Father Xmas' builds on Mwave?
By
Emberly,
Posted on: 2011-01-09 04:36 in ALL ACCESS Gameplay Technical Issues Bugs
Here's what I was able to put together from Father Xmas' high-end list:
Case
ANTEC THREE HUNDRED (black) ATX tower case no power supply 3x5.25" 6x3.5"(hidden) w/front i/o connectors, 140mm fan x 1 & 120mm case fan x 1
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BA25453
58.99
(Note: This is supposed to be COOLER MASTER RC-692-KKN2 CM690 II Advanced Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case, but it's out of stock. I don't know what compares, so I just went with the same Antec as the low-end build. Any better substitutions?)
Power Supply
ANTEC TP-750 750W Continuous power ATX12V V2.3 / EPS12V V2.91 SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=35120BA
99.00
Mobo
MSI P55A-GD65 USB3 LGA 1156 Intel P55 USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/SKUSearch...iteria=BD11464
163.00
CPU
Intel BX80605I5750 Core i5 i5-750 2.66GHz CPU/Processor, Quad-Core, 45 nm, 1 MB L2 Cache, 8 MB L3 Cache, Socket 1156, 95W, Retail, Boxed w/Cooling Fan
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=AA76366
209.00
(Note: This is supposed to be Intel Core i5-760 Lynnfield 2.8GHz LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor BX80605I5760, and this is one part where I'm afraid I might have hosed up this build. Is there a big difference between 2.66GHz and 2.8GHz?)
Memory
Kingston KHX1600C9D3K4/8GX 8GB (4 x 2GB) - 1600MHz DDR3-1600/PC3-12800 - Non-ECC - 240-pin DIMM
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=AB02413
113.66
(Note: This is supposed to be G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL8D-8GBRM, but Mwave doesn't sell G.SKILL, which is a shame especially since the Kingston uses up 2 more memory slots.)
Vid Card
Sapphire 100314-2SR HD6870 Video Card, 1GB DDR5, PCI-E, DVI, HDMI, Mini-Display Port
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=AA98980
242.00
Solid State Drive
Crucial RealSSD C300 2.5" SATA 64GB Solid State Drive
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BA39759
129.99
(Note: Father Xmas' build doesn't actually come with an SSD, but my friend said I should really consider it because of the fast boot times. You tell me -- is it worth it? And what about having CoH reside on the SSD along with Windows?)
Harddrive
WESTERN DIGITAL WD1002FAEX Caviar Black 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" internal hard drive
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=AA78035
86.99
Optical
LITE ON IHAS124-04 Black SATA 24x dvd drives internal DVD+/-RW dual layer drive
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=AA75599
18.99
(Note: This is supposed to be Sony Optiarc CD/DVD Burner Black SATA Model AD-7260S-0B - OEM, but a friend of mine recommended the similarly specced Lite-On variety, which doesn't seem to have generated the same noise complaints I've seen for the Sony, and it's the same price.)
OS
Microsoft GFC-00599 Windows 7 Home Premium 64BIT English DSP OEM 1-Pack
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BA36224
94.99
Cooling
COOLER MASTER RR-B10-212P-G1 Hyper 212 Plus Intel Core i5 & Intel Core i7 compatible 120mm "heatpipe direct contact" Long life sleeve CPU Cooler
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BD11524
26.99
Thermal
Arctic Silver AA-14G Arctic Alumina Premium Ceramic Thermal Compound
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BD11331
4.99
(Note: This is supposed to be Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound - OEM, but it's out of stock, so I went with what I hope was the next best thing, but I don't know.)
Assemble&Test
Assembly & Testing - add to cart w/selected components Please allow 5-7 working days for assembly. No refunds on assembly/testing.
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...eria=ASSEMTEST
79.99
Total of all items: $1,328.58, which is still under Father Xmas' $1375 maximum, even with a Solid State Drive and assembly & testing thrown in! However, the CPU, memory, and case substitutions trouble me. I'd appreciate anyone's input -- especially Father Xmas!
Note: Some of the prices I listed require you to register for free with the Mwave "MClub."
Try not to use Mwave at all.
*shudder*
try NewEgg http://www.newegg.com/
or Pricegrabber http://www.pricegrabber.com/
The Sly Bold Renardine - " I am Scraptastic!"
mwave is fine for getting stuff purely for this purpose. Also, they have a will call which you pay $5 and pick the part up 2 hours later. That is very handy if you need a part NOW. Newegg is hard to beat on selection.
The prices are cheaper because in most cases your buying an inferior product that isn't up to Father Xmas' specs. If you want the best parts your going to have to build it yourself.
The Antec 300 case for example is the standard 300 case not the Illusion variant. What is the difference? Well, for $10 more the Illusion case comes with $30 of case fans pre-installed.
The memory you picked I have never heard of, they do sell the higher end Kingstons go with those. Your trying to save pennies here and getting worse parts.
64GB SSD is really small, if you are going to use an SSD, 128GB is the minimum you should consider. Also, since you don't have a large storage drive your going to full that drive really quick.
I would suggest waiting to see if Father Xmas would look over the list. Just doing a quick glance over the list I can see lots of places for improvement.
On the low end system I suggest changing the memory to.
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...title=Kingston KHX1600C9D3K2/4GX HyperX 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin
H: Blaster 50, Defender 50, Tank 50, Scrapper 50, Controller 50, PB 50, WS 50
V: Brute 50, Corruptor 50, MM 50, Dominator 50, Stalker 50, AW 50, AS 50
Top 4: Controller, Brute, Scrapper, Corruptor
Bottom 4: (Peacebringer) way below everything else, Mastermind, Dominator, Blaster
CoH in WQHD
Quote:
I listed a 1TB hard drive along with the SSD drive. The SSD is just for the operating system and for CoH -- assuming all of that will fit okay, and it's worth it to put CoH there.|
Originally Posted by newchemicals
64GB SSD is really small, if you are going to use an SSD, 128GB is the minimum you should consider. Also, since you don't have a large storage drive your going to full that drive really quick.
|
I'm mainly wondering what an SSD will get me in terms of (1) booting up my PC and (2) playing CoH. A friend of mine has just priced out a DIY system on NewEgg that so far is coming to just over $1000, but that's without the SSD. Before adding $130 to that I would like to have some sense of what I'm getting....
You know that I now seem to have a 50/50 chance that either my browser will crash or the forum will log me off spontaneously whenever I have just spent a long time researching info for a long post. 
So I'm going to do this a piece at a time and edit the post as I go along.
Major differences between my builds and these.
---------------
$725 build
As newchemicles pointed out, my case has two additional front fans blowing are into the case.
That memory is Cas 9 while mine is Cas 8, but we are only talking about a 1-2% difference in practical performance.
The big gotcha is the hard drive. Searching for Samsung HD501LJ I get links not to an F1 but the T166. That drive uses 3 platters instead of 1 to achieve 500GB (it is a 3+ year old drive) so it's read/write speed isn't close to the F3 (39-82MB/s Vs 76-140MB/s).
Lastly and this is minor, the EA-430B power supply doesn't come with a power cord. Not a problem for some but it can be annoying if you are simply adding a new system instead of replacing one.
---------------
The $1375 build
Again with the case but the bigger problem is the HD 6870 does generate a lot more heat than the HD 5770, which will exacerbate the problem due to the lack of intake fans.
Again the memory is Cas 9 instead of Cas 8.
The i5-760 is 5% faster than the i5-750.
Arctic AA-14G is worse than Arctic Silver 5 but is still probably better than the paste that comes with the Hyper 212 Plus.
The motherboard is the big difference. Yes there is a difference between the P55-GD65 and the P55A-GD65, besides the USB 3.0 and SATA III (6Gb/s) support. That being this board does not support SLi as a multicard option. I chose the P55-GD65 because you could go either way. Right now I'm leaning toward AMD, a few years ago a leaned toward nVidia. Who knows what tomorrow will bring. One of the things that really ticks me off about multiple video cards is you tend to be locked in with one or the other. The Fuzion hybrid solution is iffy at best right now but higher end Intel motherboards have started offering support for both but it's not universal, you still got to read the fine print. Also the P55A-GD65 sort of shortchanges you on motherboard cooling buy skimping on the heatsinks and heatpipe. On the other hand it does give you USB 3.0 and SATA III support but I don't that that outways the loss of nVidia SLi support. But that's me.
64GB SSD is fine for the OS and a couple of games where the lack of seek time, the real advantage of an SSD, will be advantageous. However one problem with the smaller size SSDs is that their performance isn't as high as their bigger brothers for writes. The problem is that SSD is one of the few that can actually take advantage of SATA III and I just poo-pooed the motherboard that has SATA III. Whatever, it rocks SATA II as well with the exception of streaming/sequential reads, which is when it exceeds SATA II's top speed.
---------------------
On both systems, the optical drive. Funny that you mention noise because I heard it the other way around, that Lite On is louder than Sony. Six of one. Right now SATA DVD burners are virtually generic with the vast majority in the $20-25 for an OEM part.
Okay, I'm done. Of course it didn't log me out or crash.
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
Thanks for the input, Father Xmas!
Quote:
Yeah, I didn't realize that was a different case. Goof on my part.|
Originally Posted by Father Xmas
As newchemicles pointed out, my case has two additional front fans blowing air into the case.
|
Quote:
| Arctic AA-14G is worse than Arctic Silver 5 but is still probably better than the paste that comes with the Hyper 212 Plus. |
While you're here...any idea whether a 64GB SSD is worth the extra $120 for boot drive use? And would/should CoH fit on there with it? And how much of a pain is it to mount a 2.5" SSD in a 3.5" bay?
Last but not least...would you trust the stock cooler on the new Sandy Bridge i5 2500K Unlocked that's just come out?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...t=Combo.575900
On the topic of thermal interface gunk.
Quote:
No moving parts so... I just used some double sided tape and stuck it somewhere handy but out of the way of things.
|
Originally Posted by NewScrapper
And how much of a pain is it to mount a 2.5" SSD in a 3.5" bay?
|
Quote:
That's hilarious. I'm always thinking there has to be a high-tech solution to everything. Yet when my graphics card fan went out, my friend gave me one of his external fans...and a rubber band to strap it to the graphics card. Runs great!|
Originally Posted by Emberly
No moving parts so... I just used some double sided tape and stuck it somewhere handy but out of the way of things.
|
Is the SSD worth the money? What size, brand, cost, benefit, etc?
ALERT! The Antec 300 Illusion ATX mid tower case in Father XMas' low-end build just went on Shell-Shocker discount at NewEgg -- now $54.99 until 10AM PST!
Forgot the link -- http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811129066
In case anyone wants to chip in on my latest parts list, I've got a new thread at:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=250119
I'm in the market for a new PC, and someone told me you can purchase all your PC components from www.mwave.com, and for an extra $80 they'll assemble and test your PC for you. Armed with that knowledge, I took Father Xmas' two builds and tried to price them out at Mwave to see how they do. Unfortunately, there are certain items of Father Xmas' lists that are out of stock, and there are certain items that Mwave doesn't sell, but I did the best I could and came up with what I hope are fairly faithful builds.
Here's what I was able to put together from Father Xmas' low-end list:
Case
ANTEC THREE HUNDRED (black) ATX tower case no power supply 3x5.25" 6x3.5"(hidden) w/front i/o connectors, 140mm fan x 1 & 120mm case fan x 1
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BA25453
58.99
Power Supply
Antec EarthWatts Green EA-430D Green 430W Continuous power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS 12V 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=AB00047
56.99
(Note: This is supposed to be SeaSonic S12II 430B 430W ATX12V V2.3/EPS12V 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply.)
Mobo
GIGABYTE GA-770T-USB3 AM3 AMD 770 USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BD11287
79.99
CPU
AMD ADX445WFGMBOX Athlon II X3 445 3.10 GHz Processor - Tri-core - 2000 MHz HT - 1.50 MB L2 - Socket AM3 PGA-941
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BA39931
70.99
(Note: This is supposed to be AMD Athlon II X3 450 Rana 3.2GHz Socket AM3 95W Triple-Core Desktop Processor ADX450WFGMBOX.)
Memory
AVEXIR AVD3U13330902G-2SW Standard 4GB kit (2GB x 2) dual channel 240-pin pc3-10600 DDR3 1333mhz DIMM 9-9-9-24 desktop memory module
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BA42027
39.95
(Note: This is supposed to be G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F3-10600CL8D-4GBHK, but Mwave doesn't sell the G.SKILL brand. Also, I picked up this AVEXIR memory under the "DDR3 Standard" subgrouping instead of the "DDR3 Gaming" subgrouping -- I couldn't tell what the difference is between the two subgroupings?)
Vid Card
XFX HD-577A-ZNFC Radeon HD 5770 juniper xt 1GB GDDR5 pci-e 2.0 x16 hdcp ready Crossfire supported video card
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=3005602
156.06
Harddrive
SAMSUNG HD501LJ Spinpoint F1 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" internal hard drive (Bare Drive)
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=AA78012
34.99
(Note: This is supposed to be SAMSUNG Spinpoint F3 HD502HJ 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive, but the F1 was the closest thing Mwave had, and I couldn't see a difference in the specs?)
Optical
LITE ON IHAS124-04 Black SATA 24x dvd drives internal DVD+/-RW dual layer drive
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=AA75599
18.99
(Note: This is supposed to be Sony Optiarc CD/DVD Burner Black SATA Model AD-7260S-0B - OEM, but a friend of mine recommended the similarly specced Lite-On variety, which doesn't seem to have generated the same noise complaints I've seen for the Sony, and it's the same price.)
OS
Microsoft GFC-00599 Windows 7 Home Premium 64BIT English DSP OEM 1-Pack
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...iteria=BA36224
94.99
Assemble&Test
Assembly & Testing - add to cart w/selected components Please allow 5-7 working days for assembly. No refunds on assembly/testing.
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearch...eria=ASSEMTEST
79.99
Total of all items: $691.93, which is amazingly close to where Father Xmas' total hits ($684.91), even with Mwave's assembly and testing thrown in. But then, that might be because of the substitutions I had to make, so if this looks like a tempting build, make sure I'm not tempting you into the wrong decision.
(Will follow up shortly with a post on Father Xmas' high-end list!)