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I'll /sign this since it is SEVERELY annoying, and has turned me off from stalkers a lot.|
Originally Posted by Smash_Zone
Nothing is more annoying than when I'm playing my Stalker and I pick a target, hit build up, get Assassin's Strike ready aaand... MISS!!!
Seriously, this makes no sense at all. I'm invisible, my target is completely unaware of my presence, I take the time to plan out my strike, how on earth do I miss? I can see regular melee attacks missing, the opponent could dodge or block it from a RP'ers perspective. But a planned out attack where I specifically take time to aim my strike from the shadows should never miss. Ever. This is the Stalker job, he does this for a living, how do you possibly miss? That's like a ninja sneaking up behind someone, putting a knife to their throat, and then missing. Both from an Ingame and a RP'ers perspective, missing with Assassin's Strike makes no logical sense. Suggestion: Make Assassin's Strike Auto-hit when hidden. This isn't game-breaking, it doesn't harm balance in anyway. When you miss an AS, your hidden status isn't broken, so all it does it make you sit there and wait for build up to recharge again, which is annoying. You could also make it so that activating Build up makes Assassins strike auto-hit. Considering you're drastically raising your damage and accuracy for ten seconds, it would only make sense for Assassins Strike to have a guaranteed hit. Just something that prevents me from sitting there doing nothing for 45 seconds while I wait for BU to recharge, because I missed with an attack that should never have missed in the first place. Some of you are probably like "Just pop a yellow." Yeah, I could do that, but there's still that 5% chance of missing. There shouldn't even be an Accuracy component to Assassins Strike; I shouldn't have to use inspirations to get a guaranteed hit on my signature power. Thoughts? Problems? |
To ebb on the safe side, I'll say it should require build up and hidden status to make it auto hit.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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I wouldn't mind if the power became an autohit from hide, as it'd take out the moments you mentioned when one hits Build Up and whiffs spectacularly.
Don't know if it could be implemented though, a power being an automatic hit when hidden and following the normal accuracy rules when not.
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This would work too.
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Originally Posted by AzureSkyCiel
To ebb on the safe side, I'll say it should require build up and hidden status to make it auto hit.
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Oh so signed. Hide/Build up/AS "miss" waiting.... I truly hate that.
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Originally Posted by AzureSkyCiel
I'll /sign this since it is SEVERELY annoying, and has turned me off from stalkers a lot.
To ebb on the safe side, I'll say it should require build up and hidden status to make it auto hit. |
"Sorry bucko, but CoH and CoV are the same game." -BackAlleyBrawler
"Silly villain, CoX is for Heroes!" -Saicho
Other than "It's annoying to you," why change? They've already buffed it so it doesn't break hide when you miss, and it *does* give a good chance of an AOE fear when you hit (negating return fire.) I don't really see it needing more buffing (and yes, I do play stalkers. Yes, recently, too. Last pre-GR character was an Elec/Nin Stalker, now in the teens, and my first alignment change was my MA/Regen stalker.)
What are you willing to give up to make it autohit? Damage? Give it a longer recharge? Massive END cost added?
Plus the point brought up above (making it autohit when hidden, and not when you aren't,) and don't forget PVP.
Edit: Plus, you have an auto-hit undo button in Placate. No, doesn't do anything to the recharge, but you'll get a crit (typically) on your next attack.
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In return I ask "Why not change?" It's not like this attack is used in a regular attack chain, since it's got such a huge animation time and is interruptible.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Other than "It's annoying to you," why change? They've already buffed it so it doesn't break hide when you miss, and it *does* give a good chance of an AOE fear when you hit (negating return fire.) I don't really see it needing more buffing (and yes, I do play stalkers. Yes, recently, too. Last pre-GR character was an Elec/Nin Stalker, now in the teens, and my first alignment change was my MA/Regen stalker.)
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| What are you willing to give up to make it autohit? Damage? Give it a longer recharge? Massive END cost added? |
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| Plus the point brought up above (making it autohit when hidden, and not when you aren't,) and don't forget PVP. |
And I'm not terrible knowledgeable about coding, but it doesn't seem like it would be outrageously difficult to implement. Like an "If X, then Y" equation for build up, which would be "If Build up, then auto-hit AS." That's only ten seconds of auto-hit for one attack which is only useful if hidden, so again, I don't see any balance issues in PvE. And, we've seen that such tech is possible with Kinetic melee's "Power Siphon" which enables all attacks to increase your damage for 20 seconds. So attaching an auto-hit to Assassin's Strike via build up could definitely be possible.
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Here's the thing (well, two) - one, as mentioned before, it has been buffed so that not only does a miss not pull you out of hide, but a hit gives a good chance for the AOE fear. Both of those were, IMHO, pretty big deals (as opposed to a whiff leaving you in the middle of an aggroed mob, and a hit guaranteeing you're taking all the return fire that they can whip out, other teammates using control/aggro grabbing excepted, of course.)
Plus, overall - well, your main argument is that it's annoying to miss. Yes, it is. What else do we make autohit, then? Blaster nukes, if they miss someone, leave the blaster completely drained and vulnerable. Should they be autohit? (Same for Defenders and Corruptors.) Of course, I hate it when my snipes miss, too (especially if it's because something happened to wander behind a pillar on the second tohit check,) and they're more in line with an AS. Should they be autohit? How about melee? How about controllers and doms? What about Masterminds?
Point being, nobody likes when powers miss, but "make them autohit" just - to me - needs a *lot* more justification than that.
From an RP perspective, it might not makes sense to miss when you're solo, but on a team it would get much harder to strike because your target would already be fighting and moving around, making it still possible to mess up your attack.
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
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The target bent over to tie their shoes just as you swung your knife.|
Originally Posted by Smash_Zone
I'm invisible, my target is completely unaware of my presence, I take the time to plan out my strike, how on earth do I miss?
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Originally Posted by Lord Mordeth
Don't know if it could be implemented though, a power being an automatic hit when hidden and following the normal accuracy rules when not.
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http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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From a RP'ers perspective, other powers can have a chance to miss. somebody could avoid that blaster nuke, because the blaster isn't completely invisible, he's at a range, or in a PBAoE's case, he's right there, and they could dodge it. Snipes, again, could also miss, since you're at a farther range, and your accuracy isn't perfect. I explained before that regular melee attacks could be parried, dodged, or blocked if you look at it like that.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Plus, overall - well, your main argument is that it's annoying to miss. Yes, it is. What else do we make autohit, then? Blaster nukes, if they miss someone, leave the blaster completely drained and vulnerable. Should they be autohit? (Same for Defenders and Corruptors.) Of course, I hate it when my snipes miss, too (especially if it's because something happened to wander behind a pillar on the second tohit check,) and they're more in line with an AS. Should they be autohit? How about melee? How about controllers and doms? What about Masterminds? Point being, nobody likes when powers miss, but "make them autohit" just - to me - needs a *lot* more justification than that. |
but the thing with Assassin's strike is that it isn't thematic with a good villain. A stalker isn't your simple "SMASH AND KILL!" type of villain. A Stalker is more refined, has a certain elegance and subtlety with their kills. Stalkers rely on planned out strikes, and though they can scrap is out if they get caught, their real strength in taking people out without anybody noticing.
Again, the ninja and the knife situation. If I'm right behind someone, and they're completely oblivious to my presence, I power up with Build up, crouch down to ready my attack, there really isn't a possible way for you to miss unless the guy walks away as you're about to strike. But here, they don't usually walk around much, and stabbing my swords into a guy, yet still getting the "MISS!" message, really kills the mood and breaks my immersion. I really like to get in character when I play solo, but having my attack animation totally hit somebody but still miss really kills the character.
My main argument isn't that it's annoying, even though it totally is, it's more of a thematic reason. From an ingame view-point, I should not have missed. This is a point-blank strike from the shadows. It reminds me of those old scooby-doo villains who would hide behind a corner, then just swing their arms trying to catch shaggy or someone as they turn the corner, but end up just swinging at the air as they walk away. Last time I checked, I wasn't some petty scooby-doo villain whose sole purpose was to scare people away while I forged museum paintings.
Arc ID: 348998 - Becoming a villain
Arc ID: 373341 - To Save a Hero
Got Inf?
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What if the Blaster is invisible and standing right next to the target before using Inferno?
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Originally Posted by Smash_Zone
From a RP'ers perspective, other powers can have a chance to miss. somebody could avoid that blaster nuke, because the blaster isn't completely invisible, he's at a range, or in a PBAoE's case, he's right there, and they could dodge it. Snipes, again, could also miss, since you're at a farther range, and your accuracy isn't perfect. I explained before that regular melee attacks could be parried, dodged, or blocked if you look at it like that.
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http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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By that argument, all that should be needed to make a power autohit (as hinted at by Fleeting) is Stealth. Wouldn't even have to invest in a power (or IO) - you get a nice temp Combat Invisibility. You could grant autohit powers to the entire team by taking a pool. Illusion controllers would never have to invest in accuracy - 100% autohit confuse, single target and AOE hold, and damage, plus any pools they took. /Dev would become *the* blaster secondary again - this time for the autohit from its stealth power (mixed with smoke grenade for even more fun.) |
Originally Posted by Smash_Zone
From a RP'ers perspective, other powers can have a chance to miss. somebody could avoid that blaster nuke, because the blaster isn't completely invisible, he's at a range, or in a PBAoE's case, he's right there, and they could dodge it. Snipes, again, could also miss, since you're at a farther range, and your accuracy isn't perfect. I explained before that regular melee attacks could be parried, dodged, or blocked if you look at it like that.
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I'm just not sold. I'm sorry that it "breaks your immersion," but look at the groups. Most of them have some sort of equipment - it's not out of line to think of even, say, the Family having concealed holsters and such. Just tell yourself you had an unluckly glance off of that holster/armor plate/whatever and you're fortunate they didn't notice.... somehow.
Edit: Also, since you've brought up things 'breaking immersion," how does it not break your immersion that your - say, 30"-36"? - blade managed to hit somebody who has not just jogged thirty feet from you, but did so off to the side? I mean, if we're going for immersion, shouldn't we take the bad with the good and insist your target must be in a realistic range and position when the strike goes off?
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Peter Sellers/Pink Panther movies for numerous examples of this! |
Originally Posted by Fleeting Whisper
The target bent over to tie their shoes just as you swung your knife.
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Anyhow, I am with Memphis Bill in that AS has been buffed and don't see any evidence this needs to be buffed even more without some kind of balance. We already one shot plenty of mobs with AS (I have a 50 stalker and started a new one for GR).
Does it annoy once in a while? Yes, once in a while. We have had a few "autohit" or remove 95%-similar threads lately, but zero data shown how often this happens. The only bits I have seen are videos by Leo_G showing how fast he defeats mobs. Is missing suddenly a huge problem in the game? Did I miss something?
It is annoying when AS misses and I usually sit back for a while as it refreshes since I'm still hidden.
But,
I have 3 yellows slotted on AS. Freeing them up makes this a very big buff indeed.
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Well Fireball should be auto-hit if I'm running Stealth and Super Speed and use it from a distance. I mean how do you dodge an explosion of fire that you don't see coming? It's not like my aim could be the cause, it's an explosion!
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Originally Posted by Smash_Zone
From a RP'ers perspective, other powers can have a chance to miss. somebody could avoid that blaster nuke, because the blaster isn't completely invisible, he's at a range, or in a PBAoE's case, he's right there, and they could dodge it. Snipes, again, could also miss, since you're at a farther range, and your accuracy isn't perfect. I explained before that regular melee attacks could be parried, dodged, or blocked if you look at it like that.
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Nothing is more annoying than when I'm playing my Stalker and I pick a target, hit build up, get Assassin's Strike ready aaand... MISS!!!
Seriously, this makes no sense at all. I'm invisible, my target is completely unaware of my presence, I take the time to plan out my strike, how on earth do I miss? I can see regular melee attacks missing, the opponent could dodge or block it from a RP'ers perspective. But a planned out attack where I specifically take time to aim my strike from the shadows should never miss. Ever. This is the Stalker job, he does this for a living, how do you possibly miss? That's like a ninja sneaking up behind someone, putting a knife to their throat, and then missing. Both from an Ingame and a RP'ers perspective, missing with Assassin's Strike makes no logical sense.
Suggestion: Make Assassin's Strike Auto-hit when hidden. This isn't game-breaking, it doesn't harm balance in anyway. When you miss an AS, your hidden status isn't broken, so all it does it make you sit there and wait for build up to recharge again, which is annoying.
You could also make it so that activating Build up makes Assassins strike auto-hit. Considering you're drastically raising your damage and accuracy for ten seconds, it would only make sense for Assassins Strike to have a guaranteed hit. Just something that prevents me from sitting there doing nothing for 45 seconds while I wait for BU to recharge, because I missed with an attack that should never have missed in the first place.
Some of you are probably like "Just pop a yellow." Yeah, I could do that, but there's still that 5% chance of missing. There shouldn't even be an Accuracy component to Assassins Strike; I shouldn't have to use inspirations to get a guaranteed hit on my signature power.
Thoughts? Problems?
Arc ID: 348998 - Becoming a villain
Arc ID: 373341 - To Save a Hero
Got Inf?