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Unless you team a lot so someone locks down the bosses/AVs, it will not be worth it for you with no immobilize.|
Originally Posted by Lazarillo
I'm playing an AR/Sonic and trying to decide between Ignite and Beanbag. It seems like the former can dish out some pretty nice damage, but I'm not sure how practical given that it induces panic and there's nothing to keep enemies from scattering in my secondary (and I'm going heroside, so no real help from APPs, either).
How about on AVs? Will they scare out of the patch as well or will it be handier there? |
You know you can grab the villain PPPs and head back to heroside and keep them right? Worth doing.
I agree that ignite without either an immobilize or a hold is of limited utility. However, I'll add that for APPs Electric Mastery has a quite nice single target immobilize (and a nice single target hold).
It does nice damage when you can get a foe to stand in it. I'm not sure it's worth going out of your way to obtain an immobilize to leverage it though. It'll be a situational power, so whether or not you take it will depend on how you feel about that.
Any time you team with someone (usually a Controller) spamming an immobilize, you will be able to use it. Against AVs you will be able to use it. Most other times, it won't be effective for damage.
The avoid can be useful by itself though. You can put it at your own feet to keep enemies from meleeing you...much. They'll probably still run up and smack you once, then run away.
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If you have a spare power slot to drop it into, you can get a fair bit of use out of Ignite as a channeling and obstruction tool -- drop it in a doorway to block it, or to force mobs to move in a particular direction -- but it's a really situational thing.
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Originally Posted by Supernumiphone
The avoid can be useful by itself though. You can put it at your own feet to keep enemies from meleeing you...much. They'll probably still run up and smack you once, then run away.
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"But in our enthusiasm, we could not resist a radical overhaul of the system, in which all of its major weaknesses have been exposed, analyzed, and replaced with new weaknesses."
-- Bruce Leverett, Register Allocation in Optimizing Compilers
Ignite is barely worth it with an immobilize. Definitely not worth it without one.
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Gee whiz, a perma nuke-level damage power isn't worth it to you, eh?|
Originally Posted by Neogumbercules
Ignite is barely worth it with an immobilize. Definitely not worth it without one.
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Ignite is such a great power but yes you need to immobilize foes. No, AVs will probably still run. It has like a mag 50 fear in it if I remember, but it does insane damage for the cost. Without buffs, I think it cranks over 500 damage by itself every time you use it, and you can keep firing other attacks while it is doing that 500+ damage.
3 rech, 3 dam, and you are set. Grab Web Envelope from Black Scorpion.
Just to let you know, the ENTIRE SET was rebalanced around Ignite a couple of years ago. Look it up.
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I agree..saying it isnt worth it is crazy. Ar has a ton of aoes, another aoe = good. Ar has few single target attacks..meaning its usually quite easy to fit things it the build. My ar/em blaster has ignite to go with webnade and scorp shield. The aoe of Ignite is small, and takes a bit to get used to, but the damage is totally worth it. Even if your only using it on hard targets, consider it a place to throw another posi blast set.
Vs avs and stuff..well...its flat out awesome. Immob them and go to toon, I have seen it do over 100 damage a tic heaps of times. Thats 1500! damage (I think its 15 tics..). And 1500 damage that is constantly going, allowing you to keep attacking. Not to mention, get the rech down, and you can use it over and over.
Oh, but to answer the question..yes..get an immob. But then again..even using it just on teams, good odds someone will have an immob, if you do not.
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I had forgotten about that one. Plan was Power Mastery, for the delightful Build-Up, but this is worth considering.|
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
However, I'll add that for APPs Electric Mastery has a quite nice single target immobilize (and a nice single target hold).
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Thanks all for the tips and tricks. I ended up putting off Ignite for now, but, it sounds like it's definitely worth it on the right setup, so once I get a few more levels under my belt (especially with APPs coming in at 35 soon), I'll probably be adding both to my build.
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I think you're overselling Ignite's damage a bit. It does 278 base damage and that's only assuming you can manage to keep an enemy inside of it for 10 full seconds. It has been my experience that there are better things I can be doing with my endurance and cast time than use ignite on the many AR corrs i have played. I still keep it around for the few instances where I'm fighting a non-mobile enemy, such as the computer on the ITF or an AV that doesn't run around too much. The cast time changes they did a while back only helped the situation slightly. |
Originally Posted by JayboH
Gee whiz, a perma nuke-level damage power isn't worth it to you, eh?
Ignite is such a great power but yes you need to immobilize foes. No, AVs will probably still run. It has like a mag 50 fear in it if I remember, but it does insane damage for the cost. Without buffs, I think it cranks over 500 damage by itself every time you use it, and you can keep firing other attacks while it is doing that 500+ damage. 3 rech, 3 dam, and you are set. Grab Web Envelope from Black Scorpion. Just to let you know, the ENTIRE SET was rebalanced around Ignite a couple of years ago. Look it up. |
As to the point of more AoE being better, I find it to be the opposite. On a corr I often have other things I keep myself busy with. Whether that be setting up traps or casting debuffs. The set already has a couple of long animating powers that take up a comparatively huge chunk of time, and I'd hesitate to call it a good "AoE" attack since the radius is so tiny that you'd be lucky to get more than 3 enemies stuck in it, especially after aggro has been established and all of the mobs are either running around or getting knocked around by your team.
When I tried the venerable webnade - ignite combo my experience was this:
Cast Webnade
Cast Ignite
Teammates Shield Charge, Footstomp, Fireball, and nuke the enemies.
Ignite does a fraction of what it's capable of and I contributed almost nothing.
And of course if you open with Full Auto and Flamethrower, or some debuff and Full Auto everything is going to be dead from that + whatever your team is doing. That's just my personal experience with the power.
Now if you're solo'ing and have the luxury of being able to play at your own pace then I'm sure there are instances where you can find a way to make Ignite a useful tool.
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This is really what it comes down to. I use Ignite a LOT when I'm soloing on my AR characters but I rarely use it at all on teams (occasionally against an AV). It's not worth the setup time on a fast moving team but solo it's an excellent way of taking out bosses or particularly troublesome Lts.
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Originally Posted by Neogumbercules
Now if you're solo'ing and have the luxury of being able to play at your own pace then I'm sure there are instances where you can find a way to make Ignite a useful tool.
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I was using it all the time with my AR/Kin. Fulcrum Shift after Web Envelope, Ignite, then all the cones under the buff.
I don't pick powers based on solo ability though; I am not crazy enough to think I will never play with a teammate that can hold or immobilize.
I was playing him before the rebalance so it was stacking with itself constantly.
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Ah but he's using it with a corruptor and it scourges like rain of fire does. Making it much more powerfull for corruptors and very much worth taking and leveraging.
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If you are taking, or not taking, a power based on the assumption that when you use it, team mates are going to wipe spawns, what is the point even taking ANY powers? With judgements, its basically the first two people too Judge a spawn..kill it. That's how it goes. Ignite is still fun and useful..if only as a set mule for Posi's.
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So... what happens if you aren't doing level 50 content?|
Originally Posted by MisterD
If you are taking, or not taking, a power based on the assumption that when you use it, team mates are going to wipe spawns, what is the point even taking ANY powers? With judgements, its basically the first two people too Judge a spawn..kill it. That's how it goes. Ignite is still fun and useful..if only as a set mule for Posi's.
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Oh yeah, that's right... you don't HAVE Judgement powers.
Some people don't exemp...ever. I'm not one of them, but they're out there.
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Yeah, notice where the thread is located?
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Originally Posted by Mid_Boss
Ah but he's using it with a corruptor and it scourges like rain of fire does. Making it much more powerfull for corruptors and very much worth taking and leveraging.
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Too bad Ignite didn't get buffed when Burn did.
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Originally Posted by je_saist
So... what happens if you aren't doing level 50 content?
Oh yeah, that's right... you don't HAVE Judgement powers. |
Duuuh...sorry it is too tricky to make that leap that I wasnt just talking about lvl 50 content? Also, if its not lvl 50 content..chances are that spawns will NOT be getting wiped fast enough to make using ignite seem like a waste. (Oh and..you get judgements playing exempt down to 45, and since the OP was talking about epic immobs..he COULD be on a lvl 45 team with players who have judgements. So yeah..not only are you silly, your also wrong, since you can be under lvl 50 and have incarnate powers)
But hey..lets not derail a decent question with idiotic nitpickings about a reply trying to answer said question. Oh wait..you already DID.
I wouldn't take ignite without an immobilize. I wouldn't play AR without ignite.
I Would take Mu Patron and get E-Fences.
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Yeah, pretty much, except for the immobilize part, simply because even if I couldn't squeeze it in, I don't play this game to just solo 100% of the time.
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Originally Posted by Linea_Alba
I wouldn't take ignite without an immobilize. I wouldn't play AR without ignite.
I Would take Mu Patron and get E-Fences. |
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You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
Ignite used to be good in the good old days, but now by the time you immobilize a target, and Ignite is done animating a Sonic Siphoned target with the help of Burst/Slug is already into Scourge territory. I honestly don't bother with Ignite anymore, but that is my opinion.
I'm playing an AR/Sonic and trying to decide between Ignite and Beanbag. It seems like the former can dish out some pretty nice damage, but I'm not sure how practical given that it induces panic and there's nothing to keep enemies from scattering in my secondary (and I'm going heroside, so no real help from APPs, either).
How about on AVs? Will they scare out of the patch as well or will it be handier there?