_zak_

Earning pressed cheese for the Villan side (atm) is a lot harder due to not having tons of 50's to fuel the low alts so they can perma stay in SG mode.- so its quite amazing really that a few Villan groups are WAY above some hero ones..

My hat is off to you sirs...

While I agree with Filth, however at the moment, the arena is very buggy, and therfore for some, 2 times out of 5 players cannot see there team-mates - You need to allow for bugs at least I think.?

We have tried the test server for PVP recently, but was extremly laggy, not sure when this event will take place, but I feel that will be a better option (after I7 is out maybe)?

Brimmy, I am certianly not trying to abort his TF, I welcome it in fact, but the point was his idea of it being a UNION event is a little unwanted due to him being "solo" - and the fact that he thinks it is a challnge to do somthing alone, when there are other things in the game that will offer tons more excitment that what he thinks.

end off. as I have said already.
Good luck!.
(in case you missed it the first time, when you didnt read my post)

Raz no offence here, but you want us to stay out of your PVE world as us "PVP Wannabe's" stay in our own, this would not be so bad accept the fact that you chose to ruin the PVP toruney by having conversations over arena channel when the organisers were trying to do somthing for the community
and kept getting abusive when we asked you to be quiet..

We however have not ruined it for you, err I think you have just done that for yourself. throw your toys out the pram all you want. but the fact is you have X amount of 50's but yet still dont know how to get a challnge to the game? I find that odd, and in your perception soling missions is a challange then so be it.

you said, and I quote "And since most people don't wanna do TFs or even bother with me ingame" - reason of this is due to your attitude above, why is it when I have ever seen you in game, or even heard about. you have ruined the game expereince around you. - This game would be a lot more fun for everyone if you treated people with respect, and then maybe people would want to team with you on TF's and to have fun in the normal team play way!.

You can have your toys back now as long as you "grow up" a bit.

Dont take this as a flame, but just a few home truths. and making topics such as this makes you sound a bit silly as anyone can do it but yet you choose to make it a big deal.

Have a nice day

zor my Spines/da scrapper has 1.3 million
and the rest of my mains/alts have about 700ish
with my lowest at about 300

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boring maybe.. but its a challenge.. something this game lacks sometimes..

As for posting it here, I feel its a UNION - EVENT that one of its well known (I should hope I am) has done something "out of the ordinary" and "ONLY ON UNION THE HAPPENED".. hence the location

And if I wanted it easy.. I'd get a team to do it.. but I want as said.. a "challenge".

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errm, a challenge..? last time I did a TF solo, it was simple and easy..the TF adapts to the players in mission regardless to how many start. - I fail to see how this is a UNION event as its just you doing it. and none the less you are trying to make yourself sound "uber" by soling somthing that 100% of the server can do anwyay...

so err good luck!

no the idea is for raz to solo a said TF of his choice.
in my eyes its easier solo than with a group.. a lot less hassle. however. a lot less boring too. - but its his idea and so be it.

...or Am I missing the point aswell. as lets face it how many of us has actually started a TF and had the entire team drop.. then you just finish it yourself anyway, assuming you have the right build to do it of course. so not entirly sure why this thread was started also...

sounds good
I'll be there!

Thanks all. was a fun trip to 50 with this toon. (although my other spines/da was more fun I think) - but alas its another spine to add to my collection.

not sure some of us will be there yet, as test server is too buggy to play. i.e too much lag. and the worst was not being able to see anyone health bars due to GFX Coruption.

the people on hero's side is not the problem. its the 300000 villans all doing mayhem missions with there lag fested new thugs and elec elec brutes!

unless there is a patch before next week, i;d say keep it live untill its stable at least.

This whole topic is "evolution of PVP" builds, AT's anc certain powers are like fashion. they come and go, and so does the moaning...

Once this power hits mainstream in PVP in the EU, Im sure there will eventually be a way to couter it, bublers/sonics will then be target 101 all the time, rendering them pretty useless to a team.

Cast your minds back somewhat. Stormies were the evil ones. I remember the outrage of posts that came flooding in about these.. then people learned how to counter them, and eventually how to make them useless.

I mean I remember when Kinetics were not even wanted in pvp at all..now there one of the most important powersets other than an empath imo.

Same with rads and scrappers. - people screamed. - then they learned that foc acc was the way forward.. and so be it. the screaming stoped.

Now with Sonic Cages, Det feild, just need to learn a) to avoid them and to make them a target priority. - bubblers now wont even be a problem now ID from kinetic will offer walking up to them to say Hi!.

So whats a problem now. will soon be a has been.. but right now Bublers/sonic are the new storm. - learn it, learn them and move on.

One word

Kinetics!

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I'm pretty new to the whole MMORPG thing. I'm still trying to get my head round the whole concept of what is a good build. The main aspect of PVP that puts me off is the lack of segregation between various skill levels (not to mention the childish over the top comments of some players). My main toon is only level 32. It's more likely for me to come up against someone in my level range who's maybe got a whole account of various toons. The idea of getting my butt kicked on a regular basis by more experienced players just doesn't do anything for me....
Old school Street Fighter 2 on the Super Nintendo however (showing my age)....

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But if you think like this.. you will ALWAYS think this way, and therfore PVP for you and your own enjoyment will be unfair in your own mind. - if you play in the mindset that you want to learn then it will be a totaly differnt expereince for you, needless to say the zones are a good start, as you can go at your own pace. - but if that is not for you (personally I hate the silly childish smack talk) - then try arena with us on wens nights and I think this will change the whole perception of what you currently think now.

IMO You cant just get the game, then say Right im gonan go kik butt in PVP. it takes time, workable builds and tactics/soulutions and movment skills, but this will all come by "doing" rather that saying no.

People seem to think that You have to have a 100% dedicated PVP build to play well.. this is far from the truth. a normal PVE build can do real well, but a Pure PVP will perform better.

You only learn what you cant do. remember that.

*/kins are a support AT, and will act simular to an empath. - They will aid the DMG dealers to prevent them having problems on the feild such as Hurricane, Bubbles, slows, and regen and of course speed.

For defence there priority would be to SB/ID and stack them frequently enough - and for offence, you have of course slows, end drain and siphon speed/power - Fulcrum shift is the most amazing power of a Kin set for PvE but for PVP never really seen it used and would never base a tactic around this power.

Once the team is set, then the *kin can attack supporting targets assisting via a team-mate. i.e end draining or slows etc etc. plus whatever there primary is. - normally slowing there DMG dealers and draining them of -DMG is always a good idea - or end draining a Stone tank for toggledropping can also be fun.

Ask a Kin for there SB+SuperJump and you will love them forever

We have played low level PVP before. although was a bit of fun between SG mates. but I'd never consider entering a comp for that level, will just be chaos and no fun at all. - however this is my view of it and not of others.

So good luck to it. please dont let me put anyone off.

Although this is a great idea. but why not make it wens night at 8:30 on test. as thats when we do a lot of praccy PVP and test builds etc anwyay - that way you can join us. and even have a few mixed teames too of hero/villans

Just a suggestion anwyay..

Nice and honest though ashen, thats totaly fair enough, - I can understand that PVP is not everyones liking, but reading through thease posts, seems that its generally the attitude that makes a lasting sour taste.

Luckily the PVP commuity is not like the zones. - I'd like to take this chance to openly suggest that you at least try PVP on say a wednesday night (tommrow) on test server at 8:30 in PI arena. - we do mixed teams, so any build is welcome and no need for min/max as its all about "doing" rather than a true competitive event. - I think and or at least anyone who comes on wens nights will tell you that its in the best interests of fun... I mean some of the french turn up somtimes.. How much more fun do you need than that

The games I cant take credit for Knightstalker arranges the events, but Im sure he/we will appreciate anyone showing up.

So how about it ?

For those that dont know how to get the test server to work, there is a "welcome to the training room" thread in the test server topic.

Show yourselves and enjoy it

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after the pentad match i have tested alot of things to have confirmed, actual facts, and no specualtions regarding the so called unbalance between heroes and villains, which have been a very hot debate lately... and the final conclusions is, that no matter what, there was no way any of the villain-teams could have beaten the heroes in the recent Pentad event. coz even tho there was some slight differense, it wouldnt have compensated the lack of skill that villains have regarding their powersets (not overall PvP-skill).

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Villans are based on DMG At's - a min/max build on 1v1 would possibly outcome that of a hero. - therfore I'd like to know how you arranged these figures. - maybe post your differnces? would be some interesting reading.

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1) Slots make slight differense (not the full boost, but still a boost) and wont make much differense unless u plan poorly, such as granite armor 3 slots of dmg-res, while a lvl 50 might have 3 dmg res+3def.. makes differense in comparison, and would truely be make a diff on the brute. however theese kinds of cruscial slot-mistakes can be adjusted without the last 10 lvls, so in general the lack of slots, can be ignored, as long as u plan ur build correct for a lvl 40 build.the same can be said about accolades, tho ie 'Eye of the Magus' combined with 'Elude' would be nice, but wouldnt win the battle.

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Villans are equally able to do a respec into a PVP build at lvl 40. I know I did, and Im sure Im not alone. - therefor its comes down to common sence rather than facts and figures in your equasion.

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2) 1 huge misstake was made in the pentad tourny, due to no/bad info... no need to blame the events hosts for this, just a unhappy flaw (and wouldnt have changed the outcome anyway) SK/LK do NOT work in arena.. a lvl 35 is still a lvl 35, regarding def (and other effects) relations between lvl 38 and lvl 40 is none. (both will be treated as same lvl regarding acc/def/dmg/etc)

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This is true, but however only a very small margin of people were below the desired level. - and to be really honest, it would not make such a hugh impact and cannot blame the tourney or any losses due to this. I know of people that have played up to 8 times lower in strengh agaisst some of the better teams and yet still manged to win. this sounds like an escape route for you.. Dont do it!

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3) as said before, MMs has not yet found their place in PvP, and still needs alot of testing. in the meantime, MMs will be easy kills and that tips the scale of the 'even' fight situation, but not the basic balance. as soon as some1 can find a good arena-build for an MM, they will be as good as defenders or controllers in PvP. (imo MMs have found their use in base-raids with great results, but in Arena, things are alot diff and still needs to be tested for final use. my guess is buffer/debuffer only with random spawn of pets, just to confuse)

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Again this is all about teamwork, the main problem was MM's tried to use there pets to early IMO, Was too easy for the blaster on the Hero side to run in and Nuke. Knowing powers from hero side would of made you have starting tactics differntly and evaded the nuke and had a better opertunity to release pets.

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why most villains play PvP as a rigid team, prefered to be rooted down, is prolly because of MMs and their team-buffs.. i myself try to use theese buffs as much as possible (its still my PvE build, and since im not 50 yet, i have no intention of making a true PvP-build, and im sure this is the case for many other villains. and since we are PvE-built, atleast i am implementing the PvE-tactics to PvP, to use as much of my MM in PvP. this works rather well in bases, not in arena or zones, where the close quarters helps containing the good movement of PvP-heroes)

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Im sorry but this is crazy talk from somone who recently boasted about being the richest VG on Union and who are wanting PVP challenges... then you say you use tactics from PVE into PVP!. - the 2 should never be in the same sentance IMO. (You can learn what is a good power from PVE) but Never tactics. - as regards to movment. if you are rooted, then you stand more of a chance in getting targetd. - PVP skill is not just about killing, but also being evasive too, Your buffer needs to be on the move and use his movment skills to buff as he does so.

Not having a PVP build is your own fault. Why make that statement and then moan about it? respec into one then try again?

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one thing i havent figured out yet, is why corruptors cant touche me, when blasters can. in PvE corrs are (imo) alot better than blasters, and feels as one of the games, most complete ATs. i guess ppl just have to learn and realize this, and we are sure to see this in the future.

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Again knowing powers, Bubblers are powerfull and anoying. but Add a Kinetics to the team and Fort and bubblers become less powerfull.

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one problem here is that the fact that ppl feel overrun and totally helpless needs to be fixed. perhaps its because casual PvP-ers arent fully aware of the fact that players that take part in ie Three Lions pentad teams, do nothing else (figure of speach, dont take it litterary). i remember the 1st time i entered arena when it was on test, and ppl where fighting 24/7 even as it was swamped with bugs and bad even-adjusts. (such as perma-elude, 6 HOs in attacks, etc).

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3 Lions are an expereinced outfit, of course anyone to come accross them will be hard done by, but like any team, you play and practice enough, min/max teams then it wont be so bad. - that is due to discression of the player/team to do so. - as said in other threads, there is practice sessions on test server on wens nights, why not come along too? you will learn somthing.

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I am more of a PvE-Expert, than PvP. I do things in PvE that ppl wouldnt dream of testing, and would die if they tried, while in PvP ppl luagh at me. i think we need to enlighten the players of the huge amount of hours some ppl sspend in this game, doing what they do best, and that there is no way in hell u can compete with their skills (and i guess even talent) unlss u do the same.. casual PvPers shouldnt fight PvP-experts, unless its for educational purpouses only perhaps then ppl wont complain as much..

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erm you are not a PVP player? - then WHY advertise yourself as one in the harsh "we own in raids" Threads then? - and secondly. PVP Groups prefer to have a Aim or Target to beat. - why not try and fight the best, EVEN if you know that you wont stand a chance? - but if there is a small possibility that you can walk away knowing that you need to enhance on your existing build then its all good..right? - and besides people like to benchmark there own level of skill from other SG/VG's

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remember that guy outside the every PvP-zone warning u for hostile players? take that warning for what it is. if u gt killed in a PvP-zone, it is the nature of the Zone. complaining about the cercumstances (bad spelling) they got killed, would be the same as complaining to the longbow warden that he should have waited while u rested

i dont ever get upset when i get killed in a PvP-zone, and i never will.. same thing goes in the arena. gloating/boastin and snotty remarks kinda go with the territory... it cant be excluded, but i really dont find it to be as abusive as it could be.

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Generally you get a lot of smack talk in zones, however in arena PVP there never is. - we show upmost respect to who we ae fighting and they do the same for us - we never brag, or gloat or simple moan and outrage, it just isn't cool!.

Have a good day.

by the way X-treme is indeed Shamen-X - so I would personally LOVE to see them fight themselves.. :P

/em gets popcorn

As PVP is evergrowing in our community, and we are always willing to encourage more and more into the world of what us PVP's thrive on so much. - however, of late there has been a LOT of people that always HATED the entire aspect of PVP and now with a little guidence from the community, he/she/they are enjoying the thrill to maximum.

So without this becoming a flame war, just out of interest,
What do you not like about PVP? - I would really like to find out so maybe we can get more and more people involved if they are somewhat mislead.

Thanks
zak

yup should be good..

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this isnt the right place to say it but it's relevant to the quotes why use AS in the first place? if u no you'll b seen its like sitting nexxt to some1 and asking for a slap, even when seen if u have hide bonus ur guaranteed a crit which will do massive dmg, just go with that and follow it up with a couple of attacks, u dont have to kill them in 1 hit, AS has its uses, in a team with a good empath it has none

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And all you have to do, is tell a brute or corupter your target, AS=low health, and let your team finish him off. - Communication will allow a better flow of teamplay in one form or another. - and working together as a team can win matches.

To be honest kin, all is required is "time" - villans need to min/max v heroes in order to lean how to use the AT's effectivly, bearing in mind the team they host will need to focus on DMG output to break through any team. and right now tactics from villans are somewhat lacking in terms of Heros.

Sure thats to be expected though, as villans for pvp is still young in comparison.

Looking at the builds for villans, you have a MM, that once died then takes forever to reload his pets, upgrade, get back in the battle etc. by this time all his team are fighting 1 man down.. - secondly a Stalker is best when in hide. so untill he can visually see a good attempt to one shot a sqiggy then he is effectivly out of the game for a while and is not able to assist his team mates as he requires hide to do so.

Right now, to me and from what I saw last night. is the Villans seem to playing a PvE team and tactics in a PVP game. - the 2 should never be mixed.

As I said in a differnt post, to get better builds and to find what works/does'nt then villans need to find a few SG's on union to train with. - Most of the PVP groups train weekly, and will be good to get a villan group involved so we can offer our view to them about what was effective or not.

So if any villans want to train, then feel free to contact me @zak or join us from 8:30 on wens nights and we will all be happy to help.

it all sounds good and all.. however why the level 1 to 5? surely this is too low to be creative with anything.

If it was 40-50 I'd be interested.
personally I just dont see the fun or skill in lvl 1 to 5 games.

really enjoyed the games.. was fun, a lot of fun.

some late adjustments in our team layout saw me using my blaster instead of my scrapper, alas, elec/elec is a joy to play :P