An easier way for signature powers, working with the system we have now


DarkGob

 

Posted

So, I was looking at the sticky thread suggestion on signature powers .. and just think it is overly complicated (and more importantly, probably a lot of work for the developers to put into the game. ..which means not so likely they will actually do it).

But! The current system inside the game could support signature powers a LOT easier through slotting!

Basically, at level 20, you get your signature power. Selecting from:

Point Blank Area
Ranged Area
Location Area
Melee Cone
Ranged Cone
Ranged
Melee
Friendly Target
Friendly Aura
Friendly Aura Toggle
Self Toggle
Self Click
Summon (hopefully? Pets might be harder to do)

You pick the category, and under each category is an animation for every attack that fits that category.

These attacks / abilities deal 0 damage and have 0 effects.

Now, it is simple from this point! You start off with one slot… and as you level up, get access to more signature power slots.

You then simply use special enhancements to put into the slots (made through non-tradeable material… kind of like shards? Or even needing to find “recipes” for the different abilities? However they want to handle it).

Each enhancement would have a minor effect (and some fitting into only specific types).

So, you could have a ranged attack enhancement that has a 1 mag hold. Or you could even approach it in terms of sets (getting a 3 mag hold after slotting a specific set of 4 enhancements that also have minor damage components).

Some might affect the range. Some could make it more accurate. Basically, it is slotting a naked animation however you want to get the effect you are after.

Just tone down the effectiveness of the enhancements so they don’t become overpowered (maybe the absolute max you could get through this is a 2 mag hold, hardly game breaking). At level 20 with one slot, you would be very limited in what it is doing (maybe just a light damage or tiny debuff to throw in… probably acting as more of an accent for characters at that level with just a tiny advantage.. giving a tanker a couple extra defense, or a mesmer an extra mag 1 hold to use on a minion).

The idea is to keep is useful, but just a little bit… and requiring a lot of work to get and develop, never actually overshadowing the real powers a character has.


Mew

 

Posted

Interesting idea. Similar to one I'd been batting around for awhile. The trick is that the power, to be worth the development, would have to be 'worth it' to the player. This means one of two things: Either a new, reliable addition to the character, or a crazy WOW power for their character. To balance, the devs have already put this in place: the more readily available the power is, the less powerful it is. The stronger, the slower/more expensive/etc.

So let's try this, as an example: your damage effect enhancement doesn't just give damage to your ranged attack- it adds an endurance cost and longer recharge. Same with your mez, buff, etc.

This way, if the player wants the power all the time, they only throw a few damages into it. If they want a nuke, they have to know it may cost them all their endurance, recharge every three hours, and maybe apply a residual debuff to them.

To this end, I'd suggest something else- the effect enhancements would differ by archetype. If a tanker wants to use a click-boost that would give them resistance, it would have less of a recharge/endurance penalty than if they were, say, a blaster.


 

Posted

This sounds really overly-complicated, especially for level 20. From what little we've seen of the Incarnate System past the Alpha Slot, they might be using it to implement a signature power system. The next Incarnate Slot is, per the official Going Rogue site:

Judgement: Grants new upgradeable area of effect (AOE) powers.


"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...

 

Posted

I think the power should keep on a fairly short-ish recharge for everyone. So it can be used pretty much all the time and become part of how a character fights (maybe a few effects could come with larger recharges, like a 10 second long phase shift power).

Allowing these types of powers to become too strong would make a mess... people would make uber powers on long recharges for high costs and just eat an inspiration or two to get around high endurance (and use the uber power to make fighting rare super hard fights easy). Kind of like how they lmit the nukes in some taskforces... they don't want people running around with "bwahaha! die!" powers.

The thing is, in an attack chain, you can only string together so many powers before the start of the chain comes back. That is why having a bunch of medium powers is just a waste (and why it is safe to give people a bunch of medium temporary powers, like the hammer and bat). The devs know that it won't break anything, people already have access to a lot better than those.

It should be the same with the signature powers. They don't break anything... but enhance a certain aspect a character goes for.

Giving a mesmer a point more of hold. Giving a melee a little debuff. Giving a blaster a little self heal or defense... things that are already all very possible through power pools or patron /anc pools. Because they are weaker versions and pickable from any animation, they act like "icing on the cake" to help flesh out concepts and ground a character a bit more.

A ninja mastermind could take boxing or kick or jump kick to get a melee attack (all capable of being slotted with some nice effects and procs)... or, they could use their signature power to make a decent katana attack with a slight debuff that would do less damage than a proc-enhanced kick, but might give a 10 percent res debuff, making it just passable (and, more importantly, more immersive for the mastermind that was looking for a power to fit in with his pets as they go toe to toe with enemies).

The point of the signature power isn't to make characters all that much more powerful (just a tiny bit), it is meant to help fill in the gap that a player feels their character is missing and really make them feel unique.

Like creating a mind controller and having a backstory of the sindicate... but simply being unable to get the dual swords they have (outside of the very limited charge temporary power). You don't care if it does their amazing super damage, just something decent enough to throw into your attack chain with an affect that would help out a bit.

Or that melee basalisk who has a katana that has a small hold on it... again, very possible and simply not an issue in terms of gameplay balance (a melee getting ahold of a mag 1 or 2 hold won't break anything... though, it might be a tad useful running into a battle and using it on a minion level healer... simply wont break the bank on any meaningful content)


Mew

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosen_ice View Post
The point of the signature power isn't to make characters all that much more powerful (just a tiny bit), it is meant to help fill in the gap that a player feels their character is missing and really make them feel unique.
You'd definitely need to take a step back and look to see if that's what is needed in the game or even viable.

Personally, if I want my characters to look and feel unique, then it's not *a* power that we need, but customization for all our powers. I'd sooner expect a slew of alternate animations that go so deep as to give weapon options to non-weapon sets than the proposed suggestion. And this isn't a shot at your idea, but your idea doesn't seem any less complicated than the other signature powers suggestions.

But you want a really simplified system for signature powers? Give a set of predefined powers for multiple categories:
Range-
--Minor Damage
--Moderate Damage
--Superior Damage
--Extreme Damage

Targeted AoE-
--Minor Damage
--Moderate
--etc.

In each of those predefined powers, you get more options that you unlock later. The minor damage ranged power might have more options for adding debuffs or controlls, increasing the range, decreasing the recharge or even adding a self buff to yourself while the extreme damage version would be more limited (can't have a huge debuff and huge damage).

Besides that, just give lots of options for animations, particle fx, sounds and colors. But all the combinations of powers are already defined with endurance costs, recharge and so on already baked in.


 

Posted

The problem with a tree system of powers is a developer actually needs to sit down and go through each power and upgrade...

Putting it a basic "this is ranged power and can use any animation" is a lot easier (and then you just add in the enhancements, which can be combined in infinite ways).

The thing with allowing people to just customize their powers completely (as they exist, just changing the animation) is it destroys the reason for different powers. What is the difference between an ice blast and a fire blast? One slows, one has a dot... the slow is stronger in the game.

If people could take ice and make it LOOK like archery... why would anyone take archery? (Other than rain of arrows, but arrows that slow would rock so much).

Also, in terms of programming, they would have to go through everything and rip it all apart to remake every power totally customizable (also some animations are slower than others, if you meta game...animation times are very important... which is part of the balance they have in place. If i could change out everything with under 1 second animations, that would kind of break the game in terms of power levels).

Its a tricky sittuation... ideally, the players want completely open "let us have anything"... but the developers know what this will cause (food of the month, super combinations... more than already exists under a restricted system).

That's why if we get a chance for customizable powers, it needs to be in a way that is really easy for the developers to do. Throwing in a naked power and special enhancements with 100 percent procs is very easy for them (the groundwork for enhancements are already in place, creating a new enhancement would take a few minutes maybe... the hardest part is writing in the name of the enhancement :P).


Mew

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosen_ice View Post
The problem with a tree system of powers is a developer actually needs to sit down and go through each power and upgrade...
It's not a tree system. If anything it's a faux tree system that only looks like it from the outside when, in reality, you're just picking an already made power from a list and choosing an animation for it. You're not really branching anything, just picking a power with the effects you want. That'd probably add around 200 powers to the mix, but all those powers are numbers spat out and balanced by a single program.

AFAIK, there isn't a means to 'add' enhancements to a power that doesn't inherently have said effect. It's not black and white to think it's easier or harder to create a system using blank powers with 0 stats that materialize by means of some non-existent system of enhancement.


 

Posted

Passes out popcorn for another "this is easy" code thread...