I'd say it's a toss up between Ice/Ele and SD/DM.
Ice/Ele - If you cap your S/L/E/N defense, you're pretty set for the rest of the game. Ele has a good AoE, so stack that with Icicles, and you'll have some high DMG output.
SD/DM - Easier to soft cap to ALL positional defenses, and lot's of +DMG. Some will say DM is too single target oriented, but with AAO doing a Soul Drain/Shield Charge combo can really clear out a group. Build for a lot of recharge, and you'll be doing pretty good. It's also capable of soloing AVs. I've taken down Battle Maiden alone with it.
Overall, I'd say Ice/Ele has a slight upper-hand for farming. But both will be insanely fun to play.
@Rylas
Kill 'em all. Let XP sort 'em out.
oh sweet. thx dude, and SD/DM im looking forward to more, my step mom has a IOed Lvl 50 SD/DM, iv played it, and going Soul Drain + Melt Armor + Shield Charge + Fireball works wonders..most times i dont even need fireball, shield charge takes them all out. Soloing AVs..thats awesome too dude, im always looking forward for that..i never had a char which could, besides the illrad im lvliing in spare time heh. THank you for u reply and ur help.
@MachineSlave | Infinity Server | Deepdown Traumahounds Supergroup | Co-Founder
Tankers : Ice/Ele, Fire/SS, Fire/DM, Invul/Fire, Ele/Stone Corrupter : Arch/TA
Scrappers : DM/DA, Kat/SR Brutes : Fire/Shield, Ele/Fire(Villian)
Controllers : Fire/Kin, Ele/Rad, Earth/Cold
The Invulnerability/Fire tank you have might be better because you got the superior damage of the fire and the second to strongest Armor out there. The only one That I know that is stronger than invul. is stone and then wp is like tied with it.
EDIT: also the fire has lots of DoTs and AoEs which is great for herding.
Pinnacle - The Drunk Server!
MAIN: Desi Boy> Level 51 Fire/Fire Tank
Super Group: C.O.R.E.
Tanking since 05'
Vigilante
MAIN: Desi Boy> Level 51 Fire/Fire Tank
Super Group: C.O.R.E.
Tanking since 05'
Vigilante
Quote:
Many people, myself included, would argue about the strength of Inv to Ice. All sets have their strengths, and can be very survivable in the right hands. When it pertains to farming though, one of the things to keep in mind is endurance issues, and Inv/Fire won't have any inherent end recovery powers like the other two set combos the OP mentioned. |
Originally Posted by Desitre
The Invulnerability/Fire tank you have might be better because you got the superior damage of the fire and the second to strongest Armor out there. The only one That I know that is stronger than invul. is stone and then wp is like tied with it.
EDIT: also the fire has lots of DoTs and AoEs which is great for herding. |
Fire Melee is a strong damage set, but I think Elec gives a comparable amount of damage, and is just as exotic as fire.
@Rylas
Kill 'em all. Let XP sort 'em out.
Quote:
A lot of good points, but from a lot of people I talk to, say that invulnerability is easy to soft cap. Now it's impossible for me to back this up with numbers because I don't use hero builder, but Invulernability is said to be easy to soft cap and while you soft cap it the other set bonuses will help with end. And almost everybody gets stamina these days.|
Originally Posted by Rylas
Many people, myself included, would argue about the strength of Inv to Ice. All sets have their strengths, and can be very survivable in the right hands. When it pertains to farming though, one of the things to keep in mind is endurance issues, and Inv/Fire won't have any inherent end recovery powers like the other two set combos the OP mentioned.
Fire Melee is a strong damage set, but I think Elec gives a comparable amount of damage, and is just as exotic as fire. |
They are very similar builds though, I just think Invulnerability would be stronger and easier.
EDIT: not saying Ice is a bad choice, any tank these days can be built into a farming tank, I just think Invulnerability will be easier to work with.
Pinnacle - The Drunk Server!
MAIN: Desi Boy> Level 51 Fire/Fire Tank
Super Group: C.O.R.E.
Tanking since 05'
Vigilante
MAIN: Desi Boy> Level 51 Fire/Fire Tank
Super Group: C.O.R.E.
Tanking since 05'
Vigilante
Quote:
Well, although it's not difficult to soft-cap Invul, because Ice is a pure defense set it's significantly easier to cap it, even without Weave. Also in Ice's favor are CE and EA, both great powers. It also has a damage aura, which Invul does not.|
Originally Posted by Desitre
A lot of good points, but from a lot of people I talk to, say that invulnerability is easy to soft cap. Now it's impossible for me to back this up with numbers because I don't use hero builder, but Invulernability is said to be easy to soft cap and while you soft cap it the other set bonuses will help with end. And almost everybody gets stamina these days.
They are very similar builds though, I just think Invulnerability would be stronger and easier. EDIT: not saying Ice is a bad choice, any tank these days can be built into a farming tank, I just think Invulnerability will be easier to work with. |
However, Invul can also cap S/L resistance, which makes it more durable it situations against enemy ToHit buffs and defense debuffs. And though it takes a greater investment in IOs, you certainly can soft-cap Invul for most def types.
Personally, I tend to think of a well-built Invul as tougher than Ice or Shields, but that may be because as a hybrid res/def set it's less susceptible to the vagaries of the RNG than the pure defense sets.
My Characters
Knight Court--A CoH Story Complete 2/3/2012
Invuln is fairly easy to soft cap; and at least the last time I looked at the market a couple-three months ago it was also relatively inexpensive... certainly under $50 million. At the time I wrote my guide shortly after issue 13 it could be done for $10 million... the market's gone up quite a bit in the meantime.
My thoughts on Invuln are that from 1-20 it's quite strong simply by using good power selection. Up until about 30 or so you really don't need to think about soft capping; you'll be fine against most foes in your level range with a decent build and SO enhancements. It isn't until you reach the upper 30's and beyond that soft capped builds start to come into their own, which is fortunate as you'd have a hard time getting the job done much earlier
.
I've used the dual build to create an "under 30" exemplar build on my Inv/Stone tanker, CMA. Using relatively inexpensive sets that should be within reach of a leveling tanker who's managed to acquire, say, around 10 million that build puts out roughly 25% defense to S/L damage. That's been more than enough to handle anything in the under-30 range.
Your key sets will be Smashing Haymaker (Kinetic Combat is twice as good, but it's hugely expensive) and Reactive Armor, and remember that slotting level 20-25 is only very slightly inferior to slotting 35+ IO's and almost always SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper. Power selection wise you'll want Temp. Invuln, Dull Pain, Unyielding, Invincibility, Tough Hide & RPD from your primary and Boxing/Tough/Weave from fighting. It'll be a tight build, but you can get all that in with Stamina and a few attacks & taunt by 32. Of course you'll also want the Steadfast Resistance 3% def unique; this may be best purchased with Merits as it's expensive at Wentworths but only 75 merits to buy... a Positron and Synapse TF will more than pay for it.
In a roundabout way I guess I'm endorsing your Inv/Fire tanker. Of course your Shield will also be a nice choice; I've only played a shield scrapper to significant level but it's awesome on him so it can only be better on a tanker.
As a final word, there's no shame in alt-itis, many of us have suffered from this affliction. At last count I had something approaching 50 characters above level 20 and 12 at 50 so obviously I have no idea what this "alt-itis" affliction may be... I know a few people who have over 100 alts.
COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
thank for all ur replies, and my invul/fire looks like might be the one..its easy to IO, i dont have alot of cash, so build it, then farm with it to get more moola lol..
@MachineSlave | Infinity Server | Deepdown Traumahounds Supergroup | Co-Founder
Tankers : Ice/Ele, Fire/SS, Fire/DM, Invul/Fire, Ele/Stone Corrupter : Arch/TA
Scrappers : DM/DA, Kat/SR Brutes : Fire/Shield, Ele/Fire(Villian)
Controllers : Fire/Kin, Ele/Rad, Earth/Cold
Quote:
The reason that people say this is that they don't understand the mechanics of Ice - they see it as a pure defensive set when in reality it's not.|
Originally Posted by Desitre
A lot of good points, but from a lot of people I talk to, say that invulnerability is easy to soft cap. Now it's impossible for me to back this up with numbers because I don't use hero builder, but Invulernability is said to be easy to soft cap and while you soft cap it the other set bonuses will help with end. And almost everybody gets stamina these days.
They are very similar builds though, I just think Invulnerability would be stronger and easier. EDIT: not saying Ice is a bad choice, any tank these days can be built into a farming tank, I just think Invulnerability will be easier to work with. |
The factor that people don't take into account is Chilling Embrace - IMO this is the gem in the Ice Armour set.
Chilling Embrace has -32% recharge and -14% damage to mobs in melee. This translates to -46% damage to mobs on melee which egain equates to 46% resistance to all damage types from mobs in melee including psi and toxic.
Apart from the unique +3% def IO I haven't really bothered slotting any sets yet but it still has roughly (not in front of mids or CoH at the moment):
43% def to all but fire, cold and psi - this will be capped with one application of Energy Absorption.
Psi, Cold and Fire def is what ever Weave, CJ and Unuque IO give.
CE gives the equivelant of 46% resistance to all damage types from mobs in melee.
Tough gives an extra 26% to S/L so 72% Resist to S/L in melee.
Cold resist is capped irespective of CE
Ice give an extra 26% resist to Fire (off the top of my head), so 72% resist to fire damage in melee.
On top of this you get a self heal (as does invuln) but you also get Hibernate which is is a complete self heal, complete End refill and it makes you completely invulnerable while the toggles is on (max 30 seconds I believe but could be wrong) and it allows you to maintain aggro during that time.
You get a damage aura.
You get Energy Absorption that allows you to refill your End bar with a few mobs and stack additional defence (usefull if mobs are debuffing). This also allows you to drain the mobs of End - more damage mitigation.
I've played alongside various IO'd tankers on my Ice and I've never felt inferior in any way.
I've got my settings at +4 x8 and have no trouble against most mobs - Carnies and Arachnos are the only ones that make me shiver (pun intended).
I'm not going to get into a debate about Ice being better than Invuln or any other tank as they all have their pros and cons - all I'm saying don't underestimate how good other tanks can be if built and played well.
L50s: Tanks: Cryofission - Ice/EM - Dr Celsius - Fire/Ice - Saint George - SD/SS | Controllers: Psichosis - Ill/Kin - Major Chaos - Ill/Stm | Scrappers - Neutron Crusader - DM/SR
Currently Levelling: Angelic Blade - BS/WP Scrapper | Seeds of Destruction - Plant/Kin Controller
Quote:
-recharge and -damage can't be added like that really, and certainly doesn't equate resistance to all. Recharge debuffs are sometimes good, but at other times irrelevant because some mobs (AVs and the newest bosses often fall into that category) have so many attacks they're limited by animation times even when their recharge isn't debuffed. Damage debuffs are sometimes resisted. We're also talking about a melee aura with a ten feet radius, you might get most mobs but you will not get all mobs unless herding/cornerpulling (which is wasting time compared to "real" resistance to all that is just there regardless of what you do).| Chilling Embrace has -32% recharge and -14% damage to mobs in melee. This translates to -46% damage to mobs on melee which egain equates to 46% resistance to all damage types from mobs in melee including psi and toxic. |
Then, you have to consider the purple patch ; against +4s, effectiveness drops to 45%, which means you're doing a -14.4% recharge debuff and -6.3% damage debuff.
Quote:
| This also allows you to drain the mobs of End - more damage mitigation. |
I think Ice is a great set, but I completely disagree with these two quotes. What makes Ice so good in my opinion, which coincides with some of your other arguments, is the ability to softcap easily to most damage types, coupled with fantastic endurance management, great aggro and damage capabilities thanks to both auras working well together (of course, endurance tools help damage as well), and good heal/regen options.
Ice armor can softcap with just SO's, no tough/weave needed either.
I know, I do it every night on my ice/stone tank.
toggles plus saturated EA and my s/l defense is 46.7%.
I have dull pain to fall back on if defense fails (like invuln) and if it gets really nutz hibernate is a fix all. Hibernate > Unstoppable in my opinion.
As much as I like Invuln. I believe ice is a better tankin set.
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Originally Posted by Shadow Ravenwolf
My favorite combo is Faceplant/DebtCap with the TeamWipe Ancillary
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Dispari
Yeah, I like Blasters too.
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K get this. iv got a Level 27 Invul / Fire Tank, Level 25 Ice/Ele Tank, Level 20 Shield/DM Tank. I have no clue which one to play. I Love all 3. Then i have a Level 25 Illl/Rad Im leveling as well..i have alot on my plate right now and im wondering if anyone will help me out here, but telling me which will prob be the better farmer out of the tanks. I love tanks, i love getting those groups rounded up, then just dominate them. I have a Level 50 Fire/SS Tank. Love him to pieces and hes IOed. anyways..any suggestions be nice.. im pretty opened minded, i pretty would play anything in game kind of player but Im loving all 3 tanks. I just would like to focus on one really, get to 50, then repeat with another tank..
(some other info u might want, I Farm alot, i love doing TFs, i PVE, NO PVP, I Dont mind teaming for regular mishs) If anyone would like to contact me, PM, reply to this, or @MachineSlave, im on the Infinity Server. Will be playing most of the day most likely. peace people, ty for ur helping..
@MachineSlave | Infinity Server | Deepdown Traumahounds Supergroup | Co-Founder
Tankers : Ice/Ele, Fire/SS, Fire/DM, Invul/Fire, Ele/Stone Corrupter : Arch/TA
Scrappers : DM/DA, Kat/SR Brutes : Fire/Shield, Ele/Fire(Villian)
Controllers : Fire/Kin, Ele/Rad, Earth/Cold