I can't think of any problems with the powerset combination.
No real synergy, but no real conflict either.
Pop the shields out, and then just blast away with the arrows.
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Is there any point to taking both Repulsion Field and Force Bubble?
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Sort of. Repulsion field is more or less a melee shield - stuff that runs up to you gets knocked back as soon as it touches you. It doesn't prevent them from swinging once, but it does keep them from swinging *more* than once. You can also use it offensively, trying to knock things into corners or jumping next to an embattled teammate and knocking their attackers away.|
Originally Posted by Mortimer_NA
Is there any point to taking both Repulsion Field and Force Bubble?
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Force bubble is more of an overall mob positioning tool. It's not intended to save you personally from melee, although it does do that. It's often used to shove spawns into advantageous positions pseudo-stormie style, as well as keeping large amounts of melee enemies away from squishies. It's much more of a broad brush type tool, and it does draw a fair amount of aggro.
There *are* significant differences between the powers. Where repulsion field keeps mobs from meleeing you, force bubble stops them from meleeing the entire team. Where repulsion field is a precision instrument to knock back one foe or a small clump, force bubble moves around the whole enemy spawn. Since repulsion field doesn't do anything unless the foe is right next to you, you can safely leave it running. On the other hand, force bubble has such a huge radius that you'd really best turn it off when you aren't actively trying to position something lest you just make a mess.
The problem is that, while there *are* differences, the overall functions of the powers are broadly similar. They both move around foes, even if they do it in slightly different ways. And so while in an ideal world I might want both available, I find it hard to justify the power choices to take both, especially given the near requirement to take an extra pool power in maneuvers.
Also, they both use a large amount of endurance, especially repulsion field when you're actually hitting foes. So if you took both you'd end up with massive endurance drain whenever you tried to use force bubble, since you'd presumably have repulsion field on all the time, along with dispersion bubble and maneuvers to boot. Those 4 toggles between them cost about 2.4 end/s base. Even with stamina and 2 endredux in each, that's about 60% of your recovery - and that's ignoring the extra 1 end (irreducible) drained each time repulsion field hits an enemy.
Ultimately, I decided I couldn't afford the extra end cost or power pick on my FF. I already had to skip an epic power or two I wanted, and my end recovery was touch and go even with the equivalent of 2 or more end redux in every single power I have (that particular issue didn't settle down until I got a performance shifter proc). Your milage may vary, but I don't think the tradeoffs of taking both are worth it.
@MuonNeutrino
Student, Gamer, Altaholic, and future Astronomer.
This is what it means to be a tank!
Would Slotting Force Feedback Chance for +Recharge in Repulsion Field be worth it?
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Success... Hmmm... *Glances at the second link in his Sig*, Yep that would do it. Bear in mind that character is heavily IOed.|
Originally Posted by Mortimer_NA
Anyways, As a Flight based toon, has anyone had success/nightmarish failure with this combo? I look forward to hearing your tales or joy and/or woe.
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Originally Posted by Fenrisulfr
No real synergy, but no real conflict either.
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With that build you can softcap yourself to all positions for soloing, I'd go for it ;D
Also, shooting enemies with said softcap from inside Force Bubble is hilarious 
The Story of a Petless MM with a dream
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Originally Posted by Deus_Otiosus
This entire post should receive some kind of award for being both hysterical and fantastic.
Well done. |
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It's better that you take them, and then find out whether you like them or not. You can respec later to get rid of unwanted powers.|
Originally Posted by Mortimer_NA
Is there any point to taking both Repulsion Field and Force Bubble?
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For force bubble, if you can soft-cap defense yourself, then you're basically building a little fortress for the squishies in your team. I usually stand at the very back of the team as the force bubble has very large radius. If a person want to avoid melee, then he can move inside the bubble. But you do need to make yourself pretty tough such that you can take the aggro. There are other uses like blocking an entrance. I don't usually use it to push mobs to a wall or a corner, although it can be used this way (usually, some mobs can squeeze their way out, so they scatter and it doesn't work as clean as you wish it to be).
Repulsion field is basically a personal version of the force bubble. If you don't use force bubble, you can simply turn on repulsion field and forget about it. It knocks back mobs that want to melee you. Usually, a mob can hit you once before being knocked back, but the mitigation it provides is ok, I think.
I tried a FF/Archery build before, but the damage from Archery was...well, ewww.So I went with FF/Energy instead.So far its working out rather well.
I have a Theory that Ill be able to Solo using Force Bubble and 3 KB AoEs.Energy Torrent, Energy Exsplosion, and Repulsion Bomb.Sounds odd I know, but if I can solo 8 man missions with a Storm/Elec and a Cold/Ice, I shouldnt have any issues with a FF/Energy Defender.(Without IOs on any Defender builds.)
My Advice, you might want to re-evaluate Archery for a Defender.It does look fun, but after 18 Levels of a FF/Archery Defender, I wont be touching Archery for Defenders any time soon.
Alrighty! After much soul searching, long walks in the desert, and one wierd encounter with a coyote chasing some kind odd lookin bird, I have come up with a build I think will work with my playstyle(not that I have a Defender-playstyle this being my first). I have read some of the comments about not taking archery. Thats cool. I appreciate the warning. Though as a concept character, I am not looking to min/max this toon.
Here are some of the reasons for my power choices. I know that they are largely situational. Thats fine. I wanted to build a toon that may not use every power all the time but would have a utility belt to draw from when the need arises. That said, I took repulsion field(I have heard a lot of bad about this power) at level 28 for uses on mishes such as the Terra Volta Reactor. Is it necessary? Prolly not but neither are Bat-shaped (Insert weapon of choice). Keeping the baddies off of defendable objects just sounds useful. I also took Detention Field, another power I have heard a lot of hating on. I took it late as I have heard its nice effect on the towers in the Statesman TF. Again, Detention Field and Repulsion field on the towers will take them out of commission. Repulsion Bomb. hmm I have heard varying opinions on this one. I took it as an opener. Slotted for stun, I hope it will Knockdown and keep them dazed till my mates can wipe them out.
Why all the explanation? Simply, I have never played a toon like this before. I want to learn from all of you. I know I am to be a buff-bot but I feel like the toon could be so much more in different situations. Anyways, here is the build submitted for your approval.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.703
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Mutation Defender
Primary Power Set: Force Field
Secondary Power Set: Archery
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Teleportation
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Power Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Personal Force Field -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 1: Snap Shot -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(5), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(11), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(15), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(17)
Level 2: Aimed Shot -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(5), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(11), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(17)
Level 4: Force Bolt -- KinCrsh-Dmg/KB(A), KinCrsh-Acc/KB(7), KinCrsh-Rchg/KB(9), KinCrsh-Rechg/EndRdx(21), KinCrsh-Dmg/EndRdx/KB(21), KinCrsh-Acc/Dmg/KB(23)
Level 6: Deflection Shield -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(7), GftotA-Def/Rchg(13), GftotA-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(19)
Level 8: Insulation Shield -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(9), GftotA-Def/Rchg(13), GftotA-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(19)
Level 10: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 12: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(42), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 14: Super Speed -- Clrty-Stlth(A)
Level 16: Dispersion Bubble -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(37), GftotA-Def/EndRdx(37), GftotA-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(37)
Level 18: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Rcvry+(23), RgnTis-Regen+(25)
Level 20: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod(25), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(27), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(27)
Level 22: Fistful of Arrows -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(29), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(31), Posi-Dmg/Rng(33), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(34)
Level 24: Blazing Arrow -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(29), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(31), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(34), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34)
Level 26: Repulsion Field -- FrcFbk-Rechg%(A)
Level 28: Repulsion Bomb -- Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(A), Stpfy-EndRdx/Stun(31), Stpfy-Acc/EndRdx(33), Stpfy-Stun/Rng(36), Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(36), Stpfy-KB%(36)
Level 30: Recall Friend -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 32: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(39), Ksmt-Def/EndRdx(39), Ksmt-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(39)
Level 35: Ranged Shot -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(46), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(46), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(48), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(48)
Level 38: Rain of Arrows -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(40), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(40), Posi-Dmg/Rng(40), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(42), RechRdx-I(42)
Level 41: Power Build Up -- GSFC-ToHit(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(43), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(43), GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(45), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx(45), GSFC-Build%(45)
Level 44: Temp Invulnerability -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(46), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(50), RctvArm-ResDam(50), RctvArm-EndRdx(50)
Level 47: Detention Field -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Force Bubble -- EndRdx-I(A)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Vigilance
Level 6: Ninja Run
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If you're looking to keep baddies off of things like the reactor core and towers, you want to use force bubble, not repulsion field. Repulsion field's small radius means that it basically protects *you*, not others. You can jump into a crowd around a teammate and knock many of them away in different directions, but for overall keeping stuff off of things that aren't you, you want force bubble. That thing's got an absolutely huge radius, easily large enough to encompass whatever you're trying to defend. If defending things is the only reason you took repulsion field, I would just move force bubble earlier in the build instead.|
Originally Posted by Mortimer_NA
Here are some of the reasons for my power choices. I know that they are largely situational. Thats fine. I wanted to build a toon that may not use every power all the time but would have a utility belt to draw from when the need arises. That said, I took repulsion field(I have heard a lot of bad about this power) at level 28 for uses on mishes such as the Terra Volta Reactor. Is it necessary? Prolly not but neither are Bat-shaped (Insert weapon of choice). Keeping the baddies off of defendable objects just sounds useful. I also took Detention Field, another power I have heard a lot of hating on. I took it late as I have heard its nice effect on the towers in the Statesman TF. Again, Detention Field and Repulsion field on the towers will take them out of commission. Repulsion Bomb. hmm I have heard varying opinions on this one. I took it as an opener. Slotted for stun, I hope it will Knockdown and keep them dazed till my mates can wipe them out.
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You've skipped aim, which is not a good idea. Even on a defender, the damage bonus is worthwhile for boosting RoA. I'd use the freed power slot from repulsion field to take it.
Don't slot repulsion bomb for stun. The stun is only mag 2 and has a measly 40% chance to go off. Slot it as an AoE instead - it does slightly more damage than fistful or explosive, so it's well worth it. I'd give it 5 posi and the recharge proc. It *is* a very good opener, though more because of the knockdown than the stun. Aim + repulsion bomb + RoA would be pretty nice I think, repulsion bomb putting them on their butts so they don't run out of the area while RoA is animating.
That does drop you slightly under the ranged softcap, unfortunately, down to 41.5%. One thing you can do is slot one of your defense powers (I'd suggest maneuvers, since it has the highest end cost) with 6 red fortune. You do lose 2.5% recharge and the regen/recovery bonuses, but you gain 2.5% ranged defense along with a minor damage bonus. That's 44%. If you can free up two more slots somewhere (hasten can probably get away with 2 level 50 IOs, so that's one), you could put them into super speed for a pair of zephyrs. They don't give as much as they used to, but it's still another 1.25% along with some more KB protection.
Detention field is cool - I have it too, and while I don't use it often, it's useful on occasion. One thing - acc/mez hamis act to increase the intangibility magnitude, and I think you might need to slot some in order to affect some targets. I know, for example, that it doesn't work on elite bosses with no acc/mez in it. I don't know about the towers specifically or AVs in general, but you'll probably want to ask around to see if you need any acc/mez in it, and if so how many.
@MuonNeutrino
Student, Gamer, Altaholic, and future Astronomer.
This is what it means to be a tank!
Quote:
To cage a tower requires no slotting. However, it is required if you would like to cage AVs. 3 Hammi Acc/Mezz are required for a +4 AV.
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Originally Posted by Muon_Neutrino
Detention field is cool - I have it too, and while I don't use it often, it's useful on occasion. One thing - acc/mez hamis act to increase the intangibility magnitude, and I think you might need to slot some in order to affect some targets. I know, for example, that it doesn't work on elite bosses with no acc/mez in it. I don't know about the towers specifically or AVs in general, but you'll probably want to ask around to see if you need any acc/mez in it, and if so how many.
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Just for a reference here is the build I originally ran on my FF/Archery Defender:
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.704
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Magic Defender
Primary Power Set: Force Field
Secondary Power Set: Archery
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Power Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Deflection Shield -- RedFtn-Def(A), RedFtn-EndRdx(3), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(3), RedFtn-Def/Rchg(23), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(46), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 1: Snap Shot -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(7), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(7), Thundr-Acc/Dmg(9)
Level 2: Aimed Shot -- Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(11), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(11), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(13), Thundr-Acc/Dmg(13)
Level 4: Fistful of Arrows -- Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx/Rng(A), Det'tn-Dmg/Rng(15), Det'tn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15), Det'tn-Dmg/Rchg(17), Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx(17)
Level 6: Insulation Shield -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg(19), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(19), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(21), RedFtn-Def(21), RedFtn-EndRdx(46)
Level 8: Swift -- Flight-I(A)
Level 10: Blazing Arrow -- Apoc-Dam%(A), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx(23), Apoc-Dmg(25), Apoc-Dmg/Rchg(25), Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), Apoc-Acc/Rchg(27)
Level 12: Dispersion Bubble -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg(29), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(29), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(31), RedFtn-Def(43), RedFtn-EndRdx(48)
Level 14: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Numna-Heal(39), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(39), Numna-Heal/Rchg(40), Numna-EndRdx/Rchg(40), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(42)
Level 16: Hover -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def(31), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(31)
Level 18: Fly -- Frbd-Stlth(A)
Level 20: Explosive Arrow -- Det'tn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(A), Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx/Rng(33), Det'tn-Dmg/Rng(33), Det'tn-Dmg/Rchg(33), Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx(34)
Level 22: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(34), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(34), P'Shift-End%(37), P'Shift-Acc/Rchg(37), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(37)
Level 24: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(36), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36)
Level 26: Tactics -- AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx(A)
Level 28: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 30: Repulsion Bomb -- Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Det'tn-Dmg/Rchg(36), Det'tn-Dmg/Rng(42), Det'tn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(42), Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx/Rng(43)
Level 32: Force Bubble -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 35: Aim -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 38: Rain of Arrows -- Ragnrk-Dmg/Rchg(A), Ragnrk-Dmg(39), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(40), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(43), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(45)
Level 41: Power Build Up -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(45)
Level 44: Temp Invulnerability -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), Aegis-ResDam/Rchg(45), Aegis-ResDam(48), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx(50), Aegis-EndRdx/Rchg(50), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 47: Ranged Shot -- Range-I(A), Range-I(48)
Level 49: Detention Field -- RechRdx-I(A)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Vigilance
Level 0: Ninja Run
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Set Bonus Totals:
- 21.8% Defense(Ranged)
- 16.4% Defense(AoE)
- 35% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
He has since been reinvested in (A much more expensive build), but if you are looking to make yourself as tough as possible this should give you some ideas.
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You can take a look at my post 2 months ago.
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Originally Posted by Krogoth
To cage a tower requires no slotting. However, if you would like to cage AVs, 3 Hammi Acc/Mezz are required for a +4 AV.
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Not really. Procs like this only roll every ten seconds in a toggle, and then only if that split second coincides with enemy interaction with the bubble. It would take near a miracle to get it to fire.
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Originally Posted by Mortimer_NA
Would Slotting Force Feedback Chance for +Recharge in Repulsion Field be worth it?
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The plastic tips at the end of shoelaces are called aglets. Their true purpose is sinister.
--The Question, JLU
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Did you test with a defender or a controller?
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Originally Posted by Twilight_Snow
You can take a look at my post 2 months ago.
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Defender.
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Originally Posted by Krogoth
Did you test with a defender or a controller?
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Interesting because 2 Endos did not work to cage Ghost Widow on the STF for me.
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Originally Posted by Twilight_Snow
Defender.
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I never finished testing every possible combination, but from what I did test, I was not certain if 2xL50 Hamis would enough or not, but that maybe L51 or L52 hamis might, It's a really close call. It could also be possible for the MA versions to not completely match the STF versions. All my testing was prior to MA and done in the STF under the old difficulty system (Heroic to Invincible).
http://www.repeat-offenders.net/foru...1&#entry116826
I use 2 level 50 endoplasm HO. I didn't use MA missions. The mission that I used is from Daedalus, a contact in Cimerora. He has a mission with Ghost Widow inside. I tested again today against a level 54 Ghost Widow, and I could put a detention bubble on her with 2 HO. Maybe, the Ghost Widow in STF is tougher.
I created a FF/Archery Defender today. She is still in Outbreak at the moment. While it looks intriguing, I wanted to ask the group if they see any issues with this particular combo. This will be my first defender I actually put any effort into. All others stall after the sewer run. (sadly) Anyways, As a Flight based toon, has anyone had success/nightmarish failure with this combo? I look forward to hearing your tales or joy and/or woe.