New Defender Builds
I'm not sure that there is a general "how to make an awesome Defender" rule, every Defender combo plays a bit differently.
On your general combo Time Manipulation is an awesome set while DP is a bit "meh". On the plus side do have reasonably decent synergy (since HoB is PBAoE and so is Time's Juncture) and Dual Pistols is getting buffed in I24 so it's not an awful combo.
Linea-Alba has a VERY nice Time/Dual Pistols fender that just so happened to solo a itf http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=290765
Look them up and see where Linea has posted. They have great insights on Time manip alone and has helped a Dual pistol time cor in the past that might be a good guideline even for a fender.
Time is a great set, and as noted, dual pistols fit the PBAoE style of time.
Try getting the Titan Sentinel tool. I hope you are using Mids. Download your current status, and the forum can make beneficial commentary. Also, are you going SOs only, generic IOs, purples, super maxed out? Any budget?
I wouldn't worry about not hitting 50. As long as you enjoy what you are playing, revel in the experience.
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
Linea-Alba has a VERY nice Time/Dual Pistols fender that just so happened to solo a itf http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=290765
Look them up and see where Linea has posted. They have great insights on Time manip alone and has helped a Dual pistol time cor in the past that might be a good guideline even for a fender. |
Lots of ppl don't like DP due to animation times and redraw. Well, the animation times are getting shaved by a decent amount.
You should be able to enjoy the ride on this char, I've got a rupter version that's not bad at all. Good news is with this combo you don't have to worry about slowing down much. Just slot some end redux into your blasts and go to town.
I think that was my Dp/Time Botzo, but not sure.
In addition to the animation times getting some reductions, I believe that a new build up mechanic is being added to Dual Pistols as well.
Queen of the Amazons, WP/DB
Sound Judgement Son/Son
Cobra Lily Plant/Kin
Celestia, FF/Psy
Nefertiri, Storm/Elec
Pixie, Ill/Rad
Guardian Server
When something good happens to me, I can never enjoy it....
I am always too busy looking for the inevitable punchline...
BEHOLD THE POWER OF CHEESE!
Thank you for your replies all of you!
Not sure what enhancements I will choose. As much IO's as possible, I suppose they seem to be the better while more extensive approach. What sort of play style will I be able to expect with these powers? Should I emphasize a certain ability?
What sort of play style will I be able to expect with these powers? Should I emphasize a certain ability?
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Time Manip is fairly heavy on slows, debuffs, and a bit of control (especially with a Lockdown proc in Distortion Field), with a couple PBAoE buffs for defense, tohit, and recharge.
Dual Pistols is, after the I24 changes hit, looking like it works out as a somewhat bog-standard no-snipe blast set.
Expect to be getting up close and personal with the enemies a lot to keep Time's Juncture on them. At which point, Hail of Bullets is going to be very useful. If you do stay in the middle of the enemies, Empty Clips might end up not terribly useful, since cones work best if you're off to the side of the spawn. Also, since it's likely you'll end up in melee range a fair bit for your PBAoEs, you should probably slot up Farsight for defense. Slotting it for ToHit is shaping up pretty handy with some blast sets, to help with the I24 fastsnipes, but DP doesn't have a snipe, so that's not a huge consideration.
Oh, and you could probably do well with slotting pretty heavily for recharge, to try to get Hail up more often, get Farsight up more, etc. Chrono Shift helps with that, of course.
It is a chance for +2 mag on the hold
Yes, that's precisely what makes it good...
As others have stated, you will feel the most powerful when you are in melee. TJ is an incredible power. It will allow you to play at off tanking for your group also when you need to.
When you want to do that just switch to chemo rounds and fire off your aoe powers as fast as you can. You will be able to add a -Dam amount up to 52.5% which is a quite nice amount of mitigation for you and your team. Added to all the -rech, -tohit, and Def you will be adding can make most situations quite safe.
As you are in melee most of the time, I would suggest you think about Dark Mastery. It fits quite well with this combo on a defender. You can easily outheal the damage you sustain with Oppressive Gloom which will stun minions in melee (add Suppressive Fire to stun a boss). Good resistance with Dark Embrace. Soul Drain will add quite a bit to your damage with its buff. I even suggest Dark Consumption (you can never have enough endurance with high recharge builds) and Soul Transfer (you will probably feel too powerful from time to time).
As others have stated, you will feel the most powerful when you are in melee. TJ is an incredible power. It will allow you to play at off tanking for your group also when you need to.
When you want to do that just switch to chemo rounds and fire off your aoe powers as fast as you can. You will be able to add a -Dam amount up to 52.5% which is a quite nice amount of mitigation for you and your team. Added to all the -rech, -tohit, and Def you will be adding can make most situations quite safe. As you are in melee most of the time, I would suggest you think about Dark Mastery. It fits quite well with this combo on a defender. You can easily outheal the damage you sustain with Oppressive Gloom which will stun minions in melee (add Suppressive Fire to stun a boss). Good resistance with Dark Embrace. Soul Drain will add quite a bit to your damage with its buff. I even suggest Dark Consumption (you can never have enough endurance with high recharge builds) and Soul Transfer (you will probably feel too powerful from time to time). |
@ Recluse90,
Do you know what defense cap is ? Do you know how to obtain it ?
Do you know how -ToHit Debuff works ? How that works with your defenses ? The weaknesses behind using such powers that have -ToHit Debuffs ?
Do you know about streak breaker hits that this game has in place ?
If your answer to many of these questions is no then you should consider reading up on the links in my Signature.
Further there is a Mids tutorial in the players help section which does go over some of the tips and tricks with mids that is really not documented unless you have spent the time to read some of the olds posts on the mids website. For example you can click on a IO that is slotted in a power and then use the plus or minus key to increase the level of that IO. So for those that want to have really accurate numbers and do not have a 50 IO slotted but a 47 they can place a level 45 IO and then highlight it and hit the plus sign 2x to make the IO 47. I use that option a lot when I place a 50 IO and use slot enhancers to make it 55 to see what benefits I would get from it, if any.
The simple point I am getting at is once you understand the mechanics around the game every power set you come across you will see how to implement certain powers to obtain that goal your looking to get.
As a further example, Lets talk DP Time. Specifically Linea Alba build. Its probably down below or on the 2nd or 3rd page. I know you can search it and find it for sure. Here you have a build that soloed a Task Force. Honestly personally my only contention I would have with such a build were if it has purple sets that I cannot afford, how can I dumb it down for a guy like me in my price range. Or I like that she has hover but I don't like it, so how can I change the build keeping the same numbers but have another power instead.
So you have a really good build to work off and someone has invented this wheel for you. No need to reinvent it. Again personally my goal when making a build is how can I make it better then the next person or what am I lacking that this person can fix for me. Then I make my choices for my build and accept any losses from recharge or regeneration or recovery or defenses or whatever that suits me and my play style.
The reason I bring this up is because of this line in your first post.
Originally Posted by Recluse90
I usually just think of a backround and pick powers similar to my imagined character. I don't know how to pick powers that optimize specific abilities for the best in-game benefits
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I can understand where your coming from because I was in your shoes years ago. The only difference is I woke up a bit sooner then you did. Today I have an idea of what I want and I make builds based around this idea I then create the build to obtain this goal.
Now to make it clear to you, for me this goal is Defense cap. Either full positional defense cap or typed or something, based on the build and how it will interact with mobs. My next goal is some decent regeneration to get back some hit points at a faster rate then normal and try to have my endurance recovery at least 2 points higher then what I spend. If not I look to have some power that can sap endurance from mobs and give it to me. This compensates for the lower endurance values.
Once I achieve all of this I then think or rework the theme/concept of the toon. Because this is really the only real way, if your looking to optimize a build.
And if your going to spend money on IOs then I can only imagine this is what your looking to do. Otherwise there is not point. You can run with SOs on a build and survive 0/0 setting.
But if your looking to really test yourself and the build then your going to have to Optimize the build and you will be able to do 4/8 settings or do what linea alba did and solo a TF.
This at least was the fire for me. In the past, I would run on a team and I would see someone with the same power set as me on the team, but this player was making his toon look like a god where I was chump and could not do anything near as he or she could. I was like WTF ? What am I doing wrong. Someone mentioned defense cap. I was like whats defense cap? They said here read this. Then I went OHHHH MY GOSH, I was missing this all these years ???. I spent the next month or so reworking all my build into this new defense cap thing.
Today I have 3 pages and starting a 4th of toons with about 90% of them level 50 with IOs, defense capped in one way, shape or form and Incarnate slotted with at least one full set of T4 powers in each incarnate slot. I like that I can just about bring out any toon and be able to solo 4/8 and on some even do DA incarnate on 4/8 with limited deaths. It allows me to be a more then useful part of a team. It allows me the chance to step in and take the lead if needed because maybe the tank suddenly died and I need to hold aggro until he or she comes back for example.
Another limit I have is no purple sets. I make my builds where anyone can afford them with a reasonable amount of savings and investing. I might drop in one or 2 purple IOs but only because I had them or was able to get them on the cheap.
Trust me take the time to understand the game mechanics and it will feel like your cheating but without the fear of getting banned because your cheating.
Sorry for being long winded. But that's me.
1. Why Soft Cap is Important : http://dechskaison.blogspot.com/2011...important.html
2. Limits: http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Limits
3. Attack Mechanics: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Attack_Mechanics
4. Rule of Five: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Rule_o...e_Law_of_Fives
@ Recluse90,
Do you know what defense cap is ? Do you know how to obtain it ? Do you know how -ToHit Debuff works ? How that works with your defenses ? The weaknesses behind using such powers that have -ToHit Debuffs ? Do you know about streak breaker hits that this game has in place ? If your answer to many of these questions is no then you should consider reading up on the links in my Signature. Further there is a Mids tutorial in the players help section which does go over some of the tips and tricks with mids that is really not documented unless you have spent the time to read some of the olds posts on the mids website. For example you can click on a IO that is slotted in a power and then use the plus or minus key to increase the level of that IO. So for those that want to have really accurate numbers and do not have a 50 IO slotted but a 47 they can place a level 45 IO and then highlight it and hit the plus sign 2x to make the IO 47. I use that option a lot when I place a 50 IO and use slot enhancers to make it 55 to see what benefits I would get from it, if any. The simple point I am getting at is once you understand the mechanics around the game every power set you come across you will see how to implement certain powers to obtain that goal your looking to get. As a further example, Lets talk DP Time. Specifically Linea Alba build. Its probably down below or on the 2nd or 3rd page. I know you can search it and find it for sure. Here you have a build that soloed a Task Force. Honestly personally my only contention I would have with such a build were if it has purple sets that I cannot afford, how can I dumb it down for a guy like me in my price range. Or I like that she has hover but I don't like it, so how can I change the build keeping the same numbers but have another power instead. So you have a really good build to work off and someone has invented this wheel for you. No need to reinvent it. Again personally my goal when making a build is how can I make it better then the next person or what am I lacking that this person can fix for me. Then I make my choices for my build and accept any losses from recharge or regeneration or recovery or defenses or whatever that suits me and my play style. The reason I bring this up is because of this line in your first post. This game sadly does not allow you to have a concept and then optimize your build around that concept. So you can't have a super jumping teleporting, super speed Imp that is defense capped. At the end of the day your will have to pick powers that Optimize the build that will go against your concept. That is unless you want a defense capped toon that happens to be made of stone and has stone weapons or is super strong. But you get my point. I can understand where your coming from because I was in your shoes years ago. The only difference is I woke up a bit sooner then you did. Today I have an idea of what I want and I make builds based around this idea I then create the build to obtain this goal. Now to make it clear to you, for me this goal is Defense cap. Either full positional defense cap or typed or something, based on the build and how it will interact with mobs. My next goal is some decent regeneration to get back some hit points at a faster rate then normal and try to have my endurance recovery at least 2 points higher then what I spend. If not I look to have some power that can sap endurance from mobs and give it to me. This compensates for the lower endurance values. Once I achieve all of this I then think or rework the theme/concept of the toon. Because this is really the only real way, if your looking to optimize a build. And if your going to spend money on IOs then I can only imagine this is what your looking to do. Otherwise there is not point. You can run with SOs on a build and survive 0/0 setting. But if your looking to really test yourself and the build then your going to have to Optimize the build and you will be able to do 4/8 settings or do what linea alba did and solo a TF. This at least was the fire for me. In the past, I would run on a team and I would see someone with the same power set as me on the team, but this player was making his toon look like a god where I was chump and could not do anything near as he or she could. I was like WTF ? What am I doing wrong. Someone mentioned defense cap. I was like whats defense cap? They said here read this. Then I went OHHHH MY GOSH, I was missing this all these years ???. I spent the next month or so reworking all my build into this new defense cap thing. Today I have 3 pages and starting a 4th of toons with about 90% of them level 50 with IOs, defense capped in one way, shape or form and Incarnate slotted with at least one full set of T4 powers in each incarnate slot. I like that I can just about bring out any toon and be able to solo 4/8 and on some even do DA incarnate on 4/8 with limited deaths. It allows me to be a more then useful part of a team. It allows me the chance to step in and take the lead if needed because maybe the tank suddenly died and I need to hold aggro until he or she comes back for example. Another limit I have is no purple sets. I make my builds where anyone can afford them with a reasonable amount of savings and investing. I might drop in one or 2 purple IOs but only because I had them or was able to get them on the cheap. Trust me take the time to understand the game mechanics and it will feel like your cheating but without the fear of getting banned because your cheating. Sorry for being long winded. But that's me. |
All I can say is thank you. Seriously epic post plainguy, I am glad someone came from where I am now. So, should I just read the links in your sig? Is there some where else I should go too?
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Doomguide
Here is another Defense guide by Arcanaville
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=121258
Again sorry for the long speech. I'm a much better public speaker then I am a writer. Any of my writing is more technical and to the point so no fluff or feeling in it.
My first defense cap try was a Dark Electric Defender that Adeon Hawkwood and BioSpark pretty much helped me out with. Oddly enough I went the route of -ToHit Debuff which was tougher but I have to say I learn A LOT because of it.
Dechs post on defenses is something at first I skimmed over. I always say it started off like hearing charlie browns teacher talking. I read some words but then skimmed over because I got bored the first few times around. After some failed attempts I was like WTF this stuff is all wrong and stupid, of course I was the stupid one. I then took it a bit more serious and spent about 1 solid hours opening up numerous windows and Mids and playing around with builds to see "those" numbers. Then it all kicked in and after many OHHH, OHHH, OMG, How stupid I was. Since then I am a Defense cap NUT. I get the whole resistances thing but I would rather die to defense cascade failure and not have resistances then not be maxed out. I have done what I consider many amazing things with defense cap and eating a few oranges when needed. Fighting 2 AVs to unlock my Alpha slot because I didn't understand mission settings correctly was one of them. It took me forever I think 45 minutes or an hour. Only after I exited and complained in RWZ did someone say you can say no AVs in the settings. I almost fell out of my chair. Yet another skimming issue, again my fault.
Arcanaville does go into -ToHit Debuff info in that link.
Nutshell giving the mobs a hit debuff like from dark or time is equal to getting defenses. The issue with Hit debuffs is you need to touch the mob or put some sort of toggle on them. If your not touching them or not in that AOE range or move away then they are not affected, thus can usually hit you more often. What I usually do is I make my builds Range defense cap and then use the Hit debuff to add on to my defense to obtain Melee and AOE. Big bosses usually have PBAOE so it helps out.
The game always picks your best defense automatically.
When you see builds Like Linea Alba, you pick them up and save them. Rename them so you know.
As Doomguide says play around with Mids. The BIG thing I will tell you make sure the button on top right says PvE NOT PVP.. I did that on my Robot FF Mastermind and it screwed me all up. You can test this out yourself and see. But please make sure you put it back.
From reading Dechs posting you can see at defense cap it takes about 13 swings before a regular mob can hit you. So my incentive is to kill the regular mobs before they reach 5 or 10. It's much easier soloing bosses or several bosses once all the other mobs are not around causing confusion.
1. Why Soft Cap is Important : http://dechskaison.blogspot.com/2011...important.html
2. Limits: http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Limits
3. Attack Mechanics: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Attack_Mechanics
4. Rule of Five: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Rule_o...e_Law_of_Fives
Here is another Defense guide by Arcanaville
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=121258 Again sorry for the long speech. I'm a much better public speaker then I am a writer. Any of my writing is more technical and to the point so no fluff or feeling in it. My first defense cap try was a Dark Electric Defender that Adeon Hawkwood and BioSpark pretty much helped me out with. Oddly enough I went the route of -ToHit Debuff which was tougher but I have to say I learn A LOT because of it. Dechs post on defenses is something at first I skimmed over. I always say it started off like hearing charlie browns teacher talking. I read some words but then skimmed over because I got bored the first few times around. After some failed attempts I was like WTF this stuff is all wrong and stupid, of course I was the stupid one. I then took it a bit more serious and spent about 1 solid hours opening up numerous windows and Mids and playing around with builds to see "those" numbers. Then it all kicked in and after many OHHH, OHHH, OMG, How stupid I was. Since then I am a Defense cap NUT. I get the whole resistances thing but I would rather die to defense cascade failure and not have resistances then not be maxed out. I have done what I consider many amazing things with defense cap and eating a few oranges when needed. Fighting 2 AVs to unlock my Alpha slot because I didn't understand mission settings correctly was one of them. It took me forever I think 45 minutes or an hour. Only after I exited and complained in RWZ did someone say you can say no AVs in the settings. I almost fell out of my chair. Yet another skimming issue, again my fault. Arcanaville does go into -ToHit Debuff info in that link. Nutshell giving the mobs a hit debuff like from dark or time is equal to getting defenses. The issue with Hit debuffs is you need to touch the mob or put some sort of toggle on them. If your not touching them or not in that AOE range or move away then they are not affected, thus can usually hit you more often. What I usually do is I make my builds Range defense cap and then use the Hit debuff to add on to my defense to obtain Melee and AOE. Big bosses usually have PBAOE so it helps out. The game always picks your best defense automatically. When you see builds Like Linea Alba, you pick them up and save them. Rename them so you know. As Doomguide says play around with Mids. The BIG thing I will tell you make sure the button on top right says PvE NOT PVP.. I did that on my Robot FF Mastermind and it screwed me all up. You can test this out yourself and see. But please make sure you put it back. From reading Dechs posting you can see at defense cap it takes about 13 swings before a regular mob can hit you. So my incentive is to kill the regular mobs before they reach 5 or 10. It's much easier soloing bosses or several bosses once all the other mobs are not around causing confusion. |
I know in your post you actually do this while talking about your builds, but I just wanted to make it clear to the Originator of the post that this is a better way of going about things. Not a problem here as Time/DP has lots going for it anyway.
That said, yes Defense is usually the easiest thing to work on with IOs and is usually recommended as a first to add. And I agree.
Plainguy, I gotta slightly disagree with you. The way you are stating it is that Defense is absolutely better than other forms of mitigation. This game has ways around all forms of mitigation, so the best thing to do is to layer your defenses (Def, Resist, -Tohit, -Dam, etc).
I know in your post you actually do this while talking about your builds, but I just wanted to make it clear to the Originator of the post that this is a better way of going about things. Not a problem here as Time/DP has lots going for it anyway. That said, yes Defense is usually the easiest thing to work on with IOs and is usually recommended as a first to add. And I agree. |
But I will say if I had a choice between getting a 45 in Range defense and 0 resistance on my blaster or getting 35 Range defense and 30 resistance then I will go for the 45 / 0 option. Even Adeon Hawkwood pushes the 35% number and I just disagree. It was him and Biospark who showed me defense cap.
So if anything it is their fault for the monster I have become.
1. Why Soft Cap is Important : http://dechskaison.blogspot.com/2011...important.html
2. Limits: http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Limits
3. Attack Mechanics: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Attack_Mechanics
4. Rule of Five: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Rule_o...e_Law_of_Fives
>>> But I will say if I had a choice between getting a 45 in Range defense and 0 resistance on my blaster or getting 35 Range defense and 30 resistance then I will go for the 45 / 0 option. Even Adeon Hawkwood pushes the 35% number and I just disagree. It was him and Biospark who showed me defense cap. <<<
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Doomguide
I'll start by saying this is my first post on the Forums since I made my account today, six years ago (couldn't tell you why). Today, the community that you all have participated in building is an IRL inspiration to a positive, educated, and sometimes satirical experience. Truly, as players of the game and members of the forum old and new have created the BEST on-line community for the past eight years!
So, here is my problem: I have never been too good at making builds. I am also an pre-level 50 altaholic (constantly making new characters, deleting the not-so-old) so I do not have a level 50 even though I have an account since 2006, paid for play for about two years. It's embarrassing.
Defenders are my favorite. My first toon ever was one, and my currently highest level is a defender. However, as I said before, I am not good at making these awesome character choices that I see today. I usually just think of a backround and pick powers similar to my imagined character. I don't know how to pick powers that optimize specific abilities for the best in-game benefits. Right now I have a TM/DP Def (please give me your opinions on those choices). I enjoy him, but I know there are better powerset combos out there. Please, o wise communion, I need a "How to Build Awesome Defenders, and Characters in General 101".