Interesting to see it all in one place instead of having to flip back on forth on red's.
Also, you might want to include a caveat that you are assuming Sleet and Freezing Rain aren't bugged, i'd just call it "assumed ideal conditions".
I am curious about this section though:
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I would probably go into more detail on comparing -regen and -resistance, although exactly how to do that would be challenging. Comparing two sets would be easy, so the best thing to do is probably pick one to be a benchmark and then compare the others.|
Originally Posted by Garent
Offensive comparison against 1 AV with 100% recharge. Stacking is used, and animation times are ignored for simplicity. Powers requiring a dead body are ignored. EM Pulse type powers are ignored. This is meant to simulate an extended fight against a single AV in which the defender uses every debuff as soon as it's available. AVs have 85% debuff resistance, which applies to regeneration debuffs.
Cold Domination: (benumb*0.5)+(sleet*1.5)+(heat loss*0.25) = 37.5% regeneration, 52.5% resistance Dark Miasma: tar patch+(twilight grasp*2)+(howling twilight/3) = 30% resistance, 40% regeneration Kinetics: transfusion*2 = 15% regeneration Pain Domination: anguishing cry/2 = 15% resistance Poison: envenom*5 = 30% resistance, 37.5% regeneration Radiation Emission: enervating field+(lingering radiation/2) = 30% resistance, 37.5% regeneration Sonic Resonance: sonic siphon + disruption field = 60% resistance Storm Summoning: freezing rain*1.5 = 52.5% resistance Thermal Radiation: (heat exhaustion*2/3)+(melt armor*8/15) = 16% resistance, 50% regeneration Traps: (Acid Mortar*16/9)+(poison trap/2)= 47.29% resistance, 75% regeneration Trick Arrow: acid arrow+disruption arrow = 40% resistance Conclusion: The data here demonstrates why traps is a powerful set for soloing AVs and GMs. Poison trap is twice as powerful as most regeneration debuffs. The sets with stackable debuffs like cold and storm begin to pull ahead of toggle debuff sets like radiation. Higher recharge builds will make this gap even larger. |
For example:
level 50 AVs regenerate HP at ~95/sec. So for rad that's effectively 35 hp/sec from their -regen.
This means if a Storm defender wants to "outdamage" the rad defender they need to deal an effective 35 hp/sec more due to their resistance. Of course, they only have a 22.5% damage resistance advantage based on your assumptions so that comes down to dealing 157 damage/sec. That is a number that it would be almost impossible for most solo defenders to reach, although trivial for teams.
How to generalize that into a metric though for comparing all of the sets though...I don't think the benchmark set method I mentioned above would work....perhaps a table would be better with a "damage at which X surpasses Y" values...oh well. Something interesting to think about.
I suppose in general I'm interested in a "what does this mean" summary. Trying to give meaning to the offensive portion is just easier than the defensive portion. Not sure what the best bench mark is there to provide useful meaning.
Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
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I have that listed waaay way up there in the first paragraph. I can't predict how often the bug will occur, especially since it's so hard to reproduce, so I had to ignore it.|
Originally Posted by Draggynn
Also, you might want to include a caveat that you are assuming Sleet and Freezing Rain aren't bugged, i'd just call it "assumed ideal conditions".
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Draggynn
I would probably go into more detail on comparing -regen and -resistance, although exactly how to do that would be challenging. Comparing two sets would be easy, so the best thing to do is probably pick one to be a benchmark and then compare the others.
For example: We can say lvl 50 AVs regenerate HP at 95/sec. So for rad that's effectively 35 hp/sec from their -regen. |
Also, my data there didn't take into account an important fact. 1000% regeneration debuffing isn't twice as effective as 500% regeneration debuffing. Since 500% gets reduced to 75%, the 1000% debuff is only 33% more effective, since it hits the regen debuff cap of 100%.
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Originally Posted by Draggynn
I suppose in general I'm interested in a "what does this mean" summary.
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My personal opinion is that this boils down to poison and trick arrow being very underpowered, which shouldn't surprise anyone. Trick arrow comes off as average to mediocre in all of the four categories I used, and unlike every other set here, it doesn't have anything EXCEPT debuffs. This also highlights that the big reasons for this are, firstly, the low numbers of their powers, and secondly, the inability for certain powers to stack.
Those are the big balance issues, but there are a few smaller ones such as the fact that cold domination makes its mark among the top tier debuff sets, while also having some serious buffs. In light of this fact, the weakness of the resistance debuffs in thermal and pain seems unnecessary.
Honestly, the only thing that this exercise taught me that I didn't know before is that poison isn't a good single target debuffing set like I thought it was.
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Ah, not sure how i missed it before. Yeah, it tends to work about 65% of the time, but that's just from empirical testing, and probably better not to include anyway.|
Originally Posted by Garent
I have that listed waaay way up there in the first paragraph. I can't predict how often the bug will occur, especially since it's so hard to reproduce, so I had to ignore it.
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Originally Posted by Garent
If you can find the regen rate of AVs, I can include that in there. Exactly how useful regen is will depend on things like level and such, and I know reichsman's regeneration rate is lower than standard.
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AVs regen 5% of their health every 15 seconds and a standard lvl 50 AV has 28,271.7 hitpoints. Obviously as you mention this depends on lvl and there a couple unique AVs that operate differently. But I figured the lvl 50 AV was a good baseline.Quote:
| Yeah, I figured this would come up. My goal was to focus on facts and keep my opinions to a minimum in the original post. |
I don't think most folks have an intuitive sense of how -recharge compares to -damage, compares to -to-hit. The regen to -resistance was easy to put in terms so that the two could be compared side by side like I did above. The defensive aspects are harder though since you need to choose some baseline enemy for the -recharge to really have any meaning, and I'm not sure which enemy to choose. Once an enemy is chosen though it may be relatively easy to get a damage reduction number from empirical testing.
Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
I believe that all the attributes can be divided up into two categories, like an input and an output. I'd divide them into defence and offense. So when it comes to holds, disorients and knockback I'd simply want to try and quantify how much damage on average I wouldn't be taking. I'd also would have to take into account how much damage I may not be doing when applying such effects.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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That looks like what Garent did to me.|
Originally Posted by New Dawn
I believe that all the attributes can be divided up into two categories, like an input and an output. I'd divide them into defence and offense.
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Quote:
| So when it comes to holds, disorients and knockback I'd simply want to try and quantify how much damage on average I wouldn't be taking. I'd also would have to take into account how much damage I may not be doing when applying such effects. |
Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
Quote:
If I could find out how often freezing rain's knockback tics, the exact frame at which enemies become susceptible to knockback while they're getting up, and the exact frame at which they become able to queue an attack after getting up, and taking into account that the enemy's powers are recharging while they're getting up, and determine the average damage of a single attack compared to the average all out attacking of a mob, I could theoretically determine just what % of damage a knockdown patch will mitigate.|
Originally Posted by Draggynn
Yes, but the question is how do you do that and how do you find a metric that isn't completely arbitrary.
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But if I do that, I have to determine hurricane's penalty/bonus to group damage. In order to do that, I'll need to know the % chance for mobs to be bunched up by hurricane vs. the % chance for them to be scattered, then somehow determine just how many more/less targets can be hit on average by an AoE when the targets are grouped together/scattered and for that I'll need the % chance that X number of enemies will be hit by nightfall, piercing ammo, and energy torrent under a given average mob formation, and oh god I just spent an entire day proving that hurricane lowers group damage and I'm forever branded a pariah among the storm summoning community.
Basically, I had to draw the line somewhere, and I decided that resistance, regeneration, to-hit, damage, and recharge were the things to use since they were easy to quantify. I leave it up to the reader to take those values and give them context within the whole set, and also to remember that the effectiveness of damage and recharge debuffs will vary depending on what they're used on.
Also, I'll edit the first post to include that 95 hp/s number.
Brain not awake yet and I am still absorbing the data numbers. I was under the impression that the -speed portion of siphon speed was irresistible in the kinetics set; does that not include -recharge?
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
Freezing Rain ticks 5 times per second and has a 5% chance per tick to knockdown. This should translate to about a 33% chance per second. The knockdown aura has a target cap of 16 enemies but I'm unsure how or if this is actually obeyed. The animation that plays when an enemy falls over is called SWEEP_LOW. I don't know its duration or whether there is a way to obtain it.
Analysis of knockdown patches is sort of tricky because enemies can run out of them. But they can also run into them during an ongoing fight--sometimes in mass numbers, as in an ambush or accidental pull. Further, a knockdown patches' low base knockdown chance means that in the moment the power is actually cast (or when the enemy first runs into it) the odds of falling are low. The power needs a few seconds to saturate. The reason this is important to note is that a lot of damage happens in the opening seconds of the battle, when the patch is at its weakest. The reason casting these powers around corners is a popular technique is related to this issue specifically.
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According to red's only the -speed is irresistible, could be wrong though.|
Originally Posted by Psylenz
Brain not awake yet and I am still absorbing the data numbers. I was under the impression that the -speed portion of siphon speed was irresistible in the kinetics set; does that not include -recharge?
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Originally Posted by Garent
If I could find out how often freezing rain's knockback tics, the exact frame at which enemies become susceptible to knockback while they're getting up, and the exact frame at which they become able to queue an attack after getting up, and taking into account that the enemy's powers are recharging while they're getting up, and determine the average damage of a single attack compared to the average all out attacking of a mob, I could theoretically determine just what % of damage a knockdown patch will mitigate.
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Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
Freezing Rain ticks 5 times per second and has a 5% chance per tick to knockdown. This should translate to about a 33% chance per second. The knockdown aura has a target cap of 16 enemies but I'm unsure how or if this is actually obeyed. The animation that plays when an enemy falls over is called SWEEP_LOW. I don't know its duration or whether there is a way to obtain it.
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Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
Quote:
I just checked and it's irresistable. I'll update.|
Originally Posted by Psylenz
Brain not awake yet and I am still absorbing the data numbers. I was under the impression that the -speed portion of siphon speed was irresistible in the kinetics set; does that not include -recharge?
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
Freezing Rain ticks 5 times per second and has a 5% chance per tick to knockdown. This should translate to about a 33% chance per second. The knockdown aura has a target cap of 16 enemies but I'm unsure how or if this is actually obeyed. The animation that plays when an enemy falls over is called SWEEP_LOW. I don't know its duration or whether there is a way to obtain it.
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From my bad math skills. I calculated .95^5 and got .773, subtracted 1 mentally and came up with 33 instead of 22. ;p|
Originally Posted by Draggynn
Trying to figure out where where your 33% is coming from, because i'm getting a (1-.95^5) 22.6% chance/sec.
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| I god, stop. Please stop. I can't do this. If I did this, I'd also need to take into account the damage mitigation of the 'afraid' AI avoidance script. It's too much. |
There isn't really an answer. You can come up with a knockdown rate and sorta kinda figure out how many enemies you can expect to take down with it, but it's 70% a lie. It depends on who is standing in it, where you place it, and so on. If there are Controllers around (or one is casting the power) the inherent conflicts with their powers also comes into play. (E.g it partially disrupts the value of Fears, it invalidates Electric Control's sleep patch, it can be cancelled by cages, etc.)
TLDR version: it all depends.
You guys are awesome. I leave the game for the better part of a year, come back and you all are still crunching numbers.
Garent and all involved in number crunching on the fender side of the world, thx for doing this. The section considering -regen vs. -resist gives me a much clearer understanding of why my sonic/sonic is so good on AV teams. I've played many defenders in this game, but that one is special for the tough fights (yeah, teaming mostly).
Is there a Doctoral Thesis in all this number crunching? If so, can I get a copy? I'll give you 14 infl...
Yet more proof (as if we needed it) that Trick Arrow is "underpowered" as a Debuff Only powerset. Remarkable how even when every power it has does a Debuff, Trick Arrow manages to be "middling" or worse, and is overshadowed by Dark and Traps, both of which have wider and greater utility.
It's the end. But the moment has been prepared for ...
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Yeah, there are a bunch of reasons why Trick Arrow comes up poor. Glue Arrow is basically Tar Patch without the Resistance debuff, Acid Arrow and Disruption Arrow combined are worse than Freezing Rain and Sleet, Entangle Arrow is Web Grenade but with only 1/5th the magnitude slow (-12.5% vs -62.5%)... And on top of it all, virtually none of the Trick Arrow powers can stack on themselves. It's painful.
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Originally Posted by Redlynne
Yet more proof (as if we needed it) that Trick Arrow is "underpowered" as a Debuff Only powerset. Remarkable how even when every power it has does a Debuff, Trick Arrow manages to be "middling" or worse, and is overshadowed by Dark and Traps, both of which have wider and greater utility.
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Global @Diellan - 5M2M
Mids' Hero/Villain Designer Lead
Virtue Server
Redside: Lorenzo Mondavi
Blueside: Alex Rabinovich
Got a Mids suggestion? Want to report a Mids bug?
Quote:
I'm going back to school in the fall. I'll get back to you in 6-8 years.
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Originally Posted by Shadey_NA
Is there a Doctoral Thesis in all this number crunching? If so, can I get a copy? I'll give you 14 infl...
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Quote:
Minor correction. Liquify doesn't have any -recharge effect. It does have a -defense effect.
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Originally Posted by Garent
Liquefy: 300s -35.7% tohit, -28.5% recharge for 30s
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It does, in fact, have a -recharge component. The power's short and long description don't mention it, though.
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Garent and I have been putting these results to work and are coming up with a large list of tweaks and suggestions to give to Black Scorpion for the underperforming sets. I think that if we can keep the changes within certain restrictions, and if we can get enough community support, we might be able to get him to put in some of them in his spare time.
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Originally Posted by Garent
I'm going back to school in the fall. I'll get back to you in 6-8 years.
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Global @Diellan - 5M2M
Mids' Hero/Villain Designer Lead
Virtue Server
Redside: Lorenzo Mondavi
Blueside: Alex Rabinovich
Got a Mids suggestion? Want to report a Mids bug?
Well then, by all means, keep us posted. Trick Arrow needs help, since it is such a consistent underperformer at everything it does.
It's the end. But the moment has been prepared for ...
We made the list, it's here:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=262759
Global @Diellan - 5M2M
Mids' Hero/Villain Designer Lead
Virtue Server
Redside: Lorenzo Mondavi
Blueside: Alex Rabinovich
Got a Mids suggestion? Want to report a Mids bug?
I stopped reading once I saw that you did not include oil slick. But thanks for trying.
I'll always be a "Champion" at heart. My server away from home.
"When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty." - Thomas Jefferson
"With great moustache comes great responsibility" - Zee Captain
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How would you have included oil slick arrow in the above analysis?
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Originally Posted by Horusaurus
I stopped reading once I saw that you did not include oil slick. But thanks for trying.
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Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
Quote:
lolidunno maybe use it and look at it's effects? Nawwww craziness. Why would anyone look at what a power would do? That's like pfffft. It's not like it gives a ton of -def or knockdown effect to it. Why would that be a debuff. Almost like it has some sort of debuff to it...or something.
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Originally Posted by Draggynn
How would you have included oil slick arrow in the above analysis?
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I'll always be a "Champion" at heart. My server away from home.
"When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty." - Thomas Jefferson
"With great moustache comes great responsibility" - Zee Captain
Quote:
Thank you for being constructive and helpful at the analysis. Or ignoring the part where he said he was not including knockdown/knockback effects because of their difficulty in quantifying just how useful they are (especially since teaming with most controllers can completely negate it).|
Originally Posted by Horusaurus
lolidunno maybe use it and look at it's effects? Nawwww craziness. Why would anyone look at what a power would do? That's like pfffft. It's not like it gives a ton of -def or knockdown effect to it. Why would that be a debuff. Almost like it has some sort of debuff to it...or something.
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You'll also notice he didn't really count -defense anywhere. This is because, except for the case of tier 9 AVs and Paragon Protectors, there are very few cases where -Defense makes a difference in the late game. Most players are slotted to between 40 and 70% accuracy in all their attacks, usually have some amount of accuracy in their set bonuses, and can get +ToHit from a variety of places as well. As a result of the fact that the chance to hit cap is so low and so easy to hit, he didn't bother factoring in -Defense into his analysis.
The other thing that Oil Slick Arrow brings is damage, and he didn't include that either (see the lack of Lightning Storm).
Global @Diellan - 5M2M
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Got a Mids suggestion? Want to report a Mids bug?
The goal of this post is to compare the various debuff sets. More specifically, any set that contains a debuff power is mentioned here. Only the values of resistance, damage, recharge, and regeneration are considered. That is because these are the easiest to quantify. Things like knockback, controls, and endurance drain are not considered because their effectiveness varies wildly based on the enemy you are fighting. Pain domination, poison, and thermal are included here and they have been given estimated values based on reverse engineering. However, because many buff/debuff set numbers are completely made up (just look at mastermind dark miasma and compare it to the defender version) the numbers I use here are estimations, and there is a very, very high chance that these sets would have different numbers than the ones I have here if they are ever ported to defenders. Also, the freezing rain/sleet bug is ignored in this. I'll start off by posting my raw data, all of which I got from mids.
If there are any errors in what I have here, please tell me. In order to reduce math overload and TL;DRing, important parts are in yellow.
Mastermind to defender modifiers-
resistance +33%
recharge +25%
to-hit +66%
damage +33%
regeneration +0%
--Cold Domination--
Infrigidate: 15s -37.5% fire damage, -87.5% recharge for 20s (does not stack)
Snow Storm: -62.5% recharge
Benumb: 120s -62.5% damage, -500% regeneration, -effects for 30s (does not stack)
Sleet: 60s -30% resistance, -40% recharge (rain lasts 15s, debuff lasts 30s)
Heat Loss: 360s -30% resistance, -300% recharge for 30s (does not stack, max targets 10)
--Dark Miasma--
Twilight Grasp: 8s -6.25% tohit, -12.5% damage, -50% regeneration for 20s
Tar Patch: 90s -30% resistance for 45s
Darkest Night: -18.8% tohit, -37.5% damage
Howling Twilight: 180s -62.5% recharge, -500% regeneration for 30s
Fearsome Stare: 40s -18.8% tohit for 20s
-Dark Servant-
Chill of the Night: -30% tohit
Darkest Night: -30% damage, -15% tohit
Twilight Grasp: 10s -5% tohit, -10% damage, -50% regeneration for 20s
Tenebrous Tentacles: 15s -5% tohit for 8s
--Kinetics--
Transfusion: 8s -50% regeneration for 20s
Siphon Power: 20s -25% damage for 30s
Siphon Speed: 60s -20% recharge for 60s (unresistable)
Fulcrum Shift: 60s -25% damage for 30s (max 10 targets)
--Pain Domination (estimated)--
Anguishing Cry: 120s -30% resistance for 30s (does not stack)
--Poison (estimated)--
Envenom: 12s -30% resistance, -50% regeneration for 30s (-res does not stack, -regen does)
Weaken: 16s -30% damage, -18.8% tohit, -effects for 30s (does not stack)
Neurotoxic Breath: 30s -81.25% recharge for 20s (does not stack)
Noxious Gas: 300s -20% damage, -30% resistance, -12.5% tohit for 20s (max targets 10, would be very different for defenders)
--Radiation Emission--
Radiation Infection: -31.3% tohit
Enervating Field: -30% resistance, -25% damage
Lingering Radiation: 90s -500% regeneration, -75% recharge for 30s
Fallout: 300s -50% resistance, -30% tohit, -30% damage for 30s
EM Pulse: 300s -1000% regeneration for 15s
--Sonic Resonance--
Sonic Siphon: 16s -30% resistance for 30s
Disruption Field: -30% resistance
Liquefy: 300s -35.7% tohit, -28.5% recharge for 30s
--Storm Summoning--
Snow Storm: -62.5% recharge
Freezing Rain: 60s -35% resistance, -50% recharge (rain lasts 15s, debuff lasts 30s)
Hurricane: -37.5% tohit
--Thermal Radiation (estimated)--
Heat Exhaustion: 120s -50% damage, -500% regeneration for 40s (damage does not stack, regeneration does)
Melt Armor: 150s -30% resistance for 40s (does not stack)
--Traps--
Web Grenade: 4s -62.5% recharge for 15s (does not stack)
Acid Mortar: 90s -26.6% resistance (mortar lasts 60s, debuff lasts 20s) (8ft radius, 16 targets)
Poison Trap: 90s -1000% regeneration, -30% recharge for 30s
Seeker Drones: 90s -6.65% tohit, -26.6% damage for 40s (debuffs applied twice, max targets 10)
--Trick Arrow--
Entangling Arrow: 4s -12.5% recharge for 15s (does not stack)
Flash Arrow: 15s -6.25% tohit for 60s (does not stack, unresistable)
Glue Arrow: 60s -20% recharge for 30s
Ice Arrow: 18s -12.5% recharge for 10s
Poison Gas Arrow: 45s -31.3% damage for 20s
Acid Arrow: 20s -20% resistance for 20s (does not stack)
Disruption Arrow: 60s -20% resistance for 30s (max targets 10)
EMP Arrow: 300s -1000% regeneration for 15s
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Defensive comparison against 16 targets with 100% recharge, 56% tohit, and no stacking. Powers with over 90s recharges are ignored. Single target debuffs are ignored. This is meant to simulate a team where the defender is using their debuffs once at the beginning of each fight and doesn't use the powers again when they recharge, so they can be used at the beginning of the next fight. Keep in mind that all enemies resist damage debuffs based on their damage resistance, and lieutenants and bosses have a small amount of tohit debuff resistance.
Cold Domination: snow storm+sleet= 102.5% recharge
Dark Miasma: darkest night+fearsome stare= 58.656% tohit, 37.5% damage
Dark Miasma with Servant: +Chill of the night: 105.456% tohit, 37.5% damage
Kinetics: fulcrum shift*10/16 = 15.625% damage
Poison: neurotoxic breath = 81.25% recharge
Radiation Emission: radiation infection+enervating field+lingering radiation = 25% damage, 48.828% tohit, -75% recharge
Storm Summoning: snow storm+freezing rain+hurricane = 112.5% recharge, 58.5% tohit
Traps: poison trap+(seeker drones*10/16) = 30% recharge, 33.25% damage, 20.75% tohit
Trick Arrow: flash arrow+glue arrow+poison gas arrow= 9.75% tohit, 20% recharge, -31.3% damage
Conclusions: It's no surprise that dark miasma stands out as the most powerful defensive debuffing set. It's pretty common knowledge at this point. Radiation, storm (assuming you can use hurricane well), and traps are close behind. Poison, cold, and trick arrow are a tier below those. Unsurprisingly, kinetics is dead last, though it's still better than all the sets that aren't on this list at all.
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Defensive comparison against 1 AV with 100% recharge, 56% tohit. Stacking is used, and animation times are ignored for simplicity. Powers requiring a dead body are ignored. This is meant to simulate an extended fight against a single AV in which the defender uses every debuff as soon as it's available. Level 50 AVs have 85% debuff resistance, which applies to recharge and tohit debuffs.
Cold Domination: infrigidate+snow storm+(benumb*0.5)+(sleet*1.5)+(heat loss*0.25)= 37.5 fire damage, 87.5 recharge, 62.5 recharge, 31.25 damage, 60 recharge, 75 recharge = 31.25% most damage, 68.75% fire damage, 42.75% recharge
Dark Miasma: (twilight grasp*2)+darkest night+(howling twilight/3)+fearsome stare= 12.5% tohit, 25% damage, 29.328% tohit, 37.5% damage, 20.8% recharge, 29.328% tohit = 10.6734% tohit, 62.5% damage, 3.12% recharge
Dark Miasma with dark servant= +chill of the night = 17.69% tohit, 62.5% damage, 3.12% recharge
Kinetics: (siphon power*3)+(siphon speed*2(noAVres))+fulcrum shift = 100% damage, 40% recharge
Poison: weaken+neurotoxic breath = 30% damage, 4.4% tohit, 12.2% recharge
Radiation: radiation infection+enervating field+(lingering radiation*2/3) = 7.32% tohit, -25% damage, 11.25% recharge
Sonic Resonance: Liquefy/5 = 1.67% tohit
Storm Summoning: snow storm+(freezing rain*1.5)+hurricane = 20.625% recharge, 8.775% tohit
Thermal Radiation: (heat exhaustion*2/3) = 33.33% damage
Traps: web grenade+(poison trap/2)+seeker drones = 11.625% recharge, 3.11% tohit, 53.2% damage
Trick Arrow: entangling arrow+flash arrow(noAVres)+glue arrow+ice arrow+poison gas arrow = 1.875% recharge + 9.75 tohit + 3% recharge + 1.875% recharge + 31.3% damage = 9.75% tohit, 6.75% recharge, 31.3% damage
Conclusions: Against most AVs, the sets with powerful damage debuffs will be significantly better defensively than other sets. This would be cold, dark miasma, kinetics, and traps. Trick arrow, radiation, and thermal have a fair amount of it too. However, against one of the AVs that has about 90-95% resistance to the damage type that they do, these sets will be much less effective. The big underperformer here is poison, despite this being the situation in which it SHOULD be doing best since it's a single target focused set. All of its abilities being unstackable really hurts it. Honorable mentions go to cold domination for having so many recharge debuffs that it can make a noticable impact on an AV, and ditto to dark miasma with its tohit debuffs.
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Offensive comparison against 16 targets with 100% recharge and no stacking. Powers with over 90s recharges are ignored. Single target debuffs are ignored. Regeneration debuffs are ignored. This is meant to simulate a team where the defender uses their debuffs once at the beginning of each fight and doesn't use the powers again when they recharge, so they can be used at the beginning of the next fight.
Cold Domination: sleet = 30% resistance
Dark Miasma: tar patch = 30% resistance
Radiation Emission: enervating field = 30% resistance
Sonic Resonance: disruption field = 30% resistance
Storm Summoning: freezing rain = 35% resistance
Traps: acid mortar = 26.6% resistance (each of its shots has a small 8 foot radius, but it shoots multiple times and each shot can hit a maximum of 16 targets)
Trick arrow: acid arrow + (disruption arrow*10/16) = 32.5% resistance
Conclusion: Sets are very standardized when it comes to AoE -res, except for thermal and pain domination, whose resistance debuffs are on long recharge timers.
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Offensive comparison against 1 AV with 100% recharge. Stacking is used, and animation times are ignored for simplicity. Powers requiring a dead body are ignored. EM Pulse type powers are ignored. This is meant to simulate an extended fight against a single AV in which the defender uses every debuff as soon as it's available. Level 50 AVs have 85% debuff resistance, which applies to regeneration debuffs. A standard level 50 AV has a regeneration rate of about 95 hp/second. This means that completely debuffing their regeneration rate is equivalent to 95 dps. Keep in mind that higher level AVs regenerate more than this, and some of them (such as reichsman) have a different regeneration rate than normal.
Cold Domination: (benumb*0.5)+(sleet*1.5)+(heat loss*0.25) = 37.5% regeneration, 52.5% resistance
Dark Miasma: tar patch+(twilight grasp*2)+(howling twilight/3) = 30% resistance, 40% regeneration
Kinetics: transfusion*2 = 15% regeneration
Pain Domination: anguishing cry/2 = 15% resistance
Poison: envenom*5 = 30% resistance, 37.5% regeneration
Radiation Emission: enervating field+(lingering radiation/2) = 30% resistance, 37.5% regeneration
Sonic Resonance: sonic siphon + disruption field = 60% resistance
Storm Summoning: freezing rain*1.5 = 52.5% resistance
Thermal Radiation: (heat exhaustion*2/3)+(melt armor*8/15) = 16% resistance, 50% regeneration
Traps: (Acid Mortar*16/9)+(poison trap/2)= 47.29% resistance, 75% regeneration
Trick Arrow: acid arrow+disruption arrow = 40% resistance
Conclusion: The data here demonstrates why traps is a powerful set for soloing AVs and GMs. Poison trap is twice as powerful as most regeneration debuffs. The sets with stackable debuffs like cold and storm begin to pull ahead of toggle debuff sets like radiation. Higher recharge builds will make this gap even larger.