Opinions on the new Vigilance?

Just thinking out loud here and wondering if anyone has ever tried this;

What if your team build excluded stamina ? You could still build your powers to be endurance efficient, but would you be capable enough using just the inherent in group ?

I agree that some defenders would be less able to leverage the inherent.
Point of fact: The three primaries that I have the MOST experience on teams are --> Empathy, Forcefields and Kinetic.

Of the three, Forcefields is the only one that ever seemed to have endurance problems in groups, but I always attributed this to the fact that my FF characters were able to spend ALOT more time blasting away. Well that and, Empathy and Kinetics have powers to replenish endurance in massive ways.

Any thoughts ?

Hehe,

Well since it aint gonna happen, it would only be an excercise in logic.

Mainly what struck me was the synergy between the idea of Defenders being oriented towards actions which affected teammates, while corruptors being focused on actions which affected enemies. The names for the ATs go well with that logic.

Just thinking out loud really.

The buff I wanted on Defenders was wider AoEs and/or lower recharge time on primary powers (not a "bonus," just straight up lowered times). The "new" Vigilance won't get me playing Defenders. Slightly better buff numbers simply don't make up for other ATs being able to use key powers as often or in as wide an area.

I like the plus damage, but the other half of Vigilance would be more useful as a recovery rate increase that is higher the more teammates there are on the team. Even if it was, at 7 teammates, as good as un-slotted stamina it would be useful for people who want to save three power-slots from stamina.

I love the end discount of vigilance, always have.

If you tell me my storm/sonic is being a "bad defender" for getting use out of it I'll respond by telling you that you are an idiot as I can pretty much guarantee I do more for the team's reward rate than your "good defender".

Same goes for my cold/dark, who gets to use HL primarily for the debuff rather than needing it for the buff like all my other colds. Same goes for my traps/son, and my dark/rad blast.

Being able to go buck-wild when we get into the thick of things is just great. All my defenders are slotted more aggressively than the corruptor version would be because endurance is less of a concern in teams, which is where I primarily play them.

I understand the complaint that it isn't as visual as scourge or containment, maybe they could change it so that when you start receiving a vigilance discount is spams vigilance over your own head...yeah. If your net worth is determined by the gimmick text appearing over enemy heads then I feel bad for you.

The damage buff while solo is nice. Defs designed* with the intention of solo'ing were already fine at it and I'm not sure this change has made builds not designed for it much better like a single attack emp/psi, but maybe.

*When I say designed to solo I mean designed to actually contribute in all types of play. I personally don't have a defender build that can't fit in all team relevant buffs/debuffs while also fitting all solo relevent buffs/debuffs with the full gambit of attacks too. They might be out there though, playing some set that isn't available to the rest of us that makes it impossible to build for. From the way some people talk about it on the boards the power sets are out there. Who knows.

I guess that depends on your definition of soloing "Fine".

If you mean survival, then yes soloing defenders was "fine".

For me the issue mostly was regarding speed of soloing. Even on one of the better solo platforms like Rad, I would still consider soloing with Bosses slow. And when you start looking at sets like Empathy or Forcefields, you really start to feel the pain. The longer you stand toe-to-toe with a Boss, sooner or later your gonna get pounded.

Even with these changes I would still call the time spent to take down a "Boss" pretty slow, but minions and Lts are now sitting at their relative strength. This makes soloing missions alot more fun for me. Heck my Kinetic can 2-shot minions with a single-stack siphon for buffs. That is a good feeling when your solo.

As far as the endurance discount part of Vigilance, I have never been fond of it, but that was mostly because there was ZERO benefit solo. It's also probable that we did not get a revamp of the endurance aspect because it does actually work. At least for some sets, hmm, like Empathy. I know when Biospark gets on a team I never see my endurance bar dip below 75% during the times that RA is down. And I am almost always clicking something. How much of that can be attributed to my IOs and Stamina, who knows, but I would lay money that "Vigilance" is also part of it.

The damage increase to me is slightly noticeable but not enough for me to make a defender over a corrupter. With a corrupter you can adjust your attack chain to really take advantage of scourge at times. I do think the changes are huge step in the right direction. Personally what I would like to see done is for them to get rid of the grand canyon size gap that exists on soloing speeds of various ATs and powersets. For the most part I have always felt we should play the powerset or AT for the concept not because something is easier to solo, level, or is FoTM. Until the solo speeds are brought closer together thing are still going to not be so great. The creation of the VEATs proved that you could make a support AT that does damage and supports well and not be overpowered. That paved the way for doms to finally get the help they deserved without having to be tied down to that cruch of an inherrent. Samething should have applied to defenders. Maybe in 5 years they will get another look and get the damage they should have had in the begining.