really want to see more. Please make more.

Not a artist here let alone a sessioned one but I still have to say I like them. Good work Rose, keep it up.

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I feel like I need to speak up about the "artists are better than writers because etc. etc....".

Do comics work without artists? Of course not. Do comics work without writers? Of course not. I don't think that making a broad, general statement that artists are superior to writers, in the comics field, is very valid. Most of the great characters in comics were created by writers, not artists. On the flip side, the one time a bunch of "superstar artists" got together and came up with some original content, the result was the Image line. Love or hate the Image line, it's tough to argue that anything the founding members did was anything other than shallow imitations of characters and stories from the companies they left.

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As a writer, I'm a champion of writers. But regarding the comic book medium, the artist does have a greater degree of difficulty, which is what I think Sin Stalker meant. Marvel and DC tend to agree, because the artist gets a larger portion of the money, a 60-40 split as I recall.

I'm okay with that, because the artist's job *is* tougher than the writer's.

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LOL thank you for pointing that out. In two sentences you explain what I was trying.

Its funny how I want to be and consider myself a writer and yet I am bad with words when I talk normally. Hense why I will never be a book writer but visual is another story...

P.S. pun not intended.

True but you are just looking at the top writers vs not the best artists.

Those writers are also doing other non-comic book stuff too.

I was thinking more along the lines of equal level guys, but yeah, there are great writers out there who are what really makes the comics great.

I am glad you mentioned sandman. If you read the first trade paperback, ther eis an intro from the guy who hired him. It was about how Neil had great ideas but the main thing holding him back from giving him a job at one time was if he had the ability to pull it off.

Everyone here has great ideas, writers and artists. The thing that makes a person a great writer is if they are able to take a good or great idea and pull it off.
Now when it comes to comic books, alot of the time, not always but alot, the writers will make either a detailed script or a quick script depending on the situation. (Stan Lee would do alot of quick scripts that didnt break down the frames cuz he was working on so many different titles, it was up to the artists to fill in alot of the writing and do alot of the "pulling off")
Artists do more with the writering than most realize, not just the framing and whatnot. Thats why writers and artists have to work together. Idealy writers and artists should be doing there combined work and not just one of the party's ideas.

Thats why a pure writer is fine but artists (good comic book artists) are good writers in there own write and could fucntion without the pure writer partner.

Sure you have artists who write something and it sucks. But then again you have writers who do something and it sucks, so to make a fare comparision, we should look at the stuff that is equal.

Didnt frank miller write and draw some of his comics? I thought Sin City was one he drew himself.
If thats the case then thats a good example of kind of what I ment.

I really honestly didnt mean to diss anyone, especially fellow writers.

My point was that writers can write a script in a fraction of what it takes an artists to do the art.

Also writers have alot of other mediums. We could write books or scripts for TV/Movies. Short stories, articles, etc.

I personaly am a visual person. Its why I probably wont ever be a book writer. I am however good with visual story telling, stuff on camera and comics.

So again, I am sorry if I disrespected anyone here or offended anyone. It was a poor choice of words. I apologize. I really want to keep this thread about all the great advice and any further advice so if you do have a problem with what I said, if my apology isnt good enough, please just PM me and I can give you a personal apology and I wont be pulling a delete post or a "dont PM me". I misspoke and dug my own grave, trying to make up for it.

Saytress, thank you for the advice. I am going to look into getting both of those books. Hope too once I have the funds.

Any further advice you have, I would love to know about. If you dont want to post it here then please PM me. Also anyone else with honest advice would be great. This is what I am shooting for in life and I appricate any and all help.

Thank you.

Yeah, you are right. If that did offend anyone I really do apologize.

My view on it wasnt we are crap, just looked at anyone getting into the biz, there are LOT of writers. Good writers, people who can think they can write, etc.

Almost everyone I know thinks they can write so I am surrounded by writers and actors and whatnot but I am not around any artists whatsoever. I wish I did have an artist friend so I could get some discounted art to make a comic.

I also know that itll take me a few minutes to a few hours to put together a detailed comic book issue script.
Meanwhile itll take an artists HOURS on end to do even one page.

The main thing I ment is the artists are the real workers in this. Both writesr and artists have creativity and can be amazing but in the end the artist is the one doing the backbreaking work. I have learned to have nothing but respect for artists as I have only in the last year or so begun to realize how much time is put into it compared to the writing aspect.

Thats really what I ment by it and so I apoligze for mispeaking. I didnt mean to demean anyone(including myself as I am a writer too) so if i did and this apology doesnt work, please pm me and I wil give you a personal one.

Thank you.

Okay, a couple of things because I identify here from a few points of view. Please fully read my post because I am also asking for advice and whatnot.
This thread has gone so many directions, I am glad I could reply here before it gets deleted or locked as while there is alot of chaos around, there is ALOT of great advice here.

first off:
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Show of hands: who thinks Jugg and NYC Pulp should make angry manlove right now?

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This made me laugh out loud. So glad I wasnt drinking anything or my keyboard and monitor would be gone now lol.

Secondly It was mentioned here about writers vs artists and I wanted to add what I have seen here (from a writers perspective since most of the replies are artists and writers/artists).
Writers are crap. Sorry its true to a point. In comic books the artists do alot. They rework stuff and move stuff around.
If it wasnt for artists, comics wouldnt be here and I am not just talking about the art. The artists in comics go so far beyond just the art but the flow and the mood. Ultimatly they decide.

As for writers well... NY, just look around the forums and how many people are on any of those other sites that were listed. Everyone and anyone can write. Well... maybe not as good as the next but ultimatly writers are a secondary thing here in comics.
Writers might get ALOT of the fame but really its the artists who are kings.

Anyone of those artists that works for you for free could easily write something themsevles. Might not be better but its somthing and its fully there own.

As for a writer offering there services, dime a dozen. Its not needed, especially in this day and age. At least when it comes to writers in comic books.

Speaking of which, just in case there are actually some artists here who want to try out someon eles stuff or have something of there own, I am around and will 24 hours + straight to get you whatever type of story with whatever type of characters you want. I think I am pretty good even though I dont have much under my belt. I at least have the 2 issues of my Justice-Knights comic you could look at.
So if anyone wants at least me to read there stuff and throw ideas at them, I am happy to do that too. I can come up with the most detailed plots and twists and stuff in a matter of seconds. Take em or leave them but I am here for anyone I love and need the practice.


Okay so back on track, the main reason I wanted to say something is this...
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Because your going about it all wrong is why.

Trust me, i've had an idea for a TA comic for years now but i wouldn't dream of coming on the boards and asking someone to work for probably a year and then some to get paid.

You just can't say i'll give you a percentage of the profits if and when it gets off the ground. Thats bad business all the way around.

You got screwed before because you didn't have a contract. Plain and simple. If i were an artist or writer i'd either get a contract or sell it per panel. That would be my suggestion to you. Find an artist you wanna work with and order panels. Pay per page and offer them a percentage of the end sales IF it ever gets any profit.

Coming on the boards and demanding art for free with years before they may see anything from it is ludicris. Come on now.

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Relax. It isn't ludicrous, alright?. I've seen other writers and artists request help before on other forums some paying, some for free. Especially on ComicJobz.com before it was shut down and on ComicSpace.

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Actually, your proposition is fairly ludicrous. not insanely, but it's your average run of the mill type ludicrous. And before you get defensive, I'll explain why. First, your proposition is incredibly common. That's why you'd see so many postings about new projects for some pay or little pay. A lot of these people think... they KNOW they have the next big thing (I'm not lumping you in that group, but the sheer amount of times I've had people approach art forums with "THIS WILL MAKE YOU FAMOUS" scenarios is pretty insane). Before you sign up an artist to your project, you need to know if your project is at all viable. Go to conventions and talk to the writers. Pitch them the idea. Sell the idea in one sentence.

Example: Small girl raises monster to be her friend and adventures ensue.

You don't need to give how many pages. You don't have to give synopsis of the characters. If someone perks up at the idea and wants to hear more, THEN you give them more. Have someone, other than a friend, read your summaries, your character descriptions. Why not friends or family? They're going to tell you they like it because they're emotionally involved. Going to conventions with people you've never met before is a great way to figure out what needs changing.

Yes, you've seen people say they'll work for free. That's wrong. And here's why: The discussion of free work or compensation later was brought up amongst graphic designers, illustrators, animators, and comic artists on a large community forum online a few years back. The comics industry needs a re-haul. There are too many people that are doing free work with the promise of sales later, doing spec work and work for hire that lose all their rights as artists. I would advise you to look up the recent folding of Tokyopop and their contracts for artists/writers/creative teams. It's pretty horrific. Aside from that, many, MANY fresh artists out there hear those words, "Compensation later", and they want to get into the industry so badly, they go ahead and sign up for these projects. They're promised their big break, they're told that once it takes off at conventions, they'll rake in the money. This never happens. Never.

One of my first professional gigs was a very low-pay book with the promise of a percentage of any/all sales. It was one of the chief reasons I signed on. Low pay, but the promise of extra checks in the mail was really enticing. Guess how many checks I got for the sales of the books and merchandise over the last six years? Nadda. Even though I HAD a contract. I went after the company, to no avail.

As to my friends doing comics solely to make a living? Out of all my friends, I think it took one of them selling at Comic Con for three years to start making a profit on her comic.

So let's say you make this book. Between the cost of printing your comic and local shop sales, you will net a negative profit, if you go all out and take it to a self-publishing place, you'll probably be negative a few thousand dollars. This is the reality of comics. The exposure doesn't mean you'll get feedback or a break with a company, it doesn't even ensure you make money. It just doesn't work that way. Even if you did attend conventions for several years, your chances of making a profit off your book are minimal at best. My other friend, a well known web-comic artist, only now, after four or five years of working his patoot off every day drawing, is starting to see a profit on his work. He's the sole creator (artist and writer).

Your best bet? Draw up that contract that we all have talked about. Pay a PER PAGE rate, not per panel, which whould include whether or not this artist is doing it all (pencils, inks, color) or just part of it. Set your comic up on the web, and do a short five-seven page story that you can copy at Kinko's and take it to conventions. Hand it out for free, bring the artist with you if you can. With some luck, for every hundred copies you hand out, you'll get one or two emails in response to it. Lather, rinse, repeat for a few years.

Breaking into comics... I've been doing comics professionally off and on since 2001. I've yet to earn a living wage off of it, because comics don't pay a living wage. So why do I do it? Because I love stories. I love telling stories, and I love working with people.

So my two cents, again.

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This was awesome. I just have to say. Great advice. I, in fear of this thread being deleted, copy and pasted this. I am forever in debt.

I also wanted to ask for any more advice I could get from you or anyone else. I'll explain my situation but first explain this to avoid any flaming or misunderstandings (as i am misunderstood alot )


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I could die tomarrow and the world will keep going. I am a nobody and a nothing. I am very proud of what little I have done so far and try my damnest to do more. In other words I am humbling myself infront of all of you.

I do however think I have something, like many of you do. A spark of creativity, of talent. I believe and hope I could one day create something great. I believe in myself that I may oneday do so. But if I do or dont, this world keeps going and I am dust in the wind.

I know I have a gift even though many think they do and alot of the time probably dont. Making completely original ideas and stories that are completely detailed with twists and full characters developed in a matter of minutes in my head is pretty cool but then again, there are probably many who can do the same...

Now that I have that out of the way my situation is this. I am of course poor. I want to make comics. These dont work well together although are obviously going hand and hand.

I havnt been able to make my own comics because simply, I cant draw. Seriously, I can barely do stick figures. So I never made a comic. After that coh comic contest, when i was introduced to comic creator, I realized here was a way to do this without relaying on someone else .I definatly didnt want to go around asking for free stuff. I have reada alot about artists and writers and whatnot and know that is a no no.

So I have a few things out so far and more on the way. I hope this gives me some cred for if I ever work with someone else, so they can see I am not all talk, I have some completed stuff. I think thats a good first step.

I have often been told and read through this thread that about doing your own art. At the same time how if the story is good the art can be overlooked.

Also finding out that great artists take hours to do just one page makes me realized, woah... maybe i should try again.
I was a really good drawer in grade school but it just took so darn long I figured I sucked and left it alone until I suck nowadays.

I was hoping any of you could PM me with some info on how to start learning how to draw so i could learn. I have looked into this before and could really only find stuff for people already at a small level.
I have no level.

Any place I can check out for truely beginners in art?

Another thing to Sayterra is, any advice on for a humble writers? (hope I am humble)

I really think i could one day become a great writer, I pray.
I can feel it my bones, this is really the only thing I am good for this in this world, the only thing I have an actual talent for and I suck at EVERYTHING else. So I gotta be this.
I just need the resources (artist, whatever else lol). I am of course not asking for any handouts here, simply advice. From your experience and what you have seen, how have the established writers today done it?
No hand outs, just a swift kick in the butt to the correct direction is all I ask. If more is offered one day, then awesome.

That first issue I did took me very quickly to write but took me 2 and a half months of working on average 8 to 16 hours a day making it.

The second issue was the same but only took one month.

I also, if it shows anything (idk), was at comic-con in San diago a few weeks ago. I was invited and spoke on a panel about what makes a superhero and what superheroes are all about, yadda yadda yadda.
So I think I do have stuff in me to be randomly contacted and invited and stuff. At least I hope I do, could have just been dumb luck.

Anyways, so I guess this all falls into the falling.

1. Someone point me to where I can learn how to draw. How to draw from a very basic level. I wish to master and surpass stick figures!

2. Any advice, especially from you Sayterra, about what I honestly need to do or work on to get work. Also any advice or direct you can give on where to go to do what is advice previously.

3. third and finally, and I just have to put this out there. If anyone has anything they want written. A comic script made up after there plot idea or... a story completely made up by me or colaberate on together (yes I am offering my writing skills as I mispell many o' words) please contact me. Heck, give me shot.

Hope I can feedback (in this thread or in PMs) and if this thread gets locked or deleted I will probably repost this in its own thread because its really something Id like as much advice and help on as possible.

-Sin Stalker

I love the first costume aswell with the shoulder pads.

I find this kinda weird or maybe its just me:

First he has too small,
then too dark,

but there seems to be a very big difference in color and possibly some small details in design(the shoulders for instance).
Kinda seems weird to me, like you arnt sure yourself what he looks like or how you want him drawn and such.

More detail, keep it all the same and also any character detail I have noticed helps. You could say (he is kind of a batman type hero but looks like a yellow jacket and... I dont know you could say he walks around like Beast from x-men or whatever.) Even those generic things help greatly for artists.
If you want to put more info and go the more unique route then thats awesome too but details details details.

Possibly screen shots of them in there normal positions (crouching on a building roof corner, flying through the air, etc,) or fighting baddies he normally goes up against using some trademark moves.

More screen shots the better. Not just one screen shot that shows it all but close ups, midway shots, anything several times over from a slightly different angle and position.

I also think ultimatly it isnt going to be just the costume that inspires an artist to draw you. I think you need (through these explainations and details about the character) jog something in the artist to want to draw it because when you give them the shots and the concept, it jumps into there mind.

Again, something as simple as saying Batman plus Yellow Jacket but walksa round like beast might be all it takes to make them want to do something or it might be a paragraph or two.

If I am wrong here please let me know but thats what I have noticed from others getting work done and fromw what i think artists go by. I am not artist though so please LJ or anyone else, slap me if I am wrong.

Okay cool

Whos Speedy, by the way? lol

bump for my Q,

I know that. I as asking him a question and yet to have a responce from him. Was hoping he would see it now though.

Dude...

That was awesome... to like... the awesomest.

I want more!

nyc?

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Sin Stalker definitely has that look!

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Yeah. I realized after the description of what pulp is, Sin is definatly inspired by those guys. Although I went a different route. Instead of them being a detective, he really isnt. Well he is paranoid and stuff and a bit koo koo but not a detective.
He is completely human, no powers except for the abiltity to sense peoples pain.
Its this sense that allows him to go into the direction of people introuble.
Even if they arnt in physical pain, if they are being chased by a mugger or something, that emotional pain or actualy physical pain of course. Either way. He is a seemlingly very weak psychic with no real control over his powers.

The Justice-Knights featuring Sin Stalker

I think I'd consider Sin Stalker, the main character, a pulp hero.
He is ment to have the same tone as a Shadow or Phantom or Batman.
In this series though its not too pulpy right away or each issue mainly cause... imagine you team a pulp hero with a team of heroes (Justice League or Avengers). So its like when the Question teams with the League.

He is still a pulp guy I am pretty sure.

Let me know what ya think.

Also the first couple of links in that thread dont use, they are to the old hosting site I had.

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I really like the Red Phantom.
I watched those videoes, and now I also like that blind archer(name escapes me at the moment).
You mentioned something about a novel and/or a comic? Do you have any of it (preferably the comic) to see yet?

Also do you play any of these characters?

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the webcomic is at http://www.comicspace.com/nycpulpadventures/ (I had to drop the artist.. he had gotten lazy and im looking for a new one)

the info for the novel is in my sig. all i need is to save up enough $$ for a cover artist and self publishing

The blindfolded archer is called the Quiet Man and yep i play as the Red Phantom (magical tanker)

and here is a wiki on the Red Phantom and there is a link to his rival, the Quiet Man
http://www.comixpedia.org/index.php?title=Red_phantom

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Cant seem to be able to find how to access the comics on the above links. Can you direct me?

I am waiting on the colored version for the comic.

For the b&w, I am going to use it possibly on the website or the cover gallery... maybe as a cover later on or at the end of the issue, not sure yet lol.

Also, just curious, is there any update or guess at time at all LJ?

Also, whats pulp?

I really like the Red Phantom.
I watched those videoes, and now I also like that blind archer(name escapes me at the moment).
You mentioned something about a novel and/or a comic? Do you have any of it (preferably the comic) to see yet?

Also do you play any of these characters?

Its fine. Didnt really care if ya change it LJ, just was pointing it out lol.

For the name, look at the previous issues. Its the(but smaller font) and then Justice-Knights (big font).

The company name I am working on. I am talking with others cuz Id like to make the comic as "official" looking as possible. So I am looking into what is the correct ncsoft labels and if i need cryptic on there and such.
Once I have those I can work with ya more on it but until then, I am still waiting myself.

I want pictures with the bio.

I like that but the comic actually isnt just Sin Stalker and his sidekick Stalkling. Its the Justice-Knights comic. Although most of the series will star at least once of these characters for most of it since I have the most creative freedom with these characters.

If you havnt yet, please check out issues 1 and 2.

When you go to the thread, dont click on the first 2 links. They are old. Go near the end and get either the issuu versions, the cohcomics.com version or the PDF of those two.

I will start a brand new thread once the third issue is complete so I dont have to deal with the faulty links anymore.

Again, I really like what you did but unfortunatly its not what works for this series. IF you want to later get together and work on something, that would be cool.
I am happy to work with anyone and everyone in the community with the JKnights series. I will even be gaining more and more spots for cameos as we go along.

My hope is that the Justice-Knights and the series will be accepted into the coh community in the way that War Witch and Apex and the first run series has been accepted into the coh world or the way the freedom phalanx and its run has been accepted.
Only the JKnights are more like a... 3rd or 4th ranked hero while the Freedom Phalanx is 1st rate and then Vindicators and then longbow and then your top SGs on each server and then your middle class... the JKnights are the lesser known heroes at the bottom of the list more often than not so I am hoping theyw ill be more easily accepted.
If not tell me why so I can work on it and fix it into that sort of direction.

Oh shoot >< I just had a mini-rant.
Sorry...

P.S. Drooling still and I think its cuz of all the seizures.

EDITED** P.S.S. So apparently I just noticed that Stalkling is named Stalking in this thread.
Just fyi Sin Stalkers sidekick is Stalkling. Stalk + ling. Wanted to clear that up. hehe.

*drooling...*



EDITED* - BTW, when you have the art fully done, please dont forget to put your signature somewhere on it. Best is one of the two bottom corners.

Great job. Can hardly wait to see more.