Premonitions
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Posts
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Joined
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It's not a super power. It's as good as one, though, And that's what makes it so cool.
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Quote:This is pretty much the exact opposite of my thinking. Currently the Well's primary value to me is in it's ability to be ignored. Anything that makes it more recognizable as "The Source of power" is a negative. If it wants to be sentient, go ahead, just be sentient over there in the corner where I don't have to hear it.Originally Posted by Dante
I've never had an issue with the Well being the source of all power. It's making it sentient that changes the dynamic for the worse.
Thankfully the trials and incarnate system give me a healthy freedom to do such. Currently the trials just "look" like parts of the Praetorian war, which I don't have a problem with, and the incarnate system just feels like a hybrid of enhancement slotting and the inventions system. I think when the time comes that trials involve us entering the Well's collective consciousness or somesuch, I'll probably just throw my hands up in disgust and take a break from my post-fifty character(s), if not the game.
The well being the source of all power jarrs me out of the character creation process. It does this so much that I barely feel like giving my characters legitimate backstories and identities and power concepts, that is, if I forget to completely ignore it(the well) in all it's forms.
In many games that have less open-ended character creation, the kind that pre-determine my character's abilities and backstory (or don't give me one) or have less-involved visual customization, I tend to just make a "Premmy", just a basic, simple concept, cowboy, samurai, robot, whatever fits into the game in the vaguest sense. Simple identity, good guy or bad guy And often, just "whatever I want to play at the time" because most of the "Creation" aspect of the process is done by the game's creators. Even if I like the setting, story, e.t.c. , I just can't get into the idea of "Creating" a character for it. I don't feel like I'm creating very much when what I do amounts to a coat of paint on someone else's car.
City of Heroes always felt much more open ended than any other game out there. Ninja-Pirate-Magic-Robot-Super Soldier is a thing you can do easily. I can waste lots of time creating that. The early parts of the game are great for that. The idea that this magical thingamabob being put in because someone just really needed to explain EVE-RY-THING sucks because it's more or less taking away much of my job. At what point am I no longer making the car, but just painting it? The Point at which where my character came from is laid out on their end, not mine.
No it's not, you know why? because all that stuff you said? that's supposed to be my job as the creator of the character. That's supposed to be relevant to my little bio box where I explain why my techno mage's Spell Programs work, what planet my alien comes from, and why my Fishman exists. The guy next to me with the powered armor? and that zombie chick? that's their jobs too.Quote:Originally Posted by YogiThat stance is wholly flawed
It's darkness powersets and "The Netherworld" writ large across all ATs and powersets
Taking away the little FBSA cards was nice, framing the tutorial as "You are in town on your own business" is too. Going too far with the Well just dashes that all to hell.
Instead of the CoH world being just a fantastical place where all kinds of crazy stuff is possible in all kinds of ways, and everyone's idea can co-exist without the world collapsing somehow, there's just one, big giant midichlorian futzing things up. Why think much harder than
"This is Pointy Premmy, my Spines/Regen scrapper"
"So who is he?"
"A Spines/Regen Scrapper, duh......"
"Where do his powers come from?"
"What?"
"His powers"
"Huh? dude, I just heard spines was fun"
The more I think about it the more it feels like the Devs are Jossing what amounts to Fanfiction never intended to be relevant to the actual gameworld. Even as an RPer, I never expect my ideas for how my character's powers work to be taken seriously by anyone else but me and maybe the small crew I might run with. It's not a threat to the coherence of the game world because it's just my little fun I have off to the side of the game. When I'm not thinking like an RPer it becomes even less significant. Why did it need to be addressed anyway? If you're the type to think about that, you should have the freedom to come up with your own cosmology. If not, then it's not a problem for you. So why the well at all? Because it's a common misconception that a "Verse" is essential to super-hero storytelling. And It really isn't. Our current big two 'Verses came about more or less after big money-grabbing crossovers either as a justification for the continuation of said crossovers, or just organically. Next to none of the "Iconic" super heroes we know and love were necessarily designed to fit into a large shared universe at their inception. They mostly existed in their own worlds. Super-hero stories have always been deeply character-driven and MMOS deeply world-driven so It's one of those things you have to parse out at your discretion. -
You know what? You really do have bad taste, Sam. XD
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Ancillaries are so far down The line, so archetype-specific, and so limited in application that they are barely relevant to the idea of expanding character themes, abilities, or concepts.
Ancillaries are more icing on the cake.
I'm talking about allowing for more creative freedom at the near-start of the game.
These aren't supposed to have anything to do with ancillaries and more based on the normal pool powers and their application. -
Quote:This is a big issue for me, the fact that I have to stand directly over everything as a traps/devices character pretty much flies in the face of every single archetype it's based on when it comes to direct combat. If every traps power and the mine powers from devices worked like caltrops and gave m a reticle, even with a short range, they'd be miles more useful and lose nothing. Just that alone would mean I could feasibly throw traps into active situations just by hanging back and not attacking. And being able to throw traps into active situations meant I wouldn't slow down a team as much. Really the biggest issue I have with traps and devices is having to either have stalker-level stealth/invis or solo to get goo use out of them.Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I've always wondered what Trip Mines would have been like if they were made into Stick Bombs, i.e. something that you throw at the ground, it sticks to it and THEN becomes a Trip Mine. The functionality of the power remains, in the sense that you can set traps with it just as you could previously, and indeed might even be enhanced since you might be able to stick them to walls and ceilings, but it adds an extra functionality as a semi-direct attack. I do recognise that this might make the power overpowered, though.
Then again, I was also convinced that making Assassin's Strike not suck when used out of hide would make it overpowered and that's evidently happening, and I'm sure someone at some point made the argument that Elude would be overpowered if it didn't make you "only affecting self." But like I said, I doubt that would be an easy sell. -
Just weapons? *Ahem*
The best way to do this.
1:Take every primary available, pick two powers from it, preferably a tier 1 and something "distinctive" about the powerset.
2:Pick a secondary that thematically "Matches" it, do the same.
3:Scale this new power pool similarly to current power pools, especially fighting for the melee/armor sets, in terms of damage, accuracy, recharge, end cost, debuffage, holdage, range e.t.c.
4: Make available right alongside the other power pools at level four
5: Make it so current primary/secondary choices exclude certain picks, particularly "Doubles" and things like claws with shields
7:???
8: profit -
That's pretty much Sam's (and mines) entire posting history, Leo.
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Quote:I was under the impression that the "Incarnate" content was, originally "Stuff to do post-fifty" content, certain people asked for "Epic" content, or maybe just a specific story, and the devs tied the, most often hated, frequently ignored "Origin of power" idea to it. Again, Don't most people actively ignroe and dislike the Origin of Power arc? Why, besides something usually ignored and disliked, I.E. the well, I.E. the "Inarnate" aspect of things,is the content unavailable and impossible to "human" characters?Originally Posted by Johnny_Butane
The Incarnate content is supposed to be designed for Incarnates, in other words, beings of godlike power. Citizens armed with rocks should never even enter into the picture. We should be operating on a grander stage than that larger than what we have been 1-50. We're NOT. Half way though the Incarnate system, it's the same old crap just with more cheating mechanics added.
The Incarnate content is where the line should be drawn. There the rest of the content may have to provide for heroes of varied powers levels, the Incarnate content should assume you're a demigod. If your character is Billy Street Level who's just a normal guy with a bat who fights muggers, don't send him on Ramiel's arc and have him become an Incarnate. If you don't think of your character as a demigod, you shouldn't be running the Incarnate content.
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It's a war story against a tyrannical dystopian dictatorship, that's all. The fact that it was tied after the fact to an oft-maligned background bit of lore is the problem, not that it fails to meet said bit of bad story-telling. Ignoring Ramiel(which you can do so long as one of your characters has run his arc, and gets the right amount of merits) is both easy, and honestly, recommended. -
Quote:Honestly I agree, and yet I also want to see more of certain ideas. Honestly, I also like my experience from 1-50 to be different so what would be good is just more storylines using existing groups at the appropriate levels. At the atlas park/Mercy level I should be able to pursue the Snakes, Longbow, Skulls, Hellions, Galaxy-city fallout, sewers vahz, clockwork or RIP storylines to the next zone level.... so basically just the original Origin contacts but better written.Originally Posted by Party_Kake
Now personally I think there are concepts that SHOULD end after specific level ranges. I thought it was awesome that the snakes just stop appearing after mercy island, with very rare appearances in port oakes. It's cool that you can say you helped completely destroy them, and that they only exist within a certain timeframe.
This game's "level range equals time" mechanic is very cool and it's one of the things I like most about leveling. You actually CAN get the message "Sorry, you took too long, someone else handled it or it never got done" or somesuch message. That's neat. I like that. And sometimes entire groups of baddies can be classified that way too.
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I really do think if they just replaced the rocks with psychic blasts or somesuch the intended idea would be lost. As it would more seem like the civvies were controlled by the seers and not acting on their own will. Thus negating the effects of the "Who is the real bad guy here?" edge.
On the other hand, making the civvies uber-sensitive and weak, and adding a "Don't hurt anybody" aspect might be derided as another "Gimmick" by the player base. Even though I LOVE the gimmicks, even when they're super-hard.
A nice compromise might just be to have the civvies be powerless, untargetable non-damage-dealing annoyances mixed in with IDF/Seers/PPD. So for every five civilians, have two "legitimate" threat enemies. Maybe have "Civilians" be the minion class of a mob type with Seers/PPD/IDF as lieutenants, bosses, e.t.c.
Then, you don't have the "B-b-but, my power fantasy!" aspect of getting hit with rocks, and the emotional impact of the normal people joining their evil government against you isn't lost. -
All that said, a "Trap" Mission like this, with nothing but turrets and spawning traps powers would be awesome.
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irrespective of the "Incarnate" nonsense, that's actually not a bad idea.
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Quote:I too await our "Bad Writing" primary Power Set.Originally Posted by Johnny_Butane
Bruce will never, ever be taken out by a rock to the head and have it stick. He's got something that's as good as Kryptonian-level resistance to damage; he's got plot armor. His batarangs will never miss their mark when it counts. He'll never get seriously tagged by a lucky bullet. Every tactic he pulls out of his butt will always work. He'll always shake off the mind control or poison or whatever. He's seldom wrong about anything and it's a blue moon he's ever caught with his pants down.
It's a common complaint that Superman is too powerful and nothing poses a danger to him. That applies to Batsauce as well. When his writing is at its worst, he's got a plan for whatever you throw at him and it will always work, even when it shouldn't. Bat Shark Repellant. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Wing_Leader
You might, but I don't. Not by any definition of "superhero" that I subscribe to. No character calling themselves a superhero, much less an Incarnate of the Gods, should ever be killable by a lucky, well-placed rock to the head.
The concept that the only way characters can exist is by constantly climbing to new levels of power up into infinity is an inherent, profound failure as well. The idea that I have to wait x-levels just to be able to fly, or breathe fire, goes against pretty much everything that's good about super-hero video gaming.Quote:The game engine, through a profound failure to understand its own genre conceits, allows such absurdities to occur, but that's Paragon's conception of my characters, not mine.
In good super-hero games, at best you'd get new flavors of what you could already do at level one, but all of what makes Spider-man or batman or the Hulk unique was available "out of the box" which is a phrase used in every critically acclaimed, popular, or GOOD super-hero game(except X-men legends but even then, once you get past the first two levels every new character you get comes that way) out right now.
The idea that your character is fundamentally changing, progressing through "increases" of power, and getting stronger, instead of just taking on progressively harder and different challenges, and overcoming them through ingenuity, teamwork, and luck, and the peculiarities of their particular powers(bringing your fire-flinging teamates to stop the Winter Lord, for example) has been ingrained in the mindset of the devs and the player base by virtue of the perceived "necessity" of a leveling system and narrative concepts in which to frame it. It's not a failure on the part of the devs that they can't make you feel godly with their creation. It's their fault that they made you think you could, however.
Gods have immense power to shape the world around them. Destroy anything and everything in their path, create new things. Be paralleled by none. That can't work where multiple people have to exist, multiple people have to play. And multiple people have to be equal. If I can't blow up the world, I'm a pretty crappy god. heck, I'm probably just a super-hero. I probably have to overcome my challenges via new and creative methods, or the power of friendship, or something like that. It's probably very inspiring and heroic when I do, too, because it seemed impossible, but I was able to do it anyway. It also is probably not cheapened by being part of a constant, Dragon Ball z-esque stupidly-powerful arms race where we just keep blowing up planets, reviving them, because that's the only possible way that might work in a persistent world, and blowing it up again.
The Problems you have with this game would not be solvable by a new engine, a new approach to story-telling, or anything other than making it a single-player game. Feel free to discuss it, I love theoretical debates(which is why I'm blathering on here right now XD). But that's all they can ever be, theory.Quote:My choices are to accept these failures with quiet resignation, or participate in community efforts to discuss them and perhaps affect change. Hopefully I'm not the only one who sees the merits of the latter over the former.
Considering this whole thread is about how the incarnate content fails to deliver, for numerous well-thought reasons, on the feeling of god-like power? Considering my characters can gain the alpha slot, and thus access to the trials and incarnate system without actually speaking to Prometheus and dealing with all that, and thus bypass the whole "favor of the well" foolishness?(so long as one of my characters has enough merits, and SOME of my character DO go that route) Considering the Trials as they stand are, on the surface, more about the war with Praetoria and less about weakening Marcus Cole in the eyes of the Well of the Furies to get it to love me and give me it's cookies and be my Pidgeon boyfriend? No, I'd say I'm good with my batmen characters doing the trials.Quote:Originally Posted by Lazarillo
I would note that the former set of characters probably are not doing Incarnate content, in that case.
Assuming those weaknesses mean so much to you, of course. -
I have characters that totally can be killed by a lucky, well-placed rock to the dome, and characters that can. They both have to be played in the same game so I don't freak out about such trivialities.
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Oh look, it's the stupid "Ma( or StJ)/WP scrappers realitically shouldn't be relevant in this game so obviously you have super-powers even if you say you don't" argument. tralala.
I'm not even emotionally invested in the trials or anything. I just find the assetion that my characters have ascended to "PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWER" just because I want to play the game hilarious.
my batman is batman.
My superman is superman
I don't let the game change them because
They both exist in a game that has a hard time properly representing either idea.
I figure out why stuff works for myself. -
Quote:TR said to get our requests in and I'd really like to second this or something similar. perhaps a "Swirling Lines" aura? In trail,not-trail, combat and combined(combat trail auras, anyone?) versions. My main, Mobilise, a Kinetic Melee brute is supposed to use his powers as big green glowing vector arrows(arrows being symbols to signify motion, and his powers being more "Kinetics in melee" than "Telekinetic melee") and although that's a very specific idea, A "Swirling lines/Streams of Energy" aura could see much use as Wind, energy, Sword Lines, speed lines, souls, streams of light, bullets just barely whizzing past you, whatever. Just think of the Wisp and Atomic Auras without the sphere and bulb of light parts and a different flight pattern.Originally Posted by Antoinette
Want this be available in Paragon Market!
I'll call it, Soul Path Aura!
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Quote:Seixsm is an inherent part of our culture. It's like English, heck many parts of English ARE sexist.Originally Posted by Dispari
What's interesting to me is that all the people saying that this is a sexist pack designed by perverts didn't know until now that it was, mostly, designed by a woman.
Male or female are equally capable of speaking English.
OR! OR!Quote:I'm split on "gender equality." I know how much work it takes to make costume parts. And the only actual options are:
A) Everyone gets the same costume parts, which means no more skirts/frill/lace or girly stuff.
B) Everyone gets the same costume parts, and then women get girly stuff, meaning men just get less costume parts period.
C) Everyone gets the same costume parts including girly stuff, so men get corsets and high heels that are a huge waste of developer time for incredibly narrow appeal.
D) Everyone gets close to the same stuff, but sometimes women just get girly stuff instead.
E: When men get something, women get the same thing, maybe with a bow or some frills on it(roughly speaking)It's about going in two opposite directions with a theme, not a hatred of frills, lace or whatnot.
no, it's really not. We've had the ability to run around near-naked since the launch of the game. Still. Not. The.Point.Quote:Also, the barbarian pack encourages men to run around nearly naked and I've already seen someone playing a shirtless cowboy stripper in-game. Not sure what bearing that has on anything but it's worth mentioning. -
Just putting up some ideas to see what people think
Swashbuckling: Dominators
An Assault Set for Dominators based around a Gun and a Sword used simultaneously. Like Sparkblade, a Musketeer, or many pirate characters. It'd use some of the Self-targeting tech seen in Vorpal Judgement. It'd also be the only currently existing set to use two different weapons, which rather exemplifies the fighting philosophy of Assault sets. If Sparkblade ever makes it in-game. He'd Definitely be an Electric Control/Swashbuckling Dominator.
This would fit nicely as a "Natural Origin" friendly option for Dominators.
For the self-targeted AoE idea: Whenever a character fired a normally targeted gun/ranged power, they'd also fire a low-damage, very small self-targeted melee cone attack with the sword. Think, swing the sword, then fire the gun. The same would occur with normally-targeted melee attacks, Attack with the sword, then fire an extremely small (think Dual Pistols: Piercing Rounds where you'd hit three people max, if that) close-range(think Dual Pistols Executioner's Shot) shot in a different direction from the one you're facing. The idea is using the two different weapons in tandem to attack and defend at the same time. Defending with the sword when using the gun, and taking out an enemy sneaking up on you with the gun while fighting one in front of you with the sword. Things like large pistols, sawed-off shotguns, and one-handed "Big Guns". And one-handed close-ranged swords like machetes, Daos, Sabers, Cutlasses, Ninjato and such.
Throwing Blades: Controllers and Dominators.
A natural-origin friendly primary for Controllers and dominators would be great for people who play these type of characters.This particular set would also be great for any character who wants to get more mileage out of what they can do with Controller/Dominator secondary sets by offering a non-powered alternative to the primary, allowing them to explore concepts with the secondary more in mind.("This character's main power is empathy, but if you push him, he will throw knives at you"). It would also make a very nice thematic match to Thorny Assault for doms, and present a nice "active" match to the "passive" nature of Traps. Finally, it gives this Natural-origin friendly option to Controlers and dominators without just being a mashup of devices, ninjitsu, Traps, and the craftable temporary powers.
Not only does batman, everyone associated with him, and many similar characters use such weaponry, but the core idea is used by characters like Daredevil's enemy Bullseye, every ninja-related character ever. Captain Boomerang of the Suicide squad Xena warrior Prince's Chakram, and even Captain America's shield lends itself to this idea.
It's an idea that only gets touched on briefly with the Weapons Mastery Ancillary for stalkers/scrappers and it's shuriken attacks, and the envenomed dagger crafted temp power.
The central concept of this powerset is hand-thrown, offensive weapons used less as weapons, and more as tools to control the battlefield from afar. Throwing the Boomerang/Shuriken at the head of an enemy for a stunning effect, at the feet for an immobilizing effect. Expertly ricocheting them off multiple enemies for a chaining stun/confuse/hold effect. Mixed in would be a few "gimmick" throwing weapons, similar to batman and company's specialty batarangs, some exploding flash-bang throwing weapons, sonic shrieking Whistler throwing weapons. Things like this.
The best customization for this would be allowing players to choose from a few different types of color-tintable throwing weapons(I have a bird-themed Gadget-using character who would LOVE to throw feather-like blades) via the "powers" UI as opposed to a "weapon" customization. options would include
- Shuriken
- Boomerangs(both modern and traditional)
- Discs
- Chakram
- Knives of various design
- Spikes
- darts.
It would be a Control Set that used an "optional" Mix of the combo Mechanics, the Ammo-swap mechanics, and the alternate animation mechanics.
Every Power would have two Animation-altering "swap" flags. "Dominant hand/Off Hand" and "Overhand/Underhand.
The idea here is transitioning from your strong hand to your off hand(throwing with your right, then left, e.t.c.) is more cumbersome, slows you down, and breaks "flow" Because you are using two different sets of "Specially treated" throwing blades that have different effects.
fighting tactically.
"On the other hand"(heh)
Going the "Over/Under" approach uses one hand, meaning you can attack more quickly and fluidly.
Fighting Directly
Upon Executing a power, the next two powers in a possible combo would be "orange Ringed" similar to Dual Blades,(alternatively, you receive a temporary combo building buff going in the direction of whichever chain you chose, similar to Street Justice's combo system) to indicate which paths to take next. Giving you two choices for the next attack in the chain, and thus the buffs you'd receive(if you want)
Going the "Offhand/Dominant hand" route to the completion of the combo gives you a temporary buff that grants a secondary damage type and a secondary debuff effect based on what the two powers are.
Going the "Overhand/Underhand" route allows your character to attack more smoothly, seamlessly transitioning from one attack to the next by having them animate not from a normal "Standing animation" but starting out where the previous attack left off
The only example using in-game animations that would help visualize this that I can think of at the moment:
After a Street Justice Character used Rib Cracker, then executed Shin Breaker, instead of returning the raised knee from Rib-Cracker's animation down to a standing position, they would drop right down into an alternate "Shin Breaking" animation.
So a sort of
RibCracker->Psuedo-Crane Stance for 1\2 second->Shin Breaker
transition
Thoughts, suggestions, and questions are welcome and encouraged. -
Just off the top of my head I'd say katana,Kinetic melee, or claws
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Quote:If I could add my two cents, I'd say it's the problems of trying to parse what was good about the Blade movies and the actual nature of the blade comics. The more supernatural aspects of Blade in the comics can clash with the Sci-fi aspects of the movies. The "caught between two worlds" aspect of the movies wasn't as big a deal int he comics until after the movies, either. They're just two different projects that people have been trying and failing to amalgamate as of late.Originally Posted by Noble Savage
A good point, and another good example. Blade surprised everyone with it's huge box office take, and I'd cite it as another case where the comic source material was muted a bit in order to make a very successful action/horror film.
The fascinating thing for me is that Marvel's tried to relaunch the Blade comic several times since then, and it hasn't worked out. I wonder why? Is there some fundamental reason why a vampire story can't work in print? I'd say no, so it must be something else. -
Quote:I am actually curious if there are any upcoming big-systems improvements that might be in the works..Originally Posted by Noble Savage
A slider like that ould be pretty hard to do. The reveal I alluded to is cool and different from what you'd expect, but it's not a system-wide overhaul. I think you guys will dig it.
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Quote:I was starting an "Archetype man/woman" character design concept when they created the archetype screenshots Specifically because I think they should stop hitting the "Random" button so often with their characters in promotional material. It had to take a backburner for a while. I should definitely start it up again when I'm more "settled"Originally Posted by BrandX
You know, I always took that more that whoever makes the "hero outfits" on these adds is just terrible at them.
I mean really, in a lot of the adds for the game, I've found the avatars created in them to be quite boring, plain, dull.
Now this isn't to say people don't look at my characters and think that way
But much like the "santa's little helper" comment, I find it just falls in line with "can't you make some better looking heroes/villains for use int he adds" -
Quote:My point was what argument was Brand X even making against the hypothetical "Perfect" game having those features? The implication was that having them would somehow detract from the perceived "perfection" of the hypothetical game somehow. It really had nothing, or very little, to do with the main argument here. So basically I agree with what you're saying, It just isn't what I was talking about in the quoted segment.Originally Posted by Chase_Arcanum
But that's the value of a market-based system. If we can SHOW that developing these assets pays for itself (and reasonable profit) then it makes sense to invest in expanding the dev team and making them available.
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Kinetic melee.
Dual Pistols.
Yes.