Gemini_2099
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Posts
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Joined
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Quote:You are assuming that this content is designed for the majority of the player base in mind. Does it send a mixed message as to what kind of player the content is designed towards? Absolutely!Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
But raid content requires large communities of players who can coordinate with each other. CoH is full of casual players. We live on PUGs. This new content is disaster for PUGs and thus inaccessible to casual players.
To make things worse, they helpfully gave us a queue to form PUGs for the trials, which is the same as helpfully building a chute to show cattle the route into the slaughterhouse. You'd think that if you were given a system to randomly group people together for content, the content would be the sort that random people could handle. But...no.
This is just stunningly bad design.
In my opinion, the feedback from people quitting, and filling out the survey coupled with the desire of a few existing players to have an endgame spurred the design direction for Incarnate content.
I brought this up in beta as to why was there so much resistance to teaming with PUG players for the trials from many of the beta testers? Many argued that they didn't want to fail the trials. If that is the case doesn't that mean the content may be too hard? The retort from many beta testers was it is easy once it is learned? So which is it? Confused yet? -
Quote:Effort =/= grindingOriginally Posted by galadiman
Excellent, so you want the rewards, but not the effort. Sorry, no sympathy here.
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Quote:Because this feature exists in other games.Originally Posted by White Hot Flash
Why do people feel the need to run solo missions while they're queued?
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Quote:In theory, it should push you to chase the new incarnate powers, and grind it out to make your AT strong again.Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
You don't "become stronger" by being forced to pick a different AT because the one you're playing on has been marginalized by content that ignores that AT's abilities entirely and completely marginalizes the AT's utility.
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Quote:Actually 1.5.Originally Posted by Arilou
Two new TF's. That ain't cat ****.
lolvillains.
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Quote:Actually you are told to do something else...well...not much else in Issue 20: Incarnates.Originally Posted by Lazarillo
Lesson from the Beta boards: if you have a problem with the grind, you don't actually have a problem with the grind. You're just whining because it's too hard or because you don't get to have all your slots filled with Very Rares in the first day of playing. You might think you think the issue lies somewhere else, but it doesn't.
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Quote:That is not good planning IMVHO.Originally Posted by DanZero
Day 1 of issue 20. Maybe... just maybe... they plan on adding on to this over the summer? Huh? Have a Coke and a smile and relax, people.
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All end games have a bait and switch where the leveling experience and entry to end game (eg Alpha slot) vastly differs from the rest of end game. CoX has officially opened the flood gates of such design that the market leader uses. Now, if this is good or bad for the future of the game I don't know, but we will be watching quarterly earnings very closely IMVHO.
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Quote:They make it fair by making IO and SO builds feeling mediocre. The carrot is that you have to chase incarnate content to feel normal, and then eventually super powered again.Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
If that were true, I'd call utter BS on it.
I see no way to make it 'fair' against IO builds without doubly penalising SO builds.
I dread to think what the raids woulda been like if Alpha wasn't IO'd to the hilt... -
Quote:Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
All these people mentioning 'I got mine unlocked in one run' don't seem to be mentioning;
1) It's not possible to get that much IXP in one run
2) You have to pay in Inf to convert threads into IXP
Thats not 'one run'. Thats 'One run and added cost'.
Just so people aren't mislead from reading that.
Good point to bring up that influences costs are often overlooked. -
Quote:This is by design.Originally Posted by CaptainWeightWatcher
TBH my fort is hurting on these trials. Low hp and no resists coupled with the higher to hti chance makes me consume inpirations faster and cant really manage them when i have to run 4 sturdies to be able to withstand some of the damage(lambda)
End game is about making all your work to level cap pointless and you have to rebuild your character with incarnate powers to grow strong enough...eventually. -
Quote:I am in 100% agreement.Originally Posted by JKCarrier
That's the problem...they're sending mixed messages. "These Trials are extremely tough, and require expert coordination and tactics. So we set up the LFG tab that tosses casual players together in minimum-sized PuGs. Good luck!"
There was a lot of resistance in beta from players being queued up with PUGS to do these trials. It is obvious isn't it? The content isn't easy... -
Quote:Good post.Originally Posted by CactusBrawler
I'll outright say that the amount of defense ignoring AoE is outright bad design when one of your classes/arch-types relies on pets for both damage and survivability is bad game play design.
I'll also say that making another three classes/archtypes almost completely sidelined during an encounter is also bad game play design.
Let me add, that, this is what end game is about. Tearing down your AT so you can have the urge to become stronger. -
Quote:Actually at the dentist you are given candy and a toothbrush on your way out.Originally Posted by Bad_Influence
QR: all this sounds about as fun as a trip to the dentist without Novocaine. Wheee.
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Quote:All end games are designed with the grind in mind, and gear resets where all your work is invalidated by making you feel weak again, such that to push you to work towards becoming strong again.Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
No! No, it's really, really not. This is not what good end game design looks like. I could think up a half dozen better end game systems for CoH without even cracking one of my books on game theory.
All I'm left with is the hope that this is an unfinished system, in the same way that ED was unfinished until the IO system came along. I have to believe our devs will eventually put into place mechanics that will discourage griefers, allow solo play, and encourage good play instead of mindless zerging. I...I just have to.
I personally don't see the appeal of end game because you can roll a low level alt if you want to start at the bottom again to build your way up. -
Quote:For the long term, I am curious to see what the introduction of end game does to other activities.Originally Posted by Angelxman81
The thing is after all the hype about I20...
You need to keep failing the Trials to unlock the slots. Great!
Feels like theres nothing in this Issue. I know we will discovering the I-slots slowly but right now feels like just 2 Trials were added to grind them.
Not like,"The awesome I20 is here". -
Quote:Well it is not like Lineage 2 grind, but the road is being paved for that direction.Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Pretty much this. I define any option where having to repeat the same action "only" ten times is considered lucky as grind classic.
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Quote:Essentially you just described the Market leaders end game.Originally Posted by Zyphoid
There were run by teams with SOs, and beaten. It is all about tactics, and working together. Communication is a huge. People need to be told what to do, when to do it, then the actually need to do it.
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No new costumes Gemini is not happy.
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Quote:No one wants to admit it but I will.Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
Ok, it's all about tactics then, is it? No problem!
-Sit at range and have pets attack!
-Pets refuse to stay at range, despite being recalled several times, die from stupid ammounts of high-acc AoE
-Move in and lay traps in mobs!
-Pets get one shotted by high-acc Boss mobs, obliterated by stupid ammounts of AoE
-Send pets in at range so I can re-summon them in waves!
-Pets die even faster due to being retards who try to punch a warwalker in the kneecaps, and from lacking the FF Gen +def and status protection, I get picked off by auto-hit Artillery and can't resummon. Due to auto-hit cheap artillery.
So, tell me then. WHAT THE HELL AM I MEANT TO DO?! What are your mythical tactics that suddenly make it all better, and make it so that I don't get one shotted through soft cap, that means I can avoid the auto-hit artillery power (NO, not the turrets, we killed those in stage 2)
I'm a Mastermind. Supposedly I'm this mythical, overpowered thing that deserves no pity for already being so uber...
Well, Lambda sure made that even more untrue than it already was.
Incarnate content is a "gear reset" to level the playing field between SO builds and IO builds. Problem is making both SO builds and IO builds feel mediocre sends mixed messages about the future direction. -
Quote:Eight consecutive, successful runs is highly unlikely, and ten is any different IMVHO.Originally Posted by EvilGeko
Actually you will get a rare with eight successful runs. I know people want their very rares, but they really need to start looking at that as a long term goal.
Based on the failure rate of what is being described, 16 runs is more likely (failure rate of 50%). -
Quote:I would like to warn people that this is leading towards homogenization where there isn't any defined roles for AT's. That is essentially the Incarnate system in a nutshell.Originally Posted by elvnsword09
Yes, but the Nictus' heal didn't completely negate anyone's powers. a Tank's ability is: "The Tanker can take it and dish it out all at once. The Tanker primarily can absorb vast amounts of damage, and hold his own in a fist fight. But the Tanker lacks any long range punch. The Tanker would prefer just to charge straight ahead anyway." Frankly, in the BAF, they can't take it, they simply face plant... it's ridiculous...
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Quote:It requires luck for ten times to be the minimum.Originally Posted by Kelenar
Ugh. I think it says something if running them ten times is the quick option.
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Quote:My stress level punched me in the face and then started smoking an e cig.Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
Fine. Don't take some friendly advice and whine about everything being too hard. Say hi to your stress level for me.
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Quote:The goal is for challenging content while still making progression the player can tangibly see. The problem is that indeed you have to grind out the progress to reach the incarnate slots, which make the trials easier to farm...eventually. This is what end game design looks like, and those that asked for it...well here it is.Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
Is it possible to win with only 8 players?
The addition of special xp even for losing runs seems to indicate that players are now officially going to be rewarded for beating their heads against walls, with no regard to play skill. This is bad, bad design. How do we disincentivize those who will grief their leagues or just play sloppily, when everyone knows that they'll be rewarded even if they fail?
As a geek who's into game mechanics and game design, I'm just appalled. I thought our devs knew how to build a game system. I trusted them. This looks like the work of an amateur.