Untouchable not always Untouchable? Or just lag?

Probably from one of the dev posts on the forums before they were migrated.

All powers were designed such that Primary PP versions should be superior to Secondary PP which were superior to Anciliary/Epic/Patron PPs

Now some have since been rebalanced - in your examples you stated the Epic PP versions had higher end usage so it sounds as if this may be the case.

The one place I am aware of where this order falls down is in the case of summoning pets where the power is identical.

In the case of RoTP I would expect the epic version to restore a lower percentage of base health and end.

I would tend to agree that adding a short delay before becoming untouchable for one version sounds unlikely as this would make them different powers with different mechanics. More likely if it was removed (or had its duration reduced to 0 - that way keeps the same mechanics) In which case it could be that it was forgotten to be done for the Epic version.

My suspicion as to what is happening is that lag is meaning that the untouchable period is over before the client displays the res animation.
I'm not convinced about the efficacy of the untouchable mechanic which is present on most (all?) rezzes - I've certainly died mid animation from Ressurect from an Empath in the past. I've also died from aggro from a mob after hitting Hosp as well from attacks which had activated but not fired.
In practice if that quarter second is going to be an issue then wait before rezzing - that way the mobs should reset and any aggro you receive will need to wait for the power's activation time which should put you into the untouchable period.

Nope. It restores the same percentage, but less health due to the archetypes that get the epic version having less base health.
The only real intentional disadvantage is the pool version gets only 20 seconds of debt-immunity while the power set version gets 90 seconds.

That was my supposition as well. They must have just forgotten to change the pool version as they did with the power set version.

No, the situation where it fails was presented as "incarnate content with a lot of aggro and damage immediately upon rez".
The person is getting killed in the 0.25 second delay time because all that matter is that the enemy make a to-hit check in that time and damage can be calculated after untouchable is active.
"They can hit before you're invulnerable, but damage after you're invulnerable."

<waves>


I know, right? We'll see......

I'm pretty sure deliberately coding in a delay for something to happen means it's intentional.

Originally Posted by Dispari I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.

See the post by "Addo" above.
Apparently, the "untouchable" portion of resurrect powers was not even present until issue 22.

My guess? The delay was also part of all resurrects, but they forgot to delete the delay for the ancillary/patron pools and temporary power resurrects when they did so for the power set versions.



Untouchable was added to keep players alive while resurrecting. There would be no point to adding that unless it was intended to function that way.
The fact that the delay prevents the intended function in specific unforeseen situations is a bug, nothing less. Therefore, the delay needs to be removed or they need to do something else far more complicated to ensure that the power performs as they obviously intended.


I'm sick of arguing in circles here. How many different ways must I say "read the power info and see the truth of it"?

The "untouchable" portion of those *three* listed rez powers was not present until Issue 22, you are correct. All other rezzes with untouchable were already there. Most of them have had untouchable since the ability was introduced to the game.

This is simply an amusing conjecture. And wrong. None of the armor sets have a delay that I can recall.

They specifically coded in a delay stipulation. Otherwise it would happen immediately, like the armor set rezzes. How many times do we have to say "they wrote it in" before you realize the truth?

Originally Posted by Dispari I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.

Not sure, how about start with how many times the power info description has been wrong. You have a ways to go.

I know they did. You're right.

I'm just saying "how do you know the armor set resurrects did not also have a delay at some point in the past?"?
Or, how do you know that when untouchable was added to those 3 resurrects, without a delay, that it was not intended(and likely assumed to be true) that all resurrects should not have a delay?

Maybe, just maybe, the developer that added untouchable to those powers without a delay was not the same developer that put the delay in other resurrects and thus probably didn't even know about the delay, just saw "they already have untouchable so they are good".(Edit: why did a typo in "so they" turn into a censored word?)








There is just one fact that we need to know:

All resurrect powers have this description....
The delay stops that statement from being true in certain situations.


So, either the "certain situations" need to change or the delay in the powers needs to be removed or they need to come up with an entirely new and complicated piece of code to try and fix the issue without removing the delay and likely breaking all sorts of other things in the process.



There is still only one conclusion:

The delay may be intentional, and may have been intended to be removed, but the fact that it stops the resurrect power from performing as intended is obviously not intended.




That's enough of this topic.
You're all starting to just pick apart side-topics instead of the main topic:
"Is the power working as intended in every situation or not?"
Obviously not.

Wrong is fine. It can be slightly wrong. Having the wrong damage type or the wrong recharge word(how ambiguous is "long"?) or whatever small error is not a problem.


The powers say they "leave you invulnerable for a short time" and have "untouchable" in the detailed info and actual code of the power.

The description is not wrong. The behavior in most situations is not wrong. The behavior in certain "pushing the limits" situations is wrong.



Would you rather they didn't solve a crash that occurs only on a 24 person league and instead tell players "use 23 players or less because we're not fixing one situation that only happens when you are 'pushing the limits' even if that limit was something we want you to push"?

You can't just keep adding "exceptions to the rule" or the whole "rule" will have to be thrown out sooner or later due to the "exceptions" cascading.
"Don't solve a crash. Whatever caused it won't ever get worse or spread to other sectors of the program." "Don't fix a resurrect so that it performs as it should in this one situation where it doesn't. We won't ever add another similar situation that will make it fail the same way because we're done adding incarnate content." /sarcasm





Oh yeah, come on. Make the obligatory "you're back even though you said you were done /snicker" comment.
I don't care. I did this immediately after my above post because the obvious easy counter to the false(in regards to the power being argued about) quoted statement needed to be said.
Also, I'm done when I move on to another thread, not at the post I say I'm done in.
I also reserve the right to post again and not give a fart what others think.

I can agree with that part. It may be intentional, or it may not. We don't know. YOU don't know. So stop with the grand pronouncements of how it "should" be working.

You didn't read the power info in game, and you never will.

You're a perfect example of why I hate this community. You just want to push my buttons.

You win Ironblade.



RESURRECTS ARE MEANT TO KILL US!!
I agree with you.


I will now argue the opposite of logic just to anger people because the company that runs this game and the "community" that "infests" it is doing just that and getting away with bending and breaking the rules of conduct.

I don't care anymore.
Hell really is other people. They're all liars and backstabbers and psychopaths.

Hardly. I reply like this to anyone who does any of the following:
1) Post things that are incorrect.
2) Post opinion while claiming it to be fact.
3) Posting just about anything likely to be confusing or misleading to other players.

http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Fire_M...of_the_Phoenix
FACT!





Opinion:
Oh wait, you won't bother reading the words on that page. I don't know why I kept copying them FROM IN GAME to this forum to try to prove to you the FACT of the intended behavior of that power.

You call it opinion, but then you are calling the game's words "opinion" that I didn't even write.



So City of Heroes is a race car game now? It doesn't look like a race car game when I play it?
I could provide pictures and tell you "just play it" to prove it but you would say "that's you opinion as I have not seen the facts you have posted copied directly from the game".



Can you tell fact from opinion now?

Originally Posted by Dispari I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.

Originally Posted by Dispari I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.

I should. I just haven't bothered because I doubted Premiums would even have that option.

Also, I don't like to ignore people because I may miss something actually useful. I guess I have to if I want sanity.

I don't dispute anything on that page.
I take issue with your OPINION that it should work differently from the way it does.


Not cool to publicly badmouth people. Makes you look like a small person.