AA + WoC?

I've just started a new ice/thorn dom and really like the combo so far. I was thinking maybe I could leverage confuse from AA with WoC.
Has anyone tried this combo? How is it working for ya?

I had similar thoughts on a Fire controller, but after a while I came to the conclusion that it just wasn't that impressive. The radius is small, the damage is minor, the duration is shorter than the ticks even with heavy enhancement, and that's when it actually works...

It might improve your coverage level on Arctic Air for the things standing closest to you, and it would give you a chance to immediately confuse bosses. And if I'm understanding City of Data right, accuracy slotting will help the confuse happen more often. It can also take a bunch of damage procs, but I'm not sure how useful that'd really be. (I'm contemplating at least trying it if I ever get my Elec/Earth up that high. But that's Elec, which has some effects on mob behavior that would aid such an approach, and not Ice, which has a PBAoE Afraid toggle.)

Sooo... I'm thinking it might accomplish something, but I have my doubts on it being enough of anything to be worth the effort.

(Also, Ice/Thorn! I've been thinking about doing one of those, but I haven't come up with a concept yet, since I decided to keep my Plant/Ice as Plant/Ice. Also because I haven't been able to even play very much lately.)

WoC is pretty much trash except for slotting with Contagious Confusion, and that should go in Arctic Air for the much larger area coverage.

What may be effective for some characters is to go Rogue alignment. This gives you a somewhat unpredictable Mag 2 PBAoE confuse you can occasionally stack on bosses.

However, I have to admit that Villain alignment, and its auto-Domination refill are probably the most effective, as long as you can stand remaining a Villain. The main reason for it is the mezz protection you get when you pop Domination which in turn lets you run Arctic Air without worry of detoggles.

Thx for the opinions guys. I had almost given up on the idea after spending half the afternoon with my new toon anyway. AA is great all by itself. I can see that WoC will not get a lot of usage due to the fear factor in AA.

I'm thinking now that I'm gonna try for ranged defense on this char and maybe go for the soul mastery route. the damage with soul drain is just freakin awesome (according to mids anyway). Pulling that off with permadom would be quite a feat though.

The other option is the ever popular ice mastery and get some s/l/e/n defenses going. Probably easier, but not sure if I want the ice shield look.

Morganite,

Yeah the concept is more than a bit tricky with that combo. I went with the thorn mutant who was abducted, then reared by cot when she was young as she also had a penchant for magic. You know, the whole "Good work Wesley. Get some sleep. We'll most likely kill you in the morning" routine.

Here's my current thoughts on a build with soul master (yeah, i'll be chompin greens and purps and blues but... eh)

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.942
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Dominator
Primary Power Set: Ice Control
Secondary Power Set: Thorny Assault
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Block of Ice -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(13), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(15), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(15)
Level 1: Thorny Darts -- Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Apoc-Acc/Rchg(3), Apoc-Dmg(3), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx(5), Apoc-Dam%(5)
Level 2: Skewer -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(34), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(37), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39)
Level 4: Fling Thorns -- Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(17), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(17), Ragnrk-Dmg(19), Ragnrk-Knock%(19)
Level 6: Arctic Air -- EndRdx-I(A), CoPers-Conf/EndRdx(7), CoPers-Acc/Conf/Rchg(7), CoPers-Conf%(9), CoPers-Acc/Rchg(9), CoPers-Conf(11)
Level 8: Shiver -- Acc-I(A)
Level 10: Impale -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(11), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(13)
Level 12: Ice Slick -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(40)
Level 14: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 16: Aim -- Rec'dRet-ToHit(A), Rec'dRet-ToHit/Rchg(40)
Level 18: Tough -- Aegis-ResDam(A), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx(33), Aegis-ResDam/Rchg(33), Aegis-EndRdx/Rchg(34)
Level 20: Thorn Burst -- C'ngBlow-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngBlow-Dmg/EndRdx(21), C'ngBlow-Dmg/Rchg(21), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(23), Erad-%Dam(25)
Level 22: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(31), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(33)
Level 24: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 26: Glacier -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(27), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(27), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(31)
Level 28: Thorntrops -- Dmg-I(A), Dmg-I(29), Dmg-I(29)
Level 30: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(31), RechRdx-I(34)
Level 32: Jack Frost -- BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg(A), BldM'dt-Dmg/EndRdx(42), BldM'dt-Acc/EndRdx(43), BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(43), BldM'dt-Acc(43), BldM'dt-Dmg(46)
Level 35: Ripper -- C'ngBlow-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngBlow-Dmg/EndRdx(36), C'ngBlow-Dmg/Rchg(36), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), Erad-%Dam(37)
Level 38: Thorn Barrage -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(40)
Level 41: Dark Consumption -- Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Erad-Dmg/Rchg(42), Erad-Acc/Rchg(42)
Level 44: Soul Drain -- Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg(45), Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg(45), Armgdn-Dam%(45), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx(46), RechRdx-I(46)
Level 47: Dark Obliteration -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(48), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(48), Posi-Dmg/Rng(48), Posi-Dam%(50)
Level 49: Dark Embrace -- ImpArm-ResDam(A), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(50), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Domination
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(25)
------------
Set Bonus Totals:

• 8% DamageBuff(Smashing)
• 8% DamageBuff(Lethal)
• 8% DamageBuff(Fire)
• 8% DamageBuff(Cold)
• 8% DamageBuff(Energy)
• 8% DamageBuff(Negative)
• 8% DamageBuff(Toxic)
• 8% DamageBuff(Psionic)
• 8.63% Defense(Smashing)
• 8.63% Defense(Lethal)
• 9.88% Defense(Fire)
• 9.88% Defense(Cold)
• 26.8% Defense(Energy)
• 26.8% Defense(Negative)
• 3% Defense(Psionic)
• 5.81% Defense(Melee)
• 17.7% Defense(Ranged)
• 9.25% Defense(AoE)
• 5.4% Max End
• 4% Enhancement(Confused)
• 76.3% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
• 46% Enhancement(Accuracy)
• 57.2 HP (5.63%) HitPoints
• MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
• MezResist(Stun) 1.65%
• 28.5% (0.48 End/sec) Recovery
• 26% (1.1 HP/sec) Regeneration
• 6.62% Resistance(Fire)
• 6.62% Resistance(Cold)
• 5% RunSpeed
• 2.5% XPDebtProtection

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Some of that reminds me a lot of things in my (still only theoretical) ice/thorn build. And while I have limited use experience with either set, there are a few things I'm noticing...

Your defense slotting is a bit scattered. Kinetic Combat is a popular set for good reason, but it's not so hot when you're going for a ranged defense focus. Same thing with Rectified Reticle.

Personally, I've found the effect of hovering over enemies while running AA both hilarious and effective. It might not be to everyone's taste (or character concept), but it also compliments ranged defense well by keeping you out of melee range. And Skewer itself becomes kinda dubious under those circumstances. I'd rather have the slots from that and Aim (plus one more from somewhere) to fill out a couple Thunderstrike sets. That'll give pretty close to the one-purple-from-softcap range defense, which is pretty good if you can keep the attacks coming from range.

Armageddon is probably better in Thorn Burst, where it'll get used more often. The right mix of Cleaving Blow and Eradication will keep the set bonuses and get almost as good a recharge, and you'd get to see that proc fire a lot more often. Although I think there might be better ways to do it.

Not sure why you're using Aegis.

...

And on more related-to-the-original-topic topics, I keep wanting to find *something* useful to do with World of Confusion. It's an interesting power. But if I were to, say, take it on my Elec/Earth, give it 5 damage procs, it still wouldn't be all that impressive dps. Of course, set up like that it doesn't really *do* dps, it does "when the ten second mark rolls around, something gets totally clobbered, and something gets totally missed".

I don't know. I still think I might want to try it.

In all honesty a ranged defense build doesnt make much sense for an Ice/Thorn who will need to spend a lot of time in Melee to leverage many of the things that build will do well which is utilize AA, Quills. Thorn Burst and Ripper. Ice/Thorn is much better in your face.

My Suggestion go for as much Smashing/Lethal Defense as you can. That will protect you from a lot of attack no matter if they are ranged or melee. Frozen Armor, Weave and CJ will help you get there. Also those are all nice places to stick a LoTG+ recharge. Make sure to get youself some KB protection. One IO does fine in most cases.

Also remember that AA does three different things.. It confuses.. It slows.. and it also has an effect which causes mobs to try and run out of the area. That will provide a lot of mitigation for you. The contagious confusion Proc is excellent in AA.

You will have to manage your end a bit. I didnt solve it totally until I got the Cardiac Incarnate slot.

I've noticed that AA is great mitigation on its own except for the initial alpha and ranged. that's why i wanted ranged defense 1st. But, I know that good positional is a great way to go. My initial build kind of went for a general approach. I can shore it up if that's the way i decide to go.
I made a build for pretty good defense using ice mastery. I'm still not sure I want to go the way though simply because ice provides a good chunk of mitigation with mezzing and I like the extra damage that soul will provide. Cold will provide a good deal of survivability though.

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.942
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Dominator
Primary Power Set: Ice Control
Secondary Power Set: Thorny Assault
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Flight
Ancillary Pool: Ice Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Block of Ice -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(13), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(15), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(15)
Level 1: Thorny Darts -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(3), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(5), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34)
Level 2: Skewer -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(45), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(45), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 4: Fling Thorns -- Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(17), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(17), Ragnrk-Dmg(19), Ragnrk-Knock%(19)
Level 6: Arctic Air -- EndRdx-I(A), CoPers-Conf/EndRdx(7), CoPers-Acc/Conf/Rchg(7), CoPers-Conf%(9), CoPers-Acc/Rchg(9), CoPers-Conf(11)
Level 8: Shiver -- Acc-I(A)
Level 10: Impale -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(11), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(13), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(37), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(39), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 12: Ice Slick -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(40)
Level 14: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 16: Aim -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 18: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam(33), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(33), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(34)
Level 20: Thorn Burst -- C'ngBlow-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngBlow-Dmg/EndRdx(21), C'ngBlow-Dmg/Rchg(21), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(23), Erad-%Dam(25)
Level 22: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(31), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(33)
Level 24: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(42)
Level 26: Glacier -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(27), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(27), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(31)
Level 28: Thorntrops -- Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(29), Posi-Dmg/Rng(29)
Level 30: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(31), RechRdx-I(34)
Level 32: Jack Frost -- BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg(A), BldM'dt-Dmg/EndRdx(42), BldM'dt-Acc/EndRdx(43), BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(43), BldM'dt-Acc(43), BldM'dt-Dmg(46)
Level 35: Ripper -- C'ngBlow-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngBlow-Dmg/EndRdx(36), C'ngBlow-Dmg/Rchg(36), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), Erad-%Dam(37)
Level 38: Thorn Barrage -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(40)
Level 41: Hover -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(42)
Level 44: Sleet -- AnWeak-Acc/DefDeb(A), AnWeak-Acc/Rchg(45), AnWeak-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(46), AnWeak-Acc/Rchg/EndRdx(50), AnWeak-%ToHit(50)
Level 47: Frozen Armor -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(48), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(48), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(48)
Level 49: Hoarfrost -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Domination
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(25)
------------
Set Bonus Totals:

• 7% DamageBuff(Smashing)
• 7% DamageBuff(Lethal)
• 7% DamageBuff(Fire)
• 7% DamageBuff(Cold)
• 7% DamageBuff(Energy)
• 7% DamageBuff(Negative)
• 7% DamageBuff(Toxic)
• 7% DamageBuff(Psionic)
• 8% Defense(Smashing)
• 8% Defense(Lethal)
• 6.75% Defense(Fire)
• 6.75% Defense(Cold)
• 29.9% Defense(Energy)
• 29.9% Defense(Negative)
• 3% Defense(Psionic)
• 5.5% Defense(Melee)
• 23% Defense(Ranged)
• 7.69% Defense(AoE)
• 3.6% Max End
• 4% Enhancement(Confused)
• 65% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
• 47% Enhancement(Accuracy)
• 8% FlySpeed
• 38.2 HP (3.75%) HitPoints
• 8% JumpHeight
• 8% JumpSpeed
• MezResist(Immobilize) 3.85%
• MezResist(Stun) 3.85%
• 24% (0.4 End/sec) Recovery
• 50% (2.12 HP/sec) Regeneration
• 4.1% Resistance(Fire)
• 4.1% Resistance(Cold)
• 8% RunSpeed

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Just a thought.. think about dropping Jack Frost and what you could do with those slots in your build.

Is Jack really that bad? I keep hearing how he sux, but would it be worth it to get rid of him?

For an Ice/Thorn I would say yes because you have so many options for attacks and you dont have to worry about Jack aggroing things you arent ready to handle..

I think Jack works much better on controllers because they have a buff or debuff secondary which will help him.. Doms not so much...

Does domination affect AA, or is AA considered a pet?

Thanks,

Fat E

Im not sure if it does or not..

One other things.. as far as worrying about Alphas dont.. you will pretty much have enough defense and one thing I always do is open up with Ice Slick..