Mighty_EU

Hmmmm, more I think about the more I'm getting fond of the idea of any inspiration based repel counter or resistance going to Sturdies and not Breakfrees .

It makes more sense conceptually and mechanically.
It would make for increased tactical choice of inspirations.
It would avoid Break Frees becoming even more of a complete counter and negator to some ATs and power sets.

Re-reading over the US PvP wishlist, it really is a good list with some decently realised suggestions and requests. It would be very positive to see these worked through, perhaps, as Castle might like to, in a general PvP assesment.

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Knockback IOs increase mag'? Just distance AFAIK.

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No they do, or at least I think they do.

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Crikey!

Knockback IOs increase mag'? Just distance AFAIK.

And doesn't the Vanguard accolade, like Meglomaniac only increase duration, not magnitude?

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I have never, ever been satisfied with IO sets being 'required'. That is far too much WOW to me.

I am well aware of the acrobatics giving buggedly high protection for years now. However the entire pvp has revolved around that fact since I4 so I cant even begin to imagine everything these changes affect.

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*No* IO pieces or sets are "required" Hammerfall. Acrobactics will give you KB protection to a point, if you would *like* extra or an alternative source of protection there is an *additional* source available.

I don't even know how you can purport to being dis-satisfied on about that because the whole IO system is clearly added with the intention that there is NO mandatory requirement to use them.

Why would you have a problem with PvP changing in anyway since 8 "issues" ago? What's the problem with adapting and evolving?

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However, Castle is having a look at KB sets increasing your KB protection.

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As in invention sets? Great....

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Well as far as my understanding was, Acrobatics KB protection was widely considered an issue for ages, giving far too much than it's original intention was.

I can't give you a source for this, I was told it quite some time ago somewhere here where I raised some suprise that Power Thrust was able to KB through my Elec Brutes Grounded. The info and feedback I had back was that Acrobatics wasnt's really an appropriate comparison as it was giving more KB protection than intended.

No on that basis, it's not really a nerf no? More a timely correction lol.

Also, right, well if you're not happy that you could use about 2 enhancement slots to IO build the sameish KB protection that acro will offer and thus be able to free up a power choice not sure what will be satisfying for you tbh.

It's not like the KB pieces are hard to come by. I must be swimming in low level pieces from various alts just getting them off missions.

Kins are overpowered in PvP? huh?

Hmmm probably my /Kin Corruptor. I find it hard with the heal sometimes because often my target skips off out of range, and a good Blaster often spikes right over the short downtime if I do land it. It's a great fun toon tho' and as well as giving SB, ID buffs etc I see my role as being a real annoyance factor, Siphoning a target, draining it and webbing it down with the Mace etc which makes things tough on them and sets them up for my team mates to kill. Fighting melee toons on it is pretty cool fun .

With little or nothing else defensively to stack with, a defensive choice like Weave might not give a great surviveability payoff.


Vines has a worthwhile place. Even if you don't choose it however there's still better mitigation powers in the primary that could work better than Weave.

Big grats .

Ah yep, hadn't thought of that.

Edit: The mental blast animation/defiance.

Psionic Dart, I don't know. Like the Flares of Psi' lol . I can see it going in there tho...

Looks a likely list though, although maybe some of the ordering would be different. I think Mental Blast would be animated as is though?

Psychic Sream would normally be expected in a Psi Blast primary right?

With it's inclusion in /Mental Manipulation is it right to assume it's not going to be in the Psi primary, and that Subdue now wouldn't be either?

What might make up the two possible vacancies? I guess Aim would be the most likely candidate? And is it likely to assume that he expected TK Blast, Will Domination etc are staying in?

Just some wild speculation points I guess I'm looking forward to finding out about .

Er?...

I'm guessing Aim for Elec tbh if it gets any self buff thing.
Can't see BU at all, and PB doesn't seem to make an appearance in Electrical sets afaik so considering the portyness origins I don't see it going in. But then again, who knows huh?

Nice going Spawnus .

Me and Raz started a run at it tonight, but it's taken every ounce of self control to not fill the technical section with profanity ridden expletives about the lag and mapserver DCs we both got that ruined and cut short the experience very abruptly . Something to have a pop at another time .

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...can we just tone down the doom mongering?

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What's to tone down? Bar a couple of erratic posts that go a little off the deep end, generally most of what I've seen is more in the way of "Hold on... has anyone considered what this power is capable of with these buff/debuff values versus it's counterpart iteration and buff/debuff values" or beyond purely limited to syncing within the profliferated sets what happens when they start getting synced with existing sets and pools?

On the whole, I don't see anything that's beyond the normal realms of speculation and discussion that comes with any other issue and forthcoming features. On the whole of course. I thinks there's a place for informed concern over knee jerk theatrics. But really I don't see why these concerns are anymore inappropriate than speculations that came about what zones are or are not forthcoming, how VEATs will play out, and I don't see those threads stamped with "stop the speculation" refutes, nor do I think that any of the discussion has escalated to the level thats happening in places on the US boards where a lot of rattle throwing and declarations of leaving are getting made . I've not seen anything either in the concerns of balance questions that's come close to "the devs are stupid for not giving X power X" either so I don't see what the issue is here over those instances other than the ease of jumping to an easy rebuttal.

Isn't most of this discussion arisen from the fact that most people are passionate about wanting a complete product in all it's aspects? No problem there IMO whichever the stance or viewpoint.

Power Proliferation aside, I'm getting confused as to all the claims that Hero/Villain PvP is remotely balanced in the first place as to my understanding it's extremely common knowledge that it certainly isn't. US side for example, didn't all the PvPing villains give up and make hero toons etc instead, giving rise to the almost exclusively Hero/Hero PvP thats in praticised by the generally most active PvPers in the community and via arena?
Surely when that's the case, something somewhere is wrong?

Are there even more than a couple or so active and successful arenaing villain teams in the EU servers?

Just an observation like I say that I find in the current discussions that seems contradictory to nearly all playerbase experience to this point, and I can't remember there being any game changing reason for any recent shift otherwise . I'm doubtful that the poliferation will help much in light of the more enlightened and explanatory theories that some have offered beyond the other simple rebuttals that are offered with little reciprocated reasoning.

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Another thing I'm wondering is, what secondary powerset do you think Blasters will get? I've heard a few people saying Psionic Manipulation, and I doubt this greatly, simply because they'd have to introduce new powers. I'm thinking either some form of Dark Manipulation or Earth Manipulation, perhaps even Thorny Manipulation.

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Suppose I was very wrong indeed here, makes me wonder what Mental Manipulation will consist of...

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From Lighthouse:

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As a reminder of the scope of Powerset Proliferation, it was to port existing powersets, not to create new ones. While some people consider the Blaster Psi secondary to be a new one, it's not - it's pretty much Dom Psi moved over (with balance tweaking).

EDIT: and it's not as crazy as some are making it out to be. Please wait to see it in beta before you go off the deep end, thanks!

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Thanks to Harv for passing it on.

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IMO it's always seemed fairly well accepted that Villains got the short end of the stick with patron pools compared to epics.

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I think this is the real source of the problem TBH. Epics/Patrons. And in this case the problem with the strength of some Epic powers over just about anything the villains can access means a few powersets that were favourable to villains, and some which at least to some part went a bit towards balancing things, mostly in team battles, are now coughed up to heroes and will undoubtedly have fare even better fpr the heroes by way of the better stats for buff/debuff values and such. They certainly will sync extremely well with some specific Hero Epic powers. I do think the general concerns raised have been done in a much better way in the other thread about the new sets though.

Bleh, just realised my deadly bout of vicious man flu is wrecking any coherence I might have had even in small doses, so I'm off now...

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Sorry.
I was being sarcastic. Just my way of pointing out how heroes seem to be winning out of this big time pvp wise, and generaly agreeing with you. NM, should be pretty balanced when we get archery villain side and heroes get poison.

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This .

Course it comes as no suprise that otherwise an inflammatory opening post ends up getting inflammatory replies, but it's nice to see at least a couple of good posts somewhere.

*Everyone* will have to wait and see how balanced anything is from these 1st proliferations.

I don't know why you *wouldn't* go Tri-Form with a WS .

I spose if you want something that is only 1/2 good .

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I think if they are matching powersets thematically then illusion and dark would go well together. With electric... would it be possible to cobble together an electric primary out of all the different powers that are out there ?

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I'd have thought so for sure. Animations for ST and AOE holds are around I guess too. Tesla Cage OFC and so on. I'd have thought you could just about scrape together enough for a primary and an Elec' Assault secondary really. With the work really being limited to balance etc.

I think it'd make for a really "Dominator" flavoured set surely too.

Of course, being a villain, I'm bitter as hell about controllers getting Plant Control.

I wonder if Dominators are pencilled in to receive something. We're pretty short changed on range of choice anyway.

I'm guessing Earth is very likely. But I'm kind of secretly hoping for Illusion, very much like Malaise's set on the RSF. PA looks so much better in black .

I got an En/Kin at 50. It's good fun. The AOEs in Corruptor Energy Blasts aren't all that at all IMO, so mine is single target built so also I only KB single targets if I KB anything.

Fulcrum, Nova, Transference is WIN .

PvP wise, seems great one on one and very nice indeed against melee characters which you can just stand toe to toe with.
Kin's tricky with a targetted heal and it seems easy to get into trouble if you get jumped. And OFC if you miss it, or bounce out of it's field of effect then that's normally defeat time.
I took Black Scorpion on mine, for the Mace for a lot of -movement and -recharge. It plays nicely in RV.
Team wise it seems very much a buff bot keeping everyone ID'd etc. I think I did that mostly and made a pain in the [censored] of myself webbing, siphoning and spamming transference as harrasment.

This thread is weird.

Trying to get something PvP going is always a great idea and always welcomed by all and respected nps.

But there's some strange conditions to this one that aren't gonna work and tbh weren't even part of any "old skool" PvP either and regardless of that are going to make things borked so much either people won't join in, or will try and get some really wrong ideas and perma give up.

Got to be said that it really does say something crystal clear about the PvP mechanics in CoX that it takes so effing long every time to simply get a battle going.

It's not the players fault but it's just crazy that it takes weeks and months to settle on what's going to work in any event. I think that's why so many just give up tbh. Kudos for trying and sticking with it tho .

If you go traps you could do worse than asking Maelwys for his basically limitless awesome knowledge on Bots/Traps in PvP and PvE .