Shadowe

I'm reminded of my favourite joke on this. Whenever I'm in PI and I see a broadcast saying something like "Level 49 Scrapper, lf farm", I will respond "I think I saw a cow on Talos Island."

If they want to farm, that's fine - that's how some people get their fun - but nothing prevents me having a little giggle at their expense, provided I don't get petty about it.

Take a look in the Technical forum - GR has advice on how to get round that problem.

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I apologised for doing just that in Shadowe's Psychonova plot. The way we eventually planned it out it was Nitoichi playing off against Psychonova right up until the point where she stabbed him, and then everyone got to put the boot in. It happens. Sometimes it works, sometimes everyone gets narked at you. OTOH, why shouldn't you have the spotlight sometimes?

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You apologised, but it wasn't a problem. I'm happy to let people shine in a situation that warrants it, especially when I'm running a plotline.

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One technically uber-plot which worked for her was the aforementioned Psychonova plot. Psychonova could have probably given her a sound thrashing, but she had several factors on her side: he's a pervy sob with a particular liking for teenage girls and Ni was laying it on fairly thick, he wanted something and so wasn't bringing out the energy blasts too quickly, and he thought he'd fooled her into believing he was Richard, but hadn't done his homework.

So, she caught him by surprise and stuffed a Talsorian sword blade through his chest while kissing him. In comes that business Shadowe mentioned about Shadowe being badly damaged by extra-dimensional energies; Talsorian blades are basically stolen Rikti technology... Luckily enough, it was sufficiently incapacitating that he failed to start throwing energy blasts. Might have been messy if he had.

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Thus proving, quite well, actually, that even Cosmic-level characters can be beaten by an ordinary hero, in the right circumstances. In fact, to the best of my knowledge, Psychonova should, by rights, have been able to beat all of the characters that were faced off against him in that scene without breaking a sweat, but didn't, thanks to some forethought by the players and their characters, using his weaknesses and character flaws against him - which is exactly how it should work.

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Like comparing apples and oranges, I'm afraid.

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GR, that was the most AWFUL pun I've heard this year...

Ah, thanks, Z. As soon as I wrote that I knew it was wrong. Silly Shad.

Still having a lot of fun reading The Freedom Phalanx again, right now (as in - I've stopped reading it to type here), and I'll agree with the sentiment that Synapse and Positron are actually a really cool pair.

Right, my favourites...

I like Positron a fair bit, actually. He's such a... geek. It's awesome. The whole "I always wanted to be a superhero" thing coupled with the insanely phenomenal scientific and technical skills is just funky. He's one of the few heroes around who doesn't angst about anything much. It's quite refreshing.

Ms. Liberty as shown in the comics is also surprisingly appealing to me - she's trying so hard to get out of her Grandad's shadow, while not seeming to care one way or another, and it just adds the right level of rebeliousness to someone who would otherwise have been a goody-two-shoes stuck up cow.

Villain side (which I haven't really played much), Ghost Widow wins hands down. Awesome concept, fantastically realised character.

Worst...

I'd originally have said Synapse, before reading The Freedom Phalanx. He just seemed to be "yet another speeder". And then I read the book, and found out that Steve Berry is actually an interesting character.

I can't stand Scirroco (or however that's spelt), though I've picked up the odd hint that he's got some interesting things about him.

Manticore is just too arrogant by half. Really. He's a loner by trade, and to be perfectly honest, I can't for the life of me comprehend what Sister Psyche sees in him. Maybe that's because I'm a bloke, though, and he just comes across as a cocky rich brat trying to avenge his parents' deaths, with some ability to let him actually do it. He'd be great as a solo character, but he doesn't mesh well with the rest of the signature characters.

Sister Psyche is my "love her and hate her" character. I love the powerful psychic, I love the mindriding ability, I love the fact that there's this decidedly hawt red-head who's actually over 80 years old... and then there's her personality. She's an 80 year-old woman, for heaven's sakes. Sure, she might be brash and confident. But she's also vastly experienced. She should be a little wiser than she comes across, and the fact that she seems to think and act like a person who is as old as she appears to be just doesn't click right in my mind. She has the right to talk to people as if they were children, sure, but her attitudes are those of a woman in her twenties, and it just comes off badly.

I usually quote a figure of around 6 months. I also think that's wrong. I wasn't really paying attention, to be honest, but if you take my start date of 3 September 2005, then stretch that to the date of the first ever Double XP event (whenever that was), which got me to a smidgeon below 49 (48.95) and add the three weeks to a month it took me to get the last bits of XP, that's how long it took. I think it was actually about 8 or 9 months.

Why does it take so long? What's the point in spending what might seem like forever, when in other MMOs the aim of the game is to get to the level cap as soon as possible?

Because in CoH, the aim of the game is the journey, not the destination.

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Where states fights bearhands, this idiot needs a spiderpack to even do damage.

[/ QUOTE ]It's not a spiderpack, those spider limbs actually grow out of his back. He's just plated them.

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With Impervium, if I remember my Web of Arachnos correctly.

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£9.99 for a month of game time, the Valkyrie costumes and the Mission TP'er?

Bought!

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Hmm... I like the way you think, and am interested in subscribing to your newsletter. 2 Accounts, will buy it when I get home.

GR has already confirmed that it is account specific, not client-based (so, if you create an account on a MAC, and later, round a friend's house, log in on a PC, you'll still be able to access the game). The only question was whether it was actually possible to apply the code to an existing account or did it have to be used to create a new account. Sounds like upgrades work.

Valkyries ahoy!

Other than that the booster pack will probably only cost £5.99, of course. Wait a few weeks, save some money.

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I realize there's some characterization in the whole thing but sometimes I really do wonder why people do this. You could have pretty much the exact same thing by just being at that 'held back' power level and forget about the untapped reserve. Unless it's an integral part of the character (And it rarely is) it's just not needed.

The argument seems to be 'It's fine to be vastly powerful, providing you never ever use said power' which I guess is right and fine and all but just smacks of 'Well then why bother?'. Nothing turns me off more to a character than one hinting that they might blow up the whole city, mainly because it just seems a little insane for them to be in a populated area if this was true.

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I'll take this one, and explain to everyone the exceptionally embarrassing OOC story of how Richard Huntington became Shadowe.

Way back in 1999, I was just getting into superhero RPGs and started getting a few pen and paper ones (you know, as you do). I developed a character, Richard Huntington, aka Shadow (I had to add the e on the end in CoH for obvious reasons). I detailed his origin, but didn't think anything of it for absolutely ages (I mean AGES), and he festered in the shelves of my mind as a character. I never actually got round to playing him.

Roll on 3 September 2005, when I got CoH. My first ever character was Shadowe. I started off playing the game purely for playing the game, and got him to about, oh, Level 38 or so, I think, before I first ventured to Galaxy Girl.

It was actually there (or shortly thereafter) that the consequences hit me. I'd detailed something about the character, but not actually done the maths (that'll teach me) and I discovered a rather glaring discrepancy - a golf-ball sized black hole has a mass [u]~[u] twice that of Earth.

Oops.

Now, the good news was that I had a ready-made get-out-of-gaol-free card, in terms of "The Shadow World", or as Richard calls it "My own personal Hell". I could say that most of the mass is actually in this other reality, and the singularity in Richard's head is actually a dimensional rift to the real singularity, allowing a small amount of the mass to affect the world of Paragon. Bingo. Problem solved, no retcon needed (I loathe retcons), character intact...

Except he has "control" (I use the term VERY loosely) of a singularity twice the mass of his own planet. His desire to never use such power comes naturally out of his personality as originally written, but him actually being such a Cosmic-level entity was, in fact, a mistake. All mine.

Yes, I could have rewritten him and made the singularity smaller. I was strongly tempted to. But by that time there had been visual and descriptive detail of it used in-game and in fiction, and, as I said, I hate retcons. Even minor ones like that. So I let it run. Probably the biggest mistake of my RP career, and one that I regret, because I should have done the maths first. But, having made it, I've noticed that (for reasons I won't go into right now) it actually allows some fascinating developments to take place, which would be a lot harder to justify if I went for the "smaller singularity" option.

Rampant Speculation Time!

CoX-2 will NOT be produced in 2009. It will be a fully developed MMO separate to CoX (though possibly with character-portability), with a likely release date of 2012/13 (to cover development time - consider the staff NCNC had until recently: there's no way they could have been working on a new game before this).

What we will see in 2009 is a paid-for expansion to a) get the game back on the shelves and b) expand the game universe hugely (expect other places in the world, and/or a "neutral" faction of some type). It will be released concurrently to Issue 15 or 16.

The expansion will not include "must-have" stuff, and will not be required to play the game as we currently know it, but a whole raft of story arcs and missions, spanning Paragon, the Rogue Isles and possibly other places will become available, allowing a single character to experience the richness of the ENTIRE game world, and their own unique stuff, too.

Expect new Archetypes, powersets, enemy groups, costumes. We'll even get the much-asked-for dual-pistols (for blasters, defenders and corrupters), and a staff set for the effette melee types.

Hmm... now we need a catchy name for it.

World of Heroes.

City of Reckoning.

(Okay, I'm being silly, there)

Of course, something that allows travel to both Paragon and the Rogue Isles is very much like the (hoped, prayed and wished for) Going Rogue feature. With extras.

Please, God, let me be close. Please.

Nah, you want Crey's Folly.

Well, yes, I believe there is an ambiguous statement to the effect that no Kheldian ever has bonded with a meta-human, but I don't think it's actually banned by canon.

Source material unavailable at work, so if anyone can peruse ParagonWiki and Red Tomax, that would be great.

Yeah, just something like "The Game Updater has been updated, please ensure that CoHUpdater.eu.exe is not set as "read only" and note that this change may require you to update your firewall settings".

[Edit: Tweaked phraseology]

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If you make a character capable of soloing AV's you should be allowed to be IC more powerful than said AV's.

Likewise if your characters RP is they are as tough as old beats to knock down, you should be a Tanker or Brute maybe a Scrapper, possibly a Blaster with EPP God Mode.

Like wise capable of shooting lasers out of your fingers? How come you're playing a Ninja Blade stalker?

Aka if your characters meant to have a power that's in game, make them have that power or as close as you can get to it.

My Two pence any way.

Edit To Add:

It'd be like some one RPing a Paladin but playing a Rogue.

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This is a totally different issue, and quite a complex one, with a lot of proponents on both sides. The general consensus seems to be that, yes, you should fit your character's powers as closely as you can to the powersets available in-game, but there exist some characters (rightly or wrongly) who simply don't fit the bill.

For example, I've been known to use a Kheldian for a small character part, simply because I needed the character to fly. The rest of the powerset was nothing like the capabilities the character should have had.

Grav Mistress, to borrow one of Ghostie's characters for illustrative purposes, is simultaneously a powerful controller and a bonded Kheldian. This is impossible to duplicate in-game, so Ghostie has two (or more) versions of the character to allow chopping and changing dependent on circumstances.

While it would be easier for all of us if every character could be delineated by the character creation options available to us in the game, people come up with interesting concepts that don't always fit.

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I'd also like to add the fact that Sister Psyche is, according to in-game lore/canon, the most powerful psychic in the World - that's possibly not quite true and I can't find the quote that backs it up but some attention seems to be being paid to the power limits of the CoX Universe.

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According to in-game information, it's actually Penelope Yu. She just doesn't use her power. If we're talking about the most powerful hero or villain psychic, then yes, Sister Psyche tops the bill.

Glad it got sorted out for you!

Happy Heroing or Vigourous Villaining, whichever floats your boat!

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Game-mechanics and IC powers should not be taken as equal. True.
But I still think that the Incarnates are top-notch.

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Absolutely no argument from me, there. They're meant to be. They're described as being. Therefore they should be.

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I agree with you Shadowe that cosmic characters are fun. And I might even (a bit grudgingly maybe) accept that some characters can surpass the Incarnates in one aspect while lack in others.

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I have to admit that I personally dislike the "I'm stronger than Statesman" types. It smacks of powergaming. It takes a pretty hefty justification for me to be able to accept it.

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What I don't like is the sheer amount of godly/cosmic entities out there. There seem to be more gods/angels/demons in Paragon than in the seven heavens combined sometimes.

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Here's something that you and I agree on completely. Partly it's because I'm a Christian (not hugely relevant, and I'm not obsessive about it - if someone wants to play an angel or demon or divinity, that's fine by me), but it's mostly that there are so many fun human concepts out there that it takes a particularly good character concept to make me enjoy seeing one (and yes, I've seen a few well-portrayed angels in my time).

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Cosmic scale characters are fun to play, but are more suited in a tight and controlled group. And your average MMO aint exactly that.
Therefore I think they should be avoided. (Again, this is purely my own opinion and not an attack.)

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Never thought you were attacking anyone. To be honest, they make better NPCs than they do PCs, and with only a couple of exceptions I wouldn't normally play one. Those exceptions are my main, whom I maintain rigid control over, my main villain (who is really an NPC) and one other who could actually fall into every cliche of poor Cosmic-power-play unless I'm careful - given that I'm still working out exactly how the character is restricted, I have so far only played it for characterisation purposes, not anything combat or plot-related.

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I've yet to see someone portray a cosmic level character in a believable and fun (as in inspirational and not ha-ha) way. Complete with weaknesses and all.

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I'm hoping that the third character I mention above, there, will eventually be developed enough to meet those criteria. I do know that it hasn't happened yet, which is why the character is largely untouched.

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Cosmic characters shouldn't only be limited by their own will like "my morality keeps me from doing it" or "I haven't found out I can do it yet". They need a real way to weaken and beat them.

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Now, this I both agree and disagree with. A well-thought-out and -played character could be portrayed as solely restricted by their own morality. I'd love to see one in CoH. I've actually only ever seen it happen once in my 22 years RPing. But such a character has to approach "perfect Paladinhood" to work, and that can be frustrating for the player, as well as others who interact with them. So, in most circumstances, it's better to have some sort of real weakness built in (I know I tend to use my main as an example a lot, but he's a very good case-in-point - he is extremely vulnerable to energy from other realities. Not merely "he has no defence against it", but is actually harmed more by it than he should be. There are very good reasons for this, IC, and it provides a ready-made way for him to be dealt with if needed - as evidenced in one of Ravenswing's Future Imperfect stories).

Not a bad thought, Diggis. That would make some teams a lot easier to manage. If it ran off Combat Level rather than Security Level, then that would be possible. I'm sure there's some Game-World reason for it, unfortunately, but that would be easy to work around with your proposal.

As for the original idea... /unsigned, for a number of reasons, not least because under the current system there's always the Shadow Shards.

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And yet, there ARE chars out there which can solo an AV... I've seen it...

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Yes, there are.

So have I, and while I might be wrong on this (I'm willing to be), there are a few common themes running through each of the characters able to do it.

Firstly, they tend to be strong on debuffs. That's pretty much Rad and Dark. I don't think it's unreasonable to say that Incarnates are, for whatever reason, vulnerable to the weakening energy of radiation and to negative energy.

Secondly, it's common to use Temp Powers such as Warburg Nukes and Shivans to weaken the AV. Call me picky, but I consider that to not be the character. Such a test should only allow the use of Primary and Secondary powersets, Power Pools and Accolades (and Insps, I guess), and you get one shot at it. Hosping, buying more insps, and then going back for more isn't in the spirit of the thing. After all, if Tyrant dropped 3 Warburg Nukes and Shivans on the PC, to make the fight even, I think he'd find it remarkably easy to win.

AV-killers use the rules of the game, and eke out every advantage they can to be able to do it. Soloing an AV "In Character" should be in character, not meta-gaming.

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One important thing to note, here, of course, is that I am not a strict "game-world-lawyer". The CoX Universe is a living environment, and I'm grateful for it. If someone says, IC, that they managed to defeat Recluse or Tyrant on their own, then I can accept it because the EB versions can be easily defeated - write it off as Recluse having a bad day, or Tyrant remembering that he needs to spend some quality time with Dominatrix. I don't think that the AVs are invincible, but I do think that a character who manages to defeat one of them has to either be very lucky (EB version, not AV), or getting a lot of help (team, or temp powers).

I wouldn't say that it does.

Crank yourself up to invincible and go and face off against Tyrant solo. In fact, I challenge anyone to manage it on a "general" build not specifically designed for solo AV-killing. Yes, you can take him down with a team of three or more (particularly with the right Powersets in the team). A team of two struggles. A solo character facing off against an AV is going to either fight them to a standstill or faceplant.

There's a lot of this sort of leap of logic in the earlier written hero arcs - I tend not to let it bother me, and just accept that the contacts have sources of information that my character doesn't.

Magic and Mutation: Blackwand
Tech, Science, Natural: Nemesis Staff.

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Personally I like to treat Statesman and Recluse as the pinnacle of power in the CoX universe.
Otherwise there'd be no point in Recluse with cronies being the number one feared enemy.

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True enough (I'm not quoting the rest of your post, because I tend to agree with it, despite having not less than two characters who patently fall into the "uber-mighty-world-destroying-powers" category).

What tends to happen, with those of us who like playing what several superhero PnP RPG's call "Cosmic Level" characters is that we treat the Incarnates as the pinnacle of overall power in the CoX universe.

So, you could have a character who is physically stronger than Recluse (from the novels, he's stronger than Statesman), he would have to be deficient in some other way - probably by not being as physically tough. You could have a character who is a more powerful psychic than Penelope Yu, but it might be uncontrolled. You could have a character who is faster than Synapse, but has to rest after using their speed. (Yes, I'm aware that only one of those NPCs is actually an Incarnate, but the point still stands.)

The key to making a realistic, believable, fun Cosmic-level character is to make sure they have enough flaws that they don't dominate everything. I make a character who can literally destroy the world in the blink of an eye, but I make him fear for his humanity and unable to control the degree to which he uses his power such that if he were ever to let rip to the full extent of his theoretical ability, he would destroy everything he strives to keep safe.

Interestingly, villains are a slightly different kettle of fish, though at the end of the day it amounts to the same thing. I make a villain with basically the same capabilities as my hero, and he should be able to destroy the world in the blink of an eye, but I make him a petty, self-serving, egotistical psychopath who isn't interested in anything on the world stage - all he wants is to cause pain and suffering to my hero. He can't do that if he destroys the world (well, he could, but it would fade - he wants the pain to last a long time).

I tend to think of this kind of restriction as a "concept limitation" - the character's background and personality are carefully designed so that, for all their theoretical insanely huge levels of power, they effectively cannot use it if they want to acheive their goals.

Which, of course, is not to say that they are above threatening to use it. My main has done so a couple of times, in an attempt to show how seriously he takes the potential excesses of others (yes, I'm looking at Zorielle Rolando, here , for one). It's him saying "I would rather see the world and all I love in it destroyed than let you become the monster you could be". He would never do it, but it's a point of characterisation, an added level of depth that allows me to display his feelings briefly and simply, and get the point across, and that's all I ever use it for.