Leo_G

Well technically, all they have to do is add the same 'true undead' tag that the current true undead have and change the name or description of Ghost Slaying Axe to facilitate why it's doing extra damage (because now, this axe is super-charged to splice zombies, disrupt the mystical energies of demons, disperse darkness, etc.)

I think it's been a long time coming to revamp a lot of the enemies anyway (their HP, resistances, 'extras' and stuff). They could take the shortcut above, or actually differentiate between demons, science vampires, magic vampires, robots and stuff. Would be nice if electrical attacks actually *did* something vs robots that energy blast doesn't (only one example)...

Wouldn't it be simpler to just make the axe auto-hit and just give the power a % chance to do nothing? Although I actually like using the Axe on characters who can buff or debuff so it improves the attack's chances.

I'd personally rather the 'slayer' part just work vs more enemy types. Demons, monsters, ghosts, zombies, nictus...just rename the weapon to something else like 'Dark Slayer Axe' or something.

Yes. Check out the thread The Single Most Damaging Attack.

What is numerically, the most damaging attack in the game? A 'Double Assassin's Strike' at the damage cap (according to the numbers). It is also discussed exactly what causes the double crit. I, myself, have noticed my stalkers doing this on occasion. It's really noticeable. On the bosses that usually you can only take down to around 1/2 HP with a BU>AS, all of a sudden get taken down to around 10% instead.

No. Only Single Target attacks get the AoE taunt added. For AoEs or Cones, Gauntlet simply allows you to taunt whatever you hit.

Link.



Thunderstrike does not summon anything, it is a Targeted AoE you cast on a target just like Explosive Blast or Fault. If it *did* summon something, it would not be able to do critical damage at all.

To see how Thunderstrike works, look at Explosive blast. EB does smashing and energy damage to the target and all foes within 10ft of that target with a chance to KB all of those targets 50% of the time. TS does smashing damage to *only* the target and energy damage to all foes within 8ft of the target (the target included) plus an 80% chance to KD and a 50% chance to stun the target.

The easiest way to describe it is TS is 2 attacks, a smashing damage ST attack that stuns plus a targeted AoE energy damage attack with KD. The rules of Hide still applies so the ST part will always crit from hide while the AoE will only have a 50% chance on everything.

And just to state: I *do* have an Elec/Regen stalker sitting at lvl 46 and I use TS often on him. It's not a trick, fluke or bug. TS *will* crit on the target you choose 100% from hide while the rest around that target won't always crit. If you're truly skeptical, try making an Elec Stalker and trying it for yourself. And honestly, I think every Stalker fan should have at least 1 Elec Melee Stalker ^_^

Kind of already true. We currently do have a chance for double crits from hide, you just have to stack placate with it I believe. It's not particularly useful for regular crits but it's kinda nice when used for AS.

Would probably have to change the dynamics of some of those powers but, currently, Thunder Strike *does* have a guaranteed critical on the target you aim it at. This is true because TS is a ST attack that does smashing damage with energy splash damage. So for this to be true for every multi-target attack, they'd need to be multi-layered which I'm not sure is possible for cones.

It was the only reason I clicked on the topic.

I am disappointed tho. I was expecting pictures.

Yes, my fists cry tears of blood from the hundreds of faceless squads of Longbow I'm forced to destroy because they can't TAKE A HINT!

But definitely wouldn't mind pummeling these jokers if they were only lvl 25-40 or some such...not lvl 1-50

This! Somebody kill her

If you hold a sword behind you like that while you're idle, you'll slice your own legs off or twist your wrist bringing it back infront of you fast enough. The stance is illogical and (IMO) retarded-looking.

It'd depend what the buff is, really. But one point I'd address with a 'kill = buff' thought is it wouldn't self-stack with a single activation. That is, killing a mass of minions with your dmg capped Throw Spines wouldn't net you a buff per minion, but instead 1 buff for the activation of the power. This is so AoE isn't more beneficial than ST.

As for the 'not helping teamed stalker', it depends how you look at it. Demoralize is meant to make taking down hard bosses safer and benefits the team while a kill-buff is meant to help you kill weaker targets faster. They aren't there to make you do everything better, just one or the other.

But the reason I'd side with a kill-buff over a kill-rehide is because it doesn't benefit either defense or resistance or healing over the others while still maintaining a flow (especially if that buff was 'burst damage' focused).

I recall there being a bug with Dull Pain a long while back. I didn't have any experience with it (as I didn't make a /Regen stalker until after Elec melee was introduced and this was before that) but I remember, if you had DP activated, that Hide wouldn't suppress unless you took a certain amount of damage...I can't recall the specifics, but I'd look to that bug as a possible mechanic to build on.

If taking a certain amount of damage suppressed Hide, this would mean resistance sets could be struck several times before Hide would break while, for sets that relied on defense, would feel Hide vanish with only 1 hit.

Pie-in-the-sky thought but: would be kind of interesting if the amount of damage dictated the duration to unsuppress. So taking the full attack = 8sec Hide timer, taking 10% less shaves off 2sec, taking 30% less shaves off another 2 sec and taking the max 75% of the attack shaves off another 2 sec. Probably not possible but I haven't really put much thought into it...maybe relying on maximum HP vs the attack or just a threshold of damage taken being the result (meaning weaker attacks suppress hide less)...

It was a sarcastic suggestion mainly because it has been suggested before by others (I believe) along with its variants 'critical hits giving a chance to rehide you' and 'breaking LoS rehides you'. But also partially because the AT already has a decent few bells-and-whistles to work with and don't really need extra.

But I'd personally just cut out the middle man and drop the rehide part for just 'defeating enemies buffs you'. That's what you're there for, after all...to defeat targets quickly so doing so could be an advantage to you. And it's unique since there is no character in-game that does this yet Castle expressed the possibility of such a mechanic as workable in the past.

I don't think there is a way to increase duration of a buff or debuff. Nothing in the game can and not even the purple patch (basically the resistances level gaps provide) has no bearing on duration. A buff/debuff will always last x amount of time no matter the level or slotting. I don't even think suppressing effects, outside of mezzes, can have their timer adjusted so reducing rehide time depending on slotting, teammates present, enemies present or any other thing like that isn't possible with the mechanics presented by the devs.

But you never know, Castle or Posi might have some stuff in their back pockets that might do something similar.

Well, then we're at an impasse. You say we should be re-hiding, and I say we should be fighting. If we're going to be relying on getting hidden again, it should result from fighting, not running or ducking for cover. No one else has to jump through such hoops for their inherent to work. Currently, we don't *need* to hide to get anything done and you're *rewarded* for jumping into the fray.

The devs gave us +crit chance for allies within 30ft radius. This tells me, they want us to fight, not hide.

Just to share some wisdom, you don't have to wait 8sec + AS's cast time, you can simply wait 5-6sec (depending on what AS you're using). If you time it right (it takes practice), AS will land just as you revert to hidden status. You can also throw BU into the mix since using it doesn't reset Hide's timer and it takes around 1 1/2 sec to use...Basically cuts that down to around 4sec of 'sitting on your hands'.

Still, that's not optimal but it's got it's place, IMO. That's exactly what my EM/EA stalker and (to a lesser extent) my DM/WP stalkers do sometimes. He'll use stun on one target, ET > Bone Smasher on another (usually resulting in a stunned boss or something), hold for a few seconds, hit BU then queue up AS = dead boss, TF = dead Lt, another Bone Smasher and Stun, placate > AS.

Again, it's not optimal, but the enemies will usually stay demoralized, which is a boon for the team (and myself).

I suppose it depends what you want to accomplish. Are you simply aiming to defeat foes quickly? Then DPS will trump any gimmick you try to formulate. That's what it's there for (max DPS), to be the most efficient 'damage'.

The only way burst damage or some gimmick aimed toward it would outpace min/maxed DPS is if the enemy was very durable for some portions of the fight (had their Shield up or something) and very vulnerable at specific times momentarily. It will always be more useful to stand up and fight fight fight unless you had a 'golden gun' attack which IMO, no one should have...and even then, you're better off trying to exploit it in an DPS chain.

That said, if we're trying to accomplish something else besides just killing things as quickly and efficiently as possible, then sure. For my EM/EA Stalker, his damage might not be efficient, but he's pumping out lots of mez and demoralize with his damage. He's not trying to be efficient for damage but efficient for something else...get where I'm going with that?


The 'duh' answer here, Sam, is to stop waiting to re-hide then. Hidden isn't there to encourage you to not participate in fights but to encourage you to get the drop on your enemy. Hide + AS is only *part* of the AT's inherent. You've still got high(er) crit chance on your attacks + the means to boost that with allies in range.

Please stop pointing at Hide as the sole part of the AT. There's a lot more going on under the hood.

You know what? If you're so adamant about re-hiding, how about getting that...by fighting? Like Brutes and their Fury, Doms and their Domination, Blasters and their Defiance...

Kill a target = You're hidden again. I'd love it. Slap that in and ship it out. Solve the whole demoralize-not-procing issue too since, if you 1-shot something with AS, you're still hidden to strike again. The enemies would still know you're there but you can pop another shot off...possibly killing another to put you in hide again...

Just to put things in perspective, in your early Stalker career, you did a lot of ASing because it is your most accurate attack, and it can outright *kill* bosses of your level range because their HP scale is still low. Honestly, it's probably a issue the devs would try to solve (1-shotting bosses early on) but they figure the results are dismissable (like the possible Double-Assassin's Strike we can pull off on rare occasions).

But even then, in the early levels of my Stalker, I try not to use it as a crutch if only so once my AS doesn't 1-shot bosses, I'm not left feeling like a deer caught in headlights.

To tell you the truth, I haven't even read the idea. I just skimmed over it. The inverse-Fury and AoE-ish placate are ideas that have been suggested before, and while interesting mechanics that I'd like to see added to certain sets to give them a unique feel, it's probably forcing a playstyle too much. I've seen suggestions made before (like an advantage/disadvantage system) that people complained it was too complicated and, believe it or not, put forth the reason that 'even if it's optional, I'll be missing out because I don't feel like number crunching'.

I'm not putting down your idea (I enjoy reading new stuff so I guess I'll go back and read) but in the era of 'Stalkers need a change' a few issues back, I put for a lot of ideas (one being the inverse-fury mechanic similar to what you posted) and it was pointed out, most notably by Angry_Citizen, that they were just complicated kludge-work. It was annoying hearing that told to me but after playing the AT more, I've come to understand what he meant.

It's not that the AT would be worse off with some of what's suggested, but no other AT is that difficult to pick up and play with mixed and matched variables that could change suddenly...not even Masterminds.

Get the devs to implement scythe melee, bo staff and other 2-handed weapon sets, and I might thank you.

...or I might just be a ****** and take the credit for myself.

You do realize how useless relying on breaking line of sight is, right? At least for what you're wanting it to be. Using LoS to heard foes together for AoE carnage? Useful, certainly. Using LoS to just disappear for a crit on one target that will just as sooner alert the guys rushing to that same point?

It'd be different if this was Metal Gear Solid or Splinter Cell, but this isn't those games, it's City of Heroes. You'd have to completely alter the dynamics of the game in a way that AoE isn't as attractive as it is in favor of ambush tactics. I severely doubt the devs would be dumb enough to do that. It'd basically amount to upgrading all foes to big bags of HP that would need headshots to take out, spreading them out so they aren't huddled waiting to be nuked yet patrolling for loud intruders, and making them deadly enough to decimate players if you tried hearding them en mass.

As is, pushing Stalkers into such tactics to get whatever benefit you feel they lack is just putting the whole AT up as laughing stocks for the rest of the player base to shun moreso than they already do. It's not a smart decision. Oh, it would be great if the right changes (see, changes to the 'system' so that aggro, enemy AI and the general tactical direction of battles) were made in favor of ambushes...for Stalkers...but that won't happen.

I'd suggest putting that vision of Tom Clancy's Stalker to bed and visit the drawing board again. Not that it's a bad vision, just not viable in this game...And there are plenty of other possible 'visions' of what a Stalker could be capable of too.

I guess it would depend. If you're looking at Fire Armor, losing blazing aura, while it does add great amounts of sustained damage over the course of a mission, is honestly very crappy damage over the life-span of a target. How long do you engage a target on a Stalker anyway? Most likely, you're looking to bust through its HP very very fast, and thanks to Fiery Embrace, Build up and hidden critical/placate critical, that target will probably be dead far faster than the several tics it'd take for BA to be useful. Not to mention, it will interfere with placate because I don't believe that puts you in a real hidden state and therefore suppresses the aura resulting in you wasting your crit chance. In short, Burning Aura does more damage than anything else *if* you're adding up every tic it does over the course of a mission, not over a single engagement.

For Fire Melee, there are 2 versions; Tanker and Brute/Scrapper. The Brute/Scrap version has 2 AoEs while the Tanker version has 3 (the extra being Combustion in exchange for the high ST attack Cremate). Honestly, I'd prefer a Stalker version that basically uses the Brute/Scrap version but removes Incinerate for AS instead. Yeah, it's the highest damage attack after GFS, but it's a pure DoT attack over around 5 seconds which works a bit counter to placate. The only other pure DoT attack Stalkers get is Barb Swipe which is more a weak DoT over 2 seconds with a chance of more toxic DoT for 2 seconds after...

Yeah, in short, Stalker Fire Melee = Scorch, Fire Sword, Cremate, Assassin's Blaze, Build Up, Placate, Breath of Fire, Fire Sword Circle, Greater Fire Sword. Keeps the AoE, gets rid of a high powered DoT attack for a higher powered burst attack, and makes sense for the AT's style. If Incinerate must be in the set, take the Tanker version and exchange Combustion for AS. Basically, we're choosing between Incinerate and Cremate.

Of course there's the other option of taking the Brute/Scrap version and replacing either FSC or BoF for AS, but I'm just saying there are other options to look at and is probably why we don't have the fire set now because it'd take more consideration than the easy ports we've gotten so far.



I personally like to just look at what we have, AT mods aside: We have a higher base crit chance than Scrappers, nearby teammates increase it even more to over 3x what Scrappers get, 2 means of extra crits, a means to stop a target from attacking you for 20sec up to and including many AV level critters, perfect invisibility from level 1 and the most powerful single target attack per cast in the game that does a huge range AoE debuff that is not resistable with a chance of boss-lvl fear.

Consider what competing ATs get:
Brutes = really powerful damage buff from Fury, taunting attacks
Scrappers = 5% crit on minions and 10% on everything else
Blasters = Able to attack while mezzed, small stacking damage buff on every attack, 2 powersets of attacks

That said, it's not like we don't get a lot...we do. And while some of those tools can be rough around the edges due to AI reasons, there's honestly nothing wrong with the AT if you really want to leverage its strengths. The main difference I see is the powers available to the AT. Honestly, if Stalkers had the exact same powers as Scrappers had, Scrappers would barely compete...

...now add on a slew of buffs to make Stalkers the ST kings and then Scrappers are left in the dust. Blasters, Brutes, Scrappers, Stalkers and Doms are competing for the same role and I feel we already have the tools to compete with Stalkers. Just need the powers to apply those tools with and we'll be more than fine...

What is 'playing like a scrapper' anyway? Running in and hitting things in melee range?

While I'd *love* for Stalkers to have a hugely unique style of combat that relied on many tactics and skill (it actually does have more style and tactics than similar melee ATs which is why Stalkers will always have a place in my character lists), you have to keep it simple for the non-uber players. If a Scrapper is just a melee that runs in and fights in melee range, I would hardly say that's impossible for a Stalker or even a Blaster.

So, I'd love the AT to become more complex to facilitate more and unique tactics in battle, but it'd be like requesting a unique mechanic of making ranged combat for Blasters more complicated. There's no purpose and would only push away new players.

But perhaps I'm just confused at what 'playing like a Scrapper' means...

Not that doing that really matters...

A better metric is 'how fast' or 'in how many hits' does it take anyone to do the same. If a Scrapper, Brute or Blaster aren't destroying a -10 Fake Nemesis in 2 sec or in 1-3 shots, I wouldn't really be expecting Stalker to either.

But you want to know a viable and reasonable request to improve the AT? Proliferation.

Because it seems all the complaining about AoE damage or sub-par 'scrapping' is coming from the perspective of min/maxed characters. That their Elec/Nin Stalker can't out-do a FM/SD Brute or a Spines/Fire Scrapper. Well, considering you're comparing a utility/mitigation mix set vs a pure offense mix, it's to be expected in some situations...

You want more offensive/AoE focused Stalkers? Ask for offensive/AoE focused sets. Ask for Fire Melee, ask for Fiery Embrace and Super Strength.

There's a reason I'm always interested in new and impressive sets for Stalkers, for a revised version of Shield Defense and an aggressive version of Ice melee or discussing possible new sets that might work for the AT rather than squeezed in. Because those sets would *really* leverage the position Stalkers are in. You couldn't complain about AoE if you've got Elec, Fire, Ice, Spines and Dual Blades, or lower damage when you've got Fire Armor and a version Shields that meshes with the AT.

It was the same with that Greedo episode.

Announcer guy: "You remember Greedo? Yeah, I knew you'd like that."

Me: STFU! Who gives a damn about that guy!

Announcer guy: "What about Darth Maul? Take a look at this guy."

Me: Again, who gives a ****!? *Darth Maul* was cool because he was unique. I don't really give a flying **** about this poser >_>

It would have been 'plainly cool' if they just did more explanation of the Nightsisters or other various force-user lore rather than 'sell-out interesting' by diluting established characters with 'meh' extra fluff...I'm just interested in more talk of what the dark side is and other Sith lore....

-Sigh- at least they're not cloning Maul again or something stupid.

I actually find this thread so far hilarious. This is one point: that aggro isn't an issue.

Well duh, Castle isn't saying grabbing aggro is the issue. The issue is shared aggro suppressing hide (that is, a foe seeing you before you aggro and using a ST attack to knock off hide). People aren't complaining about that? Have you read those other stalker suggestion threads? Did I *not* have to go on through dozens of posts reasoning how to leverage AS when on a team with enemies attacking? Or getting the jump on using said attack?

There *are* people complaining they can't AS and one of the reasons they can't, which isn't something they can solve themselves (without building for capped defense), is that aggro. The other reason is 'the enemies die too fast' which is bollocks and can be solved by two words.

The reason you people are so pissed is because you're shortsighted and don't know the ramifications of anything you're suggesting. You only know what *you* want, not what the AT *needs*. You forego looking to base performance and just see what those capped massive recharge Brutes/Scrappers do and simply ignore the mass of deaths it took to get there. You glance over how weak Dark melee's and Martial Arts' AoE damage is and just see the AT itself as low AoE...yeah, forget Dual Blades, Spines, Electrical Melee, Kinetic Melee and all those other sets with good AoE attacks.

It was like I said, there's nothing wrong with Stalkers, they perform competitively and that's called balance. Those eager for more AoEs should be requesting that from proliferation. You'd sound a lot more reasonable and a lot less b****y.

As opposed to not discussing it. If the suggestion is so ridiculous to be considered a joke, then you can simply post nothing. And since the OP had already indicated the suggestion wasn't a joke, I'd say it's viable to bring up the limitations, yeah, but only to bring perspective. I don't think the devs illicitly shot down more models/skeletons (I think it was even brought up in one of the surveys when you deactivate your account or maybe one of the Art threads), but it was commented how much work it'd be.

Not much else other than small talk? Right, I think there's plenty....like application (beast mastermind?), possible implementation (start out with just NPCs and branch out the animations over time or stances perhaps), complications (all 4-leggers don't walk/run the same, etc.). Is it no one bothers to delve into a subject because they're too lazy? Maybe an oversight? Or perhaps they just take the easiest shots at it, like using 'furry' remarks or something...>_>

Then the obvious question is, why are we even discussing that? Animal/cat model = unisex

Honestly, I simply ignore all those other 'things' that people perceive and hope the devs do too. Players will create a powerset combo on a Scrapper or Brute, build it up, cover over its weaknesses and generally pimp it out then create a new Blaster or Stalker and be all 'What the hell!?'.

They fail to acknowledge the differences, advantages and disadvantages the AT/powerset has nor the build they used to overcome those disadvantages more often than not. This skews their perception of what's actually going on, like in your example above. Apparently you're not seeing the whole story and/or choosing to gloss over much of it to come to your conclusion. That's all well and good to form an opinion, but assure that you realize that it is just that: an *opinion*.


Lovely. I play various other ATs in tandem. That is, I don't focus on playing one then switch gears to another...and my experience is counter to yours. So what? It's just my opinion. You don't have to acknowledge it at all if you don't want.

That said, I'm not going to go point for point on what a Stalker can do...you should know (if you bother varying the way you approach fights, that is). Can my Claws/EA Brute find that Ring Mistress and destroy it before it destroys my defense, debuffs my recovery and proceeds to blast me to kingdom come with psi damage? Not reliably. But pretty much all my Stalkers can. What about that Dark Illusionist? Or that Sapper *and* Gunslinger? Or if I just want to skip an annoying spawn all together...Those are things that *can* be built toward but the Stalker can do it right off the bat. What can't a Stalker do? Tank? AoE damage? Have high survivability? My Spines/DA stalker can do all of those and he's only in the lvl 40s with only 3/4 his build done.

But just because I can do things on my Spines/DA stalker that I can't on my MA/SD Scrapper (he's amazingly damaging and bursty but has trouble surviving without inpsirations) doesn't mean there's something *wrong* with either AT. They're suppose to be competitive without one outperforming others. That you think drastic changes are required belies your experience with the AT as plain as day.


It does but DA is not the set that functions at its peak by shying away from aggro. It's a bit different from Energy Aura in that, as an EA character your goal is to suppress aggro so you get hit less where as DA nullifies it. The obvious difference is, suppressed aggro means higher chance for the enemy have 0 chance to hit you (because he's not hitting you) vs stopping it under specific conditions (if your mez mag overcomes the enemy). You're not relying on gaining no aggro as a DA character...you can, I guess, but that sorta makes Stalker DA better since you're not leveraging that extra AoE dmg that comes with the other ATs.


Oy, sometimes your ignorance annoys even me.

But just to make a point, I've been on missions where the setting was too high and we had wipe after wipe. Even if you're joining a team to 'kill' for 'expeees', there's times where circumvention is a good option. When the defender or corruptor has to leave in the middle of a mission and all of a sudden we're getting slaughtered? That Warshade with stealth and team recall to keep the ball rolling is nice. Of course there's other options, like resetting the mission or just dropping it, but the sign of a good game is having these options.

The option to fulfill goals differently, the option to approach fights differently, the option to play ATs that feel/play differently...so on and so forth.