Deus_Otiosus
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Posts
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Joined
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Quote:SR or Invuln would be fine, as would a lot of other secondaries.Originally Posted by SuperT
Hi, I'm not sure how players actually go with SR on brutes these days but I wanted to know if a dark melee/SR/soul brute would be a viable option for some good AV soloing. Outside of SR, the only other secondary I would consider for this particular toon would be invuln. But I figured dark melee and SR would work very well together along with soul mastery.
I'll stick to SR since you seem to be most interested in that.
My choices would be Cardiac or Spiritual for Alpha, Rebirth for Destiny and Reactive for Interface.Quote:Originally Posted by SuperT
Oh and as far as Incarnate powers, I'll probably go with muscular alpha and rebirth for the extra heal. Not sure if reactive is the best choice when fighting AVs.
Any thoughts and/or suggestions? Thanks -
Quote:There is very little you can do to minimize radial KB scatter.Originally Posted by BrandX
After all, if you could control it, why not play it?
If I have to waste time positioning to use a power when I could simply be using a superior power that doesn't require that. Why would I bother with the former?
I kick them if they play like idiots.Quote:Originally Posted by BrandX
But seeing this, I would assume you kick a lot of people off teams...
I do this whether or not they are using KB in particular to be an idiot.
If you want to feel bad for someone like the FF Mastermind using Repulsion Field on the 9CUs on a BAF (who just continue to shoot everyone, since they are ranged enemies) after being asked repeatedly to let them bunch up for the slaughter - well you go right ahead and be my guest.
I wish I was making this stuff up.
I was going to respond to you, but I'm tired and bored of your constant, ridiculous, strawman attacks.Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Bunch of ranting and raving -
Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Okay I'm working from memory here because city of data is down, but you're saying you don't see any balance problems with an attack that has a 100% chance for knockdown, recharges in 11.2 seconds, costs basically no endurance, does scale 1.14 damage (more for brutes), animates in one second, and hits ten targets in a massive cone? Are you sure you want to claim this? A high recharge build will have shockwave up again before the enemies have finished their standing up animation. Super balanced!
And if you are playing a Scrapper and set your enemies to +1, or run any trial - that power is doing exactly all of those things already!!.
Also, new set coming out soon. Keep an eye out for it.
They say that because they always forget that SS has some of the worst available ST damage.Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Since Silas brought it up, let's look at super strength. Now in addition to foot stomp, a power which most people would say is already far outside the realm of balance with its enormous radius and high chance for knockdown
The best SS attack chain has 4 attacks, and 2 of them aren't even from SS.
ZOMG!! They'd have to rebalance a power that no one ever uses now unless they are mentally deficient!! The sky is falling!!Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it would have a (iirc) 20 second recharge guaranteed knockdown mag 3 stun for basically no endurance with a huge radius.
Except for, you know, ST damage. When you get a chance you should go through and re-examine the DPAs on some of the stone melee attacks and then get back to me.Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
So, it's like Fault but even better and requires less thought. Wow, what's unbalanced about that in a set that already outshines stone melee in every measurable way?
Pay close attention to Seismic Smash.
I'm also working from memory here, but I think with enough recharge and Absolute Amazement in Fault that you can keep an enemy group perma stunned already.
I'm demanding nerfs?Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
To put it another way, you're demanding huge nerfs for one set that doesn't deserve it and one set that does deserve it but is so popular the devs would be insane to comply.
Please come out of your little crazy cave and join the rest of the planet. -
Quote:The only things I think I'd be interested in playing if a KB off option was given would be Energy Blast and Peacebringers. I'd say storm as well, but you can already negate your own KB as a /Storm Controller.Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Yes, and the reason you want the option to turn it off is because it's obvious that this would make a number of sets quite a bit stronger, whereas those other powers being toggleable has virtually no effect on game balance.
I'm sure the entire game will quake in fear at the sudden power of Energy Blast and Peace bringers.
I think you are worried about things that simply are not real.Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
I also don't want Claws to get nerfed into oblivion to make up for the fact that shockwave would suddenly be the best aoe attack in the game by a huge margin. -
Quote:No, we're asking for the exact same treatment that other severely annoying effects like un-asked for speed boosts, team teleports and group fly got. The option to turn it off.Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
The difference, rsclark, is that some people are asking for the removal of a big part of the game.
Quote:Originally Posted by Dispari
You're seriously stretching everything that's being said. There's a huge gap between "I don't like KB and it's an annoyance" to "I will kick and ban all people who have even one KB power from my team."
That's pretty much PR's only way of posting. -
Quote:People who are this opposed to KB can do this right now.Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Because as many have admitted in this thread, if the option to disable knockback were there, they'd either refuse to team with people who chose to use knockback or they'd simply kick them straight away.
How can the pro-KB crowd insist KB is as amazing as it is, and live in such fear that an option to turn it off would see them kicked and barred from teams?
If it really was an amazing power, people would be clamoring for its use. -
Quote:That's exactly why a lot of players dislike KB in the first place.Originally Posted by McNum
Of course, I'm wholly opposed to having ANY kind of "disable knockback" option in the game. For reasons this thread easily demonstrates. If I have to turn off my knockback, I get to pick a power YOU can't use while you're teamed with me.
KB gives the KB player the ability to literally deny other players the effective use of their powers.
This is one of the reasons radial KB scatter is so loathed. -
Quote:No I don't fuss about it if they use it well.Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
I'm referring to these people that Socorro and others were talking about who, apparently, violently oppose knockback and are willing to berate their teammates for even using it correctly. Are you saying that that's a rational behavior that is beyond reproach? I think they're a collection of ********. I've never actually met one of these people but if you all assure me that they exist I choose to believe you.
Correct.Quote:Originally Posted by BrandX
So, you kick people from teams/leagues when they are incapable of not being idiots with their KB (which is of course you judging it and not just how the player thinks it's okay to play).
I have the star, if you are unable to not be a detriment to the team/league after I've already asked you to control X behavior, you get kicked.
If they want to play like idiots, they can start their own team.
Did I say I can't be an idiot without it?Quote:Originally Posted by BrandX
And yet, YOU can't play it yourself, because...you can't play it without being an idiot yourself? Is that what you're saying?
I don't play it because it's an un-enjoyable frustrating mechanic.
I'd love to have more available sets to play, but as long as their are sets saddled with what is to me a useless mechanic, I will not play them.
Yeah, apparently so.Quote:Originally Posted by BrandX
Am I reading it wrong?
You're right, I get to decide what is fun on the teams and leagues I start. Imagine that.Quote:Originally Posted by BrandX
Obviously you don't kick the ones who know how to use it to your happy merriment, and yet you can't play it because you can't play it that way because you think you play like an idiot?
That's a few times now you've implied I play it like an idiot, most players play it like idiots.
Maybe you're just trying to be insulting, or maybe you should really learn how to read better. -
Quote:Its not about maximum power at all times, its about team mates using an ability that has detrimental effects on other people's playstyles.Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
My point in this thread is that there's more to the game than having maximum power at all times. When you're talking about the devs making radical changes to sets, farming efficacy should not be the only concern. Right now you have a choice - you can avoid KB by playing one of the many sets that lack it. If they were to start down the road of removing KB from the game, that choice is gone.
KB used without any sense is basically griefing to me (even if it's inadvertent), and it can be used on purpose as a griefing tool (isn't that one of the running jokes for /Storm vs. Tankers and putting the Tanker on auto-follow?).
I already have a solution for other people, I kick people from teams and leagues when its clear they are incapable of not being idiots with their KB.Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Making it a switch on Null is a terrible "solution" because it gives credence to the idea that KB should be removed, and it makes it easy for forum-types to cow other players into going and shutting it off so that they don't inconvenience poow wittwe babies who simply can't handle anything unexpected ever happening.
I would just like a solution for myself so I could enjoy a wider breadth of powersets & powers, all of which I currently avoid like the plague.
I also find it funny that you have resorted to insults and name calling at this point, after wondering why you were being considered mean and nasty.
Maybe they just don't want other people turning a situation into an idiot fest with their KB.Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecyclepoow wittwe babies who simply can't handle anything unexpected ever happening. -
Quote:Ok, then go ahead and tell me what exactly was your point in bringing Super Strength into the argument?Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Maybe if you keep harping on something I was never saying to begin with it...
To show that poster that a popular power set has High Mag KB in it?
Your point is still moot because nearly everyone skips those powers.
Let's try to bring the tone down a bit, I'm sorry for my earlier caustic comments.
Do you think KB is a powerful tool or do you think it is simply something you enjoy but recognize that it really isn't a useful tool to any halfway competent player, build or team?
I know that seems like a loaded question, but all of my friends who do enjoy KB basically state the latter often. -
Quote:Do you think people are playing SS for Hurl and Handclap?Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
So in other words, I was and remain completely correct.
Sorry, you don't get to use SS as a posterboy for having KB and then conveniently ignore that the two high mag KB powers are almost universally reviled and skipped.
That should tell you something about how bad KB is. -
Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Yeah, and I was responding to someone calling me an idiot for suggesting that SS had any KB at all in it.
Of course, those two powers are the ones nearly every player skips.
As I said, SS is popular in spite of those powers. Not because of them. -
Quote:I forgot about Hurl.Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Oh, you'd prefer it if I were sanctimonious and self-righteous? I'd rather be open and honest in my abrasiveness actually. Clears the air.
As someone else pointed out, SS has three powers that apply high mag KB, but thanks for the insult!
I forgot about it, because its the other high mag KB power that nearly everyone skips.
The third you are thinking of would be KO Blow. It does not do KB.
You're original point about SS being popular is still wrong. It's not popular because of those two powers, it is however popular in spite of them. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Granite Agent
Momentum and redraw lean me towards a secondary that requires few or no clickies. Specifically I am thinking of WP, INV, or maybe ELA.
My problem is trying to build any of those sets to have soft-cap to S/L/E/N with decent resists. I have not come up with a great build for WP or ELA that does this.
Ela only needs SM/L.
Here's what I have for WP.
- 3 ST attacks.
- Blinding Feint stands in for Build Up
- Leap Attack stands in for Defensive Sweep.
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Quote:I love this post.Originally Posted by Nihilii
I love knockback apologists.
Three days ago, in that other topic about knockback being underrated: "the people who dislike knockback are a minority of minmaxers, they just complain loudly".
Now, here: "so many people dislike knockback the option to turn knockback off would be an obligation".
People, it has to be one or the other. You can't just flip-flop and claim the exact opposite thing as fact whenever it's convenient to your argument.
Same goes for "knockback is useful and awesome" (in "is KB good" topics) vs "lowering KB on powers would make some too powerful" (in "option for less KB" topics).
Special gold star for Sailboat who manages to say all those things at once in the same post while also admitting he's against any change to KB just to spite people who enjoy the game differently than The One True Way It Is Meant To Be Played, By Sailboat.
Knockback is the best ranged mitigation! Anyone who dislikes KB is a powergaming munchkin! Uh... If KB is the best mitigation, wouldn't a powergaming munchkin be all over it? But I'm sure there's some crazy conspiracy theory to cover that one, like all powergaming munchkins are stupid and Sailboat, as a superior human being, comprehends the game and optimizes in a way mere commoners cannot do. Wouldn't that make Sailboat the god of all powergaming munchkins? No, stupid, because Sailboat doesn't use numbers nor prove his assertions in any way, which makes him pure and holy as we all know numbers are evil and words are good.
You can just picture all these players joining teams and laughing to themselves as they purposefully grief their teammates. Reminds me of the "incarnate content must be gated to trials" folks ; such terrible, egotistical people they are afraid nobody would team with them if they weren't forced to - and rightfully so.
Thanks Nihilii.
Quote:Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
I'd say KB is available in some of the most popular sets there are. Energy blast and super strength are the two sets that everyone picks the first time they play the game, and the latter happens to also be flavor of the century for tankers and brutes.
Are you just pretending to be obtuse?
Super Strength has almost nothing but 0.67 KB, which functions as Knockdown.
The only power in the set that actually does knock things back, Handclap, is almost universally reviled and skipped by nearly ever Super Strength character I have ever come across. -
Quote:It's basically the same argument that was made in favor of Brute nerfs.Originally Posted by EvilGeko
Why don't they?
I think Stalkers and Scrappers are pretty close in damage potential, so much so that I don't perceive a difference on average. I also don't see a major survivability differential either around the average. I think it completely sucks that certain sets like Regen, Will, Ice and other sets with Dull Pain clones don't get the full benefit of those powers and I would change that. But on the whole, I have not found Stalkers to be significantly weaker defensively than Scrappers.
How can the Brute have more HP and do equivalent or more damage in some circumstances?
I think the balance issues between Stalkers and Scrappers are much greater than the balance issues between BS and Katana.
The differences between BS and Katana are pretty minimal for anyone who isn't a high end performance focused player.
Stalkers on the other hand bring nothing to a team that wouldn't be better filled by a Scrapper. -
Quote:I agree with all of that.Originally Posted by Tannim222
Consider and balance are two entire different things for a developer. Look at time manipulation. It's a pretty good set just on SOs, this is where it's balanced around. Yet, the dev that worked on the set said something to the effect that it was a great set for a min-maxer to work with - iow, the IO sets that were able to go with it were considered.
In order for devs to balance around IOs, they can't take a set as if it were in a vaccuum. They'd have to take into consideration every possible set bonus combination possible within that primary, and every single set bonus combination for each secondaries. Then compare all of those results with the results of all the other primaries and their bonuses, and all the secondaries. Then lets not consider adding Incarnate abilities.
The majority of the game is designed to work with SOs, outside of a particular set of Incarnate abilties being useful to smooth over success for a couple of trials (which isn't an absolute either) and the level shifts, a 50 can even go through the trials on nothing but SOs.
Tha's what people mean when they talk about new sets not being balanced around IOs, because they're not, at least in the sense of how they perform for normal play.
That's not the kind of point that I was refuting however. Errant's point is that the procs are not even a consideration, which I don't believe is true.
Maybe Errant meant something different, but that's what you get with a statement like that (one that is repeated like a mantra). -
Quote:These are differences in amounts that only min maxers really care about.Originally Posted by EvilGeko
Broadsword has:
Larger per attack damage
Katana has:
Better recharge;
Faster animations; these two lead to
Better DPS;
Better Burst damage; and
Better abilities to leverage procs.
Otherwise Shield Defense is completely out of wack balance wise in favor of Scrappers vs. Brutes. The devs don't care, because in their eyes the difference is minor, even though that means Shield Charge for Scrappers does something like 40% to 50% more damage and that the ST DPS boost Scrapper's get is well beyond any mitigation benefit the Brute gets in return.
I'm sure you'll make a thread about that soon though.
I'm sure that won't stop your pet agenda, but that's my take on how the devs see things.
Really?Quote:Originally Posted by EvilGeckoIf balance in a game like this means anything it means that when someone chooses a power, a class, an archetype, etc. that they will not in all cases be either superior or inferior to other like choices.
Quote:Originally Posted by EvilGeckoI believe that Stalkers and Scrappers should be equivalent in damage potential. Not one better than the other. People harp on the survivability difference, but I don't see it.
Sorry, but those two quotes really don't match up even remotely. -
Quote:If you think the devs are not considering IOs when they design new sets, then you really are not paying attention.Originally Posted by Errant
Devs don't balance around IO's... This point is invalid too.
I think you're just repeating something that keeps getting repeated because people repeat it. -
What you can do depends on your level.
Here are some general options:
- Craft the recovery serum temp power.
- Utilize the Recovery boost from the base empowerment station
- slot the procs: miracle, numi, performance shifter
- Slot attacks for end reduction (basic IOs or frankenslotting if you are in the 22 to 32+ range)
- Take Superior condition at L35 (epic pool), take Physical perfection a bit after if needed.
- Get the Born in Battle/Portal Jockey & Marshal/Atlas Medallion Accolades
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Quote:Originally Posted by Mazey
But that's not why people run the BAF and Lambda.
They're not run constantly because they're fun, they're run constantly because they're easy and familiar.
Why run an Underground you might well fail, even if it would be more fun, when you can run a Lambda you know you'll beat?
The answer is that there's very little reason to do that, so the devs are adding that incentive.
The devs are simultaneously adding an even greater incentive than we have now to completely ignore KIR & UG Trials. -
The more recharge you have, the better your endurance efficiency needs to be.
The faster you active powers, the more endurance you consume per second.
CP will probably help, but if you have a high rech focused build - I can't recommend anything other than Cardiac.
If you want to do Blaster level damage, you should make a Blaster.
That's what they do.
Just as you are at a damage disadvantage vs. a Blaster at base, you will be at a (most likely larger) disadvantage after musculature vs. a Blaster if they grab musculature as well.
If you have low rech and want to increase your damage output, it will be very build dependent but my opinion is that Spiritual would be the better choice as it benefits both your Primary and Secondary (as does Cardiac for that matter).
If you have all of your Rech needs and all of your End under control, then I would go Musculature. -
Quote:By using an actual damage dealer?Originally Posted by Johnny_Butane
What better way is there to improve a Tractor's farming capability than with Judgment?
You're fantasy story is getting more interesting though, now apparently people are using Tankers for farming instead of Brutes because "Let's drop the charade that Tankers are being used as anything other than farm tools by people who can't yet build a good enough Brute. - Johnny_Sniffing_Butane"
On top of this, those same people who are incapable of building a Brute, which requires coming to the forums and performing the incredibly difficult task of copy pasta drawing from any number of SS/FA Brute builds - are actually taking those Tankers onto incarnate trials IN DROVES to earn Judgement powers (on Lambda!!).
Judgement powers, which come into play at best once or twice (if you suck really hard) on an ambush farm map.
The best part?
None of the Tankers I've been running with are FA/SS. Perhaps there is some new farm magic tractor that I don't know about????? -
Quote:I'm laughing because after running, literally, over a thousand Incarnate Trials - I see heaps and heaps of Tankers.Originally Posted by Johnny_Butane
The number of people who play those two ATs greatly overshadow the small number who actually give a damn about Tankers beyond using them. The few who do care have learned long ago...
This is on both Freedom and recently Virtue. In fact, in the last week of iTrials alone, I've seen several leagues with 5+ tankers on BAF and Lambda runs.
What server are you playing on? Zukunft?
Oh, yeah...
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Quote:Yes post a build, and if you are Incarnate inclined I think Cardiac would be the ideal solution.Originally Posted by _Elektro_
I agree end use is/will be an issue. So should I perhaps consider hero side body mastery? Or can I get away with Cardiac?
The thing is this character is actually level 50 so I do have the one advantage of doing up a whole build. Should I post something?
Anyway.... still thinking about this. Appreciate the input.