Returning player questions on teaming, TFs, and Free/VIP


Adeon Hawkwood

 

Posted

So I've come back after a while off...Wow! Combined markets (world didn't seem to end), red-side/blue-side (still no world ending), early level travel powers (I still ghetto travel until my 20s), and now Free to Play (all the servers are yellow!). We can even Walk!

As someone that can't guarantee if I can play for hours or minutes and who hates feeling stupid, I've usually soloed a ton. This time, with the encouragement of the helpful Help channel, I've not only one, but two different task forces (Synapse twice and posi, I think) AND did my first time braving of a PvP zone to snag a Shivan. Thanks to Falafel_Cone, Lightstarr, and Suede on Liberty.

This is also my first real shot at a hero character, I always found red-side friendlier with more compact zones and missions that didn't send you hither and yon as much. Blue side zones are still confusing (what do you mean I can't get there from here?) but the newer missions and combined rail lines are far nicer and made it not too bad.

TF questions:

1) I've noticed a lot of chatter on Help announcing DFBs and a handful of TF/SFs. Great to see red-side life as well. Is Help really the place to find these? My efforts to find a mission team tended not to succeed quickly, though it wasn't hard to join a TF that someone else was building. Since I can't usually commit to a 2 hour block, missions teams have less commitment and would thus be more interesting (though I do intend to try a few more TFs)

2) While I've no desire to rerun or reset a lot, I would like to try a DFB. Any warnings I should know about?

3) MMs still get injured (well, the team gets injured) when teammates don't understand that we can't just fly around to the different spots on an outdoor map, or short-range TP is a bad idea. Is this a common problem?

4) I used to love guides. I'd read them and weigh their descriptions of how a power is or is not useful and the hidden tidbits that the numbers don't give. It seems the last few years that guides are fewer and focus more on Mid's slotting than explaining these things. Am I just yearning for a past that won't return?

5) Did performance increase? It seems I spend less time on loading screens and have fewer slide shows, though I've not gone through a Rikti invasion lately. Meanwhile, I'm running on the same comp...

6) One reason I've often skipped TFs is that I never learn the story or what's going on. Someone suggest I read the Clues while on the mission (not really sure when that downtime would be). Is that the best way to know what's going on?

7) The other reason I've skipped TFs is my only previous attempt was a Villain Respec Trial with the frickin Tentacles. Apparently I have horrible understanding of 3-d space in-game and would always get one-shotted by the thing in the center because I didn't understand where I was relative to it. Was this just a non-standard example of what to expect? The descriptions I've read of Hamis, the new Seed event, or the Incarnate Trials all lead me to expect similar confusion and insta-dead. Am I wrong?

8) I am VIP, having been a subscriber from before and never playing without being a current subscriber. If I drop my subscription, what happens with my full load of characters, including those of restricted ATs or powersets?

9) As someone that tends to pop on, play for a few months, and then vanish for a year or more, not paying a subscription is appealing. Ideally, as soon as I get to feeling I'm done
for a while, I'd stop paying. Then, when the itch returns, I log in and play a bit, and if it's truly what I'm interested in, I'd re-subscribe, and if it really wasn't quite time, I'd wait a bit longer with no impact to my wallet. Is this a workable plan?

Thanks all!


 

Posted

Hero respec has you defending, and it's a bit more tedious but no risk like in the thorn tree. And that respec is kind of unique in how it kills you unawares.

Two places to reference in the VIP vs Prem vs Free. The main CoH website has a decent comparison chart, and the Paragonwiki.com website under paragon rewards does good in showing you what you earn when. The two things you MUST be VIP for are Incarnate stuff and interacting with the SG registrar (new SG/new base/rent).


Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net

Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
1) I've noticed a lot of chatter on Help announcing DFBs and a handful of TF/SFs. Great to see red-side life as well. Is Help really the place to find these? My efforts to find a mission team tended not to succeed quickly, though it wasn't hard to join a TF that someone else was building. Since I can't usually commit to a 2 hour block, missions teams have less commitment and would thus be more interesting (though I do intend to try a few more TFs)
The Help channel is one resource. The other option is global channels (no clue which ones are best for Liberty, sorry). The help channel theoretically has access to a larger audience since free players can use it) but I find that global channels offer more variety in terms of content.

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2) While I've no desire to rerun or reset a lot, I would like to try a DFB. Any warnings I should know about?
It's pretty simple, just watch for the attacks from the Hydra. You see a bubble forming under you and have to move before it bursts.

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3) MMs still get injured (well, the team gets injured) when teammates don't understand that we can't just fly around to the different spots on an outdoor map, or short-range TP is a bad idea. Is this a common problem?
Sadly yes. If it's a concern consider turning on teleport prompt so you can at least avoid that issue. Speed running TFs is currently the vogue which also hurts a lot of MMs (depending a lot on how quickly your summon powers animate, Demon Summoning really sucks for example)

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4) I used to love guides. I'd read them and weigh their descriptions of how a power is or is not useful and the hidden tidbits that the numbers don't give. It seems the last few years that guides are fewer and focus more on Mid's slotting than explaining these things. Am I just yearning for a past that won't return?
Probably. The community in general has become more experienced which makes guides less useful than they were. You still get a few but not as many.

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5) Did performance increase? It seems I spend less time on loading screens and have fewer slide shows, though I've not gone through a Rikti invasion lately. Meanwhile, I'm running on the same comp...
Yeah, they did make some significant upgrades in preparation for Freedom

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6) One reason I've often skipped TFs is that I never learn the story or what's going on. Someone suggest I read the Clues while on the mission (not really sure when that downtime would be). Is that the best way to know what's going on?
You can. you can also access the briefings by clicking on the red mission icon on the navigation bar. Personally though I prefer to just read the story on the wiki and forget about it in game.

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7) The other reason I've skipped TFs is my only previous attempt was a Villain Respec Trial with the frickin Tentacles. Apparently I have horrible understanding of 3-d space in-game and would always get one-shotted by the thing in the center because I didn't understand where I was relative to it. Was this just a non-standard example of what to expect? The descriptions I've read of Hamis, the new Seed event, or the Incarnate Trials all lead me to expect similar confusion and insta-dead. Am I wrong?
It varies. Some of the older TFs are just basic missions using standard maps. The newer ones do tend to go for a more "epic" feel which in general does require more 3D movement. None of them are particularly horrible but they can take some getting used to.

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8) I am VIP, having been a subscriber from before and never playing without being a current subscriber. If I drop my subscription, what happens with my full load of characters, including those of restricted ATs or powersets?
All of your characters will be locked. You will receive a number of slot tokens that you can use to create a slot on a server (the number is equal to how many slots you've bought or received as veteran rewards plus two). You can then use the server slot tokens to unlock individual characters. Characters who have restricted ATs or powersets will require you to purchase the relevant item in the store or upgrade your paragon rewards level before you can unlock them. Nothing will be deleted.

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9) As someone that tends to pop on, play for a few months, and then vanish for a year or more, not paying a subscription is appealing. Ideally, as soon as I get to feeling I'm done
for a while, I'd stop paying. Then, when the itch returns, I log in and play a bit, and if it's truly what I'm interested in, I'd re-subscribe, and if it really wasn't quite time, I'd wait a bit longer with no impact to my wallet. Is this a workable plan?
Sure. As I mentioned above nothing will get deleted so even if you unsubscribe everything will be there when you return. If you're on a premium account you will get some restrictions but it will still be fine for testing it you want to re-sub.

The only thing I might suggest for someone who is switching between VIP and Premium is that unless you are Tier 8 you only get Inventions while a VIP player so you might want to make an SO-only build on some characters for use while Premium.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
So I've come back after a while off...Wow!
Welcome back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
1) I've noticed a lot of chatter on Help announcing DFBs and a handful of TF/SFs. Great to see red-side life as well. Is Help really the place to find these? My efforts to find a mission team tended not to succeed quickly, though it wasn't hard to join a TF that someone else was building. Since I can't usually commit to a 2 hour block, missions teams have less commitment and would thus be more interesting (though I do intend to try a few more TFs)
The primary reason a lot of people are using the Help channel for teaming is the chat restrictions on Free players. They can't send tells in response to broadcasts so "Please Send Tell (or PST)" doesn't work well if you are trying to include them. Ideally, a LFG global channel would be nice. Of course, ideally, everyone would set their LFG flag, use the Search feature, and only blindly invite those folks who were actually marked as LFG.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
2) While I've no desire to rerun or reset a lot, I would like to try a DFB. Any warnings I should know about?
No real warnings. I am assuming you have already come across the changes to how Sidekicking/Exemplaring works. In short, it's automatic, and you continue to earn experience when you exemplar down. In fact, your average XP per kill is the same regardless of if you are fighting your own level or exemplared way down.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
3) MMs still get injured (well, the team gets injured) when teammates don't understand that we can't just fly around to the different spots on an outdoor map, or short-range TP is a bad idea. Is this a common problem?
Your best bet if you are running an MM is to enable the option that stops people from teleporting you without a prompt. In fact, even if you don't run an MM, it's still not a bad idea. Many people have a nasty habit of assuming everyone wants to be teleported to the door of the mission right away. Can be frustrating if you are busy emptying out your inventory or training.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
4) I used to love guides. I'd read them and weigh their descriptions of how a power is or is not useful and the hidden tidbits that the numbers don't give. It seems the last few years that guides are fewer and focus more on Mid's slotting than explaining these things. Am I just yearning for a past that won't return?
It really depends on who is writing the guide. There are still some solid guides out there that are quite comprehensive, going over each power in the sets, explaining the benefits and drawbacks of each, and perhaps giving examples of good ways to make use of them.

Other guides are just builds, perhaps explaining why certain powers were chosen, perhaps not. Also perhaps explaining effective attack chains and/or general play advice, perhaps not.

Then, of course, there are the threads that basically just present a build and ask for advice. Those are more "build advice" threads than "guides". Not sure if this is what you were seeing.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
5) Did performance increase? It seems I spend less time on loading screens and have fewer slide shows, though I've not gone through a Rikti invasion lately. Meanwhile, I'm running on the same comp...
They have done a few rounds of trying to improve server performance. They did a number of them prior to the kick off of "City of Heroes: Freedom" to try to make things as smooth and enjoyable as possible for any new faces that may wander in or old faces like you (not calling you old..really), who make their way back.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
6) One reason I've often skipped TFs is that I never learn the story or what's going on. Someone suggest I read the Clues while on the mission (not really sure when that downtime would be). Is that the best way to know what's going on?
You really miss a lot by not reading the mission text. Luckily, you don't need to do it during the TF. If you have a look at http://www.paragonwiki.com, the text of all (or almost all) missions is there for you to read at your leisure.

There's also a metric ton of other great information regarding the game, particularly the lore. I highly recommend it. In fact, the developers of themselves have stated that they use it as a reference sometimes.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
7) The other reason I've skipped TFs is my only previous attempt was a Villain Respec Trial with the frickin Tentacles. Apparently I have horrible understanding of 3-d space in-game and would always get one-shotted by the thing in the center because I didn't understand where I was relative to it. Was this just a non-standard example of what to expect? The descriptions I've read of Hamis, the new Seed event, or the Incarnate Trials all lead me to expect similar confusion and insta-dead. Am I wrong?
Yeah, the Tree is a bit of a pain. Most TFs are not quite that bad. Some of them can be a bit rough, especially at the end, but at least you see it coming. That being said, some of the Incarnate Trials can also be perilous if you aren't aware of your surroundings... orbital space stations shooting you with death rays, massive turret weapons, areas in the underground trial where you are under a constant DoT, etc.

For most of the TFs though, that's not the case.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
8) I am VIP, having been a subscriber from before and never playing without being a current subscriber. If I drop my subscription, what happens with my full load of characters, including those of restricted ATs or powersets?
If you drop your subscription, you will become a "Premium" player. "Premium" players include anyone who is not a current subscriber, but who has spend money on the game in the past. This can be through buying a boxed product, subscribing for at least a month, or buying at least $15 worth of goodies from the Paragon Market.

If you drop to Premium, you will have 2 "Global" character slot tokens. These are slots which allow you to unlock characters. These tokens are across all servers. So you would not have, for example, 2 on Freedom, 2 on Liberty, 2 on Virtue, etc.

You may have more than 2 slots available if you have purchased or earned extra character slots either through the current Paragon Market and Paragon Rewards program or through the old store and Veteran Rewards programs.

As for the restricted ATs. Depending on what tier you are on in the Paragon Rewards program, these may already be unlocked for you. Optionally, you can pay a one time fee to permanently unlock them. Be aware though, if you pay to unlock them, and then later you earn that unlock for free as part of the Rewards program, you don't get a refund.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
9) As someone that tends to pop on, play for a few months, and then vanish for a year or more, not paying a subscription is appealing. Ideally, as soon as I get to feeling I'm done
for a while, I'd stop paying. Then, when the itch returns, I log in and play a bit, and if it's truly what I'm interested in, I'd re-subscribe, and if it really wasn't quite time, I'd wait a bit longer with no impact to my wallet. Is this a workable plan?
Absolutely. There are really only two things which you can NEVER get access to if you aren't subscribing.
  • Incarnate Content

    There is no way to buy or earn permanent access to the Incarnate System. This includes not only the trials, but also the Incarnate Powers. If you already have Incarnate powers and then drop to Premium, they will be grayed out, you won't be able to craft new ones, and you won't have access to Incarnate salvage drops.
  • Base Building

    Fairly self-explanatory. Non-subscribers can not open the supergroup base editor.

As new systems are added that list may, of course, change. Also, of course, there may be new content added that you either need to be a VIP or purchase access to. First Ward and the Signature Story Arcs are examples of this.


- Garielle
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Originally Posted by Frosty_Femme View Post
I said "ur" which is not a word. It's a sound dumb people make when you ask them to spell out "you are".

 

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Originally Posted by Garielle View Post
Base Building

Fairly self-explanatory. Non-subscribers can not open the supergroup base editor.
I just want to point out that I can edit my base on my preemie account (only T3 rewards). What preemies can't do is interact with the SG registrar. This includes registering a supergroup, asking to create a base after registration, paying rent, and exchanging inf for prestige. You do not have to interact with the SG registrar to edit a base, only to create the initial plot.


Paragon Wiki: http://www.paragonwiki.com
City Info Terminal: http://cit.cohtitan.com
Mids Hero Designer: http://www.cohplanner.com
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Originally Posted by Dispari View Post
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.

 

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Originally Posted by Aggelakis View Post
I just want to point out that I can edit my base on my preemie account (only T3 rewards). What preemies can't do is interact with the SG registrar. This includes registering a supergroup, asking to create a base after registration, paying rent, and exchanging inf for prestige. You do not have to interact with the SG registrar to edit a base, only to create the initial plot.
Ah, good to know. I recall them saying in a few of the overview videos they did during the webcasts that "Base Editting" was VIP only.


- Garielle
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frosty_Femme View Post
I said "ur" which is not a word. It's a sound dumb people make when you ask them to spell out "you are".

 

Posted

Yeah, a lot of their initial restrictions comments have turned out to be totally off base. (ba dum tishhhhh)


Paragon Wiki: http://www.paragonwiki.com
City Info Terminal: http://cit.cohtitan.com
Mids Hero Designer: http://www.cohplanner.com
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dispari View Post
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
1) I've noticed a lot of chatter on Help announcing DFBs and a handful of TF/SFs. Great to see red-side life as well. Is Help really the place to find these? My efforts to find a mission team tended not to succeed quickly, though it wasn't hard to join a TF that someone else was building. Since I can't usually commit to a 2 hour block, missions teams have less commitment and would thus be more interesting (though I do intend to try a few more TFs)
I know how you feel. I am finding myself entering a phase of my main toon's development in which TFs and Incarnate Trials are about the only content really worth pursuing. However, I don't know the best way to find teams for these.

Back in October, when I was soloing some of the RWZ content, I would see large groups of people gathering (or what I imagined to be gathering) to form leagues for iTrials in the RWZ common area in front of The Lady Grey. What I have discovered, at least on Virtue, is that most folks there are only interested in speed runs. However, I've never done these TFs or Trials before and am a complete newbie. I barely made it through Lambda over the weekend, and the entire time I had no idea what I was supposed to be doing. The team leader didn't announce it was a speed run until after we were zoning into it!

I need to find people who want to do TFs (including the old classic TFs so I can get my Task Force Commander accolade), the weekly strike targets, and non-speed/non-Master-of iTrials. But everyone seems to have been doing this Incarnate stuff for so long now, that regular runs are a thing of the past for them. If there is a chat channel (on Virtue) where like-minded players can find each other, I'd love to learn about it!


NOR-RAD - 50 Rad/Rad/Elec Defender - Nikki Stryker - 50 DM/SR/Weap Scrapper - Iron Marauder - 50 Eng/Eng/Pow Blaster
Lion of Might - 50 SS/Inv/Eng Tanker - Darling Nikkee - 50 (+3) StJ/WP/Eng Brute - Ice Giant Kurg - 36 Ice/Storm Controller

 

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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
4) I used to love guides. I'd read them and weigh their descriptions of how a power is or is not useful and the hidden tidbits that the numbers don't give. It seems the last few years that guides are fewer and focus more on Mid's slotting than explaining these things. Am I just yearning for a past that won't return?

Probably. The community in general has become more experienced which makes guides less useful than they were. You still get a few but not as many.

Also, incarnate powers, Mids and IO set bonuses have made the concept of a general guide for any AT obsolete. Things are more complicated now, or at least we have more options to consider. It's best to post your questions in the appropriate forum and ask for advice now. OTOH the existing guides often make fine leveling/SO guides.


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The only thing I might suggest for someone who is switching between VIP and Premium is that unless you are Tier 8 you only get Inventions while a VIP player so you might want to make an SO-only build on some characters for use while Premium.
This bit may require more explanation. We now have two (or three, if you incarnate) builds. Your second build is essentially a whole new character that you build from level 1. This is like a free respec, so don't waste it. But you can switch between builds every 15 minutes by visiting a trainer. To get started, visit a trainer and pick "Train to a new level of power" -> "Choose your active build."

Note that the first time you pick a second build, you'll be level 1, so be ready to level up and SO, or be prepared to hang out for 15 minutes as level 1 while waiting for the cool down timer. (Or just play another toon for a while.)

Note that you don't have to earn XP to level up your 2nd build, XP earned applies to all builds. You do have to be prepared to pick new powers or choose slots.


 

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Originally Posted by Wing_Leader View Post
I need to find people who want to do TFs (including the old classic TFs so I can get my Task Force Commander accolade), the weekly strike targets, and non-speed/non-Master-of iTrials.

The easiest way to do this is to run them yourself. Advertise for a "kill to objective" run, which is what most folks think of as a normal run. You might also want to toss "noobie" in there. As long as you shoulder part of the burden, like running to contact and forming the team, you'll likely have some experienced players on the team who can give you advice along the way.

Note this really doesn't apply to incarnate trials, which in fact are darn hard, at least if you're new. Those you just might have to suffer through the confusion until you figure it out. It you could find a dedicated group of new players who want to experience the content as new, I'm sure you could do it, but I doubt most of the player base wants to watch a bunch of new folks run around at random and fail an iTtrial a few times, which is what the rest of us had to do to figure it out.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wing_Leader View Post
I need to find people who want to do TFs (including the old classic TFs so I can get my Task Force Commander accolade), the weekly strike targets, and non-speed/non-Master-of iTrials. But everyone seems to have been doing this Incarnate stuff for so long now, that regular runs are a thing of the past for them. If there is a chat channel (on Virtue) where like-minded players can find each other, I'd love to learn about it!
You mention you're on Virtue so the main teaming channels on Virtue are (in rough order of popularity):
Virtue TFs 2010
Virtue LFG Beta
Virtue TFs

Those are normally pretty good for doing TFs including TF Commander, the WST and ITFs although for the less popular ones you'll probably have to start it yourself.

Non-Speed trials are a little trickier, most of the Virtue raiders have done BAF/Lambda so much that we have gotten into a simple system that works and getting people to vary from it is tricky (in my experience half the league follows the leader and the other half just goes ahead and does the standard strategy anyway causing mass confusion). While this is nice for established people I can see that it might be intimidating for newbies. Unfortunately there aren't a whole lot of options here, you could try leading trials yourself and specify non-speed during recruiting but you might find it slow going just because a lot of people don't want to bother non-speed (still I'd encourage it if only because more trial leaders is a good thing).


 

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Originally Posted by gameboy1234 View Post
The easiest way to do this is to run them yourself. Advertise for a "kill to objective" run, which is what most folks think of as a normal run. You might also want to toss "noobie" in there. As long as you shoulder part of the burden, like running to contact and forming the team, you'll likely have some experienced players on the team who can give you advice along the way.

Note this really doesn't apply to incarnate trials, which in fact are darn hard, at least if you're new. Those you just might have to suffer through the confusion until you figure it out. It you could find a dedicated group of new players who want to experience the content as new, I'm sure you could do it, but I doubt most of the player base wants to watch a bunch of new folks run around at random and fail an iTtrial a few times, which is what the rest of us had to do to figure it out.
One thing I can recommend as far as the iTrials go is to stop by the same site I mentioned earlier, Pargon Wiki. They have strategy guides that explain all of the incarnate trials there. Where you should be at each stage, what to expect, what to avoid, etc. It will greatly improve your understanding once you are standing there in the iTrial.

There was a guy a couple of months ago that was doing Keyes Reactor trial walk throughs on Freedom. That trial is unique in that the entire area the trial takes place can be visited in world (minus all the incarnate level enemies of course). So he would get together a group of folks and take them there, and walk them through the area going over what goes on during the trial. I attended one of them and he did a spectacular job. Not sure if he still doing them or not, but keep an eye on the forums (particular the Freedom Server forum), because he will usually post a message in advance inviting people to come.

If you don't have a character on Freedom, don't sweat it. You can create a level 1 Praetorian, exit the tutorial area, and join the team for the walk through. Since you'll automatically be sidekicked up to 49, the surrounding enemies will be a non-issue.


- Garielle
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frosty_Femme View Post
I said "ur" which is not a word. It's a sound dumb people make when you ask them to spell out "you are".

 

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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
Non-Speed trials are a little trickier, most of the Virtue raiders have done BAF/Lambda so much that we have gotten into a simple system that works and getting people to vary from it is tricky (in my experience half the league follows the leader and the other half just goes ahead and does the standard strategy anyway causing mass confusion). While this is nice for established people I can see that it might be intimidating for newbies. Unfortunately there aren't a whole lot of options here, you could try leading trials yourself and specify non-speed during recruiting but you might find it slow going just because a lot of people don't want to bother non-speed (still I'd encourage it if only because more trial leaders is a good thing).
Yeah, this is what I figured was the case, and I understand how it gets this way. But it is kind of disappointing, that's all. And it's not just that it is intimidating, it simply isn't fun.

It feels like the options for newbies who make their way to 50 and decide to try Incarnates are slim, and this state of affairs might very well just turn F2P players off to such an extent that they never bother subscribing and getting into the Incarnate system at all.


NOR-RAD - 50 Rad/Rad/Elec Defender - Nikki Stryker - 50 DM/SR/Weap Scrapper - Iron Marauder - 50 Eng/Eng/Pow Blaster
Lion of Might - 50 SS/Inv/Eng Tanker - Darling Nikkee - 50 (+3) StJ/WP/Eng Brute - Ice Giant Kurg - 36 Ice/Storm Controller

 

Posted

Most of these have been adequately answered already, but here's a couple I'll put in.

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
2) While I've no desire to rerun or reset a lot, I would like to try a DFB. Any warnings I should know about?
If you want to get badges out of it:

* when you get to the Vahzilok AV, you absolutely must not defeat any minions before you defeat the AV. MM pets should be set to passive (so they don't return fire against any minions that attack them), and nobody uses AoE attacks. Be sure and convey this to your teammates ahead of time. (And be prepared for at least one of them to completely ignore you. :P)

* The Lost AV, Prophet, is the other way around—you have to defeat all the minions before you defeat him to get his badge. Or, as I like to put it

1) Defeat all minions.
2) ...
3) Prophet!

* If you do DFB more than once on any given character (it's a great way to level up beginning characters, as well as the only way you can get them SOs before the twenties), take a different reward at the end each time—they don't stack.

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7) The other reason I've skipped TFs is my only previous attempt was a Villain Respec Trial with the frickin Tentacles. Apparently I have horrible understanding of 3-d space in-game and would always get one-shotted by the thing in the center because I didn't understand where I was relative to it. Was this just a non-standard example of what to expect?
The Treespec is one of the nastiest surprises in the game. It's worth noting that one of the great benefits of going Rogue (that is, doing Rogue tips and converting your villain to a Rogue) is that your character can go do the hero-side respec instead, which is boring but definitely safer.

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The descriptions I've read of Hamis, the new Seed event, or the Incarnate Trials all lead me to expect similar confusion and insta-dead. Am I wrong?
Yes and no. The Behavioral Adjustment Facility and Lambda Complex trials are short, sweet, and drop-dead easy once you know what you're doing (and learning what you're doing doesn't take long at all). (In fact, the devs are finding, to their chagrin, that they might just be too easy, to the point that they toyed with removing Empyrean rewards from them until the players revolted—it's hard to get anyone to want to do any of the other trials, that are more challenging.)

Keyes is a bit harder, but they really nerfed it back with the update that just went in. Underground is a platinum-plated rhymes-with-witch—I've only managed to do it successfully once out of the four times I've tried it—but I expect they'll get around to making it easier at some point too. And the devs are cranking the rewards from those trials to try to get more people to do them.

It really makes a big difference to have an experienced leader who is good at communicating the objectives. The right leader can make the difference between winning and ignominious defeat.


 

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Update from the Original Poster:

First, thank you for explaining how the character slots work if you go preemie from VIP...all I could find on the websites was what's allowed, not how it handles things that are no longer allowed.

Second, now that I've tinkered a bit and interacted with the Free players, I want to offer NCSoft some props. It seems like they are really targeting the game to be usable and interesting for free, solid for Premiums, and just trying to get you interested enough for a VIP to be worthwhile, as opposed to making the game "force" you to subscribe. Compared to a lot of other "FTP" approaches in the non-MMO world, this was really nice.

I've now done a few DFBs and a couple of BAFs.

I found joining the big channels on the server to open a whole new world of offers. While finding an op to get unsilenced has been mostly unsuccessful, I can still see the groups forming and get involved. This has made a huge difference to problem #1: Finding a group without waiting hours.

I love the format of using cutscenes to layout the background and the "radio" prompts to give background/instructions. This avoids the "rush, rush, no time for appreciation or guidance" issue, while not really delaying things by very much. The status boxes (e.g. "0/11 left" or "1:34 remaining") are also awesome. The big warning text on event changes is likewise great. Having maps that aren't chaotic messes filled with trash also improves things.

Compared with the few TFs I've done, or the Villain Treespec, the new Trials are friendly to new players and quite accessible. While there are still a few gotchas (Thanks for the warning about the bubbles with the hydra - I'm not sure I'd have figured it out as actually avoidable as quickly if you hadn't warned me) - having a leader that recognizes that you're new and gives a few prompts is still awesome. (My props to NullValue on Liberty, who was a kind and successful leader on BAF) Heck, even the hospital in BAF is convenient!

Reading the Wiki was helpful, but mainly because it let more click when someone gave me hints in game. Things like "you'll get a circle for each warning of suppression" doesn't really prepare you for when it happens. (BTW, for my fellow BAF-newbs - it's VERY obvious) Reading it all was a lot to take in and remember, but when my guide said "fall back if you get a circle" it let me go "oh, I can fall back and kill adds until it fades".

I'll also say it fared well compared to my limited experiences with That-Other-Game, where the few raids I was in tended to smite-or-wipe. My first BAF was very successful, the second where they were going for more badges had NightStar rez no fewer than 3 times and had the adds on Seige get out of hand. Some 6 trips to the hospital for me and members of my "team" later we were able to regain control and come back to complete it (no success on the badges, but I got 29% Judgement after the first run and was up to 76% after the second). To have a long fight where we can be clearly "losing" and be able to readjust and come back to "winning" WITHOUT being an elite crew of people who dedicate themselves to the game made it really enjoyable.

Of vast importance to me was the fact that this didn't take an inordinate amount of time. Sure, there was 10 minutes of initial grouping time. But there wasn't a maze full of trash to defeat, there wasn't zoning between contacts for no real reason. There wasn't an hour or more of standing around waiting for the raid to assemble.

There's still room for improvement. The LFG tab would be a truly awesome idea if everyone didn't prefer to group up beforehand. I've played this for game for years and never knew that the global channels were significant at all. A few UI additions (being able to toggle between a few select targets) would make certain tasks easier on the newbie. The resulting rewards are dizzyingly incomprehensible. (I was alpha slotted so I understood shards...Now I have threads, different components, and two kinds of Merits!) And while the new format and direction for Trials is great, there are still few of them, leaving me dreading the TFs I will need to run to finish out my currently-commonly-slotted-alpha.

On the whole though, I highly enjoyed myself and look forward to finding the time to do more. The experience was more accessible than I thought once I found the global channel.


 

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
On the whole though, I highly enjoyed myself and look forward to finding the time to do more. The experience was more accessible than I thought once I found the global channel.

I'd like to highlight this and point it out to the devs. In many, many cases, I've found that the solution to everything is "join your global channels." The number of issues global channels solves is just nuts. Given they're so successful, I'd like to recommend the devs pay attention and improve them.

1. A limit of 2,500 people is too low for a feature that everyone must effectively use to enjoy the game. How about 25,000 or 250,000?

2. I think I'd like to see more official channels that everyone joins automatically. "Help" is good but some folks avoid it do to spam. An official LFT, BMTR (Badges, Missions, Task Force, Raids) Channel, and a higher level Incarnate channel might alleviate some of the pressure.


 

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So, I kinda know what global chat channels are, but it's been so long since I tried using them (probably back when they were first implemented way back when), I don't really remember how to get at them. Any quick pointers (or wiki links) explaining this? I've tried "joining" a channel (by name), but I didn't see it in the list of available channels to add to a tab after that. Was I just blind? Or is there some other voodoo I need to go through? And which of the tiny little chat channel icons (Team, Local, Supergroup, etc.) do I have to be in to send messages to one of these user-created chat channels?


NOR-RAD - 50 Rad/Rad/Elec Defender - Nikki Stryker - 50 DM/SR/Weap Scrapper - Iron Marauder - 50 Eng/Eng/Pow Blaster
Lion of Might - 50 SS/Inv/Eng Tanker - Darling Nikkee - 50 (+3) StJ/WP/Eng Brute - Ice Giant Kurg - 36 Ice/Storm Controller

 

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Originally Posted by Wing_Leader View Post
So, I kinda know what global chat channels are, but it's been so long since I tried using them (probably back when they were first implemented way back when), I don't really remember how to get at them. Any quick pointers (or wiki links) explaining this? I've tried "joining" a channel (by name), but I didn't see it in the list of available channels to add to a tab after that. Was I just blind? Or is there some other voodoo I need to go through?
No, once you join a channel you should be able to see it on the tab channel selection (at the top of the list). To check if you are actually a member of a channel go to the friends window and pull down the drop down box there. If you are a member you will see the global channel lsited there.

Quote:
And which of the tiny little chat channel icons (Team, Local, Supergroup, etc.) do I have to be in to send messages to one of these user-created chat channels?
None. You click on the channel name to the left of the chat box (i.e. where it says team, Local SG etc.) and a popup menu will allow you to select global channels to speak in.


 

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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
You mention you're on Virtue so the main teaming channels on Virtue are (in rough order of popularity):
Virtue TFs 2010
Virtue LFG Beta
Virtue TFs
Just wanted to mention that I joined these channels, but the first one listed, Virtue TFs 2010, is a "private" chat channel and not available to me apparently.


NOR-RAD - 50 Rad/Rad/Elec Defender - Nikki Stryker - 50 DM/SR/Weap Scrapper - Iron Marauder - 50 Eng/Eng/Pow Blaster
Lion of Might - 50 SS/Inv/Eng Tanker - Darling Nikkee - 50 (+3) StJ/WP/Eng Brute - Ice Giant Kurg - 36 Ice/Storm Controller

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wing_Leader View Post
Just wanted to mention that I joined these channels, but the first one listed, Virtue TFs 2010, is a "private" chat channel and not available to me apparently.
That's because Virtue TFs 2010 is going away at the end of the year in favor of the original title for the channel, which apparently became available again.

Join "Virtue TFs" instead.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wing_Leader View Post
Just wanted to mention that I joined these channels, but the first one listed, Virtue TFs 2010, is a "private" chat channel and not available to me apparently.
Were you not able to join or able to join but couldn't speak? I know they have it set to auto-silence new members to prevent spamming and you need to ask a mod to un-silence you.


 

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Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
And while the new format and direction for Trials is great, there are still few of them, leaving me dreading the TFs I will need to run to finish out my currently-commonly-slotted-alpha.
Each of the Alpha Slot enhancements actually has 2 recipes now (with the exception of Tier 4, but that's a whole different topic). The first takes shard-based components, but if you scroll down, you'll see the second recipe takes thread-based components. So, for purposes of the Alpha slot, those TF's you are dreading are no longer required.


@Mistress Rue
Yes, I RP and play Redside on Virtue - No, Rumors of its demise have been greatly exaggerated

Do you suck at COH/COV? not yet...

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SwiftOneSpeaks View Post
Reading it all was a lot to take in and remember, but when my guide said "fall back if you get a circle" it let me go "oh, I can fall back and kill adds until it fades".
Having a patient and capable "guide" in the league can make a huge difference to a newbie (like me). I spent most of Sunday running iTrials for the first time. League/Team leadership ranged from pretty good to virtually non-existant. The best was a BAF run in which we had a leader who graciously explained what needed to be done, though to be honest much of it didn't sink it until after I'd been through it. The worst was a Keyes Reactor run in which nobody seemed to know what to do, including myself. Having been through each of them 3 or 4 times at this point, I am able to muddle through Lambda and Keyes without doing too much damage to the overall effort, but I am still a bit lost on the details of what needs to happen when, where, in what order, and by whom.

I am grateful that the player community in COH continues to open its proverbial doors of participation to newbies, without reservation (I've heard tales in this forum of league-formers trying to weed out "undesireables", but thankfully that has not happened to me yet), but I wish someone out there would create some tutorial videos explaining (and showing) each stage of these things, so guys like me would know what is expected of them before diving in. Some folks may feel that the process of learning-as-you-go is exciting and "part of the game," but I assure you that the rest of my leaguemates who have done these things a hundred times already don't see it that way, and as a result, neither do I.

On bright side, however, I did manage to take my little L50 toon who, before I started on Sunday, only had her tier 1 alpha slotted, and open both interface and judgement, get all three slots up to tier 3, and even get some decent progress on unlocking lore and destiny. All of this in just one day of running iTrials (I have yet to go through UG though). The one benefit of running with highly experienced teams is that the astral merits drop like crazy, and you're in and out and on to the next run in fairly short order. It made for a somewhat dizzying first experience (with iTrials), but the resulting Incarnate progression was impressive. The Incarnate system and the Trials are just as fun and cool as I hoped they would be, but I still think a more illustrative body of tutorial material would go a long way towards converting frustration (for us newbies) into fun.


NOR-RAD - 50 Rad/Rad/Elec Defender - Nikki Stryker - 50 DM/SR/Weap Scrapper - Iron Marauder - 50 Eng/Eng/Pow Blaster
Lion of Might - 50 SS/Inv/Eng Tanker - Darling Nikkee - 50 (+3) StJ/WP/Eng Brute - Ice Giant Kurg - 36 Ice/Storm Controller

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood View Post
Were you not able to join or able to join but couldn't speak?
It wouldn't let me join the channel.

Apparently it is a deprecated channel and will be going away, so it's kinda moot at this point. I am, now, joined to Virtue LFG Beta, Virtue TFs, and LFG Beta.


NOR-RAD - 50 Rad/Rad/Elec Defender - Nikki Stryker - 50 DM/SR/Weap Scrapper - Iron Marauder - 50 Eng/Eng/Pow Blaster
Lion of Might - 50 SS/Inv/Eng Tanker - Darling Nikkee - 50 (+3) StJ/WP/Eng Brute - Ice Giant Kurg - 36 Ice/Storm Controller