Is my stalker gimped now?


beyeajus

 

Posted

So I've been away from the game for about a year and a half. I came back recently and love the new additions to the game. However, I ran the RSF for the first time since I came back with my Stalker (claws/regen). I knew /regen had it flaws before I left. However, it seems like it's gotten worse. I've looked through the forums and haven't had much luck find anything on /regen for stalkers. Could someone fill me in on why my stalker is having a harder time now?


 

Posted

Need more details.

Solo? Teamed?

What kind of build are you running?
What happened that made you feel weak?


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I am always too busy looking for the inevitable punchline...


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Posted

Just going to throw this personal experience out there. Take it for what it's worth.

Long ago, my warshade was my favorite and most often played character. He was awesome, unstoppable, and downright tankmagey. Then I stopped playing him for a few months.

Time passed, but I came back to my old favorite to do some TFs and generally lay waste to enemies like the old days.

I failed. Hard.

Taking time away from a character will not only lower your ability to play that character, but it will distort memories of said character.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Test_Rat View Post
Need more details.

Solo? Teamed?

What kind of build are you running?
What happened that made you feel weak?

As I mentioned in my original post I was on the RSF. 99% of the time it's on an 8 person team; which is the case in this example. My stalker is a Claws/Regen. I don't have my specific build details right now since I'm at work. So all I can give you are my primary and secondary powersets. We were running the mishes that contained the AVs. Typically I could hold my own with those. Yes faceplanting a few times. But I could barely stand on my feet against those guys this time.

Also, I was in on a Hami raid this past weekend. My stalker felt normal to me with Hami. But gimped when it came to RSF. So as I think more about it has the RSF changed or has my secondary been gimped.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by WoodNimph View Post
As I mentioned in my original post I was on the RSF. 99% of the time it's on an 8 person team; which is the case in this example. My stalker is a Claws/Regen. I don't have my specific build details right now since I'm at work. So all I can give you are my primary and secondary powersets. We were running the mishes that contained the AVs. Typically I could hold my own with those. Yes faceplanting a few times. But I could barely stand on my feet against those guys this time.

Also, I was in on a Hami raid this past weekend. My stalker felt normal to me with Hami. But gimped when it came to RSF. So as I think more about it has the RSF changed or has my secondary been gimped.
I'd say it's that you haven't played your toon in awhile for one. Hami is pretty easy to stay the same. It's basically a resist/defenses don't matter situation (they matter, but you know what I mean).

Nothing has changed on Regen, you just need to get back into playing the Stalker. Though, depending on how long you've been gone, might want to look at the IOs.

Also to be mentioned, it could be part of your old team and new team, maybe you teamed with certain people before, and didn't this last outing.


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Posted

The same problem happened to me with my Broadsword/Regen Scrapper. I would demolish the world with him. Stack Parry, fling my Taser Dart into another group, stack more Parry, and then go ape**** on the entire cluster.

I stopped playing him for about 6 months and dedicated myself to my Fire/Fire (now 50) and my Bots/Pain (now 48). I came back to him and got my buttocks handed to me on a not-so-silver platter.

You just gotta get back in the swing of playing your Stalker, is all.


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Posted

Thanks! Glad to know that the devs haven't done anything to /regen to cause me this headache.


 

Posted

By the way, did you notice a lot more critical now?? If you haven't played Stalker for a long while.


What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.

 

Posted

I typically don't pay attention to the damage numbers or crits when playing any of my toons. I'm assuming that they have made a change to that for stalkers? It's good if they have, just means that I should be able to kill a bit faster.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by WoodNimph View Post
I'm assuming that they have made a change to that for stalkers?
Stalkers get a base 10% chance to crit against anything now, but each teammate nearby grants you an extra 3%.

I'm pretty sure that also counts pets.

I'm also pretty sure it caps somewhere around 35%.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison View Post
Stalkers get a base 10% chance to crit against anything now, but each teammate nearby grants you an extra 3%.
This happened almost two and a half years ago so it's probably not new to WoodNimph. Hard to believe it's been that long, now I think of it.

Quote:
I'm pretty sure that also counts pets.

I'm also pretty sure it caps somewhere around 35%.
This is something I'd like to see proven or commented on by devs or something. The only thing they mention in the patch notes is "team members".

What you'd basically have to do is group up with an MM or two, head to RWZ, and play whack-a-dummy with Hide off and nothing but their pets within range. Start HeroStats and collect a decent number of hits. Probably shouldn't take that many to tell the difference between the base 10% chance and an elevated one due to surrounding pets.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zem View Post
What you'd basically have to do is group up with an MM or two, head to RWZ, and play whack-a-dummy with Hide off and nothing but their pets within range. Start HeroStats and collect a decent number of hits. Probably shouldn't take that many to tell the difference between the base 10% chance and an elevated one due to surrounding pets.
Ooooh! Great idea.

Hell, you could put them both on an Ouro team and leave the stalker to auto attack overnight.


Where to now?
Check out all my guides and fiction pieces on my blog.
The MFing Warshade | The Last Rule of Tanking | The Got Dam Mastermind
Everything Dark Armor | The Softcap
don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.

 

Posted

What exactly made you feel weak on the RSF?

Getting one shotted, Dying Alot?


When something good happens to me, I can never enjoy it....
I am always too busy looking for the inevitable punchline...


BEHOLD THE POWER OF CHEESE!

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by WoodNimph View Post
I typically don't pay attention to the damage numbers or crits when playing any of my toons. I'm assuming that they have made a change to that for stalkers? It's good if they have, just means that I should be able to kill a bit faster.

Well, critical matters a lot for Stalkers... I know I would care for it. :P

I have no experience in Regen so I won't comment on it but just Regen along, you are not going to survive those Heroes' attacks (regen lacks psi resistance?). The buffs and debuffs matter way more than your secondary against Heroes/AVs.


What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison View Post
Ooooh! Great idea.

Hell, you could put them both on an Ouro team and leave the stalker to auto attack overnight.
You know what, I always feel I get more critical when I play with MM and their pets (or any pet) (especially Ninja or Necro since they are more at melee range). I have a strong feeling that pets are counted as a party member and if my computer gets fixed tonight, I can test with a friend just to satisfy my curiosity.


What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.

 

Posted

Thanks for the info everyone. I don't hate her. Never have. I'm definitely on the "love my stalker" bandwagon. Just wish she was a little less squishy. Until the devs give us some love I'll just need to IO her up and hope for the best.


 

Posted

Do you have the Fighting Pool with your Regen? Regen is really powerful with all its heals and regeneration, but all that power is not instantaneous: you need time to click your attacks, etc. I noticed a big difference for my guy when I picked up Tough, and when he got Weave and a decent amount of defense (from IOs), he usually doesn't need to have Tough on unless I have the difficulty way up or my team is facing something rough.

Regeneration is usually considered a higher skill secondary by a lot of people, as it isn't a fire and forget secondary like Willpower: you have to know when to use what powers, etc. I'm guessing Regen also hurts a bit from Stalker's lower HP cap (when our base was increased, the cap was not also increased). It should be easy to be at or close to the cap before using Dull Pain, and increasing your HP is a big boost from Regen, or it should be.


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Posted

I actually hadn't considered the Fighting Pool. Piper needs to go through a respec anyway. That may be something that I pick up to replace unused powers that I have currently. Thanks for the suggestion.


 

Posted

My regen is a scrapper but I can say that Grey Pilgrim is right, going from zero defense to 20% made an enormous difference for me.

People can say all they like about "ooh defense doesn't matter if you don't have DDR because the romans will debuff you blah blah blah". Doesn't happen all that often in reality. Yes, the romans, the PPD, and a few others can cause cascading defense failure. But as someone wiser than me said, we have a name for it because it is rare, if it happened all the time we'd just call it "dying".

If you can get 15% defense (I recommend S/L) you will notice a difference. at 20% you will really feel it.

The other thing I found is that many times oranges are just as handy as purples. All you need is to slow incoming damage. psi attacks for instance, and moment of glory gives no help either. An orange goes a long way against carnie bosses or rikti.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade View Post
My regen is a scrapper but I can say that Grey Pilgrim is right, going from zero defense to 20% made an enormous difference for me.

People can say all they like about "ooh defense doesn't matter if you don't have DDR because the romans will debuff you blah blah blah". Doesn't happen all that often in reality. Yes, the romans, the PPD, and a few others can cause cascading defense failure. But as someone wiser than me said, we have a name for it because it is rare, if it happened all the time we'd just call it "dying".

If you can get 15% defense (I recommend S/L) you will notice a difference. at 20% you will really feel it.

The other thing I found is that many times oranges are just as handy as purples. All you need is to slow incoming damage. psi attacks for instance, and moment of glory gives no help either. An orange goes a long way against carnie bosses or rikti.
Enemies who will annihilate your defense:

PPD (all forms)
Resistance
Council
Longbow
Malta
Sky Raiders
Arachnos
Security
RIPs
Crey
Hellions
Legacy Chain
Lost
Family
Mooks
Cimemorans
Devouring Earth
Carnies
Banished Pantheon
Skulls
Rikti
Tsoo
Circle of Thorns Mages/Guards
Anything with a Gunner surname
Knives of Artemis
Vanguard
Anything with a Blade type weapon (Katana, DB, Broadsword, generic Sword powers)
The list can go on.

How is Defense Debuff rare?


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Posted

What, did you just list every enemy group you could think of? Because I'd really like to know how you managed to die to cascade failure against Rikti, of all things.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim View Post
Enemies who will annihilate your defense:

PPD (all forms)
Resistance
Council
Longbow
Malta
Sky Raiders
Arachnos
Security
RIPs
Crey
Hellions
Legacy Chain
Lost
Family
Mooks
Cimemorans
Devouring Earth
Carnies
Banished Pantheon
Skulls
Rikti
Tsoo
Circle of Thorns Mages/Guards
Anything with a Gunner surname
Knives of Artemis
Vanguard
Anything with a Blade type weapon (Katana, DB, Broadsword, generic Sword powers)
The list can go on.

How is Defense Debuff rare?
? There are some mobs in a lot of those groups, but they're not necessarily known for it. I'd cite the CoT for -to hit much sooner than -def, for instance: the main ones that do it are those Earth Mage mobs in the 30s, and they're not always there. Tsoo... sword wielders, I guess, but most of them do Kin type powers and -to hit. Rikti? Not even sure who does that... maybe the occasional Magi, but I thought they were mostly Stalagmites and mez.

Defense debuff is more common early game with all the guns being toted about, but late game it's mostly there for certain enemy groups or mob types you encounter. My Fire/Fire Tank enjoys the defense he's picked up, so he always mezzes those Tarantula Queen LTs that debuff defense so much. Rest of Arachnos, not so much.

Defense debuff is a tactical consideration, to be sure, but many mobs do not do it, and you'll notice it when they can. Adjust accordingly. Doesn't mean that having some defense (whether your primary has it or not) will help. For WP, you have heals and Tough to fall back on that point as well, which is layered mitigation, and something you want on any character.


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Story Arc:
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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim View Post
Enemies who will annihilate your defense:

How is Defense Debuff rare?
I didn't say defense debuff is rare, I said "cascading defense failure" is rare. Yes it is pretty normal to lose 6 to 20% off your defense. It is not normal to be dropped from softcap into the negatives. Here is my exact wording so you can see for yourself:

Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade View Post
Yes, the romans, the PPD, and a few others can cause cascading defense failure. But as someone wiser than me said, we have a name for it because it is rare, if it happened all the time we'd just call it "dying".
Notice I did not at any point say that defense debuffs were rare. I was only talking about cascading defense failure. I brought it up specifically because some people like to pretend that defense debuffs are so common and so powerful that res builds shouldn't bother with defense under the mistaken beliefe that you will have effectively no defense most of the time.

On my /elec brute I have 28% melee defense. I pretty commonly go down to about 12 against council at the beginning of a spawn. And I am back at 28% by the middle of it. Romans put me into the negatives. Council do not. Knives of Artemis do not. 5th column do not. Rularuu do not (unless it is a spawn with 5+ eyes, but I was farming Scirrocco's rularuu mission at 0/x6 for a long time quite happily).

Yes they all debuff me. No they do not all cause my defense to go away completely.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grey Pilgrim View Post
? There are some mobs in a lot of those groups, but they're not necessarily known for it. I'd cite the CoT for -to hit much sooner than -def, for instance: the main ones that do it are those Earth Mage mobs in the 30s, and they're not always there. Tsoo... sword wielders, I guess, but most of them do Kin type powers and -to hit. Rikti? Not even sure who does that... maybe the occasional Magi, but I thought they were mostly Stalagmites and mez.
Earth Mages and any Earth Thorn Caster will cast Quicksand. I've seen those bastids stack that thing up to 5 times. There goes all your defense. I was partially wrong about the Rikti, as I thought their blades applied -Def. Assault Suits and the Magi do it as well. Council/Longbow/Malta/Sky Raiders/PPD/Resistance have gobs of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade View Post
I didn't say defense debuff is rare, I said "cascading defense failure" is rare. Yes it is pretty normal to lose 6 to 20% off your defense. It is not normal to be dropped from softcap into the negatives. Here is my exact wording so you can see for yourself:



Notice I did not at any point say that defense debuffs were rare. I was only talking about cascading defense failure. I brought it up specifically because some people like to pretend that defense debuffs are so common and so powerful that res builds shouldn't bother with defense under the mistaken beliefe that you will have effectively no defense most of the time.

On my /elec brute I have 28% melee defense. I pretty commonly go down to about 12 against council at the beginning of a spawn. And I am back at 28% by the middle of it. Romans put me into the negatives. Council do not. Knives of Artemis do not. 5th column do not. Rularuu do not (unless it is a spawn with 5+ eyes, but I was farming Scirrocco's rularuu mission at 0/x6 for a long time quite happily).

Yes they all debuff me. No they do not all cause my defense to go away completely.
Easy skippy. The way that sentence tied in to your post made it sound like (to me at least) you were referring to regular defense debuffs, not death syndrome.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim View Post
Easy skippy. The way that sentence tied in to your post made it sound like (to me at least) you were referring to regular defense debuffs, not death syndrome.
No worries. Not upset. Just trying to be clear. When I do that, I get wordy/long winded. =)


"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.