How does the scrapper ATO set compare?


BrandX

 

Posted

The ATO sets seem to be live and sorta working now.

Has anyone tried the scrapper set yet? How does it work?


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by mauk2 View Post
The ATO sets seem to be live and sorta working now.

Has anyone tried the scrapper set yet? How does it work?
They've gone live?


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

Posted

I do not see them at the reward merit vendor like on beta. Maybe they are only active as drops?


 

Posted

From the posts I've seen of pre-beta info on the sets, the scrapper set is far and away the best of the AT sets. I personally expect it to cost twelve billion on the market and take a while to obtain through that route. 5% s/l defense, 10% recharge, and it enhances your critical chances across the board, making one of the best inherents better still. I'm glad I can afford some super packs!


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
They've gone live?
They're on beta and actually proccing now. Thus, the code is alive for them. Sorry for the confusion.

I just checked out the tanker ATO set (I like scraps, but I LOVE tanks, sorry) and that one is solid awesome-plated WIN.

But I haven't seen anybody looking at the scrapper ATO set, and I sure ain't gonna peel open another 80 packs to make one....

At least not tonight.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
From the posts I've seen of pre-beta info on the sets, the scrapper set is far and away the best of the AT sets. I personally expect it to cost twelve billion on the market and take a while to obtain through that route. 5% s/l defense, 10% recharge, and it enhances your critical chances across the board, making one of the best inherents better still. I'm glad I can afford some super packs!
I'm surprised by this.

I thought Stalker had a really great one with it's coming changes.

Slot it in Assassin Strike, the proc goes off, the next attack is automatic crit!


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

Posted

You can get the ATO's from the A-Merit vendor in Ouro.


The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
From the posts I've seen of pre-beta info on the sets, the scrapper set is far and away the best of the AT sets. I personally expect it to cost twelve billion on the market and take a while to obtain through that route. 5% s/l defense, 10% recharge, and it enhances your critical chances across the board, making one of the best inherents better still. I'm glad I can afford some super packs!
...really?!

It's only a global 1-2 percent damage increase from the proc, and the set bonuses are nice, but not THAT nice....

Ehn, I guess nobody is using it on beta. bleh. Guess I'll check that out tomorrow.


 

Posted

I don't know (or especially care) how exactly it compares to the other ATO sets, but the scrapper set compares very favorably to IO sets. Every set bonus is useful, and it lets you get both recharge and S/L defense from the same power, even in an AoE. It doesn't even have Obliteration's severe endredux problem. The crit bonus is gravy on top of all that.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopeling View Post
I don't know (or especially care) how exactly it compares to the other ATO sets, but the scrapper set compares very favorably to IO sets. Every set bonus is useful, and it lets you get both recharge and S/L defense from the same power, even in an AoE. It doesn't even have Obliteration's severe endredux problem. The crit bonus is gravy on top of all that.
Eh, I still think a flat +Defense bonus would be better and more useful to more builds, as not all builds rely on S/L Defense, but I guess that just wasn't going to happen.


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
Eh, I still think a flat +Defense bonus would be better and more useful to more builds, as not all builds rely on S/L Defense, but I guess that just wasn't going to happen.
Take the win!


 

Posted

Well okay, I suppose I'd be safer if I called it the best AT set in terms of quality times AT popularity since I didn't actually check every single other AT set before making that determination. What I do know is that I play a lot of scrappers and this set is good for every single one of them*, with the critical chance boost standing out. You can look at it as 2% or you can look at it as 40% but any way you slice it it raises scrapper damage in a multiplicative way that never existed before. I'll take it!

* Oh and when I use the word good there I mean better than any purple set.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
Well okay, I suppose I'd be safer if I called it the best AT set in terms of quality times AT popularity since I didn't actually check every single other AT set before making that determination. What I do know is that I play a lot of scrappers and this set is good for every single one of them*, with the critical chance boost standing out. You can look at it as 2% or you can look at it as 40% but any way you slice it it raises scrapper damage in a multiplicative way that never existed before. I'll take it!

* Oh and when I use the word good there I mean better than any purple set.

Ehn..... Tinkering around with orange set numbers, it's looking like the tanker set is a pretty consistent +10 percent resist vs all. The Scrapper set is around 2 percent global damage, and depending on how they tune it, the Brute set is looking like about 10 percent global damage(5 fury or so).

Of those three, the Tanker set is the clear winner. For the Scrap and brute....not so much. I'm thinking frankenslotting is in order.

But we'll see.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mauk2 View Post
The Scrapper set is around 2 percent global damage,
It's a 2% damage increase, but that's multiplicative. If you want to compare it to a damage buff, it should be worth ~4% or more to most builds. Twice that, for the Superior version.


 

Posted

We're also being a little modest here: the 2% crit chance increase is against minions. Against anything higher it's 4% higher crit chance, and with certain powers you can bump that up to 6%. That starts looking pretty beastly pretty fast.


 

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I wonder if this ramps up CS' chance to crit appropriately. Could be pretty interesting if so, considering it has a much higher than normal chance. +40%, right? So 28% chance to instantly recharge PS instead of 20%? Yum.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
We're also being a little modest here: the 2% crit chance increase is against minions. Against anything higher it's 4% higher crit chance, and with certain powers you can bump that up to 6%. That starts looking pretty beastly pretty fast.

I'll let Bill answer this one:


http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showp...2&postcount=14


Mm... Yeaaahhh....


 

Posted

Well if that's the case it sounds like beta scrappers need to be lobbying for fixes so it works as advertised. My internet isn't really up to getting it myself.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
Well if that's the case it sounds like beta scrappers need to be lobbying for fixes so it works as advertised.
I'm not sure what you mean - it does work as advertised. Indeed, Bill got those numbers by plugging it into a spreadsheet, not in-game testing.

1.76% doesn't sound like a lot, but the superior version gives twice that, and moreover what do you expect from ONE slot?


 

Posted

I could be misunderstanding. I thought it modified the crit rate on a per-attack basis? As in, attacks with higher base crit rates will be improved more. I assumed that mauk was informing me that no! Such is not the case. It only improves by the basic minion scale.

I don't know who to believe anymore! What is it doing, and which behavior is working as intended?

Honestly though, even if it is only 2% across the board I'll still happily buy tons of these sets.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
I could be misunderstanding. I thought it modified the crit rate on a per-attack basis? As in, attacks with higher base crit rates will be improved more. I assumed that mauk was informing me that no! Such is not the case. It only improves by the basic minion scale.

I don't know who to believe anymore! What is it doing, and which behavior is working as intended?

Honestly though, even if it is only 2% across the board I'll still happily buy tons of these sets.
Mauk is right,but I think Biilz went off the basic 10% likely for easier time of the math.


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

Posted

Makes sense. After crowing about how this is by far the best AT set I can hardly complain when it is slightly less overpowered than I thought it would be, hah.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
Makes sense. After crowing about how this is by far the best AT set I can hardly complain when it is slightly less overpowered than I thought it would be, hah.
Still gives some decent bonuses for those who can utilize the S/L defense. Which is my only gripe with the set, and the Stalker set.

At least I've come to see the Blaster +Defense is a bit more universal in that the blasters don't tend to come with any defense.

The Scrapper (and especially the Stalkers) I think can benefit from just straight +Defense. The Stalkers more, because of Hide's defense.

Cant recall if Brutes or Tankers get S/L Defense in the set bonuses. But the same would apply to them as well.


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

Posted

I have to say that ceteris paribus, s/l defense is the most valuable kind. By "kind" here I mean "type pair or position." Not only do the AT sets give a purple bonus worth of s/l in some cases, they're the only way to get that. Not only are they the only way to get a purple bonus worth of s/l, as far as I'm aware the only ultimate defense bonuses remain the ranged defense bonus from coercive persuasion and the various s/l 5% bonuses from the AT sets. This puts the most valuable kind of defense bonus into a class of its own, as if it weren't already. The fact that you can double up on them by going half orange half purple is just kind of silly if you ask me.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
I could be misunderstanding. I thought it modified the crit rate on a per-attack basis? As in, attacks with higher base crit rates will be improved more. I assumed that mauk was informing me that no! Such is not the case. It only improves by the basic minion scale.

I don't know who to believe anymore! What is it doing, and which behavior is working as intended?
Mauk's link seemed to be replying more to the "pretty beastly" than the actual mechanics of it. 1.76% isn't terribly beastly. Good for a single non-purple enhancement, but it won't transform a build.

Some posts from Codewalker and Arcanaville have said that the crit boost actually does not provide a larger increase to 15% crit attacks, for technical reasons or something. As far as I know, nobody's yet done any testing rigorous enough to tell the difference between a 17% and 18% crit chance with any degree of confidence (you'd need a huge sample size for that), and the difference is small enough that it borders on academic, so for now I just take their word for it.