Eva Destruction

How about, instead of asking other people to come up with your plot for you, you think about what your villains would want. If it would benefit your villains' evil plans, it would probably benefit other people's villains as well.

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I'd rather avoid that particular terminology. It makes it sound like the contact in question serves you, you alone, and every six hundred you's who talked to him in the past hour.

Now, I agree, there should be more 'fixer' type contacts.

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Yes, because the contact is a backstabbing jerk who likes to hedge his bets. As long as the game acknowledges that you know that, that's fine. He serves you, and you alone, RIGHT NOW, because you are scary, and you are right in front of him and those six hundred other guys are not.

Are you looking under the "unique" abandoned tech maps?

Because I just checked, and the tech and abandoned tech categories seem to be exactly the same maps.

On the subject of Nemesis Automatons:

Programming? Or a true artificial intelligence?

Same question, only for Council robots. Their bios say they have an advanced AI, but the Rogue Robots arc implies that their programming keeps them in check.

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I wonder why if it's superheated, pressurised steam, it deals energy damage.

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Heat is energy. Fire is combustion. Steam doesn't combust. I often take "Energy" in this game to mean any form of power that isn't a form of combustion, physical force, chemical reaction, or "negative"-type energy.

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Dude, it shoots a giant bubble. How do we get force fields out of steam?

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Because someone recycled graphics and animations.

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Still, steam would do Smashing and Fire damage, like Fireball. If you get hit with pressurized steam, it's concussive force and heat. Force in this game = smashing damage.

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I wonder why if it's superheated, pressurised steam, it deals energy damage.

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Heat is energy. Fire is combustion. Steam doesn't combust. I often take "Energy" in this game to mean any form of power that isn't a form of combustion, physical force, chemical reaction, or "negative"-type energy.

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Dude, it shoots a giant bubble. How do we get force fields out of steam?

Maybe use one of the wisps? They're pretty light-looking, and definitely alien. Or a ghost or a Shard Reflection? Although they are obviously human.

A lot of the tech maps do have abandoned versions with the same layout. Maybe even all of them? I haven't checked them all, but IIRC the Small map 1 is the same for both.

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2. Task Master when he had is own comic came out on top.

3. Deadpool is in a lot of ways a villain despite some runs in his comic where he tries the whole hero gig out. But at the end of the day the man would kill some one for a stick of gum if he wanted it. But he is just so wacky and lovable aint he?

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Deadpool is also certifiably insane. Rather than evil, he's pretty much the embodiment of Chaotic Neutral.

Besides, Deadpool and Taskmaster are small-time. They don't have any grand sweeping plans for world domination. They're just out to make a buck. So they're allowed to win sometimes. Also they are cool.

The closest I've found is to use an ally, set them to Unconscious, set their rescued animation to "kneeling" so it looks like they're trying to stand up, and set their stranded animation to unconscious, so once you leave they fall down again. You have to set them to "Non-combat" and "do nothing," and they will still stand up sometimes and people will wonder why they're not helping.

Honestly, I read each custom guy's description once and then don't bother after that. So if you have a recurring NPC I probably won't bother to read his bio after the first time, unless he looks different, or has different powers, or gives some other indication that he's different this time. But I'm sure some people will.

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Eva: Hang on.

I think we've managed to start agreeing and nobody told us. My point is that it's entirely feasible that a Sufficiently Advanced Roboticist could make a robot capable of either A: infiltrating a mindlinked society or B: mimicking an invader on said society.


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Sure, it's possible. It's just that the possibility is so completely out there that it requires way too much suspension of disbelief. Especially considering the Manticore automaton's dialogue, suggesting it has specific programming, rather than a free-thinking AI.

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[edit] The post you quoted was my attempt to explain the Lost cry of "Aberrant thought patterns!" without making the Rikti capable of mind-reading.

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But your "mind-feeling" theory would still flush out an aberration, such as an invader or a robot.

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Love of the game if you ask me.

As for the aberrant thought patterns, it could be something as simple as the telepathic equivalent of "he looks funny!" or "his accent is wrong!". Just because your thoughts 'feel' wrong doesn't mean they have to be able to read them.

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No, but you don't have to be able to read someone's thoughts precisely to know that they are an anomaly. An automaton, or someone with malicious intent, would probably "feel" wrong compared to peaceful explorers.

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In the first two books of the "Song of Ice & Fire" series by George R. R. Martin, the bad guys "win". That's why I never read the third one - I get enough gloom and doom from real life without reading about it for fun. Those friggin books read like a snuff-film script.

I heard HBO might be doing a series based on the story.

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They are (well, a pilot, at least); Peter Dinklage is already cast as Tyrion. It will be filmed in Ireland.

I'd like to say that SoF&I gets better, but it gets worse before it finally does.

Still, you get the feeling that the Good Guys (or at least the Less Evil Guys) will ultimately win in that story.

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Some of the good guys are still alive. In that series, that counts as winning.

And some of the worst bad guys have already lost.

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Actually, you know what? Someone show me proof that Nemesis Automatons are actually even steam powered. I've never read anywhere that they are. As far as I know only the Warhulks, Fake Nemeses, and Jaegers are steam powered, in addition to the rifles and such.

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Steam powered rifles, wha?

Actually this is the true genius of Nemesis. He makes Frankenguns look good.

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Pfft. Steam powered rifles are probably the easiest thing about Nemesis to rationalize. All you would need is to boil water extremely fast. Ever hear about water exploding after being microwaved? More or less the same principle at work.

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It's also unnecessary. I was under the impression their rifles operated on the same principle as the player Assault Rifles, they just looked better.

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Right. They wipe out aberrant thought, so obviously they have some concept of it. They know we're not as advanced as they are. They know we're not telepathic. It doesn't take much to figure out "hey, this guy's an aberrant, and the poor pathetic humans can't do anything about it. Sucks to be them, the ones we met earlier seemed like nice guys."

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You see, this brings up another thing that I considered. Can the Rikti actually read minds? I don't think they can. I think they simply operate on a hive mind, and just transmit thoughts, as it were. The Rikti Mentalists' attacks probably operate by pretty much screaming at someone with their mind. Their minds are alien, and the human mind probably cannot comprehend Rikti thoughts.

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The Lost dialogue "abberant thought processes detected" implies that they can. I agree with you that their thoughts are probably alien, so the Lost are better at reading our thoughts than homegrown Rikti, but the question is how alien? They are capable of more or less understanding us.

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Actually, you know what? Someone show me proof that Nemesis Automatons are actually even steam powered. I've never read anywhere that they are. As far as I know only the Warhulks, Fake Nemeses, and Jaegers are steam powered, in addition to the rifles and such.

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Steam powered rifles, wha?

Actually this is the true genius of Nemesis. He makes Frankenguns look good.

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Exactly. It doesn't make sense. Comic book logic says telepathy doesn't work on robots. CoH says psi attacks are largely ineffective against robots. The Rikti seem to have a lot of experience using telepathy, wouldn't they notice something odd if they can read some of the humans' minds and then bam, they're attacked by someone who either has no thoughts, or who's thinking "0001010010101?"

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Artificial intelligence is well documented in the CoH universe. Citadel, for one. If a machine is sophisticated enough to perfectly mimic sentience, then I would think that it could think in something other than binary.

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Maybe so, but the Manticore automaton's attempts to taunt you suggest that it doesn't actually contain an artificial intelligence. It's programmed.

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I could buy it if his methods weren't so obviously transparent. Do the Rikti have no concept of villains? Wouldn't an attack from a dimension that was no threat to them up until that point make them go "hmm?"

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Actually, they don't have any concept of villains. Rikti Priests hunt down aberrant thought processes and correct them. Hro'Dtohz's ambition and independence is said in Serpent Drummer's arc to be completely out of character for Rikti. I suspect that he is only allowed to continue with his independent line of thought because of the war.

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Right. They wipe out aberrant thought, so obviously they have some concept of it. They know we're not as advanced as they are. They know we're not telepathic. It doesn't take much to figure out "hey, this guy's an aberrant, and the poor pathetic humans can't do anything about it. Sucks to be them, the ones we met earlier seemed like nice guys."

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The more you analyze and nitpick at the storyline the less you will actually enjoy it.

In the end it is about the personal experience. Sometimes you just need to suspend belief and enjoy the story for what it is, entertainment.

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A well written story is more enjoyable when you nitpick and analyze it, IMO.

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Exactly. It doesn't make sense. Comic book logic says telepathy doesn't work on robots. CoH says psi attacks are largely ineffective against robots. The Rikti seem to have a lot of experience using telepathy, wouldn't they notice something odd if they can read some of the humans' minds and then bam, they're attacked by someone who either has no thoughts, or who's thinking "0001010010101?"

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...unless said robot was designed specifically to be psi-reactive by someone who knows what he's doing.

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I just find that a stretch. I just can't reconcile telepathy with technology. The mind is such a uniquely organic thing, and so complicated that it would require a level of technology to duplicate that I just can't accept in a game world that is still so close to ours.

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I don't think that Nemesis being behind the Rikti invasion was out of nowhere as you seem to think. Some reading material:

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Maxwell_Chri...ck_the_evidence

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Anton_Sampso...is.27_next_plan

First link explains that not only was Nemesis working on Rikti technology 10 years prior to the Rikti war, he somehow was capable of replicating Rikti telepathy, which would make one think that he probably was capable of creating a semblance of an electronic brain. Just because Rikti can read thoughts, doesn't mean they can detect organic material with their minds, mind you.

Of course, this comes with a caveat that none of this will necessarily make any sense to you. Just showing that they did make an attempt at rationalization within the game lore.

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Exactly. It doesn't make sense. Comic book logic says telepathy doesn't work on robots. CoH says psi attacks are largely ineffective against robots. The Rikti seem to have a lot of experience using telepathy, wouldn't they notice something odd if they can read some of the humans' minds and then bam, they're attacked by someone who either has no thoughts, or who's thinking "0001010010101?"

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Link number two shows that Nemesis has had portal technology for quite some time. Anton Sampson even theorizes off hand that he hid in some other dimension during the Rikti Invasion. That sounds to me like a wink and a nod from the writer.

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Yes, it's been established he has portal technology. That makes sense, he's the type who would want to get his hands on any new technology.

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The story history that I believe is still on the website, or maybe the history badge for Portal Corp, I can't remember which, states that the Rikti were first contacted back in the mid-nineties, and initial diplomatic relations with them were fairly peaceful. The Rikti invasion was sudden, unexpected, and uncharacteristic.

I've always guessed that Nemesis started the Rikti invasion. Whether it makes sense is another matter.


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I could buy it if his methods weren't so obviously transparent. Do the Rikti have no concept of villains? Wouldn't an attack from a dimension that was no threat to them up until that point make them go "hmm?"

Yes, I am talking about the LRSF. You need the Usurper badge to start it (I think). The text certainly assumes that you have finished Time after Time. Which means he has told you you are too powerful for him to mess with, you are a true villain answerable to no one....except for him. The whole thing is full of "Help Recluse in his plan" and "Lord Recluse is pleased with you, here, have a shiny."

"It's all a Nemesis plot" is another joke taken way too far. The original Nemesis story arcs end up with him dying, you beat him up, and you NEVER FIGHT HIM AGAIN. There is Nemesis? in one of Crimson's missions, and all those cheesy one-off missions you get from Maxwell Christopher, but the fact that you beat up Nemesis ONCE AND FOR ALL (?) leaves us with the "it was a Doombot....er, Fake Nemesis" excuse.

But they just couldn't let it lie, could they? No, they HAD to bring Nemesis back, they just HAD to make the biggest event in Paragon City's history Another Nemesis Plot. And one with plot holes big enough to drive a truck through, at that. And while doing so they had to make the super-advanced "aliens" dumb as bricks, just so they'd fall for it.

There's also Peter Themari's arc. It's level 10-15, so you can flashback it. Remember it for later, when you go do Vernon Von Grun's arcs. Which you should do, because they're villainous in a silly mad science way, and because Vernon is awesome and is one of the few villain contacts who isn't a jerk to you.

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Time After Time is, obviously, very impressive, but it is about the ONLY arc that's actually about you being THE villain of the story. Everything else is just mercenary work.

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And what is your reward for finishing it?

You get the opportunity to go beat up Recluse's archnemesis, because he can't, so you can prove what a good little Servant of Recluse you are.

As one of my teammates said on my first successful LRSF run: "Servant of Recluse? WTF? He should serve ME!"

At that point, the only reason you can't storm his inner sanctum with your team and beat up Recluse and all the patrons is because the Game Says So. You're not given any motivation not to.