PositronBot

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Storm is -not- the best 1v1 mastermind build.

Storm is absolutely the best anti-Mastermind build, though. Virtually nothing in MMs really can deal with storm. Traps -could- place its -def away from the stormie, so that it doesn't get hurricaned. This does not really work in practice. Poison could weaken hurricane (and powerboost + weaken is very powerful) but even still it does not gimp the mass knockback, whch ruins your pets' dps and in the end storm wins the war.

I've never straight up -dueled- GV's necro/storm but I've fought against it in team matchups where the teams were roughly equal except for his necro/storm and my mercs/psn. The necro/storm completely dominated that match, even though I stayed on him and kept weaken on him pretty much the whole time. I just spent so much of my time knocked around or stunned by tornado that occasionally weaken would drop and I'd be -tohit janked for ever. The big thing that eventually happened is that my pet recharges eventually couldn't keep up with the necro/storm's dps and I died.

Regarding /pain MMs, they are invincible more or less if WoP is up and they have even competent slotting. Take out their minions with AoE if you can, or just ST burst them down. You want to try and get them down to 1-2 pets if you can. If you can do that, they'll be forced to run or phase. If this sounds too difficult, let me tell you - it is too difficult.

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Pain hardly ever gives me problems. They can't cause enough debuffs (-to hit, -fear, -slow) that other sets can. Sure they are a great healer, but if you strategize correctly, a /pain can be a cake walk. You just have to know which pets to take down first, and when to turn all your pets on the MM. For thugs, I take down the arsonist, then bruiser, then MM. I don't even worry about gang war anymore, they just don't do that much damage.

I posted this in another forum and haven't gotten much feedback, so i'm posting it here!

"I get one extra blast attack with ice/ but I get VS and SC with elec/ Seems VS would be somewhat helpful. Am I naive to think so? I would love to get PositronBot back in pvp again. Sentimental reasons, ya know? Though, I would have to do about 3-4 respecs to get the 30 HOs out of him. :S "

I already have these two at 50. I'm not gonna roll up another toon.

I get one extra blast attack with ice/ but I get VS and SC with elec/ Seems VS would be somewhat helpful. Am I naive to think so? I would love to get PositronBot back in pvp again. Sentimental reasons, ya know? Though, I would have to do about 3-4 respecs to get the 30 HOs out of him. :S

Anyone know Ra (hotty RA, etc). I've also teamed on occasion with Katfood. This may just turn into whoever posts the most number of times is the biggest celebrity, but I would like to call those two out.

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trying to get gun to send a toon to justice...i got some good fights lined up for him....but hes a bit stubborn hehe....

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didnt gunrock start on justice? or are you talking about someone else? i remember that name from since i6 sirens.

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yes he started on justice then his origan account was banned i think n he moved to freedom...sumthing like that

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What is an origan?

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lol, I can't believe you don't know!

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Only mastermind to give my necro/storm trouble so far was another necro/storm. I've fought a fair number of darks, poisons, and traps, although admittedly most of them weren't that great. Hurricane really messes pets up though if the MM doesn't have some kinda of aoe -defense though... so much so that I usually don't even have to heal my pets anymore.

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Ok that's what I figured. I didn't believe what these other guys were saying about "ANY SECONDARY AND PRIMARY IS OK LOL". That just isn't how pvp works.

Positronbot, you say you do fine with /dark and I'm sure you do. You are a good player I'm sure and you have more IOs on that /dark than I could ever imagine. And yet you got trounced by a /storm TROLLER. Not even a /storm MM who would have even more damage and offense than a troller.

So /storm trumps the other secondaries.

And I know damn well that every primary doesn't do fine against every other primary. Ninjas would get mowed down by bots or thugs, even though they are great against single targets, probably the best there is.


My guess would be thugs/storm or bots/storm would beat any other MM. Just not sure whether thugs or bots would be top.


I can't believe some of you are actually going to sit and say that anything works with anything against anything...


We are talking equal skill levels and sets here, just pure what pet/secondary trumps what, and YES SOME TRUMP OTHERS.

That is reality.

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In a sense, no thats not how pvp works. You're right. But also, a great pvp player can beat a mediocre pvp player even with a lesser build. I definitely think /storm is one of the better 1v1 secondaries for MM, as I said earlier. But it IS beatable by other MM with proper strategy. The first time I played the /storm troller, he beat me 5-0, second time, 2-0 (and no, I didnt just RUN more ). I learned from my mistakes and found ways to over come some of his -acc. Also, a trollers -acc from hurricane is greater than a MM. To say that a /storm MM would be much harder to beat than a /storm troller isn't quite true.

Also, to say Ninjas would get mowed down by bots or thugs is definitely inaccurate. Like I said, its how you play the set. I would be hard pressed to agree that one build is gonna trump another. Anything doesn't work against anything, but played well you can make a lot of MM sets very good at pvp.

ive also since played other storm trollers and defenders (i know, dont count) and have beat each one. I do think a ninja/storm or thug/storm or merc/storm would be a great pvp build though.

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I have a question for everyone keeping up with the thread.


What MM would be the best against all other MM's?

It seems like people like poisons pains and darks but can any of them keep up with the disruption from a /storm?

Seems like /storm MM would beat any other secondary MM if skill levels were equal just due to disruption?

Thoughts?

What primary usually tops other primaries in direct battle? Thugs or Bots?

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There, in truth, is no best.

Although there are powerful builds not all of them are invincible, and you will be trying to find a non-existant needle in a hay stack if you're truly seeking an "in vincible" MM build with which to fight other MMs.

I would suggest /Storm, /Poison, /Dark, /anything but FF

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I had a whole long paragraph typed out very similar to what Bookkeeper Jay is saying, but when I went to continue it said the forum was invalid or something, so I lost it all...but BK Jay sums it up very nicely. /pain has great heals, /poison has great debuffs, no self heal, /storm has great debuffs, no self heal, /dark has decent debuffs (also dark servant) and a great self/team heal. From the numbers it would seem /storm would be one of the better 1v1 builds because of all the KB and -acc but you lack a good self heal. I've beaten /pain, and /traps, and /poison (never fought a /storm MM) and according to the numbers, I should have been out matched, but it's not as simple as standing in BG mode and seeing who prevails. You have to know when to focus all your pets on specific pets of the MM and to risk getting out of BG mode. When I beat the thug/pain I had to take out the arsonist first, then the bruiser and only then I turned all my pets on the MM himself. And in a 10 min match I only beat him 1-0. If I would have stayed in BG mode the whole time I probably would have lost that one.


Primaries, again each prim has strengths and weaknesses and in the end it will boil down to who is the better pvp player.
So, just find a primary that interests you and a secondary that would be fun to play, and become good at it in pve, and that will/should help you a lot in pvp. When I first made my ninja/dark I had no intentions of pvp. I built him thinking ninja rely on defense, so /dark has the best -acc (storm wasn't a MM /sec yet) so they would go hand in hand. Also, ninjas like to go melee and stay together so the aoe heal works great for them. And dark servant and oni (3rd tier pet) both have holds so that helps out. After lvl'n him to 50 (not once pvp'n with him) i did a couple of respecs to find the best build and now he is one of my most favorite pvp characters.

Ya, i've been seriously thinking about it. Only thing holding me back, is my wife has a lvl 41 MM that I would like to get up to 50 first before I transfer. Though I could transfer both toons...idk.

Justice

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did it work?

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oddly enough, it did not. So I changed my post.

You know, I talked to Nadz_inc (fixmysink?) in game, and he actually said he's PL'n a dark MM up to 50 just to show me how pathetic the are. I kinda take that as the ultimate compliment. Someone going out of there way to make a MM the same as mine just to try and beat me, which in turn would show me just how powerful they really are.

*edit* and in case you need some advice on how to pvp with it, or how to slot it the same as mine, here ya Go.

I'm always down for a good match with another MM. I have yet to be beaten by one

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That I'm not sure. I have been thinking on frankslotting ninjas with proc and place a lot of debuff proc on powers,or build it for +def in melee.I haven''t think much on +rechg,don't see much benefit form it.

Whatever the change I will go mako PPP for sure and will lead it for more aggressive play style. Will be the second build for my MM.I got about 350mill.My idea is to make iether a die hard or faster killer MM.

Any opinion on what a solid PvP MM should be like?

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Sorry I haven't had much time to respond. I'm working Hero Planner to make a good build for you. I'll post it when I can.

Well, i pm'd castle. Hopefully I get a response

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This is my ninja/dark MM that I have right now( two purple set short). Notes, this is a PvE build, focus on end+/recv/Hp+, I know it need a lot of changes to be able to pvp.I agreed that mako power's are a lot better for ninjas. This MM is focus more on hold/controls.

The play style I develop in pvp is to hunt down squishy targets,mezz/hold then and kill then.Tank/scrapper always manage to run away(any suggestion?).


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Well, if a tanker/scrapper are gonna want to get away from in zone pvp, chances are, they probably will. I have tarpatch slotted for slows and unless my ninjas throw down caltrops Tarpatch doesn't really do much to stop a Super speeder. You could pick up the web nade from mace, but like I said, you aren't going to be able to completely stop them from getting away. Thats why I don't really like pvp'n in zones, too many times have I come close to killing a tank/scrapper and they just go running away, or better yet phaseshift. If you want to do a full respec on your guy to gear him up for pvp I can help you. I know my guy is spec'd strictly for pvp, but I still can solo all my missions on the hardest difficulty easily and the only thing that gives me problems are the occasional AV or GM. How much of a respec you want to do?

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I noticed that there are quite a few powers like that.

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Same here. There's a general rule that activation time = damage, but there are a few powers that go completely against that rule, for no logical reason. I think people have just learned to deal with the bs, and not ask why. Nothing really makes any sense in the first place.

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Well considering this is suppose to be one of /elec most powerful melee attacks, and it shows in the dom version, I just think it should do more damage than this. Total Focus has a 100% chance to stun, while this only has an 89% (i think) chance. Sure it does measly aoe dmg, and KB, but the dmg of the attack drops drastically. How often would AOE dmg even matter in pvp?

*edit* I just noticed you registered 4 days after me... kinda funny.

I must be doing something wrong here... i've been trying to figure out the drop rate on blue side for days now. I'm using a lvl 50 controller against two lvl 50 defenders. Averaging 60-70 kills per match and have been in 7-8 matches and have still not seen any pvp drops. Any ideas. This was also a controller that was slotted pre IO days. And i haven't since used him to collect any other IO receipes.

Fixed a bug that would stop a player from being able to observe an Arena match that was created in a different zone.

I don't know about you guys, but i've been waiting for this bug to be fixed since arena first came out.

I'm glad this has nothing to do with arena...

Some quick facts for a lvl 50 blaster

Havoc punch: Activation time: 1.5sec, Rech: 14.00 sec Avg Dmg: pve 144, pvp 174

Thunderstrike: Act time: 3.3sec, Rech: 20.00 sec Avg Dmg: pve: 165, pvp: 119

Now, lets look at Dominator:

Havoc Punch: Act time: 1.5 sec Rech 14.00 sec Avg Dmg: pve 108, pvp 148

Thunderstrike: Act time: 3.3 sec Rech 20.00 sec Avg Dmg: pve 124, pvp 252

If you look at Energy melee, when you show pvp effects of Total focus the avg dmg goes up considerably (due to cast time and rech time I assume). Somehow the avg dmg of Thunderstrike goes DOWN for the blaster only version for pvp.

Also, on a side note, what does 0.00%% chance for +100.00% DropToggles on target mean?

Um...so am I gonna lose my Pocket D tp'er?? I've become addicted now!

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I try to PvP with my ninja/dark MM but quit because every time I get stun by a tank/blaster or hold by a troller mean that i was goin to die for sure.

Haven't try PvP after the change of PvP mezz protection to resistant. I have a ninja/dark/Soul MM and will like to get him some of the pvp zone. Will post my build tomorrow.

How much impact you think that your sets bonus have on your success? Don't think my pocket is deep enough for those sets.

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I think the bonuses help. The plus recharge and plus accuracy are probably the most helpful. My slotting in health is also crucial. I hardly ever go down on end (unless i'm fighting a therm/elec corruptor). For your patron power pool, you might want to look at another for pvp. Mace or leviathan seem to have better results for pvp. Post your build and I can critique it for you.

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Questions:

Are Mercs any good with dark? (no, I will not play thugs. I hate the way they look. GOD I wish I could select mobster skins for them on the character design screen...)

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Mercs can be good with most sets. They have great long range and stay together which is good for your aoe heal from dark.

Go dark! Great debuffs and a great heal. Plus dark servant is nice!

I can afford that build by manipulating the market and buying low and selling high.

My ninja/dark was one of the easiest builds (besides fire/fire tank preburn nerf) that I took to 50. I ran all missions on the highest difficulty and solo'd a lot of the way. Very effective build! Now I pvp often with him with great success. If you want difficult you might go with something else.