Issen
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I'll say that defensively, Beast is fine, it's the middle ground between Ninjas (who have NO resistance and good defense) and Demons (who have INSANE resistances but meh defense)
Offensively...well, Demons have all the damage types and -Res, and Ninjas have essentially an limitless attack chain. Beast right now feels like Mercs. They burn their attacks against a single target, then wait. Which is bad for a melee Primary. They really should have more uses of attacks, or perhaps better attacks added in so there's none of these multi-second gaps.
They don't have to Ninjas who basically spit attacks in the time it takes me to blink, but compared to the other two melee sets the pauses in Beast are inexcusable, and I like the set. -
I'll pose it here as a question:
Couldn't the melee/range pet thing be solved by removing attacks?
For example, almost all the ranged thug pets have Brawl. Wouldn't removing Brawl eliminate them moving into melee range since they no longer have an attack that requires them to move into that attack range?
Of course this doesn't apply to Demons or Beasts, (The Dire Wolf has both ranged and melee, same with pretty much all the Demon pets) but you get the idea. -
My guess is that a "true" fix could require some extensive reprogramming they simply don't have the time or resources to devote to, at least right now.
EDIT: Couldn't the problem be fixed by simply removing the melee attack from ranged pets? Why do they even have Brawl to begin with? -
With regards to the speculation around Michael and Charity, note how Michael is surprised if you back down from Prometheus during the last part of his dialog.
I get the distinct impression Michael and Charity are actually less of Prometheus' associates and perhaps more babysitters or something. Prometheus keeps trying to make sure Michael can't overhear him making threats at you, or his plans in general.
In short: Prometheus has a grudge against the Well, and has no qualms about manipulating us in order to successfully thumb his nose at it, but his methods and attitude have made him an problem among his compatriots, who consider him extreme, and have others keeping an eye on him to make sure he stays in line.
I'm very curious to see where this goes. I'd like it if there was a way to defy both the Well AND Prometheus. -
Scirocco's comment about "Arachnos being the most organized group chasing Wade" made me sort of cough and be like "Yeah, I'm sure."
Otherwise, it was nice to see that the conclusion was sufficently heroic and not so grimdark.
...So, is the next SSA going to have the heroes give the villains a proper return thrashing?
Pretty please? -
Demons is pretty much THE top-tier Melee pet set. They have decent range to compensate, lots of decent AoE, ridiculously hot resistances, exotic damage types, etc, etc. Incredibly hard to go wrong there.
And yeah, comparing Beasts to Ninjas, Beasts definitely don't attack as much, but I'm not even sure Ninjas HAVE a gap in their chain as far as I know. My Ninja/Time sees a lot of use and it's just attack after attack, especially on the Genin. My only complaint is that the Oni drops Rain of Fire...only to have my Jounin/Genin immediately kill the anchor seconds later.
I think beasts could use some improvement like Reppu said, but it's definitely not the worst set ever IMO. -
I've played Beast Mastery to 14 and haven't run into pathing issues. But back to pairing up Beast with other things?
Firstly, some notes about the primary attacks:
I do believe Call Swarm is completely skippable. The DoT is barely noteworthy (not to mention Lethal damage. You'd think if it was bees it'd be Toxic, no?), the -Speed and -Def aren't exactly noteworthy either, and it's chances of adding a Pack Mentality don't seem terribly high.
Call Hawk on the other hand, has -Fly, and Knockup and has a -really- good chance of adding Mentality.
Call Ravens? Not only visually impressive, but really effective. Cone AoE so it takes a bit more finesse, but you get a good chance of adding Mentality, and against multiple targets. It also takes an Achilles Heel proc thanks to it's -Def, and it has -Fly as well.
Since my current build has Call Ravens at 5 seconds and Call Hawk down to about 2 seconds, I can't justify Swarm.
As far as pairings go? I picked Storm and the only thing that erks me is the lack of an AoE heal. Thermal, Time and Dark has spoiled me rotten in that regard, so only having O2 Boost feels a bit...anemic by comparison. Still, Steamy Mist and Freezing Rain are a godsend, and I haven't even gotten to Hurricane shenanigans yet. -
Uhhh...but the other Mastermind Enhancement sets (Blood Mandate, Sovereign's Rite, Soulbound Allegiance, etc, etc.) all have Recharge in them. It speeds up the recharge of that particular pet. Personally, I put the slot in my T1 pets because those tend to die the quickest, thus making sure you have them up is more important.
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I've seen Reppu's review. I'm still going to buy it anyway. Better to have it now and start on it, than wait until they "fix" it and THEN buy it.
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Dark Miasma: Hard to go wrong with Dark. A great heal, Tar Pit, Fearsome Gaze, Dark Servant, Shadow Fall. Dark still remains easily one of the best MM secondaries. Hard to go wrong here.
Force Field: Forcefields is also pretty much the same easy mode as it's always been. Fire and forget powers, half the set is skippable, and combined with the Beast's naturally impressive Defense it's ridiculously easy to softcap. Force Bolt and Repulsion Bomb help negate alphas and juggle.
Pain Domination: Pain offers a LOT of heals, and Suppress Pain offers a significant boost to their Regen (which means you don't always need to pop Fortify Pack). World of Pain boosts their resistance as well. But I'm not sure the Beast's resistances are necessarily high enough for it. Beasts have good resists, but they aren't Demons, nor do they have Ember Shield.
Poison: As a MM secondary I honestly couldn't recommend poison. It's got a decent heal and the mezz protection, but even with the "splash" it's debuffs are still too ST-focused for me. But it's just my personal opinion, I could never get into Poison enough to see where it might go.
Sonic Resonance: I could definitely see Sonic being an option. Disruption Field on a Lioness or the Dire Wolf, bubble your pets, and sic 'em. Beasts definitely have good enough resists that Sonic makes them better, without specializing their resists the way Thermal does. It's the resist form of FF.
Storm Summoning: Despite Reppu's opinion of Beast, I asked about a secondary, and got this as a recommendation. Storm definitely brings LOTS of options to the field. And I do mean a lot. So much so the MM personal attacks essentially get reduced to "Use them for procs and secondary effects". Steamy Mist gives the pets a modest boost to defense and boosts their existing resists. Freezing Rain is still a ridiculously good debuff. And you've got O2 Boost for a heal.
Thermal Radiation: Thermal has a lot to offer. Good resist shields, AoE and ST heals. Forge is a good +Dmg buff as well. Melt Armor and Heat exhaustion are good debuffs as well. However, the shields are pretty specific (S/L/Fire/Energy, with a hint of Toxic and Cold), and the debuffs are mostly ST related. Thermal is amazing on Demons because of their robust resists. Not completely sure how Thermal stacks up. Also a lack of mez resistance.
Time Manipulation: Time definitely works with Beasts because it's focus is on close-range work. Time's Juncture and Temporal Mending both require you to be fairly close to your pets. Farsight gives them a good Defense boost, and you've got plenty of options to debuff your enemies with. I'd definitely consider Time a viable option.
Traps: Traps definitely requires a semi-aggressive playstyle, but I could see it working well. Soak the alpha with Seekers, toe-drop a Poison Trap, drop a Mortar and go to town. FFG offers mez protection and good defense. Caltrops are amazing as always too. And with Web Grenade you've got that -Fly.
Trick Arrow: TA and I have had a fickle relationship. I love TA as a concept, and you can layer the debuffs down in seconds. Problem is you'll be firing those debuffs a LOT which means a lot of redraw with the personal attacks.
Overall, the fact Beasts wants you to take the Personal attacks (for Pack Mentality) means you need a set that doesn't keep you constantly busy. Traps, Forcefield, and Sonic definitely help. Time and Storm give you flexibility and options, but you're going to be busy as hell. Dark is (as usual) an incredibly solid option. -
As far as I can tell, the Beasts have defense and resistances that are both serviceable. Definitely better than ninjas, but not as good as Demons.
I asked Reppu and she said Beast/Storm is a good combo, and after shuffling together a build I definitely agree. Though Storm and the MM personal attacks means I'm dropping a LOT of stuff.
My chain (as I see it) is:
Gale->Snow Storm->Freezing Rain->Call Ravens->Lightning Storm->Pets-Eat-Their-Face -
Quote:Why reduce it to an 8ft radius? Titan Weapons AoEs all retain their range regardless of AT, why would FS be any different?Originally Posted by Louis_Cipher
Reduce FS to 8 Radius but that would not make you guys happy in the least. -
...Okay. What the pancaking hell is this?
Heroes once again fall for possibly the stupidest trap again. What about us Genre Savvy heroes who actually KNOW when a trap is very obviously a trap?!
And yet ANOTHER heroes drops dead. I mean really, Wade's power levels of "Exactly as planned" is surpassing everyone in the canon, even Emperor Cole. I'm just...god. My birthday is next month, the 29th, and I have to look forward to the finale of this ridiculous arc.
So tell me, are the heroes going to get to exact payback at some point?
I recall someone asking earlier in this thread, and I'm asking here now:
When can we start cutting out villains permanently? Like say, Mako? Ghost Widow? LORD RECLUSE?
It's mind-boggling that villains have the status-quo maintained perfectly, while heroside, everyone is fair game and has a GIANT bullseyes painted all over their entire body!
And again, villains get a secret cutscene that heroes DON'T get, leaving blueside with only half the story once again.
Devs, seriously. I'm all for a good story where the heroes aren't perfect saviors and get their butts handed to them, but this is borderline overkill. Forcing us to fall for easy traps, forcing us to fail despite the fact we should be able to do something about the situation.
It's hilarious that we're lauded as being "someone Wade fears", but putting the player up on a pedastal is something that only the new DA arcs seem capable of doing properly. At least there we're treated as a viable threat and it shows. Here we're just TOLD we're a threat but it's never put into anything beyond mere words! -
Quote:I like how "villain" must mean "I'm an Omnicidal Idiot", at least in the way you're defining it. Honestly, I'm glad we've got villains like Scirocco or Ghost Widow around as examples of "You don't have to be a monster to be a bad guy."Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
Yes, we can twist the game world in our head in whatever way we want. That's called roleplaying. But it gets really, really repetitive when we have to keep doing that. All of the redside co-op content is written with heroic intent, and that's what I have a problem with.
Some of our villains don't want the heroes to succeed. At anything.
Why?
BECAUSE THEY'RE FREAKING VILLAINS.
And the contact being in the RWZ just means it CAN be co-op. You don't have to run it co-op. I've been running the SSAs solo or duo with a good friend since they've been coming out.
If you don't want the heroes to succeed at "anything" then don't play the co-op content. Zwill said himself in the thread that they can't account for every single origin/backstory you come up with, so they provide a generalized experience.
And as someone with a few redside characters I rather like the experience I'm provided. -
...If you redsiders are thinking of co-op as "For the greater good", then you're doing it wrong.
Start thinking like a villain. "The enemy of my enemy is my (temporary) friend." Any villain with any amount of common sense and who can get over their own ego/megalomania for a few moments can easily figure out that it doesn't go against your best interests for the heroes to succeed.
After all, what's the point of trying to conquer/exploit the world, if the world gets destroyed/conquered before you get a chance to? Think of it less as "doing something good" and think of it more as "I'm making a smart business move for my future."
Or is thinking like a savvy, rational person actually beyond most characters? -
Quote:Technically, killing Alexis was a big change of the status quo. And honestly, most of the SSAs up till #5 were big changes of the status quo. The Heroes were running around like idiots while the villains got to gain all sorts of shiny **** completely scot-free.Originally Posted by Venture
I'm not going to try to quote and point out all the fail; I'll just cut to the chase.
City is predicated on the notion that the character does jobs for other people. That is it. It's not a sandbox game and it never will be. Playing a villain in this game means playing a mercenary doing black-bag jobs and it always will. No, having the NPCs who are actually calling the shots the whole time kiss up to the PC does not help. It comes off like this.
Thus my earlier comment "if you're trying to score a touchdown in bowling, ur doin it wrong". Players have to create characters that fit the game. Adjust your expectations accordingly or go play something that better fits them. If you play villains here you're not going to be the mastermind and you're not going to change the status quo, end of story.
I do agree that if you're going to play an Omnicidal Maniac and expect the game to accommodate you you've got another thing coming. I know someone who plays such a character and has remarked to me that they kind playing their character a bit dull because well...let's face it, the game doesn't do much to make playing that sort of character any fun. Those kinds of characters are GREAT foils in RP, but in the actual context of gameplay mechanics? It doesn't work.
I'm sorry villains, I realize you want your day in the spotlight, and so far in WWD you're getting it, but if you really want to side with the insane, world/galaxy/universe annihilating evil?
You're pancaked. And that's all there is to it. -
Quote:See, I had an almost opposite experience with the Incarnate content. And I'm not saying this just to be contrary. I want to add a perspective to this argument that I think is getting overlooked here.Originally Posted by AkuTenshiiZero
When I started to hit the higher-end content in the 40-50 range for the first time in Grandville, I had the distinct feeling that I had become somebody important in the Rogue Isles. When I finished my first patron arc, Scirocco spoke to me, somewhat begrudgingly, as an equal. My journey was coming to an end, my efforts were being recognized, and I had the power to match my status.
Now that I've started getting into Incarnate content, I feel...pedestrian. Like I'm just one f a bajillion other heroes/villains scrambling like rats in a maze. I'm no longer a respected member in the upper ranks of a massive organization, because Arachnos doesn't amount to a pile of dirt anymore. Frankly, I haven't felt so insignificant since level 1.
The problem here is twofold: One, being forced to have a massive team for trials makes the individual feel smaller. You literally aren't making enough personal impact. Going fist-to-fist with Back Alley Brawler made me feel powerful, being one of 10 Corruptors chipping away at Siege makes me feel weak. Secondly, the narrative is no longer personal. This is where the SSA's shine infinitely brighter than trials, people call me by name and know who I am! In trials, nobody knows who I am, nobody knows of my deeds, and nobody will remember what I've done.
Finally, there is the factor of how poorly the Devs have scaled trials. This is going back the the infamous Rocks Of Death. When I started the Incarnate content, I was expecting the opportunity to face cosmic-level threats the likes of Galactus or Onslaught. And what did we get stuck with? Being pelted to death by rocks thrown by housewives while raiding a TV station. Way to seriously drop the ball, guys. I know we already have Rulaaru, and it's probably pretty tough to top that in terms of threat-level, but these are threats I surpassed in the freakin' Zig Breakout tutorial. Again, we need bigger threats to match our new level of power, if those were legions of planet-devouring Lovecraftian horrors throwing rocks at me, I would be satisfied. Housewives. F***ing housewives.
When I started doing trials, I felt VERY important. Being an Incarnate means you're part of an elite group of heroes with powers VASTLY overshadowing that of others of the same type (example, an Incarnate KM/WP Scrapper is vastly more powerful than a level 50 non-Incarnate KM/WP Scrapper). Yes, there are a lot of people that are a part of this "Elite", but the effort and energy those individuals put in to get to that point is in no way diminished or lessened simply because there's a lot of them.
I'm part of a group of ridiculously powerful heroes confronting threats that ordinary heroes stand little chance of taking on by themselves (Apex and Tin Mage TFs make this -very- clear). So I still felt powerful being a part of these Leagues because we (the League) are taking on threats far above and beyond what most normal heroes are use to dealing with. So even though I'm just one person, I'm still one very special person.
At least, that's how I see it. -
Quote:What does Twinshot or Dr. Graves do that ruin your character's story? Those arcs are specifically intended to be tutorial missions for people utterly new to CoX, and teach them about the mechanics of the game in an unobtrusive manner.Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
So, on the one hand, City of Heroes inspires people to create their own characters and their own stories by providing very powerful tools to do so... And then on the other hand, it shoots that inspiration in the knee by IMMEDIATELY thereafter running people through very intrusive, very presumptuous story arcs like Dr. Graves and Twinshot, clearly built with a specific character type in mind. Launch content notwithstanding, it just goes downhill from there, culminating in the Well of the Furies being ret-conned into our stories as the source of our powers all along. I'm ashamed it never occurred to me to ask this question before, but: Why give us so much freedom of character creation if you don't want us to create a wide diversity of characters?
City of Heroes' story, especially recently, has been the single biggest drawback to its massive, powerful character creation toolkit, and THAT is at the root of most of the complaints. You teach us to be creative, you let us go wild and make all of these weird and wonderful characters with wild and unusual storylines, but then when we get into the game, it turns out most of those characters don't fit the storyline.
And again, maybe it's just me, but none of my characters are "limited" by the story. Maybe I'm being a nit-picker on the details, but perhaps you should refer specifically to your characters, rather than generalizing. Because not everyone has issues with the Well lore.
I have a natural character for instance, my DP/Dev Blaster, my very first character in fact. I found a way to work the Well into his powers. How did I explain his Destiny/Lore/Judgment abilities? He used the components gained from the trials and worked them into his gadgets that he used. Ion Judgment became a pair of super-charged Tesla Gauntlets, Robotic Drones Lore became hard-light holograms, etc.
I don't think it's nearly as difficult to work the Well into a character's story. While I understand you feel entrapped an closed in by the lore, I think part of the challenge is to write a character that works within that existing lore, rather than simply ret-conning it or pretending it doesn't exist.
But that's just me, obviously not everyone will feel the same or think the same. -
Quote:Oh, I'm not arguing that.Originally Posted by Alevan
Also, to take into consideration Issen: Statesman lost his DAUGHTER.
You don't have to argue if whether or not he was arrogant or not. Issen. This man lost his daughter. Anyone who is a parent knows how they would feel if their kid was murdered in cold blood. They'd want to either hunt this man down or do everything to help to get this person behind bars.
Statesman did a mixture of both.
He's suffered enough grief with the death of his wife and barely got back up for that. Now some jerk comes and murders his daughter. Of course he isn't going to think rationally. He's going to hunt this jerk down and arrest him. He's going to overlook clues in his bid to avenge his daughter. He probably KNEW it was a trap but wasn't sure the magnitude of what he was facing at the time so he went on in it anyway.
So in some ways, I was a little "meh" with how they did it... but since I've read the comics, the books, etc: The whole thing? I came to really appreciate it. I liked it. I hope we can murder Darrin Wade now but, hey, I can see where it came to.
So. Come March: We declare it "Punch Darrin Wade like a pinata" day.
But claiming that walking into a trap knowing it's a trap but confident you could handle it ISN'T arrogant. Confidence =/= Arrogance. But this is Venture, so I'm not sure why I'm bothering.
And yes, ICly my character who did that arc is furious. At this point actually, killing Darrin Wade wouldn't be vigilantism. He's stolen Statesman power, and could potentially steal/kill any number of other heroes, plus he's already stated murderous intent towards Psyche. At this point finding him and killing him would be justified homicide because he's a danger to every meta-human, not to mention the fact he stole Statesman power, meaning not even Incarnates are safe. -
Quote:Actually, the players DID know about the second obelisk. It's clearly mentioned in the cutscenes that there's another one. The ritual I'll admit seemed to come out of nowhere. But then the mention of Sister Arlia in Cimerora makes me wonder if it's actually mentioned somewhere in those story arcs somewhere, since I never did them.Originally Posted by SuperOz
I'm sorry, but I must disagree. Did we know about the existence of the obelisk before? Did we know about the ritual before? No.
Wade clearly solves the unsolveable problem of Statesman's Incarnate power with knowledge and ability that apparently appears out of nowhere, because it exists nowhere else in the entire game canon.
It's unlikely (why has noone else, including the Thorns or the Mu or any number of mystical entities found out about this?), it's anticlimactic (the ritual just works and Statesman dies, seemingly without struggle, and some have even posted here he's subconsciously committed suicide).
If there had been any indication that such things existed in the lore before this point (which begs the question why Prometheus doesn't know about it), there would've been credible reason to accept them. As it is, they seem solely created in this story for this sole purpose to achieve a result previously seen as unachievable.
I think it fulfills all the requirements of DEM.
S. -
(Little cross-posting between Virtue and this Forum!)
I've seen a few times, often done in a way that just bugs me in more ways than I can say, so I'll just address it here:
If you're going to use already existing, non-CoH lore to make a character in CoH, at least TRY to make it work within the lore of CoH. Please?
This includes, but isn't limited to:
- Dungeons and Dragons
- World of Darkness
- WH40k
- World of Warcraft
- Etc, etc, etc
I know of MANY folks who use the first two, only seen a few of the latter. But really, I know an entire VG who uses WoD setting-style characters...in a manner wholly inappropriate to CoH, that just makes me facepalm.
It's perfectly acceptable to make a WoD-clan vampire/werewolf/hunter in CoH.
Just don't try to apply the basis of the WoD/DnD/etc setting to CoH haphazardly. What does this mean?
- People are not prejudiced against you because you're not human. That sort of thing (according to CoH lore) died out AGES ago. Only people like Malta still outright hate you, and that's because Malta hates metas, not because you're a supernatural critter.
- No such thing as a Masquerade, of ANY kind. Don't EVEN try to make that one fly. In a world where plenty of heroes can see or sense the energies of others, you'd be hard-pressed to keep it a secret, and even if you could, again, folks don't care.
- You're welcome to say your character is from some other Elemental Plane or what have you (DnD is RICH with planes of existence for characters to originate from), but remember how "Gods" work in CoH. All those Deities and Demigods from your handbook? Are basically Incarnates with the Omega slot unlocked. Even Mot is no exception, he didn't start as a 'god', he just got so strong that killing him became next to impossible. But he's basically a glorified Incarnate, just like Hamidon.
- Your origin story is just fine. Just...don't claim the origin story for the setting you're drawing from is factual (unless your character believes that, then it's cool to claim in IC, whether they're right or not). But to claim that the origin of the world/reality/universe is what this other lore says, disregarding CoH? Is just silly.
- If there's a clash between your lore and CoH's lore...go with CoH if you really, REALLY can't make a compromise. Why? Because it'll help other people RP with you. If there's a gray area in the lore? Try to compromise between yours and CoH as equally as possible. I've seen far too many people attempt to use rulesets or lore laws from other settings when it's silly or just plain stupid.
Sorry, all I can up with at this moment, but these stood out as the biggest things that just bugged me incessantly. -
I've seen a few times, often done in a way that just bugs me in more ways than I can say, so I'll just address it here:
If you're going to use already existing, non-CoH lore to make a character in CoH, at least TRY to make it work within the lore of CoH. Please?
This includes, but isn't limited to:
- Dungeons and Dragons
- World of Darkness
- WH40k
- World of Warcraft
- Etc, etc, etc
I know of MANY folks who use the first two, only seen a few of the latter. But really, I know an entire VG who uses WoD setting-style characters...in a manner wholly inappropriate to CoH, that just makes me facepalm.
It's perfectly acceptable to make a WoD-clan vampire/werewolf/hunter in CoH.
Just don't try to apply the basis of the WoD/DnD/etc setting to CoH haphazardly. What does this mean?
- People are not prejudiced against you because you're not human. That sort of thing (according to CoH lore) died out AGES ago. Only people like Malta still outright hate you, and that's because Malta hates metas, not because you're a supernatural critter.
- No such thing as a Masquerade. Don't EVEN try to make that one fly. In a world where plenty of heroes can see or sense the energies of others, you'd be hard-pressed to keep it a secret, and even if you could, again, folks don't care.
- You're welcome to say your character is from some other Elemental Plane or what have you (DnD is RICH with planes of existence for characters to originate from), but remember how "Gods" work in CoH. All those Deities and Demigods from your handbook? Are basically Incarnates with the Omega slot unlocked. Even Mot is no exception, he didn't start as a 'god', he just got so strong that killing him became next to impossible. But he's basically a glorified Incarnate, just like Hamidon.
- Your origin story is just fine. Just...don't claim the origin story for the setting you're drawing from is factual (unless your character believes that, then it's cool to claim in IC, whether they're right or not). But to claim that the origin of the world/reality/universe is what this other lore says, disregarding CoH? Is just silly.
- If there's a clash between your lore and CoH's lore...go with CoH if you really, REALLY can't make a compromise. Why? Because it'll help other people RP with you. If there's a gray area in the lore? Try to compromise between yours and CoH as equally as possible. I've seen far too many people attempt to use rulesets or lore laws from other settings when it's silly or just plain stupid.
Sorry, all I can up with at this moment, but these stood out as the biggest things that just bugged me incessantly. -
Actually with regards to the Statesman cutscene, I always played it as "Showing up a few seconds late", not "I was standing there the entire time and just didn't do jack."
We're just getting to see what happened so that we (the players), know what's going on. -
Quote:But everyone KNEW that risk when they went to play in the sandbox, right? Again, none of my characters, ranging from any of the origins, have had their concept or story compromised by the presence of the Well or the backstory of the Well. But then, perhaps it's just the way I make characters. Most of my characters are middle of the road. They're good, but their backstory/concept doesn't automatically make them pseudo-gods.Originally Posted by Wing_Leader
Isn't this the danger of playing in someone else's sandbox? You fill in details with your own conceptions and interpretations, taking advantage of the conceptual space left by all the unsaid things in the game's official canon (early on), and then one day those details do get elaborated upon and now everything you've come up with stands in conflict with the newly established canon. Wasn't this sort of thing inevitable?
I guess some things are just better off left unspecified, like where superpowers "come from". Flexibility here is so fundamental to character origin stories that it is probably the one thing they should never have elaborated upon. But they did. And now we are required to ignore the new canon in order to preserve our character concepts, or retcon our character concepts to fit the new reality. For anyone who already was ignoring the Well and/or the whole Incarnate concept, this is no big deal. For everyone else, disregarding everything that is coming down the pike for Incarnates is going to become harder and harder and less satisfying with every update.
So I suppose my lack of problems comes from my style. So I can understand that someone's style might get compromised or cramped due to existing lore. But isn't it part of the challenge to work new ideas into existing lore in a way that works? I have a hard time believing characters are simply flat-out BROKEN by the existence or expansion of Well lore. -
Quote:"A common form of *** Pull or Writer Cop Out, a Deus ex Machina is an outside force that solves a seemingly unsolvable problem in an extremely unlikely (and, usually, anticlimactic) way. If the secret documents are in Russian, one of the spies suddenly reveals that they learned the language. If the writers have just lost funding, a millionaire suddenly arrives, announces an interest in their movie, and offers all the finances they need to make it."Originally Posted by SuperOz
And he did. Did we know about this ritual at any place before this story? No.
Can any other villain NPC or PC have access to Wade's knowledge, planning and mystical ability?
No.
Do the actions of PC's either red or blueside have an impact on the storyline?
No.
These are all things built into the story to ensure that certain events happen. Deus ex machina is 'ghost in the machine' in French. An unseen party that enables events to happen a particular way.
All of this story, which deliberately precludes the player characters from influencing the story in any meaningful way (see: The death of Miss Liberty, Statesman, the escape of Malaise) all happen in a manner controlled by external forces to the story. By that I mean we are unable to influence the outcome of Wade attacking Statesman for no other reason that we are not allowed to.
That is deus ex machina.
S.
So far, that hasn't happened here. Yes, the arc is written in a manner where events play out regardless of player input, but that's NOT a DEM.
No. That's not it at all. For starters, you can't expect writers to be able to account for every single possibility, however likely or unlikely, that anyone else might think of. Just because you can think of something doesn't mean the characters could.Quote:Originally Posted by ElementalFury
If I, a normal person could completely destroy a plot by just holding up my hand and saying "Wait a sec. Why don't we do this instead?" with only about 10 seconds of thinking. You have failed at writing a good story.
Since we're the audience we're automatically more Genre Savvy than the entirety of the cast.