Another darn Radiation Armor thread.

I think its a little overpowered, but not much. I would probably drop the psi res totally and reduce end/rec resistance to maybe 20%. Alternatively you could drop the immob and KB protection down by about half instead of reducing the end/rec res. My reasoning is the sets with over 50% end/rec res tend to suffer from weaker status protection in other areas. The ones with it being 20% and down tend to maintain their fulls status protection though.

I think another change I would probably make is dropping the toxic res to be at 50% while boosting the energy res up to 40-50%. Simply as a flavor thing since Rad sets are currently all energy based. Plus toxic is a less common dmg type. Also I'd probably move the heal up to be tier 6, and drop Rad Haze to be tier 7 to be a bit easier on the end bar until you can get SOs and decent IOs.

Overall though I like the set and I would probably play it, and it doesn't hurt that tankers are my favorite class either!

Good suggestion overall.

I don't know how it fits into the overall balance, but I would love to see an armor set that loses a portion of its self heal strength but turns it into 1/2 strength AoE heal, 15ft radius (same as Grant Cover). Rad Armor is a natural choice for this given Radiant Aura, but not necessarily as presented here.

Thanks everyone for the feedback so far.

So right now I'm planning on removing some, if not all the -recover/-end debuff resistance. I'm still not sold on removing the psi resist. I'll probably add in taunt to Radiation Haze. I probably should have included that originally.

It's been suggested from conversations I've had in game that I should have allowed Radiation Cloud to take hold IO's. I might add that, but I still wouldn't allow the ability to add hold sets.

Madadh, what powers would you remove the ability to take Set IO's in, and more specifically why?

Any other thoughts?

I knew I was forgetting something. I'm not sure I should/would take the -regen as far as you'd like Dechs, but I think going with 5%-30% for the range on the debuff still makes it more helpful without going too far.

Shouldn't the taunt aura also be able to take normal taunt enhancements?

I thought Radiation damage was energy, not toxic? Or maybe I'm losing my marbles, not having played Radiation Blast since I5 or so.

Some of the criticisms seem to be right on the money because it does seem pretty overpowered. You've essentially got resistance to everything, coupled with defense(even if minor), a self heal, a self rez, and a taunt aura that does damage and lowers regen. The only real weakness is the endurance you would be burning through, but that's very easy to overcome compared to the holes a lot of the other sets have.

This is all constructive, so let me establish my own perspective. I feel that a 'Radiation Aura' set would need to be inherently different from the others because A. If it's sub par, who would play it, and B. If it's too powerful, who would play anything else? I feel that it should offer some outstanding protection against some of the more exotic types of damage. As a 'coat' of radiation, you'd be immensely resilient to energy, fire, cold, toxic, and maybe have some moderate protection to negative; but you wouldn't have any inherent protection to psionic, I wouldn't think. Also, while the resistance to smashing/lethal should be -there- due to being a tank, it shouldn't be more than any other type. I'd say 15% resistance would be more than enough for this sort of tank--plus it would be more balanced because of the need for fighting pool.

In terms of taunt auras, I couldn't imagine what would garner more attention than a Tank emitting copious amounts of radiation. That said, I wouldn't be adversed to it recieving three taunt auras, all with effects to cover some of the other weaknesses I've suggested. I think the first aura would do small amounts of toxic or energy, or a combination of both. The second would go along with some of the toggles you've already suggested, factoring in the non-psionic component; but what I'd suggest to go along with that would be a regeneration addition. I'd say being infused with radiation wouldn't make you completely bulletproof, but it might increase your regenerative capabilities. Or maybe add the regenerative effect into a toggle that was non-taunt; I dunno, just trying to be original. Your third aura would factor a debuff to defense, that wouldn't be affected by enhancements, while including some of the resistances you mentioned in your original post.

Personally, I'd make the auto-resistance something along the lines of 20% toxic, fire, cold, energy, and maybe +max HP. I wouldn't deprive the set from the resistance to endurance drain/debuff--that would almost be a crippling, insurmountable weakness to a set so toggle heavy. If there were a way to differentiate the -recharge from cold sets/psionic sets, I'd do that and make you immune to the cold -recharge. Since we currently have no such method, I'd include a slight resistance to -recharge, because it wouldn't make sense to be so resistant to cold and be hampered by the secondary effects of -rech. Oh and yeah, I'd keep the -regen component of one of the taunt auras. It'd be a staple of the set.

I admit I did start with Dark Armor and Electric Armor as the basis for this set. I went through and weakened portions of it so that it wasn't as strong as either of those sets. I changed things around to make it more interesting and unique. Heck, I don't think this would be as survivable as Dark Armor currently is, with the exception of toxic, but I could be wrong.

As a comparison to what I'm proposing, here are the un-enhanced base numbers I'm looking at from the other resist powers. I threw in Invulnerable for the heck of it. Invulnerable's defensive numbers do not include anyone in range. The Bold/Color was to try and make it easier to read, not to point out anything specific. If I've gotten any of the numbers incorrect, please let me know.

 Resist Base Values:
 Dark Armor:      30% S/L, 30% F/C, 20% E,  40% Neg, 20% Toxic, 50%Psi
 Fiery Armor:     30% S/L, 90% F, 20%C, 30% E/ Neg, 20% Toxic,0% Psi
 Invulnerability:  45% S/L, 20% F/C, 20% E/ Neg, 20% Toxic, 0%Psi
 Electric Armor:  35% S/L, 35% F/C, 83% E, 30% Neg, 0% Toxic, 35% Psi
 Radiation Armor: 30% S/L, 30% F/C,30% E, 25% Neg, 65% Toxic, 20% Psi

Defensive Base Values:
Dark Armor: 5% S/L, 5% F/C,  5% E/ Neg, 5% Psi, 5% M/R/AoE
Fiery Armor: 0% S/L, 0% F/C,  0% E/Neg, 0%Psi, 0% M/R/AoE
Invulnerability: 11% S/L, 11% F/C,  11% E/Neg, 0%Psi, 0% M/R/AoE
Electric Armor: 0% S/L, 0% F/C,  0% E/Neg, 0%Psi, 0% M/R/AoE
Radiation Armor: 5% S/L, 5% F/C, 5% E/Neg, 5%Psi, 5% M/R/AoE

Ok, sorry for taking so long to get back to this Rangle.

First, I want to address the toxic vs. energy issue. In my opinion, toxic works for this set. I relate it to Rad Corr debuffs which weaken foes. Radiation basically weakens and poisons a persons body. So while our tank/brute may be emmitting radioactive energy the effect it has is essentially toxic to our foes. I would almost prefer to see a -regen element in ranged rad attacks instead of the -def but that is a far different arguement. Again, just my opinion. I do not see an issue with the toxic focus of the set and infact prefer it.

As far as the set itself. Rangle has teamed with me on numerous occasions and I am sure I have mentioned my "wing it" approach to building toons, so for those who do not know me, I have spent all of about five minutes playing around on mids. I am not a min/maxer. So everything I am going to relate about this set comes from the point of veiw of somebody who is deciding what to roll and is flipping back and forth in the creator comparing sets to get a feel. Granted, I have about 6 years of playing and looking to go on but you get the drift.

With all that said. I like what I see. I do think the set is on an even keel, no big holes, but not uber to anything, except maybe toxic. Has some psi resist but not a ton. I think it would be functional and add a demension to the melee set armors. Might be as close as you can get to a debuff armor set.

Since I play brutes, a lot, I have a concern with the hold mechanic in Radiation Cloud but I can see it working for tanks. Not sure what to do with that. Perhaps the power changes to do some combination of -dam, -regen, -def, or -tohit and is called particle decay because your aura causes the particles that make up your foes to decay, weakening them a little across the board. I have no idea what values would be used.

As far as end use goes, this is what I think:

Tier 1- .21
Tier 2- .52
Tier 3- .21
Tier 4- .26
Tier 6- .26
Tier 8- .32 (perhaps .52 but not likely)

Base end use of 1.78. I can see raising the tier 8 but find it hard to punish your end use for a power that is supposed to aid your recovery. This is where a smart dev would balance end use vs. recovery and I suck at math.

By comparison, Dark would use 1.41 for the four base armors and the damage aura, 1.93 if you add the fear aura in. Fire sits at 1.04 to run 2 shields and its aura. Electric is at 1.28 for its 3 shields and aura. So this version of Rad Armor comes in at the high end of the scale, but you get what you pay for.

So aside from the hold mechanic there is not much I would mess with. Looks like it took some work Rangle. I hope somebody with some pull actually takes a look at it.

Mudpots, which is what the Tier 2 is based off of is .78/s. So the Tier 2 on this should also be .78/s. To balance that I can see the Tier 8 being less, maybe .21/s.

I hear what you're saying Papa, both with the end cost and the hold.

I was only looking at the end cost of the one power, not looking at all the end costs you'd proposed. If that was the only change, then yes the set is a bit end heavy. The current tier 8 power would/should help mitigate some of the end cost, but I'm not sure it would be enough. Still thinking about how to balance the over all end cost.

As far as the hold goes.... I'm not sure where to go with it. I think the set as designed needs some damage mitigation, which is why I've got the hold there. Something that wasn't the cold/fear/slows or stun from other sets. Even the -end/recovery from ELA can provide some damage mitigation.

There were several parts to my "thinking" about the hold. I couldn't have the Hold be as long as Mud Pots' immobilize, nor could I have the chance to hold as good/strong as Choking Cloud. I wanted something that could slow down the damage akin to Cloak of Fear/Oppressive Gloom and even Mud pots -recharge, but not be too powerful. This is why I hadn't included the option to enhance the hold.

A couple of thoughts about it.

• Maybe removing the chance for the Mag 2 hold would help with Fury generation.
• Maybe the tank version would take hold enhancements and the brute/scrapper wouldn't.

Well there can be another way to think about damage mitigation. Enervating field and Fallout use -dam and -res. Attach those to the aura and have the -regen in the tier 8 and you are in effect mitigating damage by reducing the damage foes in range can dish out and increasing the rate at which you can eliminate them through the -res and -regen.

I am not sure how the mechanics work for layering debuffs. Is it possible to say if a foe is being defuffed by the aura from player 'X" it cannot be debuffed by the same aura from another player? That way you can make the debuff significant enough to help a soloer yet not crazy when 4 Rad armor tanks are standing next to each other and the debuff would be the same because -dam and -res are not enhancable. Does a 10% damage debuff equal a +10% resist to all damage for foes within the aura?

Not saying I would go with 10% because I don't know if that is overpowered. It's just a thought, although -10% damage and -10% resist might be a starting point for discussion.

I know I've been away from the thread for awhile, I blame Rangle, but I'd just like to add my vote for Radiation Cloud (Aggro Aura) doing Toxic damage. Thematically it works, and adds uniqueness to the set.

I'm for the Hold in Radiation Cloud (Choking Cloud), but if there is a game mechanic that it's breaking then change it to -damage and/or -resist. I'd still like to see it as a minor Hold (mag 1) that is 1) Enhnacable and 2) can take IO sets. Other than the Fury mechanic issue, it would be a great way to keep the theme of the set going while bringing it over to the melee toons.

I understand the theory of the hold in rad cloud and can understand the appeal.

Aside from my issue with it on brutes, I think it will lend itself to a slower playstyle. What I mean by this is certain sets like fire, electric maybe even dark lend themseves to a certain run around the room and gather as many spawns as the aggro cap will allow. Let them chase you to a spot, mass execution, repeat.

The hold mechanic means tick of damage, aggro, hold, no chase the tank (or brute) or at best a delayed chase.

You risk making a tank that plods from spawn to spawn or must taunt everything to them. I am not saying its a bad playstyle but it may not be the most popular. I personally like a slower pace that kills more and does not skip through maps, but I feel much in the minority on that scale.

The hold will effect more than your mitigation. It could really influence the pace at which that set plays, which I think would influence its popularity.