Player-accessible Bug-tracking System?
By
AmazingMOO,
Posted on: 2011-09-20 10:04 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I really doubt they are going to give us access to such a system for the following reasons:
The QA bug tracking system is probably 3rd party software used internally between the QA and development teams.
Granting player access to it would require giving us access to their internal computer network.
Granting players access to it would overwhelm the system and result in thousands of copies of the same bug report.
Keep in mind all that is conjecture based on my software development experience but probably isn't too far off of the mark.
I think this is the bug tracking system they use:
@Quasadu
"We must prepare for DOOM and hope for FREEM." - SirFrederick
I don't see how that would relieve any frustrations, unless one's pet issue was assigned a high priority. All it would do for everything else is provide people with ammunition (without the broader context of why it was given the priority is was) for their entitlement-driven rant posts.
You hit "submit" on a bug report, and voila....the devs have officially heard about your bug. It will get fixed when they deem necessary, or when they figure out what caused it, or have the resources needed to fix it etc etc...they don't need us looking over their shoulder any more than we already do.
If i were a dev, I wouldn't work someplace with such a system in place.
Furio--Lvl 50+3 Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster, Virtue
Megadeth--Lvl 50+3 Necro/DM/Soul MM, Virtue
Veriandros--Lvl 50+3 Crab Soldier, Virtue
"So come and get me! I'll be waiting for ye, with a whiff of the old brimstone. I'm a grim bloody fable, with an unhappy bloody end!" Demoman, TF2
Quote:
They should really invest in a priority-based filing system for their reports. Something like:|
Originally Posted by Quasadu
I think this is the bug tracking system they use:
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Justice Hunter, 50 Inv/SS Tank
Slenszic, 50 Sword/Energy Stalker
MA Arc IDs: 1355, 2341, 2350
Quote:
So that missing section of floor in one of the sewers entrance rooms that I have sporadically reported for the past seven years is something they haven't gotten around to yet and I should wait longer? I know people who weren't ALIVE when I first submitted that bug.|
Originally Posted by Furio
You hit "submit" on a bug report, and voila....the devs have officially heard about your bug. It will get fixed when they deem necessary, or when they figure out what caused it, or have the resources needed to fix it etc etc...they don't need us looking over their shoulder any more than we already do.
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There's a reason people feel that their bug reports are sent straight into a black hole - because no acknowledgement is ever given that these bugs have even been read. City of Heroes has never had a comprehensive "known bugs" section outside of directly after large publishes, so people can't even tell what's considered a bug and what isn't.
And, really, us not knowing what priority a bug has been given internally doesn't really prevent us from inferring what priority that might be based on how long it's been since we reported it with no confirmation or fix in sight. To this day, I still have a Blaster who can completely and utterly bypass all power rooting, I've reported this multiple times and nothing has ever happened with it.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Quote:
And how easy is it to reproduce this? Is it a combination of powers that does it? or is it literally just your single character?|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
To this day, I still have a Blaster who can completely and utterly bypass all power rooting, I've reported this multiple times and nothing has ever happened with it.
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The reason why it *might* not be fixed is because they havent been able to reproduce it...
And yes, I have had replies to /bug asking me for more information in the past
Quote:
Us looking over their shoulders at a priority list will change any of that how? They're not going to change their procedures...bug X has priority 3-Bravo now, it'd still have that priority if this happened and we can see their redacted priority list. It's a placebo at best.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
So that missing section of floor in one of the sewers entrance rooms that I have sporadically reported for the past seven years is something they haven't gotten around to yet and I should wait longer? I know people who weren't ALIVE when I first submitted that bug.
There's a reason people feel that their bug reports are sent straight into a black hole - because no acknowledgement is ever given that these bugs have even been read. City of Heroes has never had a comprehensive "known bugs" section outside of directly after large publishes, so people can't even tell what's considered a bug and what isn't. And, really, us not knowing what priority a bug has been given internally doesn't really prevent us from inferring what priority that might be based on how long it's been since we reported it with no confirmation or fix in sight. To this day, I still have a Blaster who can completely and utterly bypass all power rooting, I've reported this multiple times and nothing has ever happened with it. |
Furio--Lvl 50+3 Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster, Virtue
Megadeth--Lvl 50+3 Necro/DM/Soul MM, Virtue
Veriandros--Lvl 50+3 Crab Soldier, Virtue
"So come and get me! I'll be waiting for ye, with a whiff of the old brimstone. I'm a grim bloody fable, with an unhappy bloody end!" Demoman, TF2
Quote:
But have those people also reported that bug and do they have 27 level 50 incarnated characters? |
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I know people who weren't ALIVE when I first submitted that bug.
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Quote:
I honestly don't know what causes it, but if I use Build Up while Hovering forward, then no animation will play thereafter until I stop moving forward or am stopped somehow. It doesn't work on all characters, but it DOES work on this one, whom I have repeatedly offered to QA to test with. They should have a copy of all my characters, my more specific reproduction steps have persisted in every bit of communication I've sent and every time I log back into this character just to check if he can override all of his animations, he still can.|
Originally Posted by Gangrel_EU
And how easy is it to reproduce this? Is it a combination of powers that does it? or is it literally just your single character?
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That's the same, I assume, as the bug which causes some characters to resurrect floating via Return to Battle and use inspirations on the way up while causing others to resurrect shambling to their feet and unable to use inspirations on the way. I've reported both, reported characters that can and cannot reproduce the bug, listed reproduction steps and conditions, and still nothing.
Now, obviously, that's one bug out of a thousand, but a bug that can allow a person to override ALL combat animations, a bug that I had an entire thread deleted by a mod because he firmly believed I was making a guide to an exploit, isn't something that should spend this long existing. I first spotted it around 2008, I think, and I will bet you dollars to doughnuts it's still in effect.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Furio
Us looking over their shoulders at a priority list will change any of that how? They're not going to change their procedures...bug X has priority 3-Bravo now, it'd still have that priority if this happened and we can see their redacted priority list. It's a placebo at best.
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At the very least, being able to see that a bug has been logged, confirmed as a bug and a solution is pending will alert me to stop reporting it, and will at least let me know that it isn't being ignored or considered working as intended.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I should have put ammunition in " ". Any rational person knows that bug reports get looked at. Not only have we been told this many times over the years, the fact that bugs *do* get fixed is evidence enough.
There's (as I'm sure we all know or should at least suspect) a lot that goes into debugging the game, and so there's a lot of different reasons why a bug (even a serious one) may continue to exist. Sure, a known bugs list would be nice....but what moo suggests goes too far, imo. Knowing the priority the devs have assigned to a bug without being privy to the reasoning and the decision-making process behind that decision would just spawn unnecessary forum drama at worst, or a lot of ctrl-v's of the Standard Code Rant at best....probably both.
So bottom line, known bugs list...I can get behind that. Anything more than that is not our business.
Furio--Lvl 50+3 Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster, Virtue
Megadeth--Lvl 50+3 Necro/DM/Soul MM, Virtue
Veriandros--Lvl 50+3 Crab Soldier, Virtue
"So come and get me! I'll be waiting for ye, with a whiff of the old brimstone. I'm a grim bloody fable, with an unhappy bloody end!" Demoman, TF2
One of the frustrations I and I imagine at least some of the other players have is logging broken items and then not hearing about them again until they happen to show up on a patch note, which could be months or even years away, depending on the priorities of the developers tasked with fixing them.
For example, there's a thread on the bug forum about missing costume pieces since i21 launched. It's had no developer posts and the posters there have no clue whether or not their concerns have been heard, whether or not anyone's working on fixing the issue, or even what priority the issue has been assigned. When it's actually going to be fixed is a complete shot in the dark at that point.
Of course many of the developers don't have rednames, so even if one is going to fix a certain bug that's a player complain, they may or may not have access to post an acknowledgement on the forum.
To help address this issue and reduce player frustration, I propose opening up whatever bug tracking system the developers are using so that players can submit bug reports directly to it, view the priority assigned to bug fixes, and see if those bug fixes are being addressed or delayed.
To ensure developer privacy, dev comments and posts to this system could be hidden from players.
Thoughts?