Desitre
-
Posts
273 -
Joined
-
Quote:Ahh thank you I was absolutely confused on what happens because I've never attended one.Originally Posted by Sailboat
The times I've attended, a big bunch of Tankers gather and, after a certain amount of chatter, split up and run Task Forces or Trials, although very hard AE missions are also sometimes chosen.
You guys think a full team of tanks can run Lady Grey TF? -
You could drop the hasten and ss unless you prefer to have them on your tank. The reason I say you could drop them is a fire fire tank doesn't have a recharge problem really and super speed isn't needed if you have super jump.
You could probably use those two power slots for lets say...Fire Breath ( It's a really nice AoE) and the other spot for Burn. Burn is also another AoE but you throw it down on the ground and if the enemies aren't locked down they'll scatter but always run back to you. If they are locked down it can become one of your most powerful powers. -
So what happens at these tanker Tuesdays exactly? do we do all tanker raids or something like that?
-
Quote:No, even if you get tough and weave they still hurt you pretty bad when your getting thrown all over the place and not everyone can afford the IOs that provide kb protection AT LVL 30 . Also if your still leveling like this guy is, you already have enough defense for the missions he's currently doing, what I suggest is keeping tough and if you get weave( you don't need it that bad until you're doing much higher level things) but also get combat jumping or acro if you can. Then when you're 50 save up the cash for the io's and you can drop acro. but for the time being you probably should get it if you haven't in the future levels. Anyways if your travel power is super jump it's not that far out of your way to get.Originally Posted by Coldmed
so you rather get hit a lot harder standing up then down cause you don't want tough and weave...gotcha
To answer the question adressed by the thread, yes you'll notice weave a lot and you should get it, just remember that you need KB protection too.
I'm not telling him to go and respec everything for acro, if it's available to him he should get it until he hits 50 and has money for IO's. Then he can respec and get rid of it.If Acro is an available option for him. I am just giving him my opinion about what he should do just like the rest of you are expressing your opinions about what he should do. I'm not saying your guy's opinions are wrong but I'm just taking in consideration that he is only lvl 30 and may not have the money for IO's.
-
Quote:yes but if u only have tough and weave your going to get thrown around like a rag dollOriginally Posted by Coldmed
acro doesnt give any defense so your basically only defense will come from c.j. for about 2/3 %
and if you were at hami and tanked the mitos youll understand that aggro will be a issue with just acro.. -
Quote:No I play him a lot, and just recently I did a hami raid with him. I usually don't have much trouble with him. I have been told to do that but the problem I have is everyone in this game has the same powers now and I feel fine with acro. I totally see why you suggest to do this and my other build is built this way but the build with acro is much more enjoyable for me. I also have combat jumping so they both add up its just my defense isn't as good as someone with tough.Originally Posted by Coldmed
i dont get why taking acro makes it ok not to take tough or weave?
not to mention your can grab a knockback i.o and lose a toggle and save on a heavy endurance power like acrobactics.not to mention it doesnt give enough kb protection from alot of things in this game..sure your standard minions and such youll have no isssue with. but i tend to tank more in higher lvls where fakes,monsters and hami raids...all which acro is too low to help you.
with just fire sheild your also only at like tops 47% s/l protection . with another 23% from tough you would be even better..not by alittle but ALOT.
i take it as you either dont play it much or your just on s.o's ..not only have i had tough and weave since dec of 04 on my fire tank but its been handy for almost 5 years now where i wouldnt get rid of either....however dropping acro was great to not only free up a power choice but drop a toggle .
id say you should look into kb i.o's..theres plenty around and they arent exspensive -
Quote:yeah you got that right. Since you deleted your tank because you don't like the energy melee I would suggest trying fire out. If you do a Shield/Fire tank you will be a very dangerous machine. You'll probably out damage most tank and maybe if built right, you could take a lot more damage than a invul. although that would be pretty hard to do you would be up there.Originally Posted by StoneColdJoker
I can definitely see how Inv could get boring and how Shield could be more entertaining, especially the damage you could put out. Maybe I'll make one of each. lol
-
Quote:Usually people take weave because they also take tough. A lot of fire fire tanks prefer to go that route but I honestly prefer Acrobatics. I took acrobatics back in oct. of 2005 and still have not seen a need for tough. The thing is is a fire fire tank takes some strategy to play so it's all about opinion. Yes you will see the difference with weave, you won't get knocked down nearly as much as you do now, but you will see more of a difference with acrobatics but if you feel you need tough grab weave as well.Originally Posted by SteelMountain
My fire/fire tank is about to hit 30, and I am trying to decide if it is worth it to take Weave when I level up next. I have no other defense at present, and don't really have plans to try to get any through IO sets, so would I even notice the 7.5% that I could get from 3-slotted Weave?
-
Quote:D4 means there are four Ds look Darkness Darkness Darkness Defender. the reason there are three darkness's is for th two power pools and the mastery pool. we commonly refer to this as a pure darkness defener although some ppl prefer D4.Originally Posted by Chaos Creator
Unrelated to the topic at hand but why are you calling it a D4? Have you found some magical 4th dark pool? Because if not it is a D3.
-
Quote:horrible advice???? almost everyone on this thread agrees with everything except my ideas on tar patch and the healing. The only advice you can give the op is three powers??? maybe your advice is good for a few situations but we're talking about a lvl 50 not a lvl 10.Originally Posted by JamMasterJMS
Horrible advice, listen to nothing of this.
If by build advice your asking for slotting advice sorry, I cant help you. However, if your asking for powers advice, id say this.
Open with fearsome stare. Follow with tarpatch and then the TT+nightfall combo. If its an especially dangerous mob id put darkest night out on a boss/Lt. rinse repeat.
With soo many great powers it is difficult to pick which you want. -
Quote:okay so fire and ice isn't the best for damage but what about a pure fire tank against the ice shield, have you tried that because when using fire together you are more effective.Originally Posted by Ice_Ember
........ form the post you quoted....
all except RotP and temp protection... it really does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that the armors are taken. The only variable is temp protection, which still does not offer enough to take it except as a spot for IO's. I should have taken consume instead of Weave, but when I respec it will be to slot it up with IO's.
SO's on Fire armor is painful.
Also... the fire/ice has all the accolades and the shield/ice has none. The fire/ice should have been able to take a bit more on higher setting, but that did not happen. The shield, again with just SO's, was at 40% defense. (want me to list each armor again...)
also i apologize for not see what your buld was when i first read it it sounded like you only had three powers.
edit: man this thread has gone on for a long time. -
Quote:Okay enough of this arguing crap about pure darkness the reason it can go on forever is because pure darkness is probably the mst original and hybrid class in the game. You can play it sooo many different ways. The thing is is that its not a easy simplistic class and no one can ask for a perfect build. you must find out what build fits you best.Originally Posted by ShadowNate
You are DEAD wrong sir. Placing a tar patch before TT makes mobs far easier to bunch up if used properly (like I previously mentioned, puting it at the far edge of a mob, it will litterally make them line up to be shot to death especially by TT)). The -resistance in Tar patch makes up for the fairly ((lets be honest)) meh damage of /dark blast. Another thing is you can't safely corner pull with tenticles.
As for putting heal on auto...Thats just a bad idea. You might accidently draw agro on yourself while placing your cones, etc. Also, even with good slotting your looking at it chewing up 5 end when it goes off and it will take a solid 4-5 Seconds to recharge. If you are doing your job well with a dark/ then you should NOT need to be constantly healing, saving it for only when your fighting a nasty boss ((it does have a regen and damage debuff )) or when a lucky shot takes a bite out of your or someone elses hp, otherwise wasting it will not help your end bar or the survival of anyone else.
D:< You are a fruit salad, not a heal bot! Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
*edit*
Also, if you really are facing a stupid challege...like...I unno... Juggling multiple AV's/Giant monsters (you bet you **** I did that) Xyzyx is right, use fluffy to absorb the alpha strike, as soon as possible heal fluffy, douse whatever you're fighting with Fearsome stare and turn on Darkest Night. Fluffy is a pretty smart pet actually and will dump his own version of Darkest night (which is EXACTLY the same as yours, 10 targets AOE up to 25ft from the anchor) this will pretty much put a end to whatever it smacking on you. -
Quote:ok i admit u dont need the heal on auto at all times, sry i should have been more specific on when to use it.Originally Posted by Ignatz
I stopped reading right here. Taking Tar Patch as one of your last powers isn't very good advice. Not only is it a slow, but it's a -30% resistance debuff. You should take it when it's available, and slot it with recharge asap. Use it whenever it's up.
No mention of Darkest Night? It's another huge to-hit debuff(-18.75% unslotted). Combined with Fearsome stare, unslotted, that's 37.5% to-hit debuff.
I would hardly ever advocate keeping Twilight Grasp on auto(in fact I have never done so myself). There should never be a need to heal every 4ish seconds.
Now there is alway a huge thing with tar patch and tentacles, some people love love love tar patch, but honestly if you have tentacles(the biggest aoe hold in the game unless they recently nerfed it) you don't really need tar patch. Yeah its great but a d4 should have a fear and have tentacles so u dont need neccessarily tar patch.
also when using tentacles target the far back center because it is a cone attack -
Quote:sorry i also forgot to mention i have recall friend. Thanks too I mainly tank so i enjoyed your adviceOriginally Posted by Elaith
For empathy you want recharge, recharge, and some more recharge, it's all about getting those power buffs back as fast as possible. +Heal certainly can't hurt, but I wouldn't sacrifice recharge to get it.
That being said, if you're playing a pure empath I'd probly say ditch stamina. I know on my empath it's blasting that burns most of my end bar (admittedly he doesn't have leadership) and even with throwing out frequent attacks he has no issues w/o stamina. With recovery aura and conserve power you can keep your blue bar up pretty well without fitness. In place of stamina, I'd grab hasten (more recharge) and 2 other powers of your choice. (In keeping with a team support theme, stunning shot and recall friend?)
PS. Keep in mind the rule of 5, keep an eye out for recharge bonuses but it's easy to go over the limit of 5 per magnitude if you aren't careful. Especially on +5% recharge, doctored wounds has it and you can slot it in 5 powers by itself (I personally have it in 4.) -
Quote:okay great but what are the powers you are using with fire armor?Originally Posted by Ice_Ember
I used several missions and several enemy types. Five missions which are all identical. With the AE it is easy to switch around. Coucil, Freaks, Nems, Carnies, and Family. I timed each map with hero stats. I had to use Heroic setting because bosses would take too long with Ice Melee.
The build is an SO build for both. The Ice powers are slotted the same for both toons. 3 recharge in FE, 3 rech and 3 Dam in burn. BA 1 acc, 3 dam, two end reduc, armors are 3 resist 1 end reduc. It had Tough and Weave but could not run Weave do to End issues.
This was a direct comparison of Fire Armor to Shield Defense. SHield wins as most offensive. Shield Charge affects 16 at a time. Fiery Embrace only increases damage on maximum ten enemies, with Burning Aura, Frost, and Frozen Aura. Burn only affects five enemies at once.
Shield Wins. Fire is not the most offensive tank. Though, it is offensive, kinda like farting really loud in religious ceremony. -
Okay so here's the thing I have a pure empathy with leadership, archery(I know i should have went rad but i'm already 50) fitness, power mastery and flight. I need to know what set bonuses I should get.
My build:
All of the Empathy powers
All the leadership powers
Archery-
--Rain of arrows
--snap shot
--Aim
Fitness-
--Swift
--stamina
--health
Flight and Hover
Power mastery-
--Conserve power
--Power build up -
THE SECRET TO A PURE DARKNESS!!!!
Okay, I just want to say something before I help you. A pure Darkness Defender is one of the best defenders out there lol. Okay I'll give you some key powers you need-
-Dark Servant
-Tentacles
-Your AoE heal
-Your AoE rez
-Your fear power
-Your sniper power(can't remember the name of it.)
-Tar patch(this is recommended to be one of the last powers you get because tentacles does a way better job.)
-there are two powers you should get in you mastery set:
--The endurance power(can't remember the name of it)
--Oppressive gloom
Also this is not needed but highly recommended: get hover & flight and get fitness
Technique while playing a darkness:
keep your Aoe heal on auto. If your going against an av or a huge mob throw your res off even if people are alive so the enemies are debuffed and you can actually effect them. After that throw off tentacles. If you have a very good tank and the groups are held togather throw down tar patch. Also always have Dark Servant out at all times. ***Know when to use those two mastery powers, this is key and will help you.
I have been playing my fire fire tank since 2005 and My uncle has played his Pure darkness since 05 aswell. We are a superior match against any enemies and these are his secrets to playing his d3. If you can get in a team with a kin, a fire fire tank and a stone, you four will be able to take on what 12 man teams can't.
I hope this helps you and if you need any other help feel free to pm me. It's hard to find anyone who plays pure darkness right anymore. -
Quote:Whats your build on your fire powers? (what I mean is what are all the powers you are using with the firey aura) The reason I ask that is because ever since ED Fire tanks all have to play with strategy, you can't run in there guns a-blazin'. Also since you only ran one mission I find your test invalid because some enemies are more resistant to fire than others.Originally Posted by Ice_Ember
Play Super strength and have 80% all the time. Play Shields and have 65% when surrounded by ten mobs.
Every 90 seconds is not nearly a good enough buff.
I have a fire/ice tank and a shield/ice tank at 50. Running the same missions and using the buffs as they are up, the shield/ice is significantly faster than the fire/ice.
Shield/ice will do the mission in 5:40 on average.
fire/ice will do the mission in 9:00 on average.
It is the exact same mission set 5 times. (Thank you AE.)
Shield Charge + Against All Odds > Fiery Embrace + Burning Aura + Burn -
Quote:if u scroll up you will see the name of this forums section; TANKERS: talk about issues related to being a Tanker here!Originally Posted by DaveMebs
Who said it has to be tankers? the thread is called Best Damage Aura.....Scraps get damage auras, heck, even certain blasters get damage auras....Leadership on a blaster or *maybe* a scrapper is in no way unreasonable.
I think if your looking to do damage go fire. A fire fire tank does the most damage out of all the other tanks, their known for it. Now if you want to be able to tank( i mean hardcore tanking) and deal lots of damage. go stone as your defense and fire melee for your damage. Also, try Firey Aura with Ice melee. A very powerfull tank indeed.
Remember too that with firey aura you get burn, which in my situation of tanking on my fire fire, i live on burn. If you can throw burn down on top of a bunch of enemies that are locked down with say... tenacles, You will be doing sooo much damage and the enemies will try to run away but they will be locked down and you take barely even any damage.
Firey aura also has a self res that can be used to deal alot of damage if built right. If you end up taking firey aura i reccomend getting either Acrobatics and Defensive Maneuvers (Leaping power pool) or getting tough and weave (Fighting power pool) -
Quote:Thanks for the thread info, im going to have to read it and see how well it works out for me.Originally Posted by scraps_ifound
there is another thread dealing with Fire/fire tanks and defense..
my fire/fire tank is nearly Defense Capped in melee which means he only gets hit 5% of the time by melee attacks
with this build I like tanking on my fire/fire tanker more then my granite brute..
my heal comes back faster then I need it to..
and I have even had people thank me for restoring their faith in Fire tankers
check it out
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=185583 -
Quote:So you're suggesting that I don't even really bother with Set bonuses and just go with enhancements and the IOsOriginally Posted by FlamingIntern
What I mean by a few IO's, is that I have a few uncomplete sets spread throughout my powers. I had even less than that, maybe even 6 total, when I tanked on the STF. As for my team, there was just one /kin troller on it, the rest were damage AT's. I also don't have Tough or Weave on my tank, don't really believe in having to go outside the set for res/def toggles. Honestly, yes you're going to get alot more damage done to you then most tankers. But that doesn't matter if you just use strategy and make sure you survive to keep the aggro. This is why RoTP is an amazing power as is, because even if you do die you have a self rez so a support character doesn't have to waste theirs. It also adds to damage mitigation with the chance of stunning a few mobs. And as for making FE work with other damage types...how would that even make sense conceptually? Yes, it really only works well with the Fire primary, but no ones forcing you to take it. If anything it opens up a power slot if you don't want to take it, so if you find you're having survival problems you can take a power better suited for immediate help. Fire tanking isn't tanking on easy mode like it used to be, and to be honest it's ALOT more fun to tank with my Fire/Fire now then the pre-ED and Burn nerfs.
So in a nutshell, other than maybe a few MINOR number tweaks, Fire Armor is working just fine. -
Okay, so you guys with the IO's seem to be doing just fine, I don't know about soloing stf but who knows. Does Anyone have any suggestion as to what set bonuses I should be looking at?
Also someone said to be more specific. I am having trouble taking on mobs. I usually have to use burn so they are running away from me reducing their chances to hit and have auto heal on. I go into the fight trying to kill off the enemies before I die, and when I do die i use rise of the phoenix. The point is I don't want to be dying all the ******* time and it never use to be like this. Honestly I can only take on half a mob with confidence. I find myself packing green insp and thats it!! EDIT: (The only time i feel i take on the world is when im with a kin, a d3 or with a stone stone)
If someone knows a way were I can improve my defense I would really like to know. Right now my build is; All possible shields and resistances with burn, build up, greater fire sword, fire sword circle, combustion, fitness, Acrobatics, firey embrace. I have some set bonuses but I think they actually made me weaker!!! -
CoH/V was my first mmorpg I ever played and I first created my Fire/Fire tank back in Oct. of 2005. I loved it. It was strong, did lots of AoE damage, and fit my play style of tanking very well. I have taking breaks from CoH/V from time to time but have always found myself coming back to it because of the great fun I could have tanking against mass amounts of enemies!!! Herding to corners, wiping out mobs, doing what a tank does best. Now, I can no longer do that.
I know Fire Aura hasn't always been the strongest defense, and could never take on as much as a stone could, but I still could tank. I find myself always playing as the secondary to the main tank, getting the scraps and runaways! That is a scrappers job not a Tank!!! I am a Tank, I am suppose to be able to take on what everyone else can't. Taking the hits for the team, protecting, and destroying all in my way!!! Can't do that now though. I have seen scrappers take on more than I can, I am dealing enough damage to keep the aggro, but I just can't take the hits.
The Devs have nerf'd us time and time again, but this is ridiculous. I have seen and heard fire fire tanks saying," I can't be the main tank" "I can't take the hits" or "I can't herd" That is the tanks job and the Fire-Fire tanks aren't able to do it! IT NEEDS TO BE FIXED!!! Give the fire aura more resistance or something!! Give us more defense!!!
I heard that the Devs nerf'd the Fire aura because a spine/fire scrapper was to strong???? So they kill a tank to fix a scrapper, not a very well thought out plan. The best advice anyone can give a 50 fire fire tank is to make a NEW tank, that is stronger. I don't see why I or any fire fire tank should have to throw away all their hard work and hard hours and badges away because they made a character and the game changed that character into something else.
I'm not asking to make us as strong as a stone tanker, but make us strong enough to be able to BE a tanker. Give us more defense or resistance and if you can't do that, than give us something to allow us to change our fire aura and swap it out for a different power. Something like a respec but it allows you to change your powers. And if you have to give it to everyone, allow us to do a Task Force that rewards you with a Power-Swap Respec!!!
Please Respond to this thread, I want at least a chance for the developers to hear us fire fire tanks!!! And hear our cry!! We are no longer tanks!!! and Something has to be done!!!