Another_Fan
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Quote:Originally Posted by Schismatrix
Well, a bit less hyperbolic straw man use, but do you really still believe that the reason NCsoft stopped reporting the subscription numbers for all its games, thus bringing its reporting practices in line with other MMO publishers, was solely because of declining CoH numbers? Really?
i expect GR to give a healthy boost to the numbers when it comes out, and i really do think a fair bit of the most recent income slump might be slightly related to the economy. No, really.
I have to agree about GR giving a bump to bottom line numbers but its sales and the sales of booster packs should be broken out into a separate category. These things all have a cost associated with them (I have no idea what that might be) and their own profit stream.
I'd also bet that GR brings back some old players that had left though I don't know how many. These days I rarely see players with less than 2 or 3 years of vet badges. So I have to wonder how many old players are going to go OOOH AHHHH I can have my nerfed to heck regen go villain and get even.
I know I will probably buy 1 copy of GR no matter what. I don't know that I will need to or want to buy them for all the accounts.
The question is "will GR get new people to play ?" Its a really great feature for those of us that have been playing but frankly the biggest plus is getting my villains out of the rogue isles so they can actually buy and sell things. If I were a new player and found out about the market problems, I might just want to say call me back when you have fixed them. Ultra Mode is also going to be a draw, but praetoria ? I just don't know. So far it doesn't sound compelling -
Quote:No what I was saying was the original is too ill formed to prove anything.Originally Posted by spiritfox
Yep.
I don't think it proves any of those things.
But here's me at 8:49 pm
http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/618/screen1ug.png
And here's me at 9:06 pm
http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/6456/screen2e.png
8.9 bubbles at 31 in 17 minutes. That included loading into and out of a mission twice (I have a new computer thats quite nice, so the load times are short, under 20 seconds).
My fire scrapper at the same level could have done it in about 13 min. This was a SS/SD brute, so factor in the fact that I had low fury sometimes from whiffing, rage crashes without enough recharge to double stack, and facing a mob that has high S/L resists and little fire resist.
No intentions of sharing my method (hence the lack of seeing anything but landscape and my xp bar and clock) but I do promise that it was done solo.
If you can beat it doesn't prove that end is not a constraint if you can't beat it, it doesn't prove it is.
If you can beat it great but you havent demonstrated end is not a constraint.
If you can't beat it you haven't demonstrated end is a constraint.
If I said the maximum rotational velocity of the axles of an automobile were the constraints for landspeed then miscalculated what they were it would be something similar. -
Quote:Does illustrate the fact that this is not one "Conjecture" but at least 3Originally Posted by spiritfox
I got my claws/sr brute from 30 to 50 in about 6 hours and my fire/shield scrapper from 20 to 50 in about 8 all over the last week.
1. The fastest way to accumulate XP/end is ST +2 boss kiling
2. The rate of endurance recovery is at best fully slotted stamina over the career
3. The rate that endurance can be generated caps how fast you can level solo
2. Is certainly wrong.
1. Most likely wrong but it assumes that an endless stream of bosses can be survived indefinitely another popping up as fast as the last one is killed and never doing more damage than can be absorbed at all levels.
3. goes out the window. Especially seeing that endurance for particular AT powerset combinations can be generated faster than it can be consumed. Even those that cant , can just buy blues and use what drops.
Someone may or may not be able to beat the challenge but they won't have demonstrated much of anything. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Reiraku
The community as a whole, or are you using the personal preferences of a minor fraction of the community to speak for them all?
Its really hard to summarize any community as a whole, especially when that community has the potential to contain people with multiple personalities ;-) But,The vitriol over the idea that everyone should have a third pvp build only for use in pvp zones, that could be built out however they wanted using any available IOs was intense. There was no mistaking where they were coming from. The funny thing was there even seemed to be pve'ers who felt making a great build was a needed form of one upsmanship for them and this would diminish it.
So yes, I would go with the bulk of the community felt that way and you can take it as evidence that some people can't be happy unless they know others are unhappy. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Coyote_Seven
MPBT and Airwarrior ftw.
LOL you never tried to take off from an air field that was surrounded by flakpanzers and had Messerschmitts and spitfires orbiting above just waiting to vulch you while you tried to take off.Quote:The learning curve was higher back then! I wonder if that equated to more intelligent opponents who were not so prone to ganking?
$8/hr to play but loads of fun just the same. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Fury Flechette
Completely agree with this. I think the devs stumbled onto the right formula (quite by accident) but never followed through. I remember at one point there were 12 or 13 full RV instances on Test. Why did it work so well? My opinion:
* Instant level to 40 - no grinding PvE to get to a PvP level
* SOs - build didn't come down to "gear"
* An opportunity to try a whole bunch of different builds without guessing whether or not it would be viable or not
I'd be curious to see how popular something like this would be if they brought it back.
Well there is a big thread on the market forum where the PvP community in no uncertain terms lays out they like having better gear than the other guy and using it to bash em, don't expect it to go over well with them. -
Quote:You probably wouldn't like how that would work out in practice. Best case you would get groups of friends taking a dive for each other and alternating, worst case you would get the opposition planting people on your team to take a dive.Originally Posted by Dawnslayer
If there was a point to PVP i'd do it.
Say a one time event where heroes had to protect something/villains had to destroy it. STORY BASED.
Then next issue a different event heroes and villains could partake in, all with their own special but not gamebreaking awards, like costume pieces. And the next event went off of if heroes won more often/villains won more often.
Yeah, i'd PVP if there was something like that. That is to say, a point. -
Quote:That was an aside.Originally Posted by Schismatrix
Title of thread: The solo leveling limit conjecture
Edit: While i find many of your comments interesting you seem to keep missing the explicitly stated point of the challenge and dwelling on conditions that are mostly irrelevant to it.
Anywho The conjecture is that the availability of end is the constraint on how rapidly you can do things in the game, in this case level. Well that is apparently just not the case.
I don't have the constants to work back the leveling rate to a DPS number but I am pretty sure the column 5 and column 6 numbers break anything that is reasonably achievable.
Putting the 6.5 hours into context, I also have not heard of /regen scrappers /ment blasters leveling at spectacular speeds. If they were able to we would see hordes of them used to pl others.
Edit just another on the aside about end being the constraint. A team of 8 rads would be expected to hit 50 8 hrs / 2.5 or approximately 3 1/3 hrs.
DPS seems more the constraint. -
FWIW
I extended out your table for a variety of reasonable endurance regimes.
Code:The third column is with all the recovery IOS2 0 3 0.01 0.01 0.01 0.01 4 0.02 0.02 0.02 0.01 5 0.04 0.03 0.03 0.02 6 0.06 0.05 0.05 0.03 7 0.09 0.07 0.07 0.05 8 0.12 0.10 0.09 0.07 9 0.16 0.13 0.12 0.09 10 0.21 0.17 0.16 0.12 11 0.26 0.22 0.20 0.15 12 0.31 0.26 0.24 0.18 13 0.37 0.31 0.29 0.21 14 0.44 0.36 0.34 0.25 15 0.5 0.41 0.39 0.29 16 0.59 0.49 0.46 0.34 17 0.68 0.56 0.53 0.39 18 0.8 0.66 0.62 0.46 19 0.93 0.77 0.72 0.53 20 1.1 0.91 0.85 0.63 21 1.29 1.07 1.00 0.74 1.18 22 1.54 1.27 1.19 0.88 1.30 23 1.83 1.51 1.42 1.04 1.42 24 2.14 1.77 1.66 1.22 1.56 25 2.5 2.07 1.94 1.43 1.72 26 2.88 2.38 2.23 1.64 1.89 27 3.32 2.75 2.57 1.89 2.09 28 3.82 3.16 2.96 2.18 2.31 29 4.36 3.61 3.38 2.49 2.55 30 4.9 4.06 3.79 2.80 2.79 31 5.52 4.57 4.27 3.15 3.06 32 6.2 5.13 4.80 3.54 3.37 33 6.95 5.75 5.38 3.97 3.70 34 7.78 6.44 6.02 4.44 4.07 35 8.63 7.14 6.68 4.93 4.45 36 9.57 7.92 7.41 5.46 4.86 37 10.61 8.78 8.21 6.06 5.33 38 11.67 9.66 9.03 6.66 5.80 39 12.88 10.66 9.97 7.35 6.34 40 14.27 11.81 11.05 8.14 6.95 41 15.82 13.09 12.25 9.03 7.64 42 17.56 14.53 13.59 10.02 8.42 43 19.45 16.10 15.06 11.10 9.26 44 21.51 17.80 16.65 12.28 10.17 45 23.78 19.68 18.41 13.57 11.18 46 26.08 21.58 20.19 14.89 12.20 47 28.41 23.51 21.99 16.21 13.24 48 30.77 25.46 23.82 17.56 14.29 49 33.16 27.44 25.67 18.93 15.35 50 35.59 29.45 27.55 20.31 16.43
The 4th column is with all the recovery IOS and perf shifter in stam 10 end/50 sec
The Fifth column is with stamina and QR
The Sixth is with Drain psyche at 50% up time. On blasters this caps out at 8.3 end sec give or take I used 8 end/sec as the number.
These can be plugged back into your calculations to see what the kill rate would have to be but as an observation Somewhere around QR+stamina with recovery IOS endurance recovery is probably not a limiting factor
Edit: Assuming a team of 8 of these and getting the 2.5x large team bonus that would be 1-50 in 6.5 hours -
Quote:The problem is without the calculation no one can even look at or make a change to the assumptions to see if they are modeling anything that even connects to the game.Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Another_Fan:
I'm not so much interested in comments on the raw calculations themselves as I'm interested in knowing if there are empirical tests that can contradict them. I posted the per-level table so that theoretically speaking anyone could take a character of any level and test leveling strategies to see if its possible to beat the curve I specified. You could take anything and see how high you can get XP/min to go at a particular level, and see if its faster than the curve implies.
The other way to look at this is the way you mention: try to calculate how *fast* someone can generate damage. But the problem with that is that sustainable damage is actually very tricky to calculate boundaries for. When I attempt such calculations, I end up with limits higher (faster) than the endurance one. So the endurance one is, at least for me at the moment, the stronger constraint, so its the more interesting one.
Take the biggest hit to the primary assumption that end is the determiner of rate. Well fully slotted stamina is about the least of the plus end powers. QR on on willpower and regen comes in early and is 20% superior to stamina.
Is QR+Stamina actually better ? Or at some point do you hit a point where you cant effectively turn more end into damage ?
If end alone is the limiting factor, On a blaster drain psyche is at minimum 3 times better than stamina and can cap your end recovery , with the right build it can be up 100% of the time. An ugly thing to try and calculate what could be achieved at what level point but once again if you are going to say end is the limiting factor this is the extreme case.
So the question becomes how much end can you use ?
There is also the question of does the end/sec you are funneling in exceed the maximum DPS chain achievable ?
The scrappers have a giant set of threads on this and Werner IIRC had a very detailed spreadsheet on this. The blasters seem to have tried halfheartedly awhile ago, but DPS on a blaster is very negatively impacted by deaditis. -
Quote:May Tipper Gore burn forever, along with doctor wertham and Jack thompson*. Unfortunately my nation like most has no shortage of people that know whats better for others. And even worse we have a legal system that allows them to make a colossal nuisance of themselves.Originally Posted by Dr_Mechano
I meant gaming wise, not movie wise, in Britain we do have a heavy restriction on Adult movies of course (the 18R is the equivilent of an Adults Only in America which is only purchasable at certain shops in Soho and restricted to 'educational' videos for adults.)
-
Quote:Originally Posted by Dr_Mechano
The different morale values between the US and the rest of the world can be pretty much summed up by what was censored in Age of Conan.
US: Any bare chested or naked females were covered up or the nipples removed but the over the top gory fatalities remained.
Germany: The naked women were fine but the gory fatalities were toned down or removed (in the case of the curb stomp fatality).
UK: Naked women and gore remain intact.
Really want to go there ?
The MPAA, who are the people who handle our movie ratings and pretty much set the tone of what is a kiddie flick, and whats not, is a private organization that no one has to listen to. Its not the police or any arm of the government. So yes the MPAA wont give a film a PG rating for showing flesh.
Now if you want to look at censorship across the pond
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/op...-39673982.html
And if you think you can't find porn or nipples in America you just haven't tried. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Smurphy
Is there a reason PvPers or really anyone isn't organizing 64 man free-for-all kill fests?Quote:Originally Posted by Smurphy
I don't care about PvP recipes and don't want to PvP.
Asked and answered ? -
Zombies (Banished pantheon)
Redcaps
Shivans
All good for fire. -
As always its very hard to comment on a calculation without seeing the work
But that said
1. Recovery IO availability
2. Recovery powers (quick recovery, drain psyche, etc)
3. Insp drop rate and the ability to combine them
4. Effectiveness of AOE powers to leverage end
5. The ability to buy insps
6. The effect of red insps on the dpe
Of these the insp drop rate is the only one mentioned and that is to discount it.
It would seem to be more effective to calculate the time it takes to kill a spawn on average using aoe/st attacks then plug that in to the calcualtion of kills/level.
Just as example an archery or assault rifle blaster can kill entire spawns as fast as full auto, rain of arrows and aim and buildup are up. I cant see how or if this is accounted for in your estimation -
Quote:Originally Posted by Another_Fan
Quick fixes have a way of lingering till they become working as intendedHami Os enhancing things that werent meant to beQuote:Originally Posted by FredrikSvanberg
Yeah, I distinctly recall... um... Well I'm certain we can all remember... oh, wait... Ok, I give up. Which quick fixes have lingered and become "working as intendeds"?
Pet Recharge
Hows that whole TF difficulty thing coming along ?
Kora Fruit
Timed Wolves
Ridiculous wolves
Just off the top of my head.
Hope is a man looking at the sky when he is walking off a cliff.Quote:Originally Posted by Clave_Dark_5
And pessimism has a way of making things look worse than they are.
I find hope to be much more fun.
Its not pessimism here its just an observation that in software development new features are considered sexier than making finished ones actually work. -
Quote:Or as I like to say, farmers enrich everyone marketeers enrich themselves.Originally Posted by Rodion
While it's true that you can make more on the market than you can by playing the game or farming, the market would not function if people did not play the game or farm.
Without any recipes to buy or sell, marketers would have nothing to do. The only real function marketers serve is to "rent out" their slots, essentially using them to store items that other players listed at prices lower than their actual worth, often because they lack slots. Otherwise marketers mostly cause inflation.
Similarly, the only players who have enough inf to pay the prices that marketers charge are those who farm or actually play the game. The market itself is a less-than-zero sum game (because there are transaction charges). If everyone in the game just plays the market, and no one brings influence or items from outside into the market, the market dies very quickly.
So, it's very misleading to say "Market > Farming." The market cannot exist without playing/farming, but playing/farming can exist without the market (especially now with AE tickets giving you a much better chance at getting useful drops/salvage).
To answer the OP's real question: the best way to earn a lot of influence if you like actually like playing the game (and not just standing around in Wentworth's fiddling with market slots):- Join a supergroup with a base and get all your characters into it. You may want to have a SG with just you in it so that you don't have to worry about other players stealing your stuff. But if you have some friends you can trust, it's best to be in an SG with other players so you can help each other out.
- You can use enhancement storage tables in the base to transfer enhancements between characters (which is why all your characters need to be in the same SG). This is why we don't really need in-game email transfer of items.
- You can use storage racks to transfer salvage between characters (most useful for transferring rares for use in crafting).
- Get a character to level 50.
- Get there quickly by running at high difficulty levels. This is probably easiest by playing on big teams and fighting +2 to +4 mobs. That way you don't have to worry about trying to run solo against big spawns. But don't run too high: if you're dying all the time, you're wasting time and influence, so don't jack up the difficulty too high.
- Once you reach level 47 run solo at +0/x2 or +0/x4, or +0/x8: the largest spawn size you can run without trouble. This will maximize your chance of getting a purple drop (which you can start getting at 47).
- Sell your good drops (purple recipes, high-demand uncommons and rares) on the market for decent prices. Don't list things at 1 influence, list them for their actual value.
- If you run out of market slots, craft high-demand recipes and make IOs that you can store in your base. Your other characters can use them, or you can sell them later, or you can have other characters use their market slots to sell them.
- You usually don't need to transfer influence between two characters on the same account. Instead, craft an IO with the rich character, put the IO in a storage table, get it with the poor character, and have that character sell it on the market.
A minor correction though marketeers don't cause inflation so much as they add an average cost to items . This actually slows the rate of inflation by causing more inf to be taken out of the system by the wentworths fees. -
Quote:Ok whats the correct one ?Originally Posted by Not_Epsilon
Cuz I leik to nitpick
Your drop rate is wrong. -
Quote:Quick fixes have a way of lingering till they become working as intendedOriginally Posted by Clave_Dark_5
The devs (or a dev, not sure) spelled it out something like this:
"we're making a quick fix for the time being until we can put in the time to code up a real solution." (note - not actual quote)
So be patient, things will hopefully improve.
And BTW - the "ugly stepdaughter" syndrome isn't warrented here as much as some players seem to think so; perceptions can be wrong. Some people still think stalkers are a terrible AT, for example. -
Quote:IIRC the drop rate for pvp IOs is 1/200 kills and the timer is on a five minute suppression cycle. that works out to a minimum of 1000 minutes or 16 2/3 hours farming per io. Its interesting because I am paying 14 cents per kwh where I live, and I keep getting emails offering me oodles of inf at 1.7 cents/ million inf. so 8 kwh * 14cents = $1.12 + wear and tear on computer vs 68 millon or so inf for that and no wear and tear. Not to endorse the RMT people but its curious to see these schemes that have worse economic returns than unskilled labor in third world countries.Originally Posted by Mercury_Down
You slot the rez power with three recharge IOs and set it to auto. If the other character uses something like Fire Imps, dismiss one or two of the imps otherwise they kill too fast and the rezzer's rez doesn't recharge fast enough and he'll end up auto-respawning in the hospital. Park the toons beside each other and go to sleep, work, vacation, whatever. When you get back, sell your PVP IOs you spent the past 8, 10, 12 hours collecting. Occasionally one of your accouts might get disconnected but it doesn't happen often.
I consider it the same as marketeering because you make your profit while not actively playing the game. That seems to be how PVP IO farming is done now. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Dispari
The only low-level changes I'd make would be allowing the tier 2 power in secondary available at level 1, so we don't always have to get stuck with lame power choices we aren't going to use.
This. The defenders get some truly useless mandatory powers in their secondary sets. I'd also have a minor tweak to defiance to go with that, in that it would it cover the first 2 primary powers you take and the first secondary power you took not just the tiers. -
Quote:Farming at 300 million an hour I am not surprised you can hit a billion in a week. If anything marketing would be slowing you down.Originally Posted by Not_Epsilon
My take on farming, depending what you are doing, how and how good you are, it can exceed your marketeering capabilities.
Farming is more additive of an inf income. My farm toons average 25-40 mil in PURE INF an hour, considering its tweaked to MAX effiency. Averaging in the drops, an hour will make me, maybe, 200-400 mil. This is if I have the attention span to devote ONLY to farming and pursue it with a single-minded purpose.
Marketeering is a multiplicative inf income. My marketeering is much more profitable, however, I can not exceed the profit made by farming with marketeering with only 1 toon, however the case may be with me, I have to the tune of 12 or so 50s in which to use the market slots.
Overall, I think it is best if you do the C. Option.
All of the above.
Using both, in a serious drive for cash, a bil in less then a RL week is not uncommon. Thats me only playing Sat, sun and wensdays.
TL;DR.
Lrn2doboth
P.S. Need to reset the highwater mark on the one hour challenge. -
Just a note have played sonic and have played devices never tried a sonic/dev but thinking about your situation is inspiring me to find a slot and roll a character.
Sonic is excellent and it has almost a Jekyll and Hyde thing going for solo and team. Sirens is almost zero use on teams, for the simple reason you can't get people not to wake up the slept mobs. Its the same problem that controllers have getting people not to kill the confused enemies, and defenders have for getting people not to kill the anchor. That is the bad news and its incredibly outweighed by the good news. Sonic amplifies everyones damage. The bigger the team the faster they go down and the more it helps.
When you are solo you will find sirens to be your best friend ever. You have a long duration sleep that will let you knock out entire spawns at your leisure and discretion. It just doesn't get much better for a blaster than that.
Devices is much the same way. Solo with sonic you can have a lot of fun with it. Put em to sleep wake em up with a bomb or a mine, you can even debuff em before it hits. Teaming though expect it will be caltrops and web grenade maybe gun drone and trip mine ( the faster the team the less likely), targeting drone should be useful to you even if it is another .31 end toggle. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Eva Destruction
It makes him another shining example of why the current ratings system is poorly implemented and completely useless as both a measure of an arc's "quality" (subjective as that is) and as a tool to help players find arcs they are likely to enjoy. He's not the only one who rates based on criteria most of us would consider stupid and/or unreasonable and/or flat-out griefing. He's just the latest to try to publicly defend his position.
He is rating on what he considers important. What any user rating system will generate is a reflection of what the overall users enjoyed. Baskin Robbins may have 31 flavors but I bet they sell more vanilla and chocolate than anything else. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Santorican
Most people are lazy
/thread
Most people work at work.
Obvious implications and conclusions left to the reader.