SR scrappers and incarnate trials

Well, the post disappeared, but I wrote a reply, and it kind of stands on its own. The basic meat of the comment as I understood it is that +defense isn't the only way to build a good Scrapper. So...

Look, yes, there can be multiple ways to build a survivable Scrapper. Taking a Regen scrapper with zero defense and low recharge is not one of those ways. The MOST survivable Scrappers tend to have soft-capped defense PLUS good resistance and high healing/regeneration. It usually takes all three to pull off something really impressive, though in some cases you get enough out of the other two legs that resistance can be pretty low (though it won't be as good as something with higher resistance, of course). So in the sense that perhaps we focus too much on the defense leg, you may be right. In the sense that we can ignore the defense leg and still somehow have a highly-survivable Scrapper, that's very much not right.

And yes, +def or even survivability is far from the only way to build a Scrapper. You can make a high damage output Scrapper at the cost of survivability. However, lots of us make high damage output scrappers WITH high survivability, so the two can coexist. In regards to what people sacrifice for +def builds, it's true, for instance, that my Katana/Dark uses the two-Divine Avalanche chain, and thus is stuck around 175 DPS (I19). If I built for pure recharge and used the top end chain, I'd pull maybe 250 DPS (again, I19). I'd also be stuck fighting much easier enemies or relying on my team due to my lack of survivability.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArcticFahx Dude, the build I have is from before GR. I know my build sucks, and I'm working on a rebuild for recharge/def instead. I just have like zero time to do so because I'm at school where it's a pain to actually get on CoH to make inf to buy the new sets I need.

OK, I'm sorry then. As I said, your point of "I did the ITF with exactly what you said, and didn't have the problems you suggested I would have" is quite relevant, and a reasonable response.

I just thought you were implying the further point that building that way was just as good as the defense/recharge alternative. That's not what you were implying, so I apologize for my reaction. I just didn't want people to be misled, and start thinking, "Oh, then I should build my Regen for passive regeneration. These guys that think defense is important are obviously wrong."

Actually, it was almost all blasters, a sonic defender, and an empath who (in a move that makes great sense) hit the blasters with fort rather than me. So the only buffs on me were sonic shields, occasionally inside the big bubble, and RAs. There may have been 2 leaderships, but even then, the two maneuvers would only up me to 10%-ish. Which was quickly negated by a single Roman.

Werner it was me who pulled the post, because it was a gripe and didn't really add to the discussion. It was more me venting about a personal peeve I have.

My /ElecA scrapper is not build for +def, yet he is often still standing when the SR and Shield scrappers around me are on the ground. Perhaps it is my tactic, my survivability increases because the mobs I am fighting never have any end. Maybe it is because all but one (toxic) resists are over 59% (energy is over 75%), maybe I am just a better player than the ones who fall. The incarnate system just makes me even better at my method of survival by giving me even more ways to keep mob end at 0.

I am not discounting the method of +def, but there seems to be the general thinking on these boards that you should sacrifice anything and everything to hit the soft cap. To me it is like trying to take a plow horse, and turn it into a race horse. Those who don't want to build that way end up getting insulted by someone.

Some +def is great, no doubt, but at the cost of Regen on a Regen? I am just not seeing it, and doubt I ever will. On SR and Shield I think it is awesome, because +def is their design focus. It seems to me the sets will work better when building to strengths, and not trying to make up for a perceived weakness.

I think my larger issue is the insults (which may be a misinterpretation on my part) that seem to end up directed at non +def builds. Shoot, I haven't posted a build here in over 2 years because of it. There are times when the numbers don't always match reality, and I grant that may be because of the "player skill" variable.

I have to admit Werner that after that post my respect for you went up many notches. I really don't disagree with anything you just said, and that includes the treatment Regen gets. Regen did what it was suppose to do, and the devs gutted it, a work around had to be found.

Thank you for the very thoughtful reply.

Defense on top of things is just that much better...

My Regeners will be just fine.... Barrier->SM->MoG.... Yeah I think Regens are fine

I have been running the trials non-stop in the evening, and so far I've only done them extensively on two characters: a DM/Regen and a DB/Regen. The first is my main badger, and the second is the closest thing I have to a farmer, who I use to mow down large spawns of regular content foes rapidly (though at significant self risk).

Both have positional defense in the range of 35/25/20 melee/ranged/AoE. Both have on the order of 65% global recharge before Hasten. The DM/Regen has Shadow Meld, the DB/Regen has no epic pool, but more powers devoted to about 3% more defense to all positions.

I have been running the trials with a core of veteran players who make a CoH career of speed running content. Most of us now have multiple Very Rare incarnates on at least one character. Our teams already consisted of well-IO'd characters liberally slathered with ally buffs, so we were rather well positioned to take the new trials on head-on, and we did well right out of the gate. With more experience (and of course more Incarnate powers) at our disposal, we're only doing better with time.

Personally, I find that Regen is very forgiving in the trials, with the caveat that has always been Regen's most visible Achilles' heel: burst damage. Naturally, burst damage is present in abundance with supercharged, over-level AVs featured prominantly in all the new Incarnate/Praetorean content. Bosses with Energy Melee or Dual Blades (plus criticals) mean death is waiting for the unlucky around every bend. But Regen's strength has long been that what doesn't kill you suddenly often doesn't kill you at all, and I find this works well for how I play in the trials.

I haven't really had any problems with this new content on my Scrappers. Part of that is me, part of that is my builds, and part of that is who I play with. So far, though, all has been well.

Edit: My DM/Regen is going for survival overload: Barrier and the debuffing Void, with (currently) the Core Reactive Interface. My DB/Regen is going for a more offensive mix: Barrier and Core Pyronic with Radial Reactive Interface.